NFL 2021

Status
Not open for further replies.

RobinLFC

Cries when Liverpool doesn't get praised
Joined
May 20, 2014
Messages
17,739
Location
Belgium
Supports
Liverpool
What a wanker.

The refs didn’t lose you the game you cock, you did.
The comment itself is absolutely pathetic but he has every right to be mad at the officials imo. Regardless of the play call, if the ref did his job they would've had one last play.

On the other hand, he shouldn't have run in the first place and could've slide down earlier so there's that as well.
 

Mike Smalling

Full Member
Joined
Jan 27, 2018
Messages
4,262
What a wanker.

The refs didn’t lose you the game you cock, you did.
That's really poor from Dak.

Just saw the final sequence, and it is pretty hilarious, to be fair. He was basically tackled by the umpire. I think they are right to feel aggrieved, that they didn't get a shot at the end zone.
 

RobinLFC

Cries when Liverpool doesn't get praised
Joined
May 20, 2014
Messages
17,739
Location
Belgium
Supports
Liverpool
That's really poor from Dak.

Just saw the final sequence, and it is pretty hilarious, to be fair. He was basically tackled by the umpire. I think they are right to feel aggrieved, that they didn't get a shot at the end zone.
You can't win the game if you don't take shots to win the game. With 14" being in the position they were in, they literally had 2, if not 3 endzone shots to simply win the game, yet they decided to run for 10 yards to throw from the 30 instead of the 40, unforgivable imo.
 

HTG

Full Member
Joined
Apr 27, 2011
Messages
3,596
Supports
Bayern
You can't win the game if you don't take shots to win the game. With 14" being in the position they were in, they literally had 2, if not 3 endzone shots to simply win the game, yet they decided to run for 10 yards to throw from the 30 instead of the 40, unforgivable imo.
Exactly. It’s not the refs fault that they chose a completely idiotic playcall.
 

UweBein

Full Member
Joined
Sep 20, 2014
Messages
3,354
Location
Köln
Supports
Chelsea
The comment itself is absolutely pathetic but he has every right to be mad at the officials imo. Regardless of the play call, if the ref did his job they would've had one last play.

.....
What could have the ref done differently?
 

Mike Smalling

Full Member
Joined
Jan 27, 2018
Messages
4,262
You can't win the game if you don't take shots to win the game. With 14" being in the position they were in, they literally had 2, if not 3 endzone shots to simply win the game, yet they decided to run for 10 yards to throw from the 30 instead of the 40, unforgivable imo.
Both things can be true, in my opinion. Should they have taken 2-3 shots from the 40 instead of running? Probably. After they decided to run, should the refs have kept up, so they had the chance to spike it? Definitely.
 

RedRover

Full Member
Joined
Mar 19, 2007
Messages
8,660
The comment itself is absolutely pathetic but he has every right to be mad at the officials imo. Regardless of the play call, if the ref did his job they would've had one last play.

On the other hand, he shouldn't have run in the first place and could've slide down earlier so there's that as well.
Seemed to me the problem was the players not knowing the rules. Prescott ran, hit the deck and then handed the ball to the Center to spot it, when it has to be spotted by the umpire - who ran as fast as he could to do just that?

Error was with him. Before the play he knew he needed to take a shot or get out of bounds, hence the side line defence.
 

rpitroda

petitioned for a just cause
Joined
May 9, 2013
Messages
18,753
Location
Los Pollos Hermanos...
Yeah, I also don’t have sympathy with the Cowboys. The referee actually made a huge effort to try and get it spotted. The collision and inefficiency was that Dak didn’t hand the ball to the right person.
 

V.O.

Last Man Standing finalist 2019/20
Joined
Jan 12, 2019
Messages
3,380
Yeah, I also don’t have sympathy with the Cowboys. The referee actually made a huge effort to try and get it spotted. The collision and inefficiency was that Dak didn’t hand the ball to the right person.
Yeah, the guy shoved his way past Dak and an NFL O-line as quickly as any normal-sized human physically could have done. 50% on Dak for not knowing who to give the ball to and 50% on whoever decided to run the fecking ball in the first place (which of course may also be Dak).
 

Rado_N

Yaaas Broncos!
Joined
Apr 6, 2009
Messages
106,161
Location
Manchester
The comment itself is absolutely pathetic but he has every right to be mad at the officials imo. Regardless of the play call, if the ref did his job they would've had one last play.

