Next permanent manager | Poll updated

[Coops73]

Just watched Ajax v Benfica and I have to say how they didn’t win I’ll never know, their passing, pressing and forward play was excellent, so quick and aggressive, especially in the first half, how the feck Ten Hag will get the numpties at our club playing like that I don’t know.

If the stories of us going for Anthony are true I’m all up for that, very exciting player, as for Timber he was playing more as a defensive midfielder and some fella called Blind wasn’t too shabby either and as a side note I thought Darwin Nunez reminded me of Andy Carroll back in the day, movement, build, ponytail, Geordie accent.

 

[Sammy McIlroys fan club]

So, apparently, it is going to be Ten Hag. Good I think he is the best currently available candidate and I look forward to seeing what he can do.
I believe he will take over a United team in the Europa league and he should use it as the opportunity it is to blood some of the youngsters in that competition and the league cup to prove if they can cut it and be involved in the premier league squad.
As has been said multiple times United's squad is very bloated and ineffective. In the summer we could easily lose 6 or 7 players, Pogba, Mata, Lingard, Henderson, Jones, Bailly and possibly Matic. We will likely bring in two or three, a right back a DM and either a striker or a right winger.
If we fail to land an adequate DM I believe there is a case to keep Matic and play him once a week in the Premier league and give Garner his chance in the midweek matches as there is less riding on them as no-one really likes the Europa league before Xmas. Similarly if Ronaldo stays he should be nowhere near a Thursday night squad and concentrating on performing in the Sunday league games. Let Rashford or even Martial lead the line in the Europa league. I hope the club and the new manager whoever it is have enough sense to use the Europa league as a testing ground and concentrate all the main resources on the league, certainly up to Xmas.
Once the world cup is out of the way and the January transfer window open the world will look a very different place and we may be able to pick up or off-load players as required.

 

[BarstoolProphet]

Ajaxsuarez' post would have worried me several years ago, but our shit appointments post SAF has changed my view a bit - now it sounds like what we need.

Look at previous managers:

Moyes: We tried to clone SAF straight away. Problem was he inherited a squad probably without any desire to adapt to a new environment. That his tactics was ultra-defensive and that he wanted to scout players for eight years before signing them didn't help either (especially with a newbie boss helping him). Only promoted Januzaj of note.

LvG: on paper a perfect match - a huge and respected name with the authority to run a big club and with history in developing star players from the academy. Wanted a thin squad just for that. Problem was there wouldn't be any surviving United fans from his insomnia-ridden tactics before we could see it bear any fruition. Also the promoted players included the likes of McNair, CBJ and Blackett - the latter being exceptionally dreadful from the get go. I'll give him Rashford though - even though he got incredibly lucky with that because of injuries to first teamers and even the first-choice academy backup got injured in the warmup before the match against Midtjylland where Rashford made his name.

Mourinho - Now we tried the galactico strategy and the youth was completely forgotten during that hiring process. Huge names were being signed and the biggest ego in the game to oversee it. Only experienced and physical players were allowed. Unsurprisingly Mou fell out with everyone from the tea lady to his own shadow and his tactics were as relevant as Kodak. Only promoted McT but felt more like a protest than having any belief in him.

Ole: in another desperate attempt to get back to winning ways was to bring back "The United Way" where tactical skills took a backseat. Ole, well aware of the famous stat involving academy players, handed out debuts to every academy player and their families, but hard to recognise any youth strategy despite that. Promoted our biggest talent since '92 and made him a mainstay - but that legacy has been ruined now.

So now it feels like EtH is exactly what we need - a person with a clear identity suited to bring us back to the summit. And more in the direction of Pep and Klopp rather than an ode to the past or some diffuse "The United Way". Obviously youth is ingrained in our history, but I bet he will promote them if their talent is big enough.

 

[Ajaxsuarez]

seem to be changing the goalposts here a bit. 1st it was he didn't promote youth. then it was he wasn't ruthless enough, now it's he's not going to win over the players because he's an awkward farmer, part of me thinks your sad he's leaving, which is fair enough.

I'm sad he's leaving but I'm highlighting his flaws, which have been genuine frustrations this past two seasons in particular, because I genuinely think United is one of the few places he could go to and fail.

