No chance of top 4 after incompetently handled transfer window ft 1000000% more tears and drama

crossy1686

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Anyone saw the under 23's this evening. There is some real talent there
Laird
Garner
Williams
OÇonnor
to name a few.
with Greenwood, Gomes and Chong getting first team experience I think the future looks great.
Like many I wished we had at least bought another midfielder and an experienced attacker to help the youngsters, but lets be positive
I just hope that Ole gives Gomes and Greenwood chances instead of Mata and Lingard
Careful mate, positivity isn't welcome around these parts any more. I agree though, we only need a couple of them to become class and we're in business.
 

JG3001

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Of course it's fecking possible.

We have a much better starting 11 than last season just from defensive stability alone.

The negativity around here pathetic.
I agree we have an outside chance, but supposedly having a better team on paper isn’t the issue here.

I think by now we’re well aware of the ability (or lack of...) in each area of the pitch, it’s a question of egos, sulking and lack of trying potentially cropping up again.
 

nokillingmoths

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Careful mate, positivity isn't welcome around these parts any more. I agree though, we only need a couple of them to become class and we're in business.
Yawn.

It is hard to integrate young players in to a struggling side bereft of leaders. I want our young players to succeed, i just think we've given them an awful chance of doing so.
 

Alabaster Codify7

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Rebuild still under construction. Opens again in January.

Our board are completely reactive, so I'm actually expecting us to do something mental in the January window.

By then, I expect us to be in trouble - I'm thinking around 7-9th in the league, lots of bad results, but most importantly a real struggle to score and create.

I can see Ole being under the microscope, lots of negative press and Woodward hitting the panic button and attempting to sign some big, marketable name striker or forward. Unsure who, I can just see it coming as a 'hail mary' attempt at saving the season and injecting positivity.
 

unitedsoldier

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The doom and gloom of some of our supporters is hilarious. Not only will we be in the top 4 this year, but we will put up a title challenge. But go on, try and convince me that my optimism is misplaced and that I should be a negative Nancy like the rest of you...
Love this post
 

UpWithRivers

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So Liverpool's improvement is all about chance? No way. Huge work, structure, thought and planning has gone into it. Can you see Woody doing any of that? Ok.

So blame the players. The point about Henderson is good, in a way. He is improved because he understands the system. Because he has good players around him. Rising tide lifts all the boats, etc. The system at LPool is built around the manager. The manager is supported by the CEO, the board.

Ok, I'll give you IF :)

Everyone has a little ray of hope before a new season begins. But we are six seasons out from SAF's era, and ten years or whatever since Glazernomics infected the club. I think if Ole's attitude of some players won't be here, you know a general bullish vibe at the end of last season ... If that was followed up on ... Say, if there was a replacement for Herrera a midfielder and maybe one more upfront. If there was a signal that here we are, we are going to compete with Spurs and City and Pool. Then you might have more optimism

We should be doing that. We are generating the money. But seeing the Glazers make off with our profits, and not enough investment in the team and the stadium. Seeing Maguire come in after him not being bought for Mourhino. Virtually everyone agrees on the incompetence of Ed. So the people who are unhappy are unhappy for a whole set of very good reasons. But likewise, fair play to the optimists, I hope you enjoy the season. If your theory is borne out I will stand you a virtual pint!
Im not an optimist. Im disgusted by this club as you will see if you go through any of my previous posts. Even if you forget about money and transfers and position and ability what sticks in my throat more is this is a bunch of players that down tools - TWICE! last season. TWICE! Everyone forgets and forgives. If we were just sht it would be easier to swallow. But this sub is saying do we have a chance. We do. Simply for the fact that we have proven that we can do it. We had Prem winning form for two months then just gave up. What I admired about Sir Alex was his ability to get his teams to perform week in week out. We would grind out results relentlessly even when we were not on form. This is down to the management as much as ability. The team we have now should beat at least 12 teams in the Prem home and away - thats 72 points. Yes football doesnt work that way, we will loose some. Say we loose 2 and draw 3. 60 points. Thats only 10/15 points we need from 14 games against the top teams. Win 50 percent and thats 21 points. Its possible.
 

MackRobinson

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So Liverpool's improvement is all about chance? No way. Huge work, structure, thought and planning has gone into it. Can you see Woody doing any of that? Ok.
Tell us more about this magical Liverpool structure that had them hiring Kenny Daglish and splurging on the likes of Andy Carroll and Benteke.
 

