Napoli boss proposal for new European league

[stevoc]

Kids are less interested in football than we were 20/30 years ago because what kids are watching today is much, much shitter than what we were watching in the 90s and early 2000's.

The idiots who have ruined the game, now want to ruin it further as some sort of answer to why people aren't interested.

At risk of sounding like a grumpy old cnut I tend to agree, football in general just isn't as entertaining as it used to be.

We dont have enough entertainers in the game in reality which is why CR7 and Messi are still considered the pinnacle of the game.

I dont enjoy the high pressing football we have today compared to the stuff we had in the 80s and 90s. I enjoy a good team goal just as much as anyone else but individual brilliance is the best part of football today. Today its mostly supreme athletes playing at breakneck speeds being pressed intensely constantly.

Nail on head mate, big part of why football in general these days just isn't that interesting as a spectacle.

Too many teams just press for pressing sake, get two teams that spend the entire 90 minutes constantly high pressing each other and it's almost guaranteed to result in a snooze fest in terms of entertainment.

 

[stevoc]

It's also less accessible to a ridiculous degree. Kids largely can't afford to watch football any more, whereas it used to be on a free television channel every Saturday when I was growing up in the 90s.

That is also a big reason kids are losing interest, if the current set-up was in place in the 90's I probably wouldn't have been able to watch any Champions League games with them being on BT instead of ITV.

 

[stu_1992]

Ugh. They can feck off coming out of the woodwork with these proposals designed only to like the pockets of the big clubs. Yes this is more inclusive than the original super league proposal, but under no circumstances should any reform of European football involve reducing the wise of thr top domestic divisions. That benefits an incredibly small fee but could potentially highly devastating implications for smaller clubs.

 

[Schmeichel's Cartwheel]

Can they not just unseed the CL and EL so we don’t get the same bloody groups and same knockout ties each year?

Also it’s obvious this is money related so feck him

Without seeding we could see groups like

Group A
Bayern Munich
PSG
Man United
Real Madrid

Group B
Wolfsburg
Club Brugge
Sheriff
Zenit

Group C
Barcelona
Juventus
Liverpool
Dortmund

Group D
Dynamo Kiev
Young Boys
Salzburg
Lille

Would be potentially disastrous for interest in the knockout rounds.

 

[golden_blunder]

But why? Why are high transfer fees so disgusting?

Aren't transfers how the money is naturally distributed back down through football's tiers? If Brentford somehow produce the next Lionel Messi, why do you want to cap the money they can make when/if they sell him and use it to catapult themselves up?

Why are high transfer fees disgusting?

Spoken like a true football gamer fan rather than a traditional football fan. Football was always the working mans/woman’s game. People could afford to watch. People could afford to buy a top every season for their kids. Now they are being priced out in favour of casual fans with no real affinity to a team but who can afford to do those things. Until prices stop rising the ordinary people are slowly being phased out. Why do prices go up? Because the crazy agents want more and more for each deal. Prices have already gone crazy. It’s imperative that clubs across Europe talk about caps. Some of the biggest clubs have got their financial backs up to the wall already. Do we need to perpetuate that further by creating another money generating competition or updating what we already have? For me it’s the latter. The former May create more money but it will create more and more 100million pound players who aren’t worth it. Football needs to stop and take stock

 

[noodlehair]

Young people have more options for entertainment now and many don't involve them having to leave their bedroom. There's nothing they can do with football that will change that. It's still a very popular firm of entertainment for all ages but you know, the more TV channels there are the less people will be watching the same one. Even if all the others are a bit shit/less popular by comparison

 

[JPRouve]

I disagree with that. If a player was worth £50,000,000 5 years ago and is worth £100,000,000 now clubs need extra revenue to buy the same class of player. The inflation in player prices is a pretty obvious problem I think and it's not sustainable long-term. When you says it's only a few owners, pretty much every major club in Europe wanted to join a cash-cow in the summer and the only real reason for that was to gain revenue.

If the money coming in rises naturally player prices would not rise nearly as quickly because it would be a natural competitive market.

That's not how it works. The inflation in football whether we are talking about transfer or wages is preceded by an increase of value of TV and commercial deals which has nothing to do with trying to spend more on transfers but the simple fact that with technology Football has become more accessible internationally which means that it is more valuable for companies when it comes to advertisement and in general visibility, these companies the likes of Samsung, Visa or bwin.

