Mourinho Post Match Comments

Dominos said:
I'd go along with this. The obvious/closest pass is the one City are ready to press.

I think this may be why we saw so many long balls and rushed forward passes in the 2nd half - he'd told them to stop playing their way out of situations. But to me it just came across as a lack of patience and composure, and we were not having any success with the long balls either. We should be able to keep the ball better than we did, this was not peak Barca pressing we were facing today. We had no desire to work good positions through our passing or keep the ball to pin them back for long periods and sustain the pressure we built.

I can accept a certain amount of turnover in possession, but the amount of times we gave it away needlessly today was far beyond acceptable. I said in another thread if we gave the ball away half the amount we did today, although it still would have been too many, we'd have had a much better chance of getting a draw or win out the game.
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Agreed. I'd rather we get better at dealing with it and improving our cohesion and intelligence than accept defeat and lump it. I'm probably expecting too much.
 
DWelbz19 said:
... Which tends to be short passes in our own half.
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No its not, you might be making a 1-2 or a series of short passes. The 1st station is a different concept to short passes in your own half. Its a phrase which is related to the fundamentals of defending, 1st defender, 2nd defender etc etc. 1st station is sometimes called the 1st receiver etc. Mourinho was talking about a specific pass, your explanation is a general concept
 
krazyrobus said:
If the first station thing means more clearances then i despair for the team because the result ends up being the same. The goals didn't even come from the pressing, I hope it means changing the orientation of the pass.
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To be fair, Jose won't have to play Pep every week.

He will have to play Klopp, though.
 
I think he means passing the ball on the first touch. We lost possession a bunch of times trying to pass too quick and he probably wanted the players to take a touch to compose themselves before playing the pass out of pressure.
 
amolbhatia50k said:
Not so sure. Maybe against Barcelona our hand would be forced, but in the PL we usually took teams on. I don't see any reason, looking at the team sheets, to suggest that we need to play like underdogs against City. The only reason I can think of for us to play that way is that Pep is at City and Mourinho at United.
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Some more, it is at home
 
Kind of makes sense to me. If Pep's tactic, away from home, is to attack the player receiving the ball in the hope of dispossessing him or making him place a stray pass in order to gain possession and counter attack, then it kind of figures that you don't play the 'first station' system (if that is the right word) but bypass that player and punt it forward to expose the space left by the opposition player being in close proximity trying to close down the receiving player of the opposite team....

feck me...I should have been a manager.....

Seriously though, I do think Jose learnt a lot today, about some of our players. That stifling negativity indoctrinated over the last three seasons isn't going to be easy to shift....
 
It's all good dissing out players but the manager should also take some blame, right? It can't be always the players fault whenever his team loses a game!

There were players who were poor namely Lingard and Mikhi (along with Ibra, Rooney and Pogba) but should they have started the game? Whose decision was it to start with players who haven't played for weeks in a derby game? And then the shocking tactics and set-up in the 1st half, were the players responsible for that too?
 
togg said:
Kind of makes sense to me. If Pep's tactic, away from home, is to attack the player receiving the ball in the hope of dispossessing him or making him place a stray pass in order to gain possession and counter attack, then it kind of figures that you don't play the 'first station' system (if that is the right word) but bypass that player and punt it forward to expose the space left by the opposition player being in close proximity trying to close down the receiving player of the opposite team....

feck me...I should have been a manager.....

Seriously though, I do think Jose learnt a lot today, about some of our players. That stifling negativity indoctrinated over the last three seasons isn't going to be easy to shift....
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Blaming previous managers about negativity when we played like that ON PURPOSE at home.

Well...yeah it is SAF's fault too I think.
 
That interview doesn't inspire me with much confidence. Long ball shouldn't be our go-to strategy against City at home no matter how good they might be with their pressing. Surely we have the players to be able to pass it around nicely a bit?
amolbhatia50k said:
Yep. There's nothing inherently wrong with sitting back. But I personally hate seeing United doing it at home. I better get used to it given it happened against Southampton at times as well, and well, because this is Jose Mourinho. I just thought maybe he always had the Barca excuse earlier. Turns out not to be the case at all.

Funnily enough, that performance under LVG at SB made me proud, because we were brave enough to take charge of the game even if we lost.
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I feel the exact same way. The way we played against Chelsea, and the games before that against Tottenham and City themselves, made me excited that we were evolving our style of play. Sadly, after the game against Chelsea at home to West Brom in a 0-1 loss, it just seemed to disappear.
 
