Improvement that is almost universally seen when a manager takes over a new team. Poch has taken PSG from being 1 point behind a relatively weak Lille side to being 1 point behind a relatively weak Lille side. I'm not sure why we're pretending that's good enough.
Mauricio Amadaeus Pochettino | Chelsea sack watch
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No, he got sacked due to his poor relationship with his bosses.
It wouldn't have happened if they were comfortably clear at the top of the table.
Next season is make or break for him. Winning Ligue 1 will be a norm and even if he does win it but doesn't get at least to the semis of CL they'll probably sack him.
That's still not the reason and there is no point pretending otherwise.
Only reason for them to sack him right away - they are a ruthless bunch after all - if Zidane would somehow be available next season. This "team" cries out loud for such a manager - like Real did when he took over (and took over again..).
So you agree he wouldn't have been sacked if his team wasn't below the required standard. They were looking for a reason to sack him, and they got one because he was underperforming. It's as simple as that.
Still, it only strengthens my point. Tuchel was in a hostile environment with the owners wanting him out. Poch came in and made no ground on a team with the likes of a 37 year old Jose Fonte captaining it. Let's not pretend he shouldn't be taking some of the blame.
PSG aren't ruthless, I don't really know where that reputation comes from.
He would have been sacked because the reason they found was his management of the game against the turkish teamin CL, he tried to force the players to not leave the field in solidarity and some key players allegedly turned against him. And he wasn't going to be extended even if he managed to win the CL.
Poch got the same out of them as Tuchel did.
To me it says more about the players than either of the managers. Loads of horribly over paid players playing in a crap league with little or no challenge or motivation.
They know they don't have to try to win most of the games, when you have that attitude it seeps down to every aspect of the team, in training, match preparation etc. I know they got to the semis but you could see in the CL games that they lack leadership on the pitch, Neymar just does what he wants, the midfield is very poor and lacks balance. Then most senior players are Navas, Veratti, Neymar, Di Maria, Gueye and Herrera, not one of these is a commanding figure or a leader.
That's why players like Tiago Silva are important, they help keep all that in check in training and around the team and during games. Chelsea had the same sort of problem when Lampard, Terry and Drogba left. Standards drop and it's hard for any manager to get a group like that going consistently again.
Since Leonardo took over? Be it player or Tuchel being sacked at 24.12. - not one single case went off smooth.
anyway,yes they‘ve kept coaches rather longish before and I too think that‘ll go for Poch -unless he completely messes up next season or if Zidane becomes available .
Why did they wait 3 games to sack him? Not getting an extension and being sacked are very different things.
Nothing special has happened since Leonardo cameback outside of not extending older players. There is nothing ruthless about PSG and they don't have an habit of sacking managers or not giving them the entire length of their first contract. If it was to happen to Pochettino it would be a first.
They thought that it was a better timing with the 10 days break.
And he came in and done just as poorly while having a far more favourable environment to work in. Almost every team gets a lift when a new manager comes in. The likes of Big Sam has extended his career massively on the back of that. Tuchel went to Chelsea and got them to a CL final, while securing top 4. Poch? Nothing.
Loads of horribly overpaid players who got to the final of the CL 4 months prior and were going to win the league at a canter the previous season. They are significantly better than the competition. They lost a the league to a team with a 37 Jose Fonte as captain and am average 35 year old CF who has never played outside of Turkey ffs. To say they fell apart because Silva left is crazy.
A lift only works when you have something to lift, if you take over a team that is not actually underachieving and on a fairly good form in the league, you lift nothing. Out of his 10 first games he had 8 wins.
Losing and drawing in the following 3 games probably helped. If you are going to sack a manager because of perceived poor standards regarding a specific game, then you don't wait until 5 days before Christmas to do it.
Anyway, we are digressing. This is the Poch thread.
To be fair Poch took over from Tuchel.
Tuchel took over from Lampard.
If you're looking for a reason why the performance of one team went up considerably while the other didn't I think we have to factor in the outgoing manager.
Not underachieving?
Oh yeah, how could a manager hope to overturn the juggernaut that is Lille with such a mediocre squad. I've seen you plug this before here. It's baffling.
And equally the incoming manager.
Clean slate next season. Expect to see clear improvement from them, especially in the CL.
Saying that, they need to tidy up their squad. They have some outstanding talent coupled with some surprisingly average players.
Saying that, they need to tidy up their squad. They have some outstanding talent coupled with some surprisingly average players.
