Mason Greenwood | Please be respectful and stay on topic

[luke511]

Seriously? Will United be in the championship by then and not a big news story or do you think we're due for a big social change that makes us all care less about domestic violence? It'd take one of those two things for the issue to matter less.



If they tell United, they're annoyed that their brand is being represented by Greenwood, United will pull a complete 180. United is an advertising company ultimately.

They don't care about success on the pitch. If they did, our sponsorship money would be halved. They care about people watching and this controversy would reduce the people watching.

They can be annoyed all they want, they still have to pay up. If they leave at the end of the contract they will be replaced by a bigger deal.

Success drives fans and viewing figures, the club is still living off the success from the SAF era. There comes a point where that success needs to be maintained and Utd are feeling it at the moment, there’s a massive growing market in America that Utd is in a losing battle due to the lack of success recently, also the new generation of fans coming through are savvy to Utd becoming a laughing stock in recent times due to their lack of success and this needs to change. If Utd have a striker with world class potential, they will try and maximise that potential, rather than sell it off for cheap so it can reached elsewhere. I’m pretty certain there won’t a reduction in viewership if he’s integrated into the side again.

 

[TheReligion]

Seriously? Will United be in the championship by then and not a big news story or do you think we're due for a big social change that makes us all care less about domestic violence? It'd take one of those two things for the issue to matter less.

We shall see. I think you’ll be surprised.

 

[luke511]

Right. So in a nutshell it's ok if you're a domestic abuser. All is forgiven if you're worldclass potential.

2nd chance, rehab, DV ambassador, etc

Hey it's fine. But we lost our rights to condemn anything else after this.

No, it's not okay. It is possible to think he was an awful person that did something vile and disgusting, paid the price by becoming one of the most hated people in the country for 2 years (as good as a prison sentence imo) and has now repaired the damage with his girlfriend, in the process of building a family and is given a second chance to learn and grow for the better at 21 years old. Look at Mike Tyson, everybody loves him and he did exactly the same thing. He's ended up as a good person through forgiveness, education and maturity, the same is possible for Greenwood.

 

[FriedClams]

Obviously it’s not comparable, but carragher spat at a family on camera and managed to get his job back. Why? Because he apologized, publicly and it appeared genuine. Greenwood needs to make a statement for his own sake.

 

[Wibble]

Can’t wait till the prick fecks off forever and I don’t have to hear wank posts about how harshly he has been treated for 1.5 years.

We can but dream.

 

[DRJosh]

Obviously it’s not comparable, but carragher spat at a family on camera and managed to get his job back. Why? Because he apologized, publicly and it appeared genuine. Greenwood needs to make a statement for his own sake.

But yet you're still drawing the comparison...An apology for Greenwood's case just won't cut it.

 

[Tyrion]

We shall see. I think you’ll be surprised.

I hope not. The clubs management is stupid enough to do it.

 

[MrWilliams]

Can I ask why backlash is in quote marks or will my brain hurt?

He won't play for us again. The club may well try again next year but they'll panic when the backlash starts. Good form at Getafe may help get a higher price for him though.



No quotation marks needed. It was a backlash and many of our own fans would be put off if we played him again.



We already know the scum running the club are happy to do that, they just got enough pushback they panicked. Greenwood isn't on loan because the clubs management has strong principles. He's on loan because even though they don't care about domestic violence, they're also cowards.

It’s like everyone ignored the bit that this very website of Man Utd supporters unanimously voted for him never to feature for the club again.

do these people who randomly post in this thread think the backlash is purely from the media and Rachel Riley?

The backlash from what I’ve seen is mainly online.

I don’t believe the match going fans will actually boycott the club for playing Greenwood. At most, they’ll boo and moan but they’ll still pay their tickets to see United play.

If Greenwood performs well, trust the United board will find a way to reintegrate him.

It’s easy to take a stance online, but in person, slightly different.

Seen it with the glazer protests, the 2022 Qatar protests, etc.