ReDDHDevilS said:
It's all good dissing out players but the manager should also take some blame, right? It can't be always the players fault whenever his team loses a game!

There were players who were poor namely Lingard and Mikhi (along with Ibra, Rooney and Pogba) but should they have started the game? Whose decision was it to start with players who haven't played for weeks in a derby game? And then the shocking tactics and set-up in the 1st half, were the players responsible for that too?
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He kind of did take the blame to be fair....
 
krazyrobus said:
I'm thinking more long term, like champions league I mean. He is not going to win it like that.
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I suppose he's done it before with Inter. Not my preference at all, though. And it appears it doesn't seem to work against Pep in general either given their record is now 9-3.
 
Walters_19_MuFc said:
Jose is as much to blame than the players.

Before the game, a number of us, including myself, felt it was necessary we went with a three man midfield, because we know the way Guardiola plays. As it were, we didn't, and were punished because of it.

Poor mistake by Jose, in my opinion.
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I have sympathy for Jose here, the problem wasnt City going through the middle because they were actually going wide early and going around our midfield before coming in. If Lingard and Miki had done their jobs properly City wouldnt have been able to do this so easily. Its probably why he subbed both of them. City went wide early, most of their middle third play was on the flanks, once they got past the line of our CM they came back in. It was a pretty clear pattern. Every ball from their own defensive third went wide, once they hit our defensive third they came in behind our CM. Fellaini was being sucked wide as they got past our wide players leaving gaps behind. He had to go wide to provide cover.
 
First station means the first pass you see.
 
Stack said:
I have sympathy for Jose here, the problem wasnt City going through the middle because they were actually going wide early and going around our midfield before coming in. If Lingard and Miki had done their jobs properly City wouldnt have been able to do this so easily. Its probably why he subbed both of them. City went wide early, most of their middle third play was on the flanks, once they got past the line of our CM they came back in. It was a pretty clear pattern. Every ball from their own defensive third went wide, once they hit our defensive third they came in behind our CM. Fellaini was being sucked wide as they got past our wide players leaving gaps behind. He had to go wide to provide cover.
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Gotta say pep is another level to jose in term of vision and tactical set ups. I thought he would take his time here. Apparently not so. At least not against his nemesis.
 
The United said:
Gotta say pep is another level to jose in term of vision and tactical set ups. I thought he would take his time here. Apparently not so. At least not against his nemesis.
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I thought it was a clever approach, it meant they basically kept the ball away from Pogba.
 
I wonder how common it is that players fail to make the tactical choices the manager tells them to do. Not exactly comforting, if true. Perhaps its a habitual thing, but it should be pretty straightforward to at least try adhering to your managers instructions.
 
Stack said:
I have sympathy for Jose here, the problem wasnt City going through the middle because they were actually going wide early and going around our midfield before coming in. If Lingard and Miki had done their jobs properly City wouldnt have been able to do this so easily. Its probably why he subbed both of them. City went wide early, most of their middle third play was on the flanks, once they got past the line of our CM they came back in. It was a pretty clear pattern. Every ball from their own defensive third went wide, once they hit our defensive third they came in behind our CM. Fellaini was being sucked wide as they got past our wide players leaving gaps behind. He had to go wide to provide cover.
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Agreed, I think those subs were indicative of those two players not doing what they were asked to do. He tried to correct it and to be frank in the second half...it could have worked out.
 
Stack said:
I thought it was a clever approach, it meant they basically kept the ball away from Pogba.
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It seemed like jose thought about how to play city for 2 weeks and still got outplayed anyway while none of his worked.
 
fontaine said:
I'm wondering the same. Maybe its the first half of the pitch?
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I think it's the closest player to pass to. And yes many times United lost it in the the first half because City's players were more aggressive on it when the United players were waiting for the ball. Maybe he wanted us to bypass that first wave of pressing. Wenger said something similar against Barcelona a while ago... Get out of the first wave of pressing and opportunities will come.
 
amolbhatia50k said:
Yep. There's nothing inherently wrong with sitting back. But I personally hate seeing United doing it at home. I better get used to it given it happened against Southampton at times as well, and well, because this is Jose Mourinho. I just thought maybe he always had the Barca excuse earlier. Turns out not to be the case at all.

Funnily enough, that performance under LVG at SB made me proud, because we were brave enough to take charge of the game even if we lost.
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It's not just Mourinho though. Fergie did it was United as well on occasion. He did it against Barca, Mourinho's Madrid, among other teams. It's just them being pragmatic. Van Gaal and Pep are more the type of managers who will play their way against everyone and make the opposition adapt to you.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
It doesn't mean all the time, just today it was needed. Other teams don't press like City.
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Exactly. More direct football and passing it into space is the way to go in our approach against City.

