Matt O'Riley Celtic player

Vault Dweller

Correctly predicted Italy to win Euro 2020
Joined
May 26, 2016
Messages
6,495
Location
Vault 88, The Commonwealth
I thought that was overblown by the media?
Don't think so, thought a few times I've heard O'Riley speak about last season it's sounded like there was definitely some issues there. Maybe nothing OTT but didn't seem like they were that compatible.

Really like the look of him though but yet another player who I genuinely wouldn't know where to play him if he came here.
 

poleglass red

Full Member
Joined
Aug 5, 2015
Messages
3,694
Rodgers playing him more advanced this season, so he's adding goals to his game now.
 

golden_blunder

Site admin. Manchester United fan
Staff
Joined
Jun 1, 2000
Messages
119,000
Location
Dublin, Ireland
Buying from the SPL is like buying from L1. You might find a bargain but quite easily you may find that they cannot adapt to the PL
 

MegadrivePerson

Full Member
Joined
Aug 17, 2022
Messages
1,449
He did play really well against Atletico Madrid yesterday, but obviously its a small sample size.

It would be better for him to go to a club like Crystal Palace or West Ham first to see if he can consistently do it in the Premier League.
 

Bwuk

Full Member
Joined
Feb 29, 2012
Messages
17,255
He did play really well against Atletico Madrid yesterday, but obviously its a small sample size.

It would be better for him to go to a club like Crystal Palace or West Ham first to see if he can consistently do it in the Premier League.
If they do that his price goes from 15-20m to 50-60m.
 

golden_blunder

Site admin. Manchester United fan
Staff
Joined
Jun 1, 2000
Messages
119,000
Location
Dublin, Ireland
The worst that could happen is that you buy a 12m dud. Unlike the Holland shopping mall we've been visiting lately.
We’ve bought one over priced did from Holland

I think you may find that the prices in Scotland are higher than 12m too. Not that you can’t find bargains but I’d be wary of spending money on Celtic players, just because the standard in Scotland to compare them with is so bad
 

Oranges038

Full Member
Joined
Oct 19, 2020
Messages
11,521
Looks a good player. I think from watching him, he has the technical qualities required to be a very good player, he has good vision, awareness, weight and range in his passing long and short. Those sort of abilities are rarely combined into one player, if he can step up and continue to play well in Europe he's a player that should at least be on the radar.
 

Gio

★★★★★★★★
Joined
Jan 25, 2001
Messages
20,247
Location
Bonnie Scotland
Supports
Rangers
If they do that his price goes from 15-20m to 50-60m.
Yeah. We're also seeing big clubs getting overtaken by mid-sized clubs who are braver and more competent at hunting out value from lower leagues. And then have to spend silly money to get a players they could have got in the first place.
 

MegadrivePerson

Full Member
Joined
Aug 17, 2022
Messages
1,449
If they do that his price goes from 15-20m to 50-60m.
So what?

The alternative is we waste £15 to 20 million on a player that's not good enough for the Premier League. Celtic will probably want closer to £30 million too.

It's too big a step to go directly from Celtic to United. He needs to play for a smaller Premier League team first.
 

poleglass red

Full Member
Joined
Aug 5, 2015
Messages
3,694
We’ve bought one over priced did from Holland

I think you may find that the prices in Scotland are higher than 12m too. Not that you can’t find bargains but I’d be wary of spending money on Celtic players, just because the standard in Scotland to compare them with is so bad
VDB, Antony- there's 2 for a start
 

Adnan

Talent Spotter
Joined
Oct 5, 2013
Messages
29,775
Location
England
Fair point, forgot the first one if I’m honest
You were correct the first time mate because the poster you were responding to mentioned what we've been doing 'lately'

And lately the only player we overspent on from the Dutch league is Antony. And that shouldn't happen now that we have two people directing the recruitment in Mayorga and Wells with Matt Hargreaves leading the negotiations. And for any DoF to succeed at any club during a transfer window, he needs capable heads of recruitment who will lead the recruitment department and they will then provide lists of names for a set strategy.