Tom Cato

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People acting like Chelsea somehow got strengthened by losing Eden Hazard in this thread.
 

ryansgirl

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Another farcical, disgraceful, incompetently handled transfer window, which will result in another statement about pulling in a director of football, that won't happen.

I mean what club knowing Lukaku is going waits till the day before the window closes to get a replacement. You think that's bull?

Well Lyon has confirmed that we tried to get Moussa Dembele... and Lyon president Jean-Michel Aulas has trolled the club saying: “It is not a question of money, it is a question of ambition.“

“Moussa Dembele will not leave,” he said.

“The model was made for him. We recruited according to him.


“He becomes centre number one, which he was not totally last season.

“It is not a question of money, it is a question of ambition.“



“Moussa is part of the project just like Juninho or others,” he added.

“We want him to succeed and to reach the France team from his club which is Lyon.

“We have a great deal of confidence in its capabilities and potential.”

Defenders were needed, but they won't make the difference at the top half of the table. Right now we are fighting Everton and Wolves for sixth place. We have NO chance of top four.

The fact we think our midfield is good enough shows that there is something dreadfully wrong within our club.

But surely the club knows our midfield is not good enough, hence the last minute dalliance with Eriksen.

Meanwhile the midfielder-rich Spurs bring in not one but two central midfielders of quality.

It has been said many times before, but I don't think I am alone in thinking that enough is enough.

Woodward out. Glazers out.
Well, what a drama queen of a post.

With a just about pointless reference to a bloke United tried to get but couldn't because his club wouldn't let him go. Small club in Lyon doesn't want one of the biggest names in football picking off their talent - who would have thought?

Frankly I give less than an iota of a damn about Jean Michael-Arse 'trolling' the club about how Lyon kept Moussa. He and the player are welcome to brag about being small fish in a small pond. Enjoy flopping about in the shallows, minnows.

The poster of this thread just doesn't understand United's strategy before the transfer window closed. I'll help with that. While there is uncertainty hanging over Paul Pogba, United has to be ready to get somebody else. Fernandes fell through because of unreasonable demands, so did Dyabala and he and Erikson were lukewarm about United so we were not going to waste money, time and energy on them any further.

Manchester United is back to its Ferguson philosophy of recruiting players who actually want to play for United as much as they want to be paid for their skills. United is back to creating a team identity instead of over-paying for players that don't resemble a team with the same values and are mismatches.

So Ole and co didn't get another midfielder or another striker not through want of trying but at the end of the day it is about team building and not about individual players that don't mesh. It is also about other clubs and their demands - we can't change that. The OP also ignores the building from the back that was so important to do and has been done. With defensive players who want to play for United, already play for England and also possess attacking skills.

As for Frank Lampard's Chelsea - even if they beat United in the first game, I really don't see them having an easy season and in fact I think it's going to be rocky for Frank and his players.
 

ryansgirl

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Tell us more about this magical Liverpool structure that had them hiring Kenny Daglish and splurging on the likes of Andy Carroll and Benteke.
Yes, I'd like to hear that too. And while European Cups are wonderful and Liverpool deserve praise for those, they still haven't won the English title for how many years now?
 

Casanova85

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Not worried about the defense anymore now that Young and Smalling are not part of the Starting XI anymore. Maguire and Bissaka are quality, at least better than Pallister-Brown standards.

Midfield seems secured with Pogba staying.

It's the attack that worries me. Not signing Sancho sure was disappointing. Unless Martial plays CF and scores at least 18 PL goals we are in for a long-dull 1-0 season. Pogba needs to keep scoring goals and Rashford must improve his finishing.
 

ryansgirl

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Oh and I love the OP's 'Right now we are fighting Everton and Wolves for sixth place'.
Really? And the Manchester United team hasn't even kicked a ball yet in the new season.
What utter tosh.
 

Will Singh

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Untill we don't change our mindsets you will be in for a disappointment, to put it in English we are the new Arsenal when it comes to football matters. Spend minimum and get into the top 4 except we won't as the other clubs have made good investments and are reaping the rewards. Financially Arsenal have a brand new stadium and are debt free (I think) where as we have a dated stadium and have debt the size of the moon.