Today is was combination from both - team selection and individual errors. Lindgard, Micky IMO shouldn't have started based on current form and the magnitude of the game. Ibra, Blind, etc disappointed.

I thought it was good interview and identifying the mistakes made. Still early in the season.
 
bosnian_red said:
It's not just Mourinho though. Fergie did it was United as well on occasion. He did it against Barca, Mourinho's Madrid, among other teams. It's just them being pragmatic. Van Gaal and Pep are more the type of managers who will play their way against everyone and make the opposition adapt to you.
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Fergie actually went gungho against pep's barca team twice on CL finals... and still didn't lose 5-0... and we attacked mourinho's madrid at home etc.

You just can't compare. And fergie's teams play counter attack to almost perfection without having to hoof balls too much.
 
donkeyfish said:
I wonder how common it is that players fail to make the tactical choices the manager tells them to do. Not exactly comforting, if true. Perhaps its a habitual thing, but it should be pretty straightforward to at least try adhering to your managers instructions.
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Maybe this is what he meant about getting players out of certain habits. Last season it was pass, pass, mostly short passes. It played right into City's hands.
 
RedChip said:
Yeah, thought the same. Thought station was for stationary; so my interpretation is not to pass to first stationary player, whom they can press easily.
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Nah I think station merely means a station the ball can arrive, i. e. passing option, or simply team mate.

I'd reckon 'first station' passes for example for the RCB would be the RB, LCB or most of all nearest holding midfielder.
 
The first station football comment by Jose makes sense in a way, regardless of how it is interpreted. The City players will hound the zone on the pitch where our players have won the ball back, in the hope that they quickly win it by pressurising the player who has the ball or the player about to receive the short pass. Therefore, it is sensible to release the ball into the spaces in behind the city press and defence, not exactly rocket science.

But the system and selection of players weren't fit for purpose. The lack of threat in behind without Rashford or Martial, meant that City could press high and squeeze the space. This led to us being caught in possession a lot. Second half was a lot better, as we threatened several times in behind with Rashford on the left and were a bit unlucky in a sense. But we just don't have that balance yet or the team cohesion.
 
Gasolin said:
I think it's the closest player to pass to. And yes many times United lost it in the the first half because City's players were more aggressive on it when the United players were waiting for the ball. Maybe he wanted us to bypass that first wave of pressing. Wenger said something similar against Barcelona a while ago... Get out of the first wave of pressing and opportunities will come.
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Yes, Fernando said in espn brazil that in the second half United stopped doing short passes. maybe thats it
 
The United said:
Fergie actually went gungho against pep's barca team twice on CL finals... and still didn't lose 5-0... and we attacked mourinho's madrid at home etc.

You just can't compare. And fergie's teams play counter attack to almost perfection without having to hoof balls too much.
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This thing is getting quite boring actually. SAF didn't Park the fecking Bus at home. There were games where we got outplayed at home but we didn't approach the game with a negative mind set.
Even with 10 men we battered Madrid at OT, a far superior team in every department at that time.
And when we did play a more conservative game away from home, they're more ambitious than typical Jose's big game approach away from home. I don't really understand why nowadays people constantly need to bring up SAF to defend Jose's negative approach. Is it just because he's our manager now? Jose's negative approach is well known where as SAF's isn't (or Ancelotti, Wenger etc.) and there must be a reason for that.
 
The United said:
Fergie actually went gungho against pep's barca team twice on CL finals... and still didn't lose 5-0... and we attacked mourinho's madrid at home etc.

You just can't compare. And fergie's teams play counter attack to almost perfection without having to hoof balls too much.
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We counter attacked them like Mourinho went to do today. We just didn't execute it well today as our wingers played really badly in the first half. The hoofing was mainly seen in the last 15 minutes or so when we tired and basically didn't create a thing from it.
 
Cristiano Lell said:
Nah I think station merely means a station the ball can arrive, i. e. passing option, or simply team mate.

I'd reckon 'first station' passes for example for the RCB would be the RB, LCB or most of all nearest holding midfielder.
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Ah, Ok.

There should be a football wiki for some of us!
 
