I’ve read a lot about this new format and I cannot get my head around it.
What are they doing?
What are they doing?
New champions league format
- Thread starter Rolandofgilead
- Start date
It should stick to 32 teams and just do 4 groups of 8. first 4 go through. 1st vs 4th and 2nd vs 3rd in the first knockout round. That way there is only 1 extra group game.
Or that. That fecking group setup is so shit. New format looks even worse.
A big two would be a start.
Oh man. The Champion's League needs to be smaller. Not bigger. Do away with the league format and just have 2 legged knockout rounds from the first round. The high seeded 'big clubs' can join in the later rounds, like the FA Cup.
New format is bad because the 24th team actually advances to the ko and could win the Champions league. Bassically the 10 groupe games are not interesting at all. There is no point in getting 1th or 5th in the league as its same thing, same for 18 or 22. We will have games where some teams wont feature the strongest 11 on purpose, others depending on others too often.
Best format in order to get more money for both uefa and the top clubs is the return of the second groupe phase, where you have 4 groups of death similar to the esl and a lot of buzz. A possible death group this year could have been : Bayern, Barca, Atletico, Juventus. Any lesser club that manages to qualify will have 6 more games and tons of money. The normal groupe phase, while it stays the same, the stakes are higher in order to qualify.
Also I would like a return of the cup winners cup, as direct ko. All participants can still play in the cl or europa, its a paralel competition. However in order not to increase the calendar by 6 more games, all participant and cup winners will not play in their domestic cup competition that year. winners will also be granted a champions league place and to participate in the cup winners cup next season as well, having yet another chance to qualify for the cl. with this system the entire roster changes every year. This will increase the fa cup buzz, since it can lead to champions league qualification. The quarter finals of the cups winners cup can be very similar to the champions league, wich is what uefa and top clubs wants, more battles between top clubs in europe
Both systems would be better then either esl or swiss model.
Best format in order to get more money for both uefa and the top clubs is the return of the second groupe phase, where you have 4 groups of death similar to the esl and a lot of buzz. A possible death group this year could have been : Bayern, Barca, Atletico, Juventus. Any lesser club that manages to qualify will have 6 more games and tons of money. The normal groupe phase, while it stays the same, the stakes are higher in order to qualify.
Also I would like a return of the cup winners cup, as direct ko. All participants can still play in the cl or europa, its a paralel competition. However in order not to increase the calendar by 6 more games, all participant and cup winners will not play in their domestic cup competition that year. winners will also be granted a champions league place and to participate in the cup winners cup next season as well, having yet another chance to qualify for the cl. with this system the entire roster changes every year. This will increase the fa cup buzz, since it can lead to champions league qualification. The quarter finals of the cups winners cup can be very similar to the champions league, wich is what uefa and top clubs wants, more battles between top clubs in europe
Both systems would be better then either esl or swiss model.
I think giving a second chance to a big club which have contributed to the Champions League in seasons gone by isn't bad. I don't really understand the outrage anyway.
Poor Ilkay, has to play few more games to earn only 10 millions a year.
The more I think about this format the more I like it.
It keeps what works, the knockouts, and changes what is broken, the group stage. If this was a game sequel everybody would be raving.
Problem in the group stage was too many dead ringer games and top dogs taking it easy against each other because a draw was enough. Now that is going to be less the case. Top 8 will be needed to assure advancement, not top 16 like before. They'll have to work harder. And except for the very worst teams, hope remains alive when the playoff is set so low. So they'll offer hard resistance to the big clubs looking for an easy score. The 9th placed club has to play two extra games against a bottom rung side? Buhu, you're not good enough.The single ties will also help. With two games it's easy to settle for a defensive strategy hoping to knick a win in at least one of them. Will they be so cautious if it's one game and they need the points? This move is world cupish and I love it. Drawing the away game also adds the extra sharpness making your win more satisfying.
More money to the bigger clubs, but also more money to the smaller clubs. Not just more games, but a higher likelihood of advancing to the second round and get that payday as well. I think this edges in the small clubs favour because where the 9 to 16th placed clubs would be assured of getting that second round money before, now they will some of the time surrender it to a smaller club.