As a rule clubs do not spend more than they have and they don't have to, there is no inflation to sustain or follow, there is a pot of money and when you don't have money you don't spend.

 

[RedDevil@84]

2. stop hiring boring managers like Mourinho. Get more attacking coaches and formations. Show the likes of Jose etc that their ways are no longer the best ways. I can empathise with this complaint as LVG practically turned me off football for a year

Nonsense. There are many ways to approach a football game. Entertainment cannot be forced.

 

[carvajal]

His 2 main complaints;

1. CL and EL don’t generate enough money anymore to keep up with buying elite players
2. Young people being driven away because not enough entertainment anymore

The two points coincide with what Florentino and Agnelli said, and in this case Napoli are not a super elite evil club trying to eat all the super stars.
In any case, I don't think his idea has the funding that the super league does. Some kind of democratic system could be agreed as he says,to establish superliga A,B and even C.
I think that in the end the teams chosen would be basically those of the super league

 

[Skills]

Why are high transfer fees disgusting?

Spoken like a true football gamer fan rather than a traditional football fan. Football was always the working mans/woman’s game. People could afford to watch. People could afford to buy a top every season for their kids. Now they are being priced out in favour of casual fans with no real affinity to a team but who can afford to do those things. Until prices stop rising the ordinary people are slowly being phased out. Why do prices go up? Because the crazy agents want more and more for each deal. Prices have already gone crazy. It’s imperative that clubs across Europe talk about caps. Some of the biggest clubs have got their financial backs up to the wall already. Do we need to perpetuate that further by creating another money generating competition or updating what we already have? For me it’s the latter. The former May create more money but it will create more and more 100million pound players who aren’t worth it. Football needs to stop and take stock

You're confusing cause & effect. Players are costing more and getting paid more because clubs actually have more money to spend. Not the other way around. The wages and fees in football have explode after the record TV deals because clubs have more money to actually spend.

Football tops were always expensive. My parents definitely couldn't afford to buy me a new one every season. The elite clubs in European and English football were always hard to access - the terraces in the 70s and 80s were still packed, when the country had much less people. People were just less picky if they wanted a matchday experience - they'd go and watch smaller clubs for the same experience. The TV prices are expensive but at the same time you are essentially complaining about having to pay money to have access to more games than ever (especially if you support a top club like United). You're also essentially complaining of having to buy the convenience of being able to watch more football than ever in your own living room - something the working man of the past didn't even have an option for.

 

[JPRouve]

You're confusing cause & effect. Players are costing more and getting paid more because clubs actually have more money to spend. Not the other way around. The wages and fees in football have explode after the record TV deals because clubs have more money to actually spend.

Football tops were always expensive. My parents definitely couldn't afford to buy me a new one every season. The elite clubs in European and English football were always hard to access - the terraces in the 70s and 80s were still packed, when the country had much less people. People were just less picky if they wanted a matchday experience - they'd go and watch smaller clubs for the same experience. The TV prices are expensive but at the same time you are essentially complaining about having to pay money to have access to more games than ever (especially if you support a top club like United). You're also essentially complaining of having to buy the convenience of being able to watch more football than ever in your own living room - something the working man of the past didn't even have an option for.

Yeah, I was thinking about the TV part. People would mainly follow games through the radio not TV, which I believe is still possible.

 

[Iker Quesadillas]

You're confusing cause & effect. Players are costing more and getting paid more because clubs actually have more money to spend. Not the other way around. The wages and fees in football have explode after the record TV deals because clubs have more money to actually spend.

Cool, if money in football has exploded after record tv deals then they can lower the price of tickets.

 

[Red_toad]

I don't understand this. You want money to stop coming into the game?

Agents and players don’t put money into the game, they take it out for their bank accounts, lifestyle and excesses. Players may bring the fans, but the game isn’t able to support their growing excessive wages forever, something will break eventually.

 

[JPRouve]

Cool, if money in football has exploded after record tv deals then they can lower the price of tickets.

Why would they do that when stadiums have the same attendancy rates? And it's not an if, there is significantly more money in football today than 10 years ago and there was significanly more money in football 10 years ago than 20 years ago.

 

[JPRouve]

Agents and players don’t put money into the game, they take it out for their bank accounts, lifestyle and excesses. Players may bring the fans, but the game isn’t able to support their growing excessive wages forever, something will break eventually.