And after sacking Bout and Lawlor on the eve of the summer transfer window last year, it was always going to be a tunnel visioned approach towards recruitment because you don't sack heads of recruitment and then sign the players the sacked heads of recruitment recommended. I said at the time that until new recruitment heads are brought in, it would be sensible to go with ten Hag's choices. And like with any other club that is run well, their recruitment is led by their heads of recruitment which helps the DoF. Edwards at Liverpool was being supported by Barry Hunter and Dave Fallows who run recruitment at Liverpool. At City it's Gary Worthington who runs their recruitment department and at Brighton it's Sam Jewell who runs their recruitment department.

I fully expect Mayorga and Wells to have a even bigger influence next summer when it comes to recruitment. The DoF role is simply one where his job is to connect all the football departments together where they work in tandem towards a common goal. So creating a structure where you have teams leading the coaching, sport science, scouting, data science and medical departments (to name some) is the job of the DoF. And hence each department has their own director and they all report into the director of the whole operation who we call the DoF.

The most important people when it comes to recruitment are the heads of recruitment. Unfortunately the media here in the UK are clueless about how a football structure functions, which then leads to confusion among many fans. Below is a training ground guru interview with Dan Ashworth, who goes into some detail about his role as a DoF when he was at Brighton. And he clearly says that his role is to connect the dots and keep the wheel turning when it comes to the departments on the football side of the club. His role is not to solely focus on recruitment because they have people within the recruitment department whose full-time job is to work on recruitment.






Dan Ashworth: "There’s also a misconception out there that the Technical Director is just about recruitment. For pretty much all of us recruitment is a major part of the role, but it’s only one part of the role."


"I sit in the middle of a wheel and my job is to bring together seven departments, connecting those spokes. And when one of those head of departments leaves, you keep the wheel spinning and find a replacement."
 
Last edited:

Bwuk

Full Member
Joined
Feb 29, 2012
Messages
17,255
So what?

The alternative is we waste £15 to 20 million on a player that's not good enough for the Premier League. Celtic will probably want closer to £30 million too.

It's too big a step to go directly from Celtic to United. He needs to play for a smaller Premier League team first.
No. Doing things like that is where we keep messing up.
 

MegadrivePerson

Full Member
Joined
Aug 17, 2022
Messages
1,449
No. Doing things like that is where we keep messing up.
He's not currently shown that he can do it at the very highest level. We can't be the club where he tests himself. How many players go directly from the Scottish Premier league to the English Premier league and immediately step up?

Somebody like Jota looked great for Celtic last season, and he's now deemed not good enough for a Saudi club.
 

Krny

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Sep 2, 2022
Messages
182
Location
Belfast
Supports
Celtic Football Club
He's not currently shown that he can do it at the very highest level. We can't be the club where he tests himself. How many players go directly from the Scottish Premier league to the English Premier league and immediately step up?

Somebody like Jota looked great for Celtic last season, and he's now deemed not good enough for a Saudi club.
Jota wasn't dropped due to his ability. His manager wanted to register him , people above him wanted to register someone else.
 

Superden

Full Member
Joined
Jul 13, 2013
Messages
2,051
sort of player fergie would snap up. looks like he has the 'balls' to go with his talent.
 

slyadams

Full Member
Joined
Sep 20, 2012
Messages
2,183
Yes please. Again, just so the Dons get a nice big sell on fee.
 

Lash

Full Member
Joined
May 3, 2012
Messages
11,765
Location
Buckinghamshire
Supports
Millwall, Saint-Etienne
I thought he was not meant to be that mobile, has that changed/never the case?
 

Krny

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Sep 2, 2022
Messages
182
Location
Belfast
Supports
Celtic Football Club
I thought he was not meant to be that mobile, has that changed/never the case?
He isn't fast at all. But he intercepts and gets infront of the attacker to steal the ball with his long legs alot.
 