It's not changing the goalposts. I was initially responding to comments saying he would give youth the chance, then to questions of why I still rated him despite that, but then also why I thought he would fail at United despite really rating him as a manager.

He's not ruthless enough in cutting the dross, because he isn't willing to leave those spots to talents who haven't proven they're reliable first-team footballers yet (but how could they have?), and is in that same way too cautious in holding on to players for depth even when they aren't going to help bring the club to a higher level anymore.

The awkward farmer part is why I think he'll fail at United of all clubs in particular, combined with the structure of the club and that the nature of (some of) the players in your dressing room, especially if, if I'm to believe a lot of posters on here, that dressing room calls for a massive overhaul.

As an example of my frustration with trusting youth, is his interview just this month about why he continues to call up (the never played) Labyad over our (super)talent Unuvar, who is now the most consistent performer in our reserves (who play in the Dutch second tier) and has built up his physical capacity to the level expected (this was his issue previous season):

Erik ten Hag does not think that Naci Ünüvar is ready for a permanent place in the A-selection of Ajax. On Friday afternoon, the coach of the Amsterdammers announced at the press conference that Zakaria Labyad will be preferred over Ünüvar in the match selection for next Sunday's Klassieker. In addition, the coach provided a medical update on Sean Klaiber, Remko Pasveer and Maarten Stekelenburg.

As Labyad decides on an expiring contract and Ünüvar is seen as an up-and-coming talent from his own youth, Ten Hag was asked why he doesn't or rarely includes the latter in the selection so far. "Naci is on the right track, but he is not yet on the road to make the difference for us," responded Ten Hag, who indicated that he expects more added value from Labyad at the moment. "'He has already proven it in the past. You have to look at his statistics. If you don't play, of course you can't work on your stats. But when Labyad played for Ajax, he always delivered."


Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version)

https://www.voetbalzone.nl/doc.asp?uid=401599

The problem though is that Unuvar can never show that he can make the difference for the first team if he isn't given the chance in the first place.

Again, Noa Lang was in this exact same position, and went to Brugge, and in his first season destroyed the Belgian league.

So the same player who was deemed unable to make the difference, even coming from the bench, for Ajax was somehow good enough to immediately be basically the best and most decisive player in the Belgian league.

 

[Ajaxsuarez]

Just watched Ajax v Benfica and I have to say how they didn’t win I’ll never know, their passing, pressing and forward play was excellent, so quick and aggressive, especially in the first half, how the feck Ten Hag will get the numpties at our club playing like that I don’t know.

If the stories of us going for Anthony are true I’m all up for that, very exciting player, as for Timber he was playing more as a defensive midfielder and some fella called Blind wasn’t too shabby either and as a side note I thought Darwin Nunez reminded me of Andy Carroll back in the day, movement, build, ponytail, Geordie accent.

The problem with that game (the second leg, I imagine?) was that while we had the massive dominance in the general play, we were unable to create any real clearcut chances.
I believe that this stems from another trend of Ten Hag's over the past couple seasons compared to his earlier year or two at Ajax, in that (maybe following the Spurs heartbreak?) the focus has shifted more and more towards operating from a position of security - which I think definitely has some clear positives to it - but in doing so you sometimes lose that 20% of extra risk taking needed to force something against teams like Getafe, Valencia, Atalanta, Benfica, the 4 teams who we've lost those decisive European home games against these past few years. Especially in that first half vs Benfica we should have taken that 20% more risk. The risk-reward of scoring vs conceding at that point in the tie is far better than when you begin to feel the urgency in the second half.

The games against Roma where we went out of the EL last season though were truly unbelievable. In that case we genuinely did create those 100% chances and it just wouldn't go in, and we conceded to a massive goalkeeping error by Scherpen in the first leg which eventually did us over.

 

[Withnail]

I'm actually more surprised this thread went several hundred pages and we're just now learning he isn't the most risk embracing when it comes to youth. Also says a lot about the depth of discussion that took place and how little informed some are about Ajax. Like it would kill us to admit "yeah he has so and so weaknesses he would need to improve but here's why he's still the right man for the job". Even the guy who said something about his English needing work was dismissed. Ever heard of nuance? Portion of our current batch of youth are probably overrated anyway but I'd rather we didn't just ice out that side. ETH must adapt to our values as much as we to his. The guy can still grow as a manager.