Ask yourself this question: if United brought Greenwood back in Jan’24 would most of our match going fans stop going to games? I think not…

Just my honest opinion

 

[Wibble]

No, it's not okay. It is possible to think he was an awful person that did something vile and disgusting, paid the price by becoming one of the most hated people in the country for 2 years (as good as a prison sentence imo) and has now repaired the damage with his girlfriend, in the process of building a family and is given a second chance to learn and grow for the better at 21 years old. Look at Mike Tyson, everybody loves him and he did exactly the same thing. He's ended up as a good person through forgiveness, education and maturity, the same is possible for Greenwood.

You are using an unrepentant rapist who is now simply out of prison as an example ..... really?

And the idea that Greenwood has been punished as much by being put on paid gardening leave as if he had gone to prison, presumably as a convicted sex offender, is patently ludicrous.

 

[johnnyteutonic]

In recent news, it's said that Richard Arnold spoke to staff members that he's not expecting Greenwood would play for Man united again in future.
Unless there's successful take-over and changing the owner and CEO, it's nearly zero chance to predict his return.

Here's my favourite front four for future (in FM of course).
Hojlund
Nusa Nypan Greenwood

So what's with Norway suddenly producing a lot of talented footballers?

 

[MrWilliams]

Personally, if he performs well at Getafe during this loan, I want him back at United.

It is what it is, but I don’t see any legal reason why he shouldn’t play for us.

 

[Yakuza_devils]

The best case scenario is that he got back to his best and being sold for 100M for us to then invest in a world class striker.

I don't think he will back to Man Utd even if he got golden boot in La Liga this year.

Man Utd and Greenwood both need to reset and have a new start. It's win win for both parties.

 

[TrustInJanuzaj]

Any chance he starts today?

 

[Leftback99]

Obviously it’s not comparable, but carragher spat at a family on camera and managed to get his job back. Why? Because he apologized, publicly and it appeared genuine. Greenwood needs to make a statement for his own sake.

Understatement of the year.

 

[Berbasbullet]

The best case scenario is that he got back to his best and being sold for 100M for us to then invest in a world class striker.

I don't think he will back to Man Utd even if he got golden boot in La Liga this year.

Man Utd and Greenwood both need to reset and have a new start. It's win win for both parties.

Do you genuinely think there's a hope in hell we'd get 100m for a player next summer who has 1 year on his deal (i think?), and we clearly can't/won't play for us?

 

[sugar_kane]

The best case scenario is that he got back to his best and being sold for 100M for us to then invest in a world class striker.

I don't think he will back to Man Utd even if he got golden boot in La Liga this year.

Man Utd and Greenwood both need to reset and have a new start. It's win win for both parties.

In the unlikely scenario he gets the golden boot I’d be astonished if he doesn’t come back.

A year is a long time, and the idea of him playing will have been long since normalised by that point.

People are fickle and the morals they love to showcase will be exposed as only surface deep in that scenario.

 

[Gazautd18]

Understatement of the year.

 

[reelworld]

No, it's not okay. It is possible to think he was an awful person that did something vile and disgusting, paid the price by becoming one of the most hated people in the country for 2 years (as good as a prison sentence imo) and has now repaired the damage with his girlfriend, in the process of building a family and is given a second chance to learn and grow for the better at 21 years old. Look at Mike Tyson, everybody loves him and he did exactly the same thing. He's ended up as a good person through forgiveness, education and maturity, the same is possible for Greenwood.

Mike Tyson went to prison. Greenwood didn't.
And no, being hated in his comfy house while being paid hundreds of pounds every week for doing nothing is not at all comparable to prison time.

 

[TrustInJanuzaj]

@mods please can we have a performance thread? I’m not really interested in the boring circular debates anymore and I don’t think I’m the only one! Please can we just have a place to discuss his football performances?

 

[Nero]

It’s like everyone ignored the bit that this very website of Man Utd supporters unanimously voted for him never to feature for the club again.

do these people who randomly post in this thread think the backlash is purely from the media and Rachel Riley?

Wasn't unanimous at all, it was pretty much 50/50
https://www.redcafe.net/threads/mason-greenwood-please-post-respectfully.477446/

 

[flappyjay]

@mods please can we have a performance thread? I’m not really interested in the boring circular debates anymore and I don’t think I’m the only one! Please can we just have a place to discuss his football performances?