Lash

Full Member
Joined
May 3, 2012
Messages
11,765
Location
Buckinghamshire
Supports
Millwall, Saint-Etienne
He isn't fast at all. But he intercepts and gets infront of the attacker to steal the ball with his long legs alot.
Interesting, thanks for responding. Will try and watch him more to form a better opinion.
 

Still ill

Fantasy Football Champ 2018
Joined
Jul 11, 2011
Messages
8,147
Location
Ireland
So what?

The alternative is we waste £15 to 20 million on a player that's not good enough for the Premier League. Celtic will probably want closer to £30 million too.

It's too big a step to go directly from Celtic to United. He needs to play for a smaller Premier League team first.
I really feel that model is gone for us. It's no longer financially viable. God be with the days when a Southampton or a Brighton or whoever would take the initial low priced risk and then, when the player excelled, they'd doff their caps at ourselves or Liverpool or City when we swooped in with a generous 25 mil. We just have to accept that everyone who's played 45 minutes in the prem costs 70 million for us and cut out the middle man.
 

Gio

★★★★★★★★
Joined
Jan 25, 2001
Messages
20,247
Location
Bonnie Scotland
Supports
Rangers
He's not currently shown that he can do it at the very highest level. We can't be the club where he tests himself. How many players go directly from the Scottish Premier league to the English Premier league and immediately step up?

Somebody like Jota looked great for Celtic last season, and he's now deemed not good enough for a Saudi club.
More hits than misses. Most clubs (not United obviously) are smart with their recruitment these days and can filter out what will make players successful in a more challenging league.
 

poleglass red

Full Member
Joined
Aug 5, 2015
Messages
3,694
He's not currently shown that he can do it at the very highest level. We can't be the club where he tests himself. How many players go directly from the Scottish Premier league to the English Premier league and immediately step up?

Somebody like Jota looked great for Celtic last season, and he's now deemed not good enough for a Saudi club.
so you wouldn't buy anyone from a so called weaker league. Almiron at Newcastle is a classic example, came from a poor team in the mls, and he's doing ok. This is where we need our scouting dept to do their due diligence. Does a certain player have the ability to fit into the pattern we are looking to implement, does he have the scope to continually improve. If he does then, I don't care what league he's played in. We've been buying so called finished articles that have played at the "very highest level" the last few seasons and it hasn't does us much good. We need to broaden our horizons in regards to our recruitment.
 

MegadrivePerson

Full Member
Joined
Aug 17, 2022
Messages
1,449
so you wouldn't buy anyone from a so called weaker league. Almiron at Newcastle is a classic example, came from a poor team in the mls, and he's doing ok. This is where we need our scouting dept to do their due diligence. Does a certain player have the ability to fit into the pattern we are looking to implement, does he have the scope to continually improve. If he does then, I don't care what league he's played in. We've been buying so called finished articles that have played at the "very highest level" the last few seasons and it hasn't does us much good. We need to broaden our horizons in regards to our recruitment.
That's not a good example though. Almiron is the exception not the rule. How many other players came directly from the MLS to the Premier League and made a big impact? Even with a player like Almiron it took him a long time to establish himself as a Premier League player. Do you think he'd get that same level of time at United?

The Scottish Premier League is on a par with league one in England. O'riley needs to go to a bigger club first (Palace, West Ham Everton etc) see how he gets on in the Premier League and then if he's good enough make a move to United later.

Odsonne Edouard looked like a really good player at Celtic, would you have advocated signing him? Moussa Dembele looked like a really good player at Celtic, would you have advocated signing him?
 

poleglass red

Full Member
Joined
Aug 5, 2015
Messages
3,694
That's not a good example though. Almiron is the exception not the rule. How many other players came directly from the MLS to the Premier League and made a big impact? Even with a player like Almiron it took him a long time to establish himself as a Premier League player. Do you think he'd get that same level of time at United?