On the other hand, he shouldn't have run in the first place and could've slide down earlier so there's that as well.
I only saw the very end as I flicked Game Pass on when I saw the commotion on Twitter about the 4th down the other way, so I may have missed something but IMO you can’t blame the refs for that final play and them not having time to spike it.

You can’t expect the refs to keep up with Dak running at full pelt, and the ref obviously has to position the ball, it was a bonehead play to run as far as he did and then not leave room for the ref to get to the ball, he’s nobody to blame but himself and/or whoever called the play, be it Moore or McCarthy.
 

Ayush_reddevil

Full Member
Joined
Mar 22, 2014
Messages
7,791
And to be fair, it had some competition for “dumbest minute award” in that game?

Still don’t understand (please explain anyone) why official stands over ball for so long then moves with a second to go?
Basically the rules are that if the offence makes subs then the defence are allowed reasonable time to make subs as well so as cowboys subbed in the offence late he had to allow Niners to sub their players
 

HTG

Full Member
Joined
Apr 27, 2011
Messages
3,596
Supports
Bayern
Could Dak be suspended for his comments on the refs? I mean endorsing throwing things on them is hardly sportsmanlike.
 

Organic Potatoes

Full Member
Joined
Dec 2, 2013
Messages
15,870
Location
85R723R2+R6
Supports
Colorado Rapids
Basically the rules are that if the offence makes subs then the defence are allowed reasonable time to make subs as well so as cowboys subbed in the offence late he had to allow Niners to sub their players
They do have to wait in that circumstance, but here they didn’t make any subs. The ump just has to establish the spot of the ball as the ref and chains are moving into place. In this case they inexplicably tried to spot it themselves, did so incorrectly whilst blocking the ump, and had to move back.

This highlights one of the rules I like better in college ball, where when it’s under 2 minutes of each half the clock stops as the officials complete this process after a 1st down (the other rule that I like much better is DPI is a 15 yard penalty instead of a spot foul).
 

rpitroda

petitioned for a just cause
Joined
May 9, 2013
Messages
18,753
Location
Los Pollos Hermanos...
The more I think about it, the more I find the angle MM and Dak are taking reprehensible. Let’s not forget that even if they got a play off, we are talking about a Hail Mary - which unless I’m mistaken has never been converted to win a playoff game in history?

I’ll say it again, there were so many things fundamentally wrong with the Cowboys; bad play calling at times on offence. Stupid penalties. Inconsistent QB play. Dropped catches. Porous o-line. If the HC and team leader set a tone that the reason for defeat was poor officiating, then it completely undermines any future effort they invest in fixing the real issues which, had they not been present, would likely have won the game comfortably. Let’s not forget that the only reason they even had a chance at the end was because of a) one of the most stupid turnovers I’ve seen (contextualised) and b) a ridiculous false start on a 4th and inches sneak, after a time out). 49ers had a pretty indisciplined showing and even then they couldn’t get it done.

At some point you’ve gotta just accept what everyone else sees and knows. The way this game played out for the Cowboys is all too familiar to how some of those close Packers games played out. The people might be different and the actual issues might be different, but the principle nature is consistent. Poor discipline. Poor game management. Poor performance at big moments.

If I was Jerry, I wouldn’t have any hesitation at firing MM, especially since he has two OCs who, apparently, are going to become saviours of some other franchises. The HC search if he really believed in them would be quick.
 

RobinLFC

Cries when Liverpool doesn't get praised
Joined
May 20, 2014
Messages
17,739
Location
Belgium
Supports
Liverpool
The more I think about it, the more I find the angle MM and Dak are taking reprehensible. Let’s not forget that even if they got a play off, we are talking about a Hail Mary - which unless I’m mistaken has never been converted to win a playoff game in history?
Rodgers threw a hail mary TD a few years ago against the Cards, but they lost in OT because of Fitzgerald. Jacoby Jones against the Broncos was also a hail mary by Flacco to go into OT (and win the game) if I'm not mistaken.

But yeah, their stances are quite ridiculous and hard to have any compassion for them. They brought it upon theirselves.
 

HTG

Full Member
Joined
Apr 27, 2011
Messages
3,596
Supports
Bayern
The more I think about it, the more I find the angle MM and Dak are taking reprehensible. Let’s not forget that even if they got a play off, we are talking about a Hail Mary - which unless I’m mistaken has never been converted to win a playoff game in history?