It's weird they closed it up.

 

[Trequarista10]

There's no chance he plays for United next season imo. The storm would be too much. The club will aim to loan him again, likely to a smaller PL side, with the aim of getting him playing in England but at a club that would attract a less attention than United, and hope the storm dies down enough that the following season they can bring him back with comparatively little fuss.

Best case scenario football wise is Mason does well at Getafe, then has a good season somewhere like Brighton or Brentford, a documentary or interview put out by Mason and his partner to offer a different narrative, possible England recall, let the other clubs take all the criticism, and then Mason to smoothly return to United fit, in form and a more experienced player.

Will it work? Will any club take the public backlash not even for one of their own, but for a loanee? Probably not. And this is assuming Greenwood will perform well enough on the pitch to warrant United and other clubs even wanting his services in the first place, let alone bending over backwards to accommodate him, which is no guarantee. Greenwood himself might end up feeling more comfortable outside of England anyway. He'll face some of the most hostile crowd reactions if he does return, and endless media attention into his every move. If I was him I'd look to relocate abroad permanently.

 

[Tyrion]

The backlash from what I’ve seen is mainly online.

I don’t believe the match going fans will actually boycott the club for playing Greenwood. At most, they’ll boo and moan but they’ll still pay their tickets to see United play.

If Greenwood performs well, trust the United board will find a way to reintegrate him.

It’s easy to take a stance online, but in person, slightly different.

I don't trust the United board to find a way out of their chairs.

And the support for him is mostly online as well.

 

[McTerminator]

Right. So in a nutshell it's ok if you're a domestic abuser rapist. All is forgiven if you're worldclass potential.

2nd chance, rehab, DV ambassador, etc

Hey it's fine. But we lost our rights to condemn anything else after this.

He isn’t though?

In the eyes of the law he is innocent.

To be clear, he was not cleared of all wrongdoing in a court of law as some have suggested… the case against him was simply dropped (answers on a postcard as to why).

However, our legal system, and therefore our country, operates on the basis of innocent until proven guilty. Accordingly, he is ‘innocent’.

What happens to Antony if the allegations against him are never proven? Or never even make it to court? Do we boot him anyway because there was an accusation that didn’t even have the legs to get to court?

Dangerous precedent whatever you do.

 

[Reditus]

Wasn't unanimous at all, it was pretty much 50/50
https://www.redcafe.net/threads/mason-greenwood-please-post-respectfully.477446/

There was one in the general last month that looked considerably different

https://www.redcafe.net/threads/should-mason-greenwood-play-for-united-again.478687/

 

[Raoul]

@mods please can we have a performance thread? I’m not really interested in the boring circular debates anymore and I don’t think I’m the only one! Please can we just have a place to discuss his football performances?

One thread will do. There's little to discuss in terms of his player performances and we don't want other convos about Greenwood to take place in that. This shouldn't be an issue since he isn't even starting today.

 

[Cascarino]

Why open it then?

Because it’s important to challenge bad faith arguments, “he’s been treated harshly”, “He’s been found innocent”, “she forgave him so the matter is ended”, “it was just a toxic relationship”

For victims everywhere this stuff needs to be challenged.

 

[Barthez]

Because it’s important to challenge bad faith arguments, “he’s been treated harshly”, “He’s been found innocent”, “she forgave him so the matter is ended”, “it was just a toxic relationship”

For victims everywhere this stuff needs to be challenged.

It’s nothing to do with anyone else though. Go open a domestic violence thread and discuss the matter in generality and leave this for those who want to support him, follow his career and discuss his performances

 

[Cascarino]

It’s nothing to do with anyone else though. Go open a domestic violence thread and discuss the matter in generality and leave this for those who want to support him, follow his career and discuss his performances

You’re free to support him, and I’m free to comment on there shitty arguments

 

[Pogue Mahone]

It’s nothing to do with anyone else though. Go open a domestic violence thread and discuss the matter in generality and leave this for those who want to support him, follow his career and discuss his performances

The majority of our player performance threads would be dead every week if those were the rules.