ReDDHDevilS said:
This thing is getting quite boring actually. SAF didn't Park the fecking Bus at home. There were games we got outplayed at home but we didn't approach the game with a negative mind set.
Even with 10 men we battered Madrid at OT, a far superior team in every department at that time.
And when we did play a more conservative game away from home, they're more ambitious than typical Jose's big game approach away from home. I don't really understand why nowadays people constantly need to bring up SAF to defend Jose's negative approach. Is it just because he's our manager now? Jose's negative approach is well known where as SAF's isn't (or Ancelotti, Wenger etc.) and there must be a reason for that.
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I know. I like jose and think he would be the 2nd best manager to manage us after SAF. But, people would be a bit naive and blind not to see increasingly negative shit he is spouting and playing lately.
 
bosnian_red said:
We counter attacked them like Mourinho went to do today. We just didn't execute it well today as our wingers played really badly in the first half. The hoofing was mainly seen in the last 15 minutes or so when we tired and basically didn't create a thing from it.
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We counter who? Against pep barca?

We played more open than we did today in the first half. The only negative high profile game we played on purpose was againt dinho's barca in 08 and fergie said he couldn't do it anymore in another match.

We outplayed both jose's inter and madrid in CL as well.
 
siw2007 said:
The first station football comment by Jose makes sense in a way, regardless of how it is interpreted. The City players will hound the zone on the pitch where our players have won the ball back, in the hope that they quickly win it by pressurising the player who has the ball or the player about to receive the short pass. Therefore, it is sensible to release the ball into the spaces in behind the city press and defence, not exactly rocket science.

But the system and selection of players weren't fit for purpose. The lack of threat in behind without Rashford or Martial, meant that City could press high and squeeze the space. This led to us being caught in possession a lot. Second half was a lot better, as we threatened several times in behind with Rashford on the left and were a bit unlucky in a sense. But we just don't have that balance yet or the team cohesion.
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Pretty much what I said earlier and I think, from what Jose said afterwards, he was tempted to make these changes after 20 minutes! He blames himself, but also to a certain degree, players who don't do what is asked of them and you can't really legislate for that if they don't. People are criticising Jose for criticising players (although not in name...the subs indicate who they mainly are)...but to be honest, I think at this stage of getting United back on form, it's fair game and something all these so called 'big European' managers will do during the season. Ferguson never blamed players by name...but you bloody knew he was pissed off with one or two if they weren't playing the next game!
 
ReDDHDevilS said:
This thing is getting quite boring actually. SAF didn't Park the fecking Bus at home. There were games where we got outplayed at home but we didn't approach the game with a negative mind set.
Even with 10 men we battered Madrid at OT, a far superior team in every department at that time.
And when we did play a more conservative game away from home, they're more ambitious than typical Jose's big game approach away from home. I don't really understand why nowadays people constantly need to bring up SAF to defend Jose's negative approach. Is it just because he's our manager now? Jose's negative approach is well known where as SAF's isn't (or Ancelotti, Wenger etc.) and there must be a reason for that.
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Didn't we do that vs Barca in 2008
 
bosnian_red said:
It's not just Mourinho though. Fergie did it was United as well on occasion. He did it against Barca, Mourinho's Madrid, among other teams. It's just them being pragmatic. Van Gaal and Pep are more the type of managers who will play their way against everyone and make the opposition adapt to you.
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Because they're Madrid and Barca.

I didn't see Arsenal particularly adapt against us at the Emirates last season.

DomesticTadpole said:
It doesn't mean all the time, just today it was needed. Other teams don't press like City.
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Of course. I just expected Mourinho to have a more effective answer. At least he could have picked players who would follow his instructions. Pep certainly did.
 
Stack said:
I have sympathy for Jose here, the problem wasnt City going through the middle because they were actually going wide early and going around our midfield before coming in. If Lingard and Miki had done their jobs properly City wouldnt have been able to do this so easily. Its probably why he subbed both of them. City went wide early, most of their middle third play was on the flanks, once they got past the line of our CM they came back in. It was a pretty clear pattern. Every ball from their own defensive third went wide, once they hit our defensive third they came in behind our CM. Fellaini was being sucked wide as they got past our wide players leaving gaps behind. He had to go wide to provide cover.
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It was the problem. Yes, De Bruyne made some good runs down the channels, but there were countless times Silva and De Bruyne picked up the ball in behind our midfield.

Jose knew there was a problem. This is why Jose put Herrera on in the second half. It was so we could go man for man with City in midfield and have someone in front of our back four. Apart from counter's in the second half, which was going to be inevitable as we were pushing for the goal, City didn't really pose a threat.
 
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