Do they? During Ronaldo's time in La Liga,
La liga titles: Messi (7) Ronaldo (2)
Pichichi: Messi (5) Ronaldo (3)
La liga best player: Messi (5) Ronaldo (1)
Messi v Ronaldo | Contains double your daily salt allowance
- Thread starter Rado_N
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La liga titles: Messi (7) Ronaldo (2)
Pichichi: Messi (5) Ronaldo (3)
La liga best player: Messi (5) Ronaldo (1)
I'm curious, if Messi scores 40 goals a season with PSG and wins the league and cups but doesn't win the champions league, would his PSG stint be considered a failure? That he hasn't "done it at another league"?
It is funny how this poll has gotten closer since Ronaldo re-joined us 
I can't even imagine what happens if Ronaldo leads us to the Prem title.
I can't even imagine what happens if Ronaldo leads us to the Prem title.
Been saying this all this while, CR7 ran away from La Liga after only won 2 Ligas over 7-8 years, to the only horse in the 1 horse league in Juve.
Now after that 1 horse has fallen, ran away again to the 2nd best team in England (basically the best team he could have gone to because RM, PSG, City and Bayern either rejected him quite publicly, do not want to meet his demands, or simply did not show interest)
Only CR7 50cents army can spin it like how he is the ultimate alphamale god who loves challenges, from someone who ran away at least twice.
Laughable isnt it. Imagine being rejected in the interview for Goldman (RM), JPM (PSG), Morgan Stanley (City) offered you less than you want and finally landed your 4th choice job, all the fangirls telling you it is because you love a challenge by not going to your first 3 choices
For me I won't considered this a failure, but it adds nothing more to his legacy, as winning French league/cup, especially with PSG, is just so irrelevant.
Yet he still managed to win more trophies at Juventus than Messi at Barca over the past 3 seasons, and he still end up at the best league here taking up most challenge, instead of 6th league walking away trophies even if without him.
One player doesn't make a team. Juve's transfer policy after Ronaldo has been shambles. Ronaldo basically had to carry them dragging and screaming the past 2 seasons to anything resembling a strong finish. They have Aaron Ramsey in midfield and a bunch of 30 years olds that are long past. Said transfer policy cannot be put down on Ronaldo's feet. If Juve couldn't afford him, then they should have never taken him. On top of that, the managers have been disaster - Sarri and Pirlo were never fit to lead a team such as Juventus. You say Ronaldo looked to leave. Well, what was he to do? Allegri doesn't want him, the club doesn't appreciate him, they bashed him all the time even if he contributed for 90% of the goals and he was always the scapegoat because they didn't win the CL. Well, the CL is a knockout competition. Not every time the best team wins it. Otherwise we'd have 10 CL's by now at least.
He didn't want to stay in Juve for obvious reasons. Why wouldn't you go back to a club that loves you and rather stay in a club that bashes you constantly and blames you for all of their woes despite your contribution? Juve could also never hope to compete for anything outside Serie A. Why? They mostly coasted on Conte's success. Once said signings wore off due to time, they went right back to where Conte first took them. That's a problem Juve has to deal with. And again, it's best for both sides that Ronaldo has to leave. He might be the best or joint best or second best player to ever play the game, but it is also a player that they could never support financially.
United finished second but we never challenged for the league. We coasted mostly on individual performances, especially on Bruno. We never looked a threat to City and quite honestly - the way it's going, it doesn't seem like this season we would be either (unless Ronaldo severely changes us). This is why winning the league with us would be so significant. If Messi wins the CL, so what? He basically has assembled his prime Barcelona team with possibly the most deadly attacking trio in existence. Where is the challenge in that? On top of that, they have a top-tier coach in Pochettino.
As far as Ronaldo's "failures", this is absurd. Sure, they've underachieved prior to Ancelotti first stint, but then again - they faced a monstrous Barcelona team that not many teams would ever be able to go toe-to-toe against. He still gave Madrid's their best or second best period in history after Di Stefano when Madrid before Ronaldo went where the joke of Europe and irrelevant past their own bubble in Spain and the latin countries. His contribution was immense in giving them 4 CL titles. And I'd argue it was better achievement because as great as Di Stefano was, the CL was nowhere near as competitive back in his time than during Ronaldo's days. It was a competition of teams you probably haven't even heard with the only notable one being Milan. England wasn't even in the competition.