 

[Brophs]

I really worry for these people who can apparently only form opinions based upon a guilty verdict in a criminal trial. It’s almost as if they have a vested interest in conflating the criminal standard of proof with the ability to process the information available to them.

 

[Raoul]

Minute 68 - Sociedad just went up 3-2 after an error from the Getafe keeper (attempted to punch the ball away following a cross and completely missed - Sociedad player then headed it in).

Greenwood just subbed on and immediately made a promising run down the right.

 

[VorZakone]

I really worry for these people who can apparently only form opinions based upon a guilty verdict in a criminal trial. It’s almost as if they have a vested interest in conflating the criminal standard of proof with the ability to process the information available to them.

Or...maybe, just maybe, they think someone deserves a 2nd chance in life after being cleared.

 

[sizzling sausages]

It’s nothing to do with anyone else though. Go open a domestic violence thread and discuss the matter in generality and leave this for those who want to support him, follow his career and discuss his performances

If you just want that kind of echo chamber then you and others are probably best off starting a private conversation.

 

[cafecillos]

I really worry for these people who can apparently only form opinions based upon a guilty verdict in a criminal trial. It’s almost as if they have a vested interest in conflating the criminal standard of proof with the ability to process the information available to them.

They are so incredibly invested in the "innocent until proven guilty" thing that I'm 100% certain they apply it to everything in their everyday lives. Their PS5 split in half on the floor next to their dog: "hmmm I guess we'll have to wait until we get the pawprint analysis results, and even then how will I be sure? Damn these criminal trial guarantees that need to be upheld in everything I say and do".

 

[Cascarino]

Or...maybe, just maybe, they think someone deserves a 2nd chance in life after being cleared.

Wanting him to play again is different to saying he’s innocent/done nothing wrong.

 

[flameinthesun]

They are so incredibly invested in the "innocent until proven guilty" thing that I'm 100% certain they apply it to everything in their everyday lives. Their PS5 split in half on the floor next to their dog: "hmmm I guess we'll have to wait until we get the pawprint analysis results, and even then how will I be sure? Damn these criminal trial guarantees that need to be upheld in everything I say and do".

Honestly feels like half of you all are just making up scenarios in here to have a moan because some posters want to follow how he does at Getafe. Not even providing anything constructive just random "PS5 breaks, oh need a criminal trial haha", which contributes nothing and is honestly an idiotic post. Which is a shame as there are posters here who genuinely want to follow his performances and quite honestly the excuse that a performance thread would have to be heavily modded rings hollow as the majority of posters not really contributing anything are those who are shouting from the hilltops that everybody must have nothing to do with greenwood.

 

[Lash]

I don't see him starting a game for a while. It seems like he can only manage 20 mins of effort at a time.

 

[klsv]

It’s nothing to do with anyone else though. Go open a domestic violence thread and discuss the matter in generality and leave this for those who want to support him, follow his career and discuss his performances

He's been on the pitch for over 20 minutes and I can't see anyone discussing his performance.

 

[cafecillos]

Honestly feels like half of you all are just making up scenarios in here to have a moan because some posters want to follow how he does at Getafe. Not even providing anything constructive just random "PS5 breaks, oh need a criminal trial haha", which contributes nothing and is honestly an idiotic post. Which is a shame as there are posters here who genuinely want to follow his performances and quite honestly the excuse that a performance thread would have to be heavily modded rings hollow as the majority of posters not really contributing anything are those who are shouting from the hilltops that everybody must have nothing to do with greenwood.

What is idiotic is claiming, literally hundreds of times in this thread alone, that we have to apply the "innocent until proven guilty" principle to personal opinions on a fecking internet forum. I'm sick and tired of pointing out the idiocy in that using a fairly neutral and serious tone, so I decided to try a less serious approach, I'm not sorry at all that bothered you. Also, you have my word I'll disappear from the thread the second nobody uses that stupid argument or the one about the woman "forgiving" him any more. When people stop making those objectively wrong and subjectively infuriating arguments, I'll stop contesting them.