Footballers are the ones creating value, it is their labour that we watch and is therefore worth every cents put in Football.

 

[Kentonio]

Clubs are able to spend more because they generate more money, as a rule they don't spend beyond their means

I'm sorry, what now?

 

[Gio]

I don't believe it's to do with how entertaining the football is. It's about the lack of accessibility. 20 years ago the Champions League was on terrestrial TV, alongside the UEFA cup. Even Sky Sports News was available on freeview. Now you need both Sky and BT to watch both the Premier League and Champions League. In a world with on-demand tele it's such an outdated format. It's only a matter of time before the World Cup and Euros won't be on the BBC and ITV, meaning less kids watching that as well.

Aye, I understand that every European country outside the UK has a free-to-air CL game on every week.

Given many fans bond with the sport by attending games when they are kids, clubs haven't helped themselves by pricing many families out of matchdays. Clubs have been too busy chasing annual revenue at the expense of building long-term support.

If there are problems partly caused by the greed of clubs, the solution isn't about clubs becoming even greedier. It's pure short-term thinking looking from one transfer window to the next.

 

[JPRouve]

I'm sorry, what now?

It's literally what I wrote. As a rule clubs don't spend more than they have or can have.

 

[Iker Quesadillas]

Why would they do that when stadiums have the same attendancy rates? And it's not an if, there is significantly more money in football today than 10 years ago and there was significanly more money in football 10 years ago than 20 years ago.

Yes, clubs can make more money by charging high prices and many people will still go to the stadium, just like clubs can make more money by selling television rights for extremely high prices to the highest bidder, and then clubs can spend even more money in increasingly high transfer fees. What I'm saying is, I don't give a flying feck that they can do that.

 

[VeevaVee]

But why? Why are high transfer fees so disgusting?

Aren't transfers how the money is naturally distributed back down through football's tiers? If Brentford somehow produce the next Lionel Messi, why do you want to cap the money they can make when/if they sell him and use it to catapult themselves up?

When has that happened though? And they’d be snatched up long before they’re worth the cap.

The reason I want it to happen is because it’s the fans that are ultimately squeezed directly or indirectly, all for what becomes an arbitrary number at the end of the line with transfer fees or for lining players’ and agents’ pockets.

 

[matherto]

Without seeding we could see groups like

Group A
Bayern Munich
PSG
Man United
Real Madrid

Group B
Wolfsburg
Club Brugge
Sheriff
Zenit

Group C
Barcelona
Juventus
Liverpool
Dortmund

Group D
Dynamo Kiev
Young Boys
Salzburg
Lille

Would be potentially disastrous for interest in the knockout rounds.

But over time that would help the newer teams surely.

And as it is currently, you get the same ties over and over again.

I’m fine with unseeded.

 

[golden_blunder]

You're confusing cause & effect. Players are costing more and getting paid more because clubs actually have more money to spend. Not the other way around. The wages and fees in football have explode after the record TV deals because clubs have more money to actually spend.

Football tops were always expensive. My parents definitely couldn't afford to buy me a new one every season. The elite clubs in European and English football were always hard to access - the terraces in the 70s and 80s were still packed, when the country had much less people. People were just less picky if they wanted a matchday experience - they'd go and watch smaller clubs for the same experience. The TV prices are expensive but at the same time you are essentially complaining about having to pay money to have access to more games than ever (especially if you support a top club like United). You're also essentially complaining of having to buy the convenience of being able to watch more football than ever in your own living room - something the working man of the past didn't even have an option for.

No you are assuming I’m complying about those things. I am complaining about clubs trying to money grab in every way they can think off and the go-to option at the moment appears to be another league.
I am complaining because the ordinary man has been priced out of live games. Don’t tell me they’d rather stream, there’s nothing like a live game.
yes football has evolved but money is ruining it and will continue to

I presume because of your take on this you were in favour of a ESL?

 

[Cal?]

Cool, if money in football has exploded after record tv deals then they can lower the price of tickets.

That makes no economic sense whatsoever, let's not forget clubs are not charities.

 

[Cal?]

But over time that would help the newer teams surely.

And as it is currently, you get the same ties over and over again.

I’m fine with unseeded.

How is it in the interest of the super clubs to help the newer teams?

 

[golden_blunder]

Footballers are the ones creating value, it is their labour that we watch and is therefore worth every cents put in Football.