We need to do what the Arsenal fans did and start getting on to the Glazers backs.
 

TrimiPejes

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Defenders were needed, but they won't make the difference at the top half of the table. Right now we are fighting Everton and Wolves for sixth place. We have NO chance of top four.

Come on man, what are you on about? A strong defence is the spine of a good team. Just look at the transformation of Liverpool after they got Van Dijk. Our defence looks improved so that's a major step in the right direction. And I'm confident we'll do good in the future. Maybe not this season, but the seasons after and IF Olé gets a chance to really rebuild, then we might have a topteam in the coming years.
 
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jesperjaap

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Biggest loss for me is herrera.
Just wish we managed to replace him.

I'm happy with the rest of the window
I know he was player of he season at one point, but he was never more than average for me. I liked him for his love of the club and professionalism, but even that is tinted with his wanting silly wages and then going.

We should of replaced him....but he is easily replacable, agree with Gary Neville that there are loads of Herreras about and McTominay already is not much of a step down. I think our whole midfield needed rebuilding personally but in Fellaini and Herrera we havent lost much
 

jesperjaap

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Anyone else? Leicester, Everton?
What is better about those squads?
Thing is, it isnt who else, utter nonsense Wolves have a better squad than us, half there side wouldnt get into ours. What they do have is a well drilled side. Nobody outside the top six has a better squad than us on paper. We have a big and deep squad, but the likes of Mata, Lingard, Smalling, Bailly would all still get into the sides below us.

Our side is weaker than the rest of the top six as it has more glaring holes and underperforming players in it, less attitude or idnentity....but it is still better than those below it. That doesnt mean we wont finish our rivals for the top four, nor does it mean we wont finish below the likes of WOlves or Leicester as either are realistically possible but people are over rating players individually from the likes of Leicester and Wolves, Watford when it is the teams performances and well drilled attacking football that is bringing them success
 

jesperjaap

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Yawn.

It is hard to integrate young players in to a struggling side bereft of leaders. I want our young players to succeed, i just think we've given them an awful chance of doing so.
I agree with you here. hoping Maguire can develop into a leader.

Same point though, where we are now I think we have to show faith in our youngsters over the next two years. We seem incapable of a major clearout or purchases in one season with all this no quick fix, phase one (which we have not got further than in 7 bloody years) etc stuff, which I think is nonsense but it is what we are doing.

I genuinely think there were 10-12 players in our squad needed moving on from last summer Valencia, Herrera, Lukaku we didnt even move on, they chose to leave and with the slow process we are doing, others will choose to as well, we have already heard rumours of Pogba, Rashford, DeGea considering to do so and we have failed to move on the likes of Rojo and Darmian as of yet.

We are probably looking at 3/4 windows to move on all our players not good enough, which is criminal but likely judging on what has happened so far and I genuinely think we needed up to 8 new players in our first eleven.

That is 2/3 windows minimum the way we are doing business, so even everything working, we are talking about 2 full seasons to get the side right with perfect transfers. Thinking of it like that and us still having several mediocre players for a good 18months I feel that Greenwood, Tuanzabe and Gomes should definaely be getting lots of games and we should even be looking to integrate the likes of Garner and Laird into the squad in preparation for next season.

I think the step up is huge and some of them, even the talented ones may not be able to. Also think we are over rating a fair few in the likes of McTominay and what we are doing isnt going to win titles or even challenge for them over the next couple of years but with the slow process we are doing, the youngsters are probably our best hope ironically over the short term.

Again though, agree with you,should have been at least four signings, more like six, should have been a few strong characters added to the side and a lot more should have been moved on, even if on loan, it isnt whats happening though so I am really wanting to see these youngsters play
 

Houdini

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Can't agree that we stand no chance.

Arsenal look good on paper, but they are Arsenal. They'll have a meltdown and a injury crisis just like us. They are thin in midfield and need to put together a new CB-pairing consisting of Holding, Sokratis or Luiz.

Chelsea lost their talisman in Hazard, and while i believe Pulisic & CHO will be a good pair for them, they don't have a proper striker and on top of that they don't have good backup (to my knowledge) for CB spots. Injuries in the backline could be terrible for them.

I think it's up in the air who will get more goals between us and Chelsea, but I also think we look better in defense than Arsenal (ignoring the midfield). We certainly would need some luck and the squad to perform well in order to get top 4, but again I can't agree with the notion that we have no chance.