PSG played at their level 82 points is more or less what you should expect from this version of PSG, this is easily the weakest PSG in QSI era. The fact that Lille overachieved doesn't change what PSG are.
You're not making any sense.
Tuchel took over an under performing team who had just gotten rid of a bad manager so obviously their level would go up considerably.
It's not a fair comparison. If you stick to they should have won the league because they are the better team with better players then fair enough. Although, I still think it's a bit early to judge. Give him a transfer window, pre-season and crowds back and I'd be surprised if they don't win the league next year.
Aye, so two managers got pretty much the same out of the same batch of players. That would suggest to me that it's not who the manager is that is the problem there.
This isn't your typical season and what usually happens with a new manager doesn't always happen in a COVID-filled season. I don't think any manager out there should be judged coming in mid-season. As brilliant as Tuchel has been since he took over Chelsea, the cracks are already starting to show and let's see how things go in his second full season. Same with Poch, he got some big results against big teams but missed out on the league. Personally, I have no worries over it, I think he needs a full pre-season and then he has to stand on his accomplishments with no excuses, so let's see what happens.
But this has always been a weird season and I don't think we'll see one like it (at least I hope so) for some time. Juventus always dominates, they barely made the CL, PSG came in second in Ligue 1, Liverpool last season champ and almost lost out on CL as well. No one is going to look at this season and draw any kind of conclusion from it. It was a shit-show, I'm glad it's winding down, let's see what happens now. The shitshow may continue a bit more with what I expect to be a pretty slow summer with clubs decimated for transfer funds, but I could be wrong.
They lost the league to a team that lost 3 times all season, stop acting like Lille are some shit team with geriatric players on their side. They're champions and they deserve respect.
Ok guys, we know that Poch is a shit coach and he'll never manage United. I honestly don't know what you guys want to prove otherwise but if that's it and only it you can move on. He'll probably never manage United so you can rest easy.
And still easily the best team in the league. They were in the CL 4 months prior to Tuchels sacking, and were 12 points clear the previous season before it was abandoned. Let's not pretend this team couldn't have don more.
With near enough the same team that were 12 points clear last season before it was abandoned, and reached the CL final. Only Tuchel was managing under intense scrutiny with the owners looking to sack him. Poch wasn't. Looks like a manager problem as well to me. Surely then you think Jose was doing a good job with Spurs, what with Poch having them in 14th place before he was sacked.
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Only if they have everyone fit and at their best level which wasn't the case.
He wasn't a bad manager. As JP points out, the owners wanted to sack him. His position was becoming untenable. To compare his position to Poch's is entirely unreasonable.
They could have half of their team out with broken legs and they're still got better players than Lille.
Emmm what? I said Tuchel took over from a bad manager.
You were comparing the impact of Tuchel at Chelsea to Poch at PSG and I was saying that wasn't fair because Tuchel took over from Lampard so there was more scope for improvement.
That statement is telling.
Won't disagree there.
My apologies. I misread. The rest of my point still stands though. Poch didn't have to face nearly the level of scrutiny Tuchel did by the end. It's not unreasonable to expect him to improve the teams fortunes. That's not to say he's a bad manager, but he deserves criticism for failing to fend off a very ordinary Killed side.
Don't think anyone called him a shit coach. Hyped up especially by the UK media to where he got overrated yes but that's no fault of his own.
One of the reasons why Poch has his own dedicated thread on here was because he was strongly linked with United. One of the main question marks plenty had over him was how he'd handle a high pressure job with big egos and the expectations to succeed as United are and those question marks remain with how he managed to lose this French league title.
The fact that two managers got the same performance levels out of the same group of players. Tells me that it's more down to the players and their attitude than the managers that they've not won the league.
I went back to check the table. It's not like Lille were brilliant or anything. 83 points is all PSG had to beat in that farmers league. Piss poor from both Tuchel and Pochettino, tbh. They lost 8(!) games this season 
How do you feck up so much as to not win the ligue 1 with PSG?
Always liked Pochettino and his work at Spurs but to not win the league with PSG is very poor on his part. Not a good few years for him crashing with Spurs first, a year out and then this season. Needs to work hard and up his level if he wants to build on the potential he showed at spurs.
Also I don't think PsG was a good move at all. Should have picked a club where he could build and develop rather than chasing a quick trophy or two.
Also I don't think PsG was a good move at all. Should have picked a club where he could build and develop rather than chasing a quick trophy or two.
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