I've seen him speak in pressers and his English seems fine. Whoever said his english was no better than a young child, didn't do their credibility much good.

 

[Revaulx]

I love Blind

Ditto. Particularly at CB. And Smalling was the perfect partner for him.

 

[Becks00]

For reasons I laid out here



But to be more specific, the reason I think he will fail is becaue like I said he doesn't have the gravitas, but also doesn't have the personality, to actually overthrow things and cut the dross.

His character in terms of player selection is heavily tilted towards fear rather than reward. He will always choose a guaranteed 7/10 performance now over a potential 9/10 player by the end of the season/ a year from now.

So where a Peter Bosz in his one season at Ajax brutally told players like Bazoer and El Ghazi that they weren't good enough (even though Bazoer represented a lot of value before that point), and was willing to put massive faith in 18 year old Dolberg (despite having brought in Traore on loan from Chelsea for the striker position), 19 year old Onana (depsite having brought in Tim Krul on loan), and 17 year old De Ligt. This lead to a difficult first half of the season, which ended up costing us the league by like 2 points in the end, despite a fantastic second half of the season and a Europa League final reached with this incredibly young core, which then developed (also thanks to Keizer taking the crazy risk of putting Frenkie de Jong into the first team at centreback the months after Bosz' departure) into the core that Ten Hag reached the CL semifinal on (together with the purchases of Blind/Tadic in his first summer at the club), and which resulted in Ajax' biggest ever financial windfall (the CL money + the €150m De Ligt+De Jong money). Also Vd Beek got starts towards the end of that season under Bosz, including in pivotal knockout EL games

Ten Hag on the other hand won't cut out any dross (not even from the bench) and won't risk any youngsters in that same way, and so it's impossible to build towards a future in which you don't continue to rely on this same set of players, and as a result you end up desperately holding onto them when offers come in for them, until eventually you're stuck with players whose value has diminished, whose contracts are running out, and a bunch of youth players whose development has stalled/hasn't been given a chance, or who have had to leave the club and immediately shine elsewhere (see Noa Lang immediately being player of the season (basically) in Belgium despite not even making our bench under Ten Hag, and Botman winning the league in France with Lille immediately after being sold, though in his case we had Martinez and Blind for his position so I get selling him for that money at the time)

And United need someone with the sway or at least character to ruthlessly cut through the rot that's been running through the squad this past years, but Ten Hag, being so overly cautious in this regard, would never be the man to do this even if he had that sort of influence/freedom within the club

But what you described was that he is cautious about cutting dross ( or more precisely, players you feel are not as talented as what the youngsters could be) from the bench and also risk averse about depending on young players for an extended period of time. The question I have though is, would he be as cautious if a player in the first 11, or a significant part of the first 11 players are not good enough for the kind of football he intends to play, there by compromising on his ideal team performance.

The reason I ask is, there is a huge difference between being averse to risking younger players when the starting 11 are good enough and when they are not. If the core base of 13 - 14 players he uses are excellently delivering his ideas on the pitch, then I certainly see reasons why he would be apprehensive about uprooting them to develop some young players.

 

[croadyman]

Will be interesting to see what the ex players who wanted Pochettino say when asked about Ten Hag.

I admit the Fergie cult stuff was OTT from me and down to the fact I panicked and thought we were going to miss out on ETH.

 

[Rolaholic]

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[Adnan]

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[Karlos PFC]

Assistant Manager at Manchester United.

Assistant TO THE Manager of Manchester United

 

[Adam-Utd]

It's clearly done - can't wait. First time I've felt optimistic in a long while.

 

[ti vu]

Whats very wrong is you making it sound like when Poch first went to Spurs he already had a ready made team ready to fight for titles instead of him putting everything together and actually coaching them to become the players they eventually became which is a massive difference and no where as easy as you make it out to be.

Yes it was a strange comment to make after the CL final but one thing no one knows is what went on behind the scenes to make him voice such a comment but why do you link his comment with the players wanting to leave? Couldn't it be something as simple as the players thought they were worth more than they were getting paid and Levy playing hardball which from the outside seemed to be the case?