I’ll say it again, there were so many things fundamentally wrong with the Cowboys; bad play calling at times on offence. Stupid penalties. Inconsistent QB play. Dropped catches. Porous o-line. If the HC and team leader set a tone that the reason for defeat was poor officiating, then it completely undermines any future effort they invest in fixing the real issues which, had they not been present, would likely have won the game comfortably. Let’s not forget that the only reason they even had a chance at the end was because of a) one of the most stupid turnovers I’ve seen (contextualised) and b) a ridiculous false start on a 4th and inches sneak, after a time out). 49ers had a pretty indisciplined showing and even then they couldn’t get it done.

At some point you’ve gotta just accept what everyone else sees and knows. The way this game played out for the Cowboys is all too familiar to how some of those close Packers games played out. The people might be different and the actual issues might be different, but the principle nature is consistent. Poor discipline. Poor game management. Poor performance at big moments.

If I was Jerry, I wouldn’t have any hesitation at firing MM, especially since he has two OCs who, apparently, are going to become saviours of some other franchises. The HC search if he really believed in them would be quick.
Completely agree. It felt like a typical ending to a Packers playoff game. Mike McCarthy has shown again and again that he is not able to prepare his teams for moments like these.
 

rpitroda

petitioned for a just cause
Joined
May 9, 2013
Messages
18,753
Location
Los Pollos Hermanos...
Rodgers threw a hail mary TD a few years ago against the Cards, but they lost in OT because of Fitzgerald. Jacoby Jones against the Broncos was also a hail mary by Flacco to go into OT (and win the game) if I'm not mistaken.

But yeah, their stances are quite ridiculous and hard to have any compassion for them. They brought it upon theirselves.
I remember the Packers one. God that Larry F run was sublime :lol:
 

RobinLFC

Cries when Liverpool doesn't get praised
Joined
May 20, 2014
Messages
17,739
Location
Belgium
Supports
Liverpool
They do have to wait in that circumstance, but here they didn’t make any subs. The ump just has to establish the spot of the ball as the ref and chains are moving into place. In this case they inexplicably tried to spot it themselves, did so incorrectly whilst blocking the ump, and had to move back.
But is that usually done by the ref that's in the backfield of the offense? Haven't really ever checked that but you can't expect that referee to immediately be at the spot of the QB slide (or where a RB gets taken down). Would make more sense for the line judges or someone in the end zone to do that as they'd have a better view on the spot anyway.
 

MrMarcello

In a well-ordered universe...
Joined
Dec 26, 2000
Messages
49,402
Location
On a pale blue dot in space
McCarthy's presser about "would you rather have five shots from the 25" was the stupidest comment during. They would have got one shot at most after the run but ended up with no play. Then blamed the officials.

Edit: Here's the quote. Verticals not plays.

McCarthy defended offensive coordinator Kellen Moore's decision to call the run, even with no timeouts. He said he was "shocked" the Cowboys didn't get a last-play opportunity. The Cowboys call those situations "church clock" situations, and they practice them each week.

"Do you want to be running a Hail Mary play from the 50-yard line or do you want to run five verticals from the 25-yard line?" McCarthy said. "So, that's the decision, it's the right decision." https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/33083093/had-problem-getting-ball-spotted
 
Last edited:

rpitroda

petitioned for a just cause
Joined
May 9, 2013
Messages
18,753
Location
Los Pollos Hermanos...
McCarthy's presser about "would you rather have five shots from the 25" was the stupidest comment during. They would have got one shot at most after the run but ended up with no play. Then blamed the officials.

Edit: Here's the quote. Verticals not plays.

McCarthy defended offensive coordinator Kellen Moore's decision to call the run, even with no timeouts. He said he was "shocked" the Cowboys didn't get a last-play opportunity. The Cowboys call those situations "church clock" situations, and they practice them each week.

"Do you want to be running a Hail Mary play from the 50-yard line or do you want to run five verticals from the 25-yard line?" McCarthy said. "So, that's the decision, it's the right decision." https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/33083093/had-problem-getting-ball-spotted
Does it really it matter? I guess the difference is trajectory of the throw. But either way this wasn’t the scenario. It was 2 Hail Marys (most likely) - the first of which would have been against a defence who was more concerned about the sideline. All in all he’s an idiot.
 

HTG

Full Member
Joined
Apr 27, 2011
Messages
3,596
Supports
Bayern
McCarthy's presser about "would you rather have five shots from the 25" was the stupidest comment during. They would have got one shot at most after the run but ended up with no play. Then blamed the officials.

Edit: Here's the quote. Verticals not plays.