The only drawback is the 4-6 extra games you have to play. For a City player to have the nerve to complain is beyond belief. Perhaps he is just that thick, or on the bottle. No team is better equipped to handle it, and take advantage of it, than them. I heard Guardiola too a while back, saying they could not afford big players as if he was managing Brighton.
It keeps what works, the knockouts, and changes what is broken, the group stage. If this was a game sequel everybody would be raving.
Problem in the group stage was too many dead ringer games and top dogs taking it easy against each other because a draw was enough. Now that is going to be less the case. Top 8 will be needed to assure advancement, not top 16 like before. They'll have to work harder. And except for the very worst teams, hope remains alive when the playoff is set so low. So they'll offer hard resistance to the big clubs looking for an easy score. The 9th placed club has to play two extra games against a bottom rung side? Buhu, you're not good enough.The single ties will also help. With two games it's easy to settle for a defensive strategy hoping to knick a win in at least one of them. Will they be so cautious if it's one game and they need the points? This move is world cupish and I love it. Drawing the away game also adds the extra sharpness making your win more satisfying.
More money to the bigger clubs, but also more money to the smaller clubs. Not just more games, but a higher likelihood of advancing to the second round and get that payday as well. I think this edges in the small clubs favour because where the 9 to 16th placed clubs would be assured of getting that second round money before, now they will some of the time surrender it to a smaller club.
The only drawback is the 4-6 extra games you have to play. For a City player to have the nerve to complain is beyond belief. Perhaps he is just that thick, or on the bottle. No team is better equipped to handle it, and take advantage of it, than them. I heard Guardiola too a while back, saying they could not afford big players as if he was managing Brighton.
Here's who would have plausibly benefitted in recent seasons as I posted in another thread:
CL 21/22: Liverpool (9th),
CL 20/21: Arsenal (11th) and Spurs (14th) [or Lyon (15th)]
CL 19/20: Sevilla (7th) and Arsenal (9th)
CL 18/19: Sevilla (6th) and Arsenal (9th)
CL 17/18: Arsenal (11th),
CL 16/17:
Qualifying will be tweaked so its not quite accurate, but good enough to get an idea, but listed are clubs with the highest coefficient who did not qualify for the CL group stage through other means.
I know people like to lampoon Arsenal, but they will have earned this by consistently progressing in Europe. If anything this system should help ensure that all teams, just as Arsenal have, take the Europa League and the new Europa Conference League seriously, as you can qualify for the Champions League through strong, consistent European performances. The only change I would perhaps make is to limit the number of teams from a particular association that can qualify through this method to one. If that was the case, Lyon would have qualified instead of Spurs in 20/21. Changes may also be needed to how coefficients are earned in future.
To me at least, the potential interest in CL qualification is by seeing teams make it for the first time or on a rare occasion, and not in seeing one of the top teams in recent years missing out. This wouldn't take away from that.
Useful to see. So it's simply another tweak to favour the 3 big leagues at the expense of everyone else. Over the years I've lost count of how many of these tweaks have been made to incrementally increase the wealth of the richest clubs. The accumulative impact of these changes is huge.
It's not at the expense of others, because it is more spots and there are two additional spots still, one for the fifth association and one for another national champion. The proportion of teams from the 3 big leagues (which are England, Spain and Germany?) would only be slightly increased if they monopolise these two coefficient berths, but would actually be reduced if not.
As your analysis showed, these spots will always be filled by the big leagues. The English league will always get an extra place through this method. And then they'll get more points as a result. And on the cycle will go.
CL reforms are awful. The 10 group games are going to be dire as you know they will keep the seeding so that it assures the big clubs go through. Further this format requires 10-12 games to reduce 36 to 16. As for the historical performance places they're a joke.
What they should've done was go back to the two group stage format which would've been a Super League by proxy. Look at the type of groups they could've had this year:
Bayern
City
Barca
Lazio
Juventus
Chelsea
Atletico
Gladbach
Dippers
PSG
Sevilla
RBL
Real
Dortmund
Atlanta
Porto
What they should've done was go back to the two group stage format which would've been a Super League by proxy. Look at the type of groups they could've had this year:
Bayern
City
Barca
Lazio
Juventus
Chelsea
Atletico
Gladbach
Dippers
PSG
Sevilla
RBL
Real
Dortmund
Atlanta
Porto
No sympathy what is ever sorry. Most clubs in the CL are in a position to rotate if it’s such an issue of fatigue.