There's only so much you can carry the walking cripples that is this Juventus team, and the everlasting "youngster" with the potential to be world beater that is Dybala... who is starting to remind me of Jesse Lingard in that regard.
I'm not sure how much point there is engaging with that poster on this. 72 posts so far, 70 of them in this thread. The other two were in the Ballon D'Or thread about...you guessed it, Messi and Ronaldo!
They are both great players, any attempt to separate them is generally quite painful (as this thread proves). It just boils down to personal preference, it will always be this way with players who take part in team sports.
In my day it was Maradona vs Pele, this current incarnation will continue to rage on with no end in sight.
Really to be a GOAT in a team sport you would need to be truly exceptional, I mean some people think that Michael Jordan isn't the greatest basketball player of all time and he was about as good as it gets in my eyes.
How many sports can you come up with that have a undisputed GOAT?
I will start...
Darts - Phil Taylor
Err...
Would seem I'm already stuck!
In my day it was Maradona vs Pele, this current incarnation will continue to rage on with no end in sight.
Really to be a GOAT in a team sport you would need to be truly exceptional, I mean some people think that Michael Jordan isn't the greatest basketball player of all time and he was about as good as it gets in my eyes.
How many sports can you come up with that have a undisputed GOAT?
I will start...
Darts - Phil Taylor
Err...
Would seem I'm already stuck!
So much drivel written by both you and the guy you’re quoting that it would take hours to correct. Firstly, why do you only mention la liga when referencing his time at Madrid? Is it because that’s what suits your agenda? Why not mention that he left a team that had just won an unprecedented 3 CLs in a row (and a remarkable 4 in 5 years) in a period he also won 3 of the last 4 editions of the BDOR at that time to join a CLEARLY inferior team that he himself had eliminated the last 2 years in a row of the competition he was winning for fun. It was a clear step down and more challenging for him to move from Madrid to Juve. I would even go as far as saying that his move to Juve cost him the 2018 BDOR and at least one more CL trophy with Madrid.
Also, when he left United, he left a team that had just won THREE consecutive Premier Leagues (hasn’t been achieved since) and made it to back-to-back CL finals (winning one) to join a Madrid team that just had their worst season in modern history and hadn’t made it past the CL RO16 for several years. He joined a rebuilding project that he basically had to wait 3-4 years with before he could start winning anything. Clearly he could’ve remained at United and kept winning as they won another 2 league titles from when he left till SAFs retirement. Every career move he’s made actually suggests the opposite of what you’re saying and he’s always moved to teams inferior to what he was playing for.
His current move now is the only one that isn’t a clear step-down. Man Utd on paper are better than Juve but it’s FAR more challenging to win the EPL than to win Serie A with that Juve team even with as poor as they are right now, no doubt about it.
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Skimming through this thread the one thing that’s definitely not in doubt is the Messi fan boys are 100% the worst. The state of them the minute anyone happens to praise Ronaldo for something he’s done.
They’re 10x worse on Twitter. When Messi was winning Copa America and making his incredible transfer to PSG that subsequently had all eyes and media on him, all they could still think of and write about was Ronaldo.Skimming through this thread the one thing that’s definitely not in doubt is the Messi fan boys are 100% the worst. The state of them the minute anyone happens to praise Ronaldo for something he’s done.
I like to think United are good but there’s a lot of competition for you to state matter of factly we’re the “2nd best team”?
I’m also not sure City publicly rejected him or failed to show interest? That goes against pretty much everything reported.
You are right about one thing though… the laughable fanboys/fangirls. You can spot them a mile off… they go around different threads, always praising one player, always disparaging another and give the one they hate a silly nickname. Know anyone like that?
Ridiculous to say either of them ran away from any club. They won everything many times over where they were.
For Ronaldo it makes sense to leave Juventus. They've entered a transitionary period, he's 36 and he doesn't have time for that. But United are hardly the finished article either, so he's taking on a hell of a challenge there.
For Messi he didn't even want to leave Barca in the end. But for the same reasons as Ronaldo leaving Juve it makes sense for Messi to leave Barca. If he can get PSG their first Champions League it would be a massive achievement.
The goal for Messi has to be the Champions League. For Ronaldo, of course the Champions League would be amazing, but it would be something very special if he could help United win the Premier League. But at this point in both of their careers it's all gravy.