The disdain for Poch is laughable. Posters commenting that they're done with the club if Poch is hired sound like spoiled children just because they could have a shiny new toy to play with. People never cease to amaze me.

Would Poch be the one to take us back to the top? It's impossible to say but sometimes in life it can just click between manager and the squad due to many reasons such as how the players perceive said manager and there's absolutely no evidence to think ETH has a big advantage if we look at both managers careers and the state of our current squad. Each for me has an equal chance at success just as each has an equal chance at failure which is why I won't be throwing a tantrum if we choose one over the other. I'm in a very happy place at the minute because either choice for me is a big step in the right direction not like some of the miserable fecks on here who have publicly quoted they're finished with he club if Poch is hired and others knocking down one to bump up the other just because they think it's ETH or bust. Middle ground seems to be an alien concept for many on social media but I suppose as long as they're happy complaining that's all that counts.

The way you put it, you don't give the recruitment work its due credit. No one is saying Poch got that team handed to him on silver plate. What being said is that he was lucky getting a group of talented players at good age that has potential to fit into the team and complement each other. Beside Kyle Walker who left for better wage and chance to win trophy, Poch didn't have to face the issue of losing his star players every season, which gave him the opportunity to build on previous season progress. Yet by the time some players reached their expiration, that team failed to win anything. The players eventually grew dillusioned over being underpaying, and ending their career trophyless.

Once some key people in recruitment team moved away, with a Poch gaining more power, their recruitment became worse, not be able to add quality to the team, as well as failing to replace declining, even with handsome transfer fee. No amount of coaching can work on the wrong type of players.

When your manager said he's ready to leave, why would you care to extend your stay at this club? He basically said we'd done everything and this is the best we could reach. You're underpaid in comparison to the peers of similar quality/contribution, and most importantly your career would end in a low point with the lack of trophy. Levy could keep the salary cap low and everyone happy while u det paid because they previously believed that they could end up going places. Once Poch came out saying what he said, it rocked the boat, and create conflict of interest especially for players entering the last big contract zone.

Poch eventually created his downfall at Spurs, fighting to gain more control of the decision over transfer, but not made the good out of that power. Starting to lose people from his side. Spooked the squad that had the vulnerable ones rethink about their commitment to the project.

 

[Real Name]

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Why is it taking so long?!
Get it done ffs.

 

[Kaos]

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One thing I don't understand is we're supposedly holding off the announcement out of respect for Ajax who are still locked in a tight title race. Yet by the end of next week nothing will have changed, so what difference does it make announcing it then instead of now? Or are they just waiting for their cup final with PSV to be played out just as an arbitrary checkpoint for when its acceptable to make it official?

 

[L1nk]

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[ti vu]

One thing I don't understand is we're supposedly holding off the announcement out of respect for Ajax who are still locked in a tight title race. Yet by the end of next week nothing will have changed, so what difference does it make announcing it then instead of now? Or are they just waiting for their cup final with PSV to be played out just as an arbitrary checkpoint for when its acceptable to make it official?

The announcement part sounded to me like the guesswork to keep reader interaction . Next 48 hours kind of thing. Not what is being communicated by either clubs.

 

[DeGea’sFeet]

I think it’s naive to suggests that is how ten Hag would operate at United just because he’s done so at Ajax.

Totally different clubs and needs.

So even more pressure. Tbh I thought the same about Mourinho but he didn’t really change, Ole is Ole, but traditionally managers don’t change in style or “manner”

Ajax fans complaining about ETH putting together a bloated elderly squad: I thought Overmars was responsible for assembling the squad, and the general view was that he’d done a great job?

I posted earlier the main concern from Ajax fans and an ex Ajax manager was stubbornness with playing certain players and what some felt was in game management, the latter I might add is a problem with all manager’s in that style. Who would you back to come back from 2-0 at half time Vs Real/Bayern based on the manager making some radical tactical changes Liverpool or City? Most people would say Liverpool due to Klopp being more pragmatic and at the same time most people would say Liverpool would also be the team most likely to end up losing 4/5-0.