You would get the odd year when one of the big clubs from other leagues misses top four, but bottom line it would just straight up increase the slots for PL teams to 6 and not even for e.g. Leicester, but for Arsenal, because it's near impossible to actually lose that free spot, when you're playing CL football, while the other club misses out.
There's plenty of sides who play in Europe every season, or every four years out of five at the very least. The vast majority of those have performed nowhere near as well as many of the sides in my posts. I know Arsenal are the object of much scorn and derision, but they are high in the European club coefficient rankings because they consistently find a way to qualify and perform reasonably well in European football.
That still should not give them a guaranteed CL starting spot. At least that's the point many people seemed to be making when it came to ESL. Part of having an actual competition is that you can lose and that if you lose you suffer consequences.
Oh poor thing he has to play a few more games of FOOTBALL for a living, in the arguably more complete squad in the world. STOP THIS ABUSE! poor them earning just a few millions a year to play a game.
He has a point though it won't just be City having to play the extra games. Wheres the room in the calendar for potentially an extra 6 games?
I think the new UCL format is awful, but hearing a City player complaining FFS is ridiculous. They have the depth to play those games and more.
I hear you mate they do have the squad to cope with it, but many/most teams won't. I don't think there's anything wrong with a footballer speaking up about it even if it probably won't affect him personally.
The Super League proposal earlier in the week would have been great for United, Chelsea, Liverpool, City, Arse and Spurs but it didn't stop ex-players and fans of those clubs coming out against it.
This is a watered down version of the ESL and in my humble opinion a bad idea.
We are at saturation point of football on TV where people are becoming disillusioned with the game., and potential extra costs
What about legacy fans with season tickets being held to ransom to pay for these extra games.
The increase in the Euros of how many teams will take part and no doubt the World Cup will follow suit. The proposals of of other country and club competitions.
Surely so many games week in week out will only dilute the quality with 2nd and 3rd string teams, increased injuries and lack of training .
Enough is enough there is only so many weeks in a year and you can only flog a dead horse for so long
We are at saturation point of football on TV where people are becoming disillusioned with the game., and potential extra costs
What about legacy fans with season tickets being held to ransom to pay for these extra games.
The increase in the Euros of how many teams will take part and no doubt the World Cup will follow suit. The proposals of of other country and club competitions.
Surely so many games week in week out will only dilute the quality with 2nd and 3rd string teams, increased injuries and lack of training .
Enough is enough there is only so many weeks in a year and you can only flog a dead horse for so long
Agree, I just think it's cynical. Also I'm biased against City, feck em.
I'm with you on the feck City part. Guardiola had the cheek to talk about equality in football in his press conference earlier.
Usual for him, I remember he said something about them not having money for players some time ago. As cynical as it can get.
Extra few boring games perhaps gives us chance to play some squad palyers including lads form the academy which makes the quality go down another notch. WOuldn't we have a bigger chance to progress to knockout stage than last year in the "group of dead" though?
The good thing of this new format is that a team plays 10 different teams in the group phase, which is an improvement to the current format. The knockout phase remains the same.
Those 4-6 extra ucl games, can be compensated by reducing the Premier League (and La Liga and Serie A and Ligue1) to 18 teams, just like Bundesliga. I also think that english teams playing in europe, shouldn't be playing in the League Cup.
Perez has a point when he says that football needs big games played regularly, and removing 4 games against the likes of West Brom and Sheffield to play 4 extra games against some of the best teams in Europe is the better thing in my opinion.
Those 4-6 extra ucl games, can be compensated by reducing the Premier League (and La Liga and Serie A and Ligue1) to 18 teams, just like Bundesliga. I also think that english teams playing in europe, shouldn't be playing in the League Cup.
Perez has a point when he says that football needs big games played regularly, and removing 4 games against the likes of West Brom and Sheffield to play 4 extra games against some of the best teams in Europe is the better thing in my opinion.
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Seems as though there may be a slight twist, with it being based on a league's performance.
Based on club coefficient: United and Roma would take the additional places in the CL.
Based on the new proposal it would be: Spurs or Arsenal (whoever finishes 5th) and Feyenord.