I think the season as things stand now will end with:
1. City
2. Pool
3-4. Arsenal and Spurs
5. United
6. Chelsea


But injuries and form can certainly change everything from 3rd to 6th, maybe even 8th if Wolves and Everton are lucky.
If spurs lose Eriksen then they might fall down to 4th or 5th.
This is realistic. But we lack the depth. Just one or two injuries (pogba/Rash/Martial) and we can easily end up fighting for the 6-7...
 

Mark Pawelek

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We can make 3rd or 4th place. We could've last season had the players been really up for it and the moral been there.
  • An injury to Kane will knobble Spurs. Like it did last season.
  • Arsenal can still implode any time.
  • Chelsea are lightweight in attack and suffering a transfer ban.
 

BlueHaze

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Regarding our transfer policy there is only one thing I want to know. Ole recently said there was money available for the right players. Is he saying this to try and avoid fan backlash toward the Glazer's or is it actually true? If so then how come we placed no bids for players like Ndombele, Pepe or Bruno? Makes no sense to me. Had we gone into the season with additions to midfield and Pepe for the RW I would have been much more confident. How can Ole give Lingard continous support after his shambolic performances last year?
 

matsdf

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Regarding our transfer policy there is only one thing I want to know. Ole recently said there was money available for the right players. Is he saying this to try and avoid fan backlash toward the Glazer's or is it actually true? If so then how come we placed no bids for players like Ndombele, Pepe or Bruno? Makes no sense to me. Had we gone into the season with additions to midfield and Pepe for the RW I would have been much more confident. How can Ole give Lingard continous support after his shambolic performances last year?
SAF always said there was money available, but he wouldn't buy if the price wasn't right (no value etc), we never bought just to buy. Ole mirrors SAF in a lot of the stuff he did, I have no problem believing that it's the same with transfers. Very few credible reports linked us with Ndombele or Pepe. For me the far most believable scenario was just that we weren't interested. We wanted Longstaff, but not at the price Newcastle wanted. Since no player we really wanted was availabe at an acceptable price, we simply didn't buy them.
 

Kelly15

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We definately have a chance of top 4. Will we challenge for the title? I'm not sure. I do have hope that we will.

Having said that I feel like we are behind in what we need. Last year we needed a cb and we have needed a rb and a rw for a few seasons now. Finally we addressed that this year. Though the rw is still up in the air.

We really need another wc midfielder as we are a little short of competition in this area. But we will see how the season goes. We might have the talent all ready here.

Looking forward to this season.
 

TheRedDevil'sAdvocate

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Regarding our transfer policy there is only one thing I want to know. Ole recently said there was money available for the right players. Is he saying this to try and avoid fan backlash toward the Glazer's or is it actually true? If so then how come we placed no bids for players like Ndombele, Pepe or Bruno? Makes no sense to me. Had we gone into the season with additions to midfield and Pepe for the RW I would have been much more confident. How can Ole give Lingard continous support after his shambolic performances last year?
He's saying that the money is there for players that will come here to start for us and have an immediate positive impact on the side because they offer qualities that we either lack or have but not in abundance. When we saw an experienced and PL proven defender with leadership qualities in Maguire we paid Leicester what they asked for him. The money is also available for top talents who will be willing to spend their best years with us like AWB. Hence the British core argument since British players traditionally don't leave to play in foreign leagues and they are more accustomed to the English environment.

My guess is he probably believes that Mata/Lingard will suffice for next season (with CL qualification being the goal, not challenging for the title) and then perhaps someone better than Bruno or Pepe(meaning better suited to his plans) may become available. Similarly, he's content to give McT the chance to flourish and to Fred an opportunity to prove himself instead of signing an out and out defensive midfielder to play next to Pogba because we don't know if Pogba will commit himself to United (probably he'll be offered a contract extension during the season). If he goes, we'll have to rethink the whole midfield.

I believe that we were willing to get either Dybala or Eriksen and make them top earners. Because these are players who could come here and elevate the whole team. So, the money is there. I'm not downplaying your concerns. I have mine too. I think we can finish in the top four but i also believe that it will be a "best-case scenario" outcome. And my greatest fear is that we will start well but the lack of depth and experience will prove too costly and the wheels will come off toward the end of the season. But i don't have any issues with what Solskjaer is trying to do either. Whether Woodward is doing a good job or not, the market has gone nuts and we are not a sugar-daddy club and therefore we have to be careful with how we spend our money.
 