So you don’t care if your club hypothetically spends day €500m on a player? What has the common man got in touch with the game then?
there has to be a “that’s enough” moment

 

[JPRouve]

Yes, clubs can make more money by charging high prices and many people will still go to the stadium, just like clubs can make more money by selling television rights for extremely high prices to the highest bidder, and then clubs can spend even more money in increasingly high transfer fees. What I'm saying is, I don't give a flying feck that they can do that.

I don't follow your point, who said that you should care about it? You suggested that if they make more money then they should reduce ticket prices which makes no sense for them since demand is high.

 

[Cal?]

No you are assuming I’m complying about those things. I am complaining about clubs trying to money grab in every way they can think off and the go-to option at the moment appears to be another league.
I am complaining because the ordinary man has been priced out of live games. Don’t tell me they’d rather stream, there’s nothing like a live game.
yes football has evolved but money is ruining it and will continue to

I presume because of your take on this you were in favour of a ESL?

You can make the same argument with everything in life, people are getting prices out of everything as everything becomes more expensive. Why should football be any different?

 

[Cal?]

So you don’t care if your club hypothetically spends day €500m on a player? What has the common man got in touch with the game then?
there has to be a “that’s enough” moment

Not at all, Hollywood studios used to blockbuster movies for less than 100m, nowadays all the MCU movies costs a few more times that.

It makes no differnece to the 'common man' if the transfer record fee is 50m or 500m.

 

[matherto]

How is it in the interest of the super clubs to help the newer teams?

It isn’t

But if new clubs reach the knockout stages or go further than that helps them doesn’t it?

The opposite of what the big clubs want is what we should all want.

 

[golden_blunder]

When has that happened though? And they’d be snatched up long before they’re worth the cap.

The reason I want it to happen is because theit’s the fans that are ultimately squeezed directly or indirectly

Bingo. Fans will pay for it whilst the likes of the Glazers will pocket more whilst City and PSG splash out on a player worth €300m in transfer fee, 1m a month in salary, 500k a month in ‘ethical fees’ and 20m in agents fees.
How can any ‘fan’ be ok with the way this is going?

 

[golden_blunder]

Not at all, Hollywood studios used to blockbuster movies for less than 100m, nowadays all the MCU movies costs a few more times that.

It makes no differnece to the 'common man' if the transfer record fee is 50m or 500m.

That’s movies. Different thing altogether

 

[Cal?]

It isn’t

But if new clubs reach the knockout stages or go further than that helps them doesn’t it?

The opposite of what the big clubs want is what we should all want.

I don't understand the concept of any United fan advocating something terrible for United. It's almost as if you care about the rest of the clubs more than United.

 

[golden_blunder]

You can make the same argument with everything in life, people are getting prices out of everything as everything becomes more expensive. Why should football be any different?

So again you’d have no concerns about a club spending €500m on a new player?

 

[Cal?]

That’s movies. Different thing altogether

How is it different? Movies, football are ultimately a form of entertainment.

 

[Schmeichel's Cartwheel]

But over time that would help the newer teams surely.

And as it is currently, you get the same ties over and over again.

I’m fine with unseeded.

Unseeded would be fun, as in fully unseeded. United & Liverpool in the same group. It’ll never happen though as UEFA don’t want teams like Madrid & Barca going out in the group stages while BATE Borisov & Young Boys make the knockouts. It’s a money thing.

 

[JPRouve]

So you don’t care if your club hypothetically spends day €500m on a player? What has the common man got in touch with the game then?
there has to be a “that’s enough” moment

If revenues are multiplied by 5 or 10 then I don't see why I should care. And I don't really understand the second question, why should the common man be in touch with professional Football? And it's not as if he was in touch with a 1m transfer fee, I really don't understand that point.

 

[golden_blunder]

I don't understand the concept of any United fan advocating something terrible for United. It's almost as if you care about the rest of the clubs more than United.

How is it against United if we are suggesting consistency across the board?

 

[Cal?]

So again you’d have no concerns about a club spending €500m on a new player?

Not at all, if they can afford it, why not?

Some people spend 10k+ on a bottle of wine.

 

[kouroux]

He does have a point concerning the ridiculous number of (pointless) games teams play

 

[Cal?]

How is it against United if we are suggesting consistency across the board?

United, even post-Sir Alex are better than most and gets seeded accordingly, why would we as United fans want an unseeded draw which makes it so much easier to go out in the group stage?