For Ronaldo it makes sense to leave Juventus. They've entered a transitionary period, he's 36 and he doesn't have time for that. But United are hardly the finished article either, so he's taking on a hell of a challenge there.
For Messi he didn't even want to leave Barca in the end. But for the same reasons as Ronaldo leaving Juve it makes sense for Messi to leave Barca. If he can get PSG their first Champions League it would be a massive achievement.
The goal for Messi has to be the Champions League. For Ronaldo, of course the Champions League would be amazing, but it would be something very special if he could help United win the Premier League. But at this point in both of their careers it's all gravy.
-- says in a previous comment " But if Ronaldo wins the PL or CL with us, then Ronaldo would be the clear better and more accomplished player, save for Messi winning the WC. Nothing he can do with PSG is going to impress, even the CL," probably one of the most absurd comments of all time in this thread & that tells a lot, and when shown Ronaldo's CL failures at Juve, remembers football is a team game, CL is a knockout competition and even the best may not win the CL)) the level of hypocrisy..
-- All of a sudden Juve becomes "a crippling team" after their regular failures with Ronaldo) You can continue creating an alternative history in your parallel universe looking down on Juve that already won 7 Serie A titles and played 2 CL finals in 4 years prior to his arrival, and, yes, with that "Dybala"..
-- What does Conte have to do with this?? It was Allegri, the current Juve manager, that took them to two CL finals in 2015 & 2017 and brought them 5 Serie A titles in his 5-year stint there.. what are you smoking?
-- While you're at it, also tell us why he wanted to go to Juve in a one-team Serie A and not to PL (to United or others) at that time or stay in La Liga to improve his poor league record, for the challenge, yeah right)) It took Ronaldo "9 years" to get two league titles in La Liga while it took him just two years to get the same number in Serie A..so much challenge)
-- Talks like it was a well organized move.. your hero literally had to escape from Juve the moment things got more challenging at Juve, a coward move lacking class & professionalism by all accounts of Juve fans saying he should at least move earlier so that they could look for a proper replacement.. And why last minute? Because that was the only time he finally managed to get some concrete interest after months of being on the market & desperation after Kane's signing failure with City) I prefer to listen to Juve fans and credible reports than a random poster on a United forum that thinks winning a CL with PSG is nothing in one place and says even the best may not win the CL as it is a knock-out tournament in another)
-- completely ignores that United is easily a top 3-side in the Premier League and a top 4-5 side in CL, and way better than current Juve by any measure..and calls this desperate last-minute move a well-planned challenge again)
-- ignores as usual that Messi is coming to a team that has not won a single CL and played only a single final in its history in the CL let alone winning it and only won 3 league titles in 5 years versus Juve that won 7 times in a row and played 2 finals in the previous 4 years before Ronaldo's arrival..
-- conveniently ignores just like many other Ronaldo fans the fact that Ronaldo played under some of the legends of the managerial world, SAF, Mourinho, Allegri, and Ancelotti, all serial winners, and just decides to remember the standard notion in the football world that "managers matter a lot" when Messi starts playing under Pochettino (who is not comparable to any of those top managers Ronaldo worked with btw)..mind-blown as usual by the level of hypocrisy..
-- says that Real was a bubble team completely ignoring that Real won 3-CLs between 1998 and 2002)).. Tell that bubble story to Zidane, Raul, Roberto Carlos etc. & Real fans.. I am sure they will find it fascinating))
Dude, you really need to take a breath and count to ten. You know Messi is never going to bang you, right?
--
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This is a great forum with fans of all different backgrounds, different ages and even supporters of different clubs.
It works the vast majority of the time because people either have rational conversations or just ignore posts.
You come across like a 12 year old Messi disciple with numerous pro Messi posts and slagging off anyone with a different opinion.
Surely you can debate without looking like you’re having a strop? If not, maybe this forum isn’t for you. (and that decision may be taken for you soon)
They need to continue with this "new challenge" narrative because other than that, there's not much to compare. "New challenge" is a proxy for mentality, leadership etc. Therefore, any threat to this new challenge BS narrative would lead to a total collapse, it has to be fully protected)
Based on what you said above, many Ronaldo fans in this thread should come across to you like a 12-year old "Ronaldo disciple with numerous pro Ronaldo posts and slagging off anyone with a different opinion." Or, do you have different standards for them?