I’m very happy with ETH think he’s the best option out of two and a manager who deserves 3-4 years and money

 

[TheReligion]

Ajax fans complaining about ETH putting together a bloated elderly squad: I thought Overmars was responsible for assembling the squad, and the general view was that he’d done a great job?

it does seem sour grapes doesn’t it

 

[ShinjiNinja26]

it does seem sour grapes doesn’t it

Take that as a good sign we’ve made the right decision when they’re so hurt he’s leaving.

 

[wise_old_man]

Take that as a good sign we’ve made the right decision when they’re so hurt he’s leaving.

Spurs fans said the same about us when Mourinho joined them, though.

 

[VP89]

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full interview here:

 

[AltiUn]

it does seem sour grapes doesn’t it

Since the news broke I don't think I've seen a single positive Ajax comment about him

 

[AltiUn]

Spurs fans said the same about us when Mourinho joined them, though.

Yeah but ten Hag is coming on the back of 2 titles in 3 years with the potential to add another this season, whereas Mourinho had torpedoed us down the table and hadn't won a trophy since his first season after alienating everyone except Matic and Lukaku.

 

[Foxbatt]

So could it be they come out and say we couldn't get an agreement with ETH and sign The Pok?

 

[UnitedSofa]

So could it be they come out and say we couldn't get an agreement with ETH and sign The Pok?

Have patience

 

[United in sin]

By the looks of things his advice is bearing fruit with the Hag appointment.


Are people still going to be beating this we haven't got a clue angle when behind the scenes their has clearly been big changes, to try and rectify the rot and make the changes that are needed to start running at a smoother pace now on the football side of things?

https://www.tribalfootball.com/articles/rangnick-removed-from-say-on-next-man-utd-manager-4410184

Ralf Rangnick won't have a major influence on the choice of Manchester United's next manager.

The interim manager is in charge of the Red Devils for the remainder of the season before he takes a two-year consultancy role in the summer. It's been reported that Rangnick has been involved in the search for his successor, but this may no longer be the case.

Rangnick has already advised the board that the new man needs significant backing in the transfer market while giving his seal of approval for Erik ten Hag, who is a leading contender for the role.

But The National says Rangnick has 'limited say in the matter' and has been asked to concentrate on finishing the season as strongly as possible.

Depends on what you believe innit? The truth is in the pudding, United made no signings in January. There were numerous links to midfielders during the January transfer market and not a thing was done. Perhaps the club wanted to wait for the next permanent appointment but if you believe the rumors Rangknick made strong recommendations for players in the aforementioned links and came to no avail. There's also this:

What I will tell you is that I am very well connected professionally with someone who is a long time friend and colleague of a senior member of the current coaching set up and the word from inside the club is that it is a “complete shitshow”. There are far too many people trying to make decisions and no clear unified direction, voice or strategy. I’ve also been told that Rangnick was marginalised within the first few weeks of taking the job, and the powers that be within the club - executive board, DoF, TD, are not only dissenting amongst themselves but also doing it their own way without listening to external, qualified input. Often competing against one another.

From everything I’ve heard, it makes it sound like the next manager will just be cannon fodder. The club repeatedly promotes from within, to key strategic positions, to avoid having new ideas and voices challenging their hegemonic culture.

However low your expectations are, lower them further.

I wasn’t going to post this because I don’t want to get anyone in trouble, and I can’t be dealing with being labelled an ITK wannabe. I know a lot of stuff from within the club, I’m just not going to get into the habit of sharing it on an Internet forum, because my friendships and business relationships are more important than anonymous internet infamy.

Suffice to say that this is general enough, and I am pissed off enough, to share this particular tidbit. I can almost as close enough as guarantee that we will never see a meaningful change, pattern, strategy, or success, until the owners change. That’s been said by many on here for a long time. Speculating from what they’ve seen from the outside. From what I can tell you from what I know from the inside, is that all those people are correct. That the Glazer power structure, strategy, decision making, is about as unimaginative, uninformed, disorganised, and disconnected from the fans, club, and orthodox expectations of a big club, as you can possibly imagine. Even the Glazers themselves disagree on the direction, timing of the exit strategy, and valuation of the club.

It is my opinion, and now we are back to uninformed speculation, that the best outcome for us is a Hicks/Gillette type financial meltdown that forces the sale of the club. Either way, we are going to be in the wilderness for a while.