McCarthy defended offensive coordinator Kellen Moore's decision to call the run, even with no timeouts. He said he was "shocked" the Cowboys didn't get a last-play opportunity. The Cowboys call those situations "church clock" situations, and they practice them each week.

"Do you want to be running a Hail Mary play from the 50-yard line or do you want to run five verticals from the 25-yard line?" McCarthy said. "So, that's the decision, it's the right decision." https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/33083093/had-problem-getting-ball-spotted
I must defend McCarthy here, a bit at least. Five verticals doesn’t mean five attempts to run vertical plays, but one play where five receivers run vertical routes.
 

Organic Potatoes

Full Member
Joined
Dec 2, 2013
Messages
15,870
Location
85R723R2+R6
Supports
Colorado Rapids
But is that usually done by the ref that's in the backfield of the offense? Haven't really ever checked that but you can't expect that referee to immediately be at the spot of the QB slide (or where a RB gets taken down). Would make more sense for the line judges or someone in the end zone to do that as they'd have a better view on the spot anyway.
I meant physically establish the official starting point of the next play on the correct side of the hash marks in conjunction with the line judge for the yard marker.
 

RobinLFC

Cries when Liverpool doesn't get praised
Joined
May 20, 2014
Messages
17,739
Location
Belgium
Supports
Liverpool
I meant physically establish the official starting point of the next play on the correct side of the hash marks in conjunction with the line judge for the yard marker.
Yeah I know, just never seen before that it has to be done by the backfield judge (if it even was him?) who has to "jump over" the offensive line. Usually there's a ref right next to where the play ends and the ball just gets flicked to that ref, but maybe that's just a hunch I had that's not really based on anything but my own experience, dunno.
 

lsd

The Oracle
Joined
Jun 5, 2016
Messages
8,223
With the added bonus of taking Quinn off the table for Denver and meaning Hackett likely gets the job ;)

I hope you get McCarthy or Moore


Hard to defend anyone from Cowboys same old story we beat ourselves with dumb penalties, kept giving the ball to Zeke to run two yards when we must know he has been out for two years now.

Dak again took to long to get going and only seems to stir when we are down more than two scores.

I highly doubt he made the call to run but he should have known better than to run as far as he did and then block the ref.

The fact we have lost to any decent team we have faced all season tells its own story . We are not that good but yet it hurts when we then get into a position to win and blow it like that .

At least go out taking a shot or two
 

rpitroda

petitioned for a just cause
Joined
May 9, 2013
Messages
18,753
Location
Los Pollos Hermanos...
I must defend McCarthy here, a bit at least. Five verticals doesn’t mean five attempts to run vertical plays, but one play where five receivers run vertical routes.
Is it that different though to a Hail Mary 10-15 yards back? If they’d clocked it, that play would have still been from what, 25-30 yards out anyway?
 

HTG

Full Member
Joined
Apr 27, 2011
Messages
3,596
Supports
Bayern
Is it that different though to a Hail Mary 10-15 yards back? If they’d clocked it, that play would have still been from what, 25-30 yards out anyway?
It is a difference. The few yards allow for more different routes and plays. It’s a small advantage, but it is there.
 

lsd

The Oracle
Joined
Jun 5, 2016
Messages
8,223
Could Dak be suspended for his comments on the refs? I mean endorsing throwing things on them is hardly sportsmanlike.

He should be be worried some of those throws from the crowd were finding Cowboy players that he wasn't able to do
 

rpitroda

petitioned for a just cause
Joined
May 9, 2013
Messages
18,753
Location
Los Pollos Hermanos...
It is a difference. The few yards allow for more different routes and plays. It’s a small advantage, but it is there.
I don’t disagree. But it’s all about opportunity cost right. Are those few yards and extra route combinations worth the risk of a) potentially not getting any play off and b) at the expense of 2 shots at the end zone rather than 1?

Obviously with hindsight it’s easy to say - but I still think if you ignore a) and take it as a given that you will get that play, I would personally rather have the two shots - especially when in the first shot the defence isn’t in a hail mary defence.
 

Charlie Foley

Full Member
Joined
Mar 11, 2012
Messages
14,222
The comment itself is absolutely pathetic but he has every right to be mad at the officials imo. Regardless of the play call, if the ref did his job they would've had one last play.

On the other hand, he shouldn't have run in the first place and could've slide down earlier so there's that as well.
What part of his job did the ref not do? Dak gave the ball to the wrong guy and then sets up in the ref’s way. What should have been done differently?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.