Tango80

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Regarding our transfer policy there is only one thing I want to know. Ole recently said there was money available for the right players. Is he saying this to try and avoid fan backlash toward the Glazer's or is it actually true? If so then how come we placed no bids for players like Ndombele, Pepe or Bruno? Makes no sense to me. Had we gone into the season with additions to midfield and Pepe for the RW I would have been much more confident. How can Ole give Lingard continous support after his shambolic performances last year?
I genuinely think it's true.

Ndombele I'm not sure why but you could say that about any player? Maybe he just wanted someone a bit different (ie Longstaff)
Pepe - same reason why we sold Lukaku, massively expensive in an area which wasn't the priority given the kids coming through
Bruno - hes not that good, and all of the gossip's been pushed solely by his agent.
 

Ollie Derbyshire

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Thing is, it isnt who else, utter nonsense Wolves have a better squad than us, half there side wouldnt get into ours. What they do have is a well drilled side. Nobody outside the top six has a better squad than us on paper. We have a big and deep squad, but the likes of Mata, Lingard, Smalling, Bailly would all still get into the sides below us.

Our side is weaker than the rest of the top six as it has more glaring holes and underperforming players in it, less attitude or idnentity....but it is still better than those below it. That doesnt mean we wont finish our rivals for the top four, nor does it mean we wont finish below the likes of WOlves or Leicester as either are realistically possible but people are over rating players individually from the likes of Leicester and Wolves, Watford when it is the teams performances and well drilled attacking football that is bringing them success
This I agree with, watching the pre season games it looks like we starting to finally get a ‘team’ playing together
 

mitchmouse

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Of course it's fecking possible.

We have a much better starting 11 than last season just from defensive stability alone.

The negativity around here pathetic.
but have weakened midfield and attack
 

Greck

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No chance at all of finishing ahead of Chelsea? Didn't even think to have a look at our competition.
 

Devil_forever

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Another farcical, disgraceful, incompetently handled transfer window, which will result in another statement about pulling in a director of football, that won't happen.

I mean what club knowing Lukaku is going waits till the day before the window closes to get a replacement. You think that's bull?

Well Lyon has confirmed that we tried to get Moussa Dembele... and Lyon president Jean-Michel Aulas has trolled the club saying: “It is not a question of money, it is a question of ambition.“

“Moussa Dembele will not leave,” he said.

“The model was made for him. We recruited according to him.


“He becomes centre number one, which he was not totally last season.

“It is not a question of money, it is a question of ambition.“



“Moussa is part of the project just like Juninho or others,” he added.

“We want him to succeed and to reach the France team from his club which is Lyon.

“We have a great deal of confidence in its capabilities and potential.”

Defenders were needed, but they won't make the difference at the top half of the table. Right now we are fighting Everton and Wolves for sixth place. We have NO chance of top four.

The fact we think our midfield is good enough shows that there is something dreadfully wrong within our club.

But surely the club knows our midfield is not good enough, hence the last minute dalliance with Eriksen.

Meanwhile the midfielder-rich Spurs bring in not one but two central midfielders of quality.

It has been said many times before, but I don't think I am alone in thinking that enough is enough.

Woodward out. Glazers out.
Hey cnut, take my bet, we’re finishing below wolves right? 7th? Dickhead.
 

FootballHQ

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I think by virtue of the defence that won't be possible. If de gea returns to form that is such a strong back 5 we will be really tough to beat and that is a great foundation.

We won't be competitive though because we will struggle to score enough. I predict a lot of low scoring games.
Pretty good prediction there.

Quite a few good posts here foreseeing the problems actually.
 

Yagami

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The doom and gloom of some of our supporters is hilarious. Not only will we be in the top 4 this year, but we will put up a title challenge. But go on, try and convince me that my optimism is misplaced and that I should be a negative Nancy like the rest of you...
Negative Nancy? More like Realistic Rachel.

after that terrible transfer window so many of us saw this coming a mile away.
 

DevilRed

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Not replacing the players that left is the big mistake.

However, whether thats down to Ole not wanting anyone or the board not wanting to spend the money, is something we will never know.
 

Makelele

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Not replacing Lukaku and going into the