The Scottish Premier League is on a par with league one in England. O'riley needs to go to a bigger club first (Palace, West Ham Everton etc) see how he gets on in the Premier League and then if he's good enough make a move to United later.

Odsonne Edouard looked like a really good player at Celtic, would you have advocated signing him? Moussa Dembele looked like a really good player at Celtic, would you have advocated signing him?
so what leagues do you advocate buying players from then. Even players from top leagues don't settle in and produce the good consistently when they come to the pl, we've seen that with Pogba, Casemiro, Sanchez, Di Maria, Martial, Falcao, Onana to name but a few. Not every player who looks good in Scotland has to be a target, by the way Edouard had 5 goals in 7 games this season in a poor Palace team. Yes he's took a while to settle, but we've had Martial since 2015 and we are still waiting on him to settle.I think it's very naive if we follow your approach, where we let Palace, West Ham Everton etc identify the talent, then we wait and pay top money for these players from them. I see you fail to mention Brighton, whose recruitment has been exceptional on players who hit the ground running. A blind man could have seen how good a player VVD was at Celtic, yet teams sat back and let Southampton take the plunge. We need to move away from buying big name players for the sake of it, and look at players that fit into the style of play we want to implement. What is the point of having a scouting dept if they don't scout for young talented players.We were caught short this off season, as we didn't have the money to buy what we needed, successive seasons of over paying transfers fees and wages catches up on you.
 

MegadrivePerson

Full Member
Joined
Aug 17, 2022
Messages
1,449
so what leagues do you advocate buying players from then. Even players from top leagues don't settle in and produce the good consistently when they come to the pl, we've seen that with Pogba, Casemiro, Sanchez, Di Maria, Martial, Falcao, Onana to name but a few. Not every player who looks good in Scotland has to be a target, by the way Edouard had 5 goals in 7 games this season in a poor Palace team. Yes he's took a while to settle, but we've had Martial since 2015 and we are still waiting on him to settle.I think it's very naive if we follow your approach, where we let Palace, West Ham Everton etc identify the talent, then we wait and pay top money for these players from them. I see you fail to mention Brighton, whose recruitment has been exceptional on players who hit the ground running. A blind man could have seen how good a player VVD was at Celtic, yet teams sat back and let Southampton take the plunge. We need to move away from buying big name players for the sake of it, and look at players that fit into the style of play we want to implement. What is the point of having a scouting dept if they don't scout for young talented players.We were caught short this off season, as we didn't have the money to buy what we needed, successive seasons of over paying transfers fees and wages catches up on you.
That's my point though in a way. If Edouard continues to score goals and has a really good season then he could be a target next summer. We use Palace as a testing ground.

The reason I didn't mention Brighton is because they don't have the same expectations as United do they?

If you think United should become a testing ground for unproven players than so be it, I can't see it going down well.

Back on topic, O'Riley played really well against Atletico Madrid in the Champions League, which clearly suggests that he may have it in him to play at the very highest level. I think it would be too big a step for him to go straight to United though. If he's not good enough to make the step up he will get crucified.
 

A9X SJ

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Oct 20, 2013
Messages
272
I was laughed at when I suggested this lad.
It’s clear he’s a talent and would I reckon he would walk into our side
 

matherto

ask me about our 50% off sale!
Joined
Nov 3, 2009
Messages
17,451
Location
St. Helens
We don't have enough players who play with their socks low to indicate their technical ability so I'm for it.
 

SparkedIntoLife

Full Member
Joined
May 15, 2013
Messages
1,117
How was he in Celtic's 6 nil loss last night? If he was one of the few who played well, then maybe that speaks well to his ability and application under adversity, which is something we hugely lack IMHO.
 

Robbie Boy

Full Member
Joined
Jun 17, 2010
Messages
27,494
Location
Dublin
I've watched a fair bit of him and I reckon he's probably around midtable PL level.