I think it's a better idea than their first one, even if I'm still yet to be sold on the new format.
Basically the 5th placed gets the CL from EPL as long as Liverpool and City continues to perform well in CL knock out stages.
They had to do something. You want the best teams in it and the best teams are now the wealtiest.
Pretty much, England were 3rd in the ranking In the 19/20 season where Liverpool were knocked out by Atleti in R16 and City lost to Lyon in the QFs.
Before that England was outside the top 2 in 11/12, 12/13, 14/15 and 15/16.
This is so fecking transparent it’s laughable. It’s pretty much always going to be la liga and the prem. this whole scheme along with Europa league winners going into cl is just a way of getting “the big six” of the prem into the CL as much as possible. Although at least it’s down to 8 games. 10 was absurd.
You misspelled our name, sacrilege!
Full details
- format applies to all European competitions
- So for 16 teams they’ll have to play 10 games just get into the last 16
- surely this is the end of the league cup for any English team in Europe?
- how are the fixtures being decided ?
- uefa “consulted with fans”
- How have Holland performed better in Europe this season as a nation than Spain?
-“ One place will be awarded to a domestic champion by extending from four to five the number of clubs qualifying via the so-called “Champions Path”.
Da feck does this mean ? Which domestic champion?
- whats the incentive to finish 1st rather than 8th? You could win your first five games and then just not giving a feck about the last three and you’d still probably qualify.
Following an exhaustive consultation with stakeholders in the game, the UEFA Executive Committee has today in Vienna approved the final format and access list for European club competitions as of the 2024/25 season further to its decision of 19 April 2021 to introduce the so-called “Swiss system”.
The key amendments relate to the reduction from 10 matches to 8 in the league phase of the UEFA Champions League and the change of criteria for the allocation of two of the four additional places in the UEFA Champions League, removing access based on club coefficient. This confirms UEFA’s strong commitment to the principle of open competitions and sporting merit, while recognising the need to protect domestic leagues.
The eight matches of the UEFA Champions League will be played over the ten European weeks foreseen by the decision made in April 2021. The UEFA Champions League, UEFA Europa League and UEFA Europa Conference League will all enjoy one week of calendar exclusivity.
The four additional places created by the increase from 32 to 36 teams in the league phase of the UEFA Champions League will be allocated as follows:
• One place will go to the club ranked third in the championship of the association in fifth position in the UEFA national association ranking.
• One place will be awarded to a domestic champion by extending from four to five the number of clubs qualifying via the so-called “Champions Path”.
• The final two places will go to the associations with the best collective performance by their clubs in the previous season (total number of points obtained divided by the number of participating clubs). Those two associations will earn one place for the club best ranked in the domestic league behind the UEFA Champions League positions. For example, at the end of the current season the two associations adding one club to the Champions League, based on the collective performance of their clubs would be England and the Netherlands.
• The UEFA Executive Committee once again confirmed that all games before the final will still be played midweek, recognising the importance of the domestic calendar of games across Europe.
Commenting on the decisions, UEFA President Aleksander Čeferin, said:
“UEFA has clearly shown today that we are fully committed to respecting the fundamental values of sport and to defending the key principle of open competitions, with qualification based on sporting merit, fully in line with the values and solidarity-based European sports model.
“Today’s decisions conclude an extensive consultation process during which we listened to the ideas of fans, players, coaches, national associations, clubs and leagues to name but a few, with the aim to find the best solution for the development and success of European football, both domestically and on the international club stage.
“We are convinced that the format chosen strikes the right balance and that it will improve the competitive balance and generate solid revenues that can be distributed to clubs, leagues and into grassroots football across our continent while increasing the appeal and popularity of our club competitions”
“I am really pleased that it was a unanimous decision of the UEFA Executive Committee, with the European Club Association, European Leagues and National Associations all agreeing with the proposal made. Another proof that European football is more united than ever.
“Qualification will thus remain purely based on sporting performance and the dream to participate will remain for all clubs.”
Format summary
Taking the total number of teams from 32 to 36 in the UEFA Champions League, the biggest change will see a transformation from the traditional group stage to a single league phase including all participating teams. Every club will now be guaranteed a minimum of 8 league stage games against 8 different opponents (four home games, four away) rather than the previous six matches against three teams, played on a home-and-away basis.