No.
The vast majority just don’t post like you.
Even the very pro Ronaldo posters acknowledge an area of grey… you’re just going out of your way to spin everything and argue with/insult everyone. As I said before, that’s not how this forum works and you can calm down/debate or get thread banned or just plain completely banned.
It’s really that easy.
Your responses generally seem to be a variation on 'I know you are but what am I'. So tiresome.
Ronaldo has gone up nearly 5% in the poll after he signed for us again We're getting very close to 50/50 now.
We're getting very close to 50/50 now.To be honest, I usually just skip his posts but I from what I've read he's hardly any different to @Cal? or @SportingCP96. If the rules you're citing would apply, then many, many more people should be banned. The amount of tribalism in here is pretty devastating in recent times. Just read a few threads in which United supporters clash with "oppo fans". I considered putting him on ignore, too, and that's although I support his opinion in general but he's hardly justifying a ban, at least in comparison to other more tribal posters on this board.
I think a lot of this new challenge bollocks is bollocks. Ronaldo wanted to go to Real Madrid the moment he was world class whilst Madrid were the best team in Spain. It was only in 2009 Barca won the treble and Madrid bought Ronaldo, kaka, Alonso and Benzema in one window. There is no doubt that Ronaldo is a greater Madrid fan than a United fan, but he left Madrid for Juve because he wanted a pay raise in 2018 and didnt get it and didnt feel appreciated by Perez. No doubt he felt it would add to his legacy to play for juve in Seria A but a lot of it can be boiled down to more than just a "new challenge". If the best players in the world wanted a challenge they would move to Stoke, but obviously they dont. Its all about money, location, prestige, glory and team mates.
On a Man United forum. That’s still not good. What do you think the percentages would be on a Barcelona forum? Or even a Newell’s Old Boys forum?Ronaldo has gone up nearly 5% in the poll after he signed for us again
It's football, tbf. I think an element of tribalism is to be expected. From what I can tell, oppos are usually welcomed better than most other forums and they definitely do add a lot of value to it, otherwise it just becomes an echo chamber. By and large it's reasonably good natured and stays the right side of the line. That poster is really annoying though...he's the forum equivalent of the little guy that runs into a fight head down, blindly windmilling.
Responding to your post assuming you are a moderator:
"Spinning everything", really, it must be easy to see who is spinning what (completely ignoring my posts) and looking at what other forumers are posting... There are may posters here who seem to be in full agreement with me on many points and with me being in full agreement with what they are posting.. It is obvious to many here who is going out of their way to spin things to fit their narrative.. If that's your metric, I think you should send warnings to many others before warning me..
From your posts, I am under the impression that you were irritated by the tone of my posts more than anything, and probably by my "parallel universe" use in arguments and maybe the use of smileys )), and that's fine if this is the case.. If their use in this way is against the rules and/or people are that sensitive to feel insulted (which by the way I do not personally feel that way), I will comply with the rules of course..
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I think it's evident that most neutrals would say Messi.On a Man United forum. That’s still not good. What do you think the percentages would be on a Barcelona forum? Or even a Newell’s Old Boys forum?
I would say Bradman but for the fact that cricket has bowlers and all rounders as well and you could argue someone like Sobers over him as a complete player.
Ronnie could be a good shout for snooker? O'Sullivan, not CR7...!
The Messi brigade still pretending to not realize this poll was rigged years ago. :houllierOn a Man United forum. That’s still not good. What do you think the percentages would be on a Barcelona forum? Or even a Newell’s Old Boys forum?
In terms of prolific players, managers and pundits it's overwhelmingly in favour of Messi. Even a fair few of Ronaldo's ex-team mates or current team mates choose Messi. Like 90% to 10%.
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Speaking of ten… He is a newbie (status not expected to change) and only has 10 daily posts. Just let him burn through it and enjoy 23.5 hours of silence.
Not ‘the Messi brigade’ but you don’t have to cry just because he wins every poll. It’s because he’s objectively a better player. Sorry.
Nah, he’s a genius but there’s definitely a dispute, Hendry etc.
Because he’s objectively a better player. This is not hard people….some will insist on beating their heads against a brick wall though…..
N
It was just advice.
Feel free to completely ignore.
Nope I'm not (a mod or bothered by what you posted).
It was just advice.
Feel free to completely ignore.
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