You dont have to believe a word of this, but consider how the club has been run since Woodward took the helm. Consider that the same people who were part of the same failed regime are still at the club in different roles overseeing the 'big changes' you speak of to 'stop the rot'. Use some discernment and see what conclusions you come to. Perhaps you think I'm a doom monger, but these concerns are real

 

[Pexbo]

I feel like everything in this thread belongs in the next manager thread until it’s officially announced

Done. No ETH threads before official announcement please otherwise it’s just doubling up on existing threads

Say no to megathreads but also megathreads

 

[Corridor of Uncertainty]

You are my Ten Hag
My only Ten Hag
You make me happy
When skies are grey
Oh Pochettino
Is not for us no
So please don't take my Ten Hag away

 

[SATA]

Since the news broke I don't think I've seen a single positive Ajax comment about him

The resident Bayern fans in here seem to have really great adulation for him and that United have finally made a right decision in appointing the right type of manager

 

[Revaulx]

it does seem sour grapes doesn’t it

Well I did wonder!

The "his English is poor" as well...

 

[Spoony]

Well I did wonder!

The "his English is poor" as well...

We've got our man, Rev. Now let's hope our wish comes true - Ajax on steroids. Well...we can dream can't we!?

 

[VidaRed]

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That looks like ten hag was interviewing the interviewers.

 

[ShinjiNinja26]

Spurs fans said the same about us when Mourinho joined them, though.

Nah that was completely different, everyone knew Jose was a busted flush and we tried to warn them and they were having none of it. ETH is clearly the best manager Ajax have had in years and is at the top of his game, the fact they’re now downplaying him suddenly after it looks like he’s coming here just screams sour grapes to me.

 

[Coops73]

The problem with that game (the second leg, I imagine?) was that while we had the massive dominance in the general play, we were unable to create any real clearcut chances.
I believe that this stems from another trend of Ten Hag's over the past couple seasons compared to his earlier year or two at Ajax, in that (maybe following the Spurs heartbreak?) the focus has shifted more and more towards operating from a position of security - which I think definitely has some clear positives to it - but in doing so you sometimes lose that 20% of extra risk taking needed to force something against teams like Getafe, Valencia, Atalanta, Benfica, the 4 teams who we've lost those decisive European home games against these past few years. Especially in that first half vs Benfica we should have taken that 20% more risk. The risk-reward of scoring vs conceding at that point in the tie is far better than when you begin to feel the urgency in the second half.

The games against Roma where we went out of the EL last season though were truly unbelievable. In that case we genuinely did create those 100% chances and it just wouldn't go in, and we conceded to a massive goalkeeping error by Scherpen in the first leg which eventually did us over.

Yeah, yeah, nice try mate, you can try and convince us Ten Hag is shit and not worth going for but it won’t work on us desperate fecks.

All joking aside (apart from us being desperate fecks) I don’t know too much about him as a manager and have only watched a couple of games but have been pretty impressed with how Ajax play. I did vote for him too but only out of the need for something and someone different at United, I wouldn’t have a problem with Poch either, but I definitely didn’t want Rogers because just watching one of his interviews makes me want to bust out the lip balm.

 

[Blood Mage]

Just watched a few videos of some Ajax performances this season. It's going to take a long time for Ten Hag to get our squad of pampered layabouts playing like that. Relentless tempo and pressing.

He'll need at least 4 or 5 signings if he wants to implement that type of system quickly.

 

[Judas]

So could it be they come out and say we couldn't get an agreement with ETH and sign The Pok?

Its a done dealio.

 

[Rightnr]

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Sensible questions and pretty much what I said I would ask if I was being interviewed in the thread on this topic.

Hopefully, PSV can just lose two games on the trot and Ajax have all but won their league by the end of next week.

 

[Andycoleno9]

Anyone care to offer a guess as to what ten Hag’s starting 11 will be next season? There are so many players here that I doubt he wants but I can’t see the owners giving him a blank chequebook either.

DDG
Dalot Maguire Varane Shaw
Fred Nevas Fernandes
Antony Rashford Sancho

I wouldn’t be overly surprised if it was something like this

Dave
Dalot, Maguire (price tag and captain role shield), Varane, Shaw
Bruno, Donny, Fred
Jadon, Ronaldo, Rashford.