The top eight sides in the league will qualify automatically for the knockout stage, while the teams finishing in ninth to 24th place will compete in a two-legged play-off to secure their path to the last 16 of the competition.
Similar format changes will also be applied to the UEFA Europa League (8 matches in the league stage) and UEFA Europa Conference League (6 matches in the league stage) and both will also include 36 teams in the league phase.
The key amendments relate to the reduction from 10 matches to 8 in the league phase of the UEFA Champions League and the change of criteria for the allocation of two of the four additional places in the UEFA Champions League, removing access based on club coefficient. This confirms UEFA’s strong commitment to the principle of open competitions and sporting merit, while recognising the need to protect domestic leagues.
The eight matches of the UEFA Champions League will be played over the ten European weeks foreseen by the decision made in April 2021. The UEFA Champions League, UEFA Europa League and UEFA Europa Conference League will all enjoy one week of calendar exclusivity.
The four additional places created by the increase from 32 to 36 teams in the league phase of the UEFA Champions League will be allocated as follows:
• One place will go to the club ranked third in the championship of the association in fifth position in the UEFA national association ranking.
• One place will be awarded to a domestic champion by extending from four to five the number of clubs qualifying via the so-called “Champions Path”.
• The final two places will go to the associations with the best collective performance by their clubs in the previous season (total number of points obtained divided by the number of participating clubs). Those two associations will earn one place for the club best ranked in the domestic league behind the UEFA Champions League positions. For example, at the end of the current season the two associations adding one club to the Champions League, based on the collective performance of their clubs would be England and the Netherlands.
• The UEFA Executive Committee once again confirmed that all games before the final will still be played midweek, recognising the importance of the domestic calendar of games across Europe.
Commenting on the decisions, UEFA President Aleksander Čeferin, said:
“UEFA has clearly shown today that we are fully committed to respecting the fundamental values of sport and to defending the key principle of open competitions, with qualification based on sporting merit, fully in line with the values and solidarity-based European sports model.
“Today’s decisions conclude an extensive consultation process during which we listened to the ideas of fans, players, coaches, national associations, clubs and leagues to name but a few, with the aim to find the best solution for the development and success of European football, both domestically and on the international club stage.
“We are convinced that the format chosen strikes the right balance and that it will improve the competitive balance and generate solid revenues that can be distributed to clubs, leagues and into grassroots football across our continent while increasing the appeal and popularity of our club competitions”
“I am really pleased that it was a unanimous decision of the UEFA Executive Committee, with the European Club Association, European Leagues and National Associations all agreeing with the proposal made. Another proof that European football is more united than ever.
“Qualification will thus remain purely based on sporting performance and the dream to participate will remain for all clubs.”
Format summary
Taking the total number of teams from 32 to 36 in the UEFA Champions League, the biggest change will see a transformation from the traditional group stage to a single league phase including all participating teams. Every club will now be guaranteed a minimum of 8 league stage games against 8 different opponents (four home games, four away) rather than the previous six matches against three teams, played on a home-and-away basis.
The top eight sides in the league will qualify automatically for the knockout stage, while the teams finishing in ninth to 24th place will compete in a two-legged play-off to secure their path to the last 16 of the competition.
Similar format changes will also be applied to the UEFA Europa League (8 matches in the league stage) and UEFA Europa Conference League (6 matches in the league stage) and both will also include 36 teams in the league phase.
- format applies to all European competitions
- So for 16 teams they’ll have to play 10 games just get into the last 16
- surely this is the end of the league cup for any English team in Europe?
- how are the fixtures being decided ?
- uefa “consulted with fans”
- How have Holland performed better in Europe this season as a nation than Spain?
-“ One place will be awarded to a domestic champion by extending from four to five the number of clubs qualifying via the so-called “Champions Path”.
Da feck does this mean ? Which domestic champion?
- whats the incentive to finish 1st rather than 8th? You could win your first five games and then just not giving a feck about the last three and you’d still probably qualify.
Could they perhaps expedite this whole legacy slot thing for a season or so.
We could use all the help we can get.
We could use all the help we can get.
Do you need a PhD to understand the new format, like with the Nations League?
Sure someone’s already asked but who’s get in the CL if it was in place now and the PL season was over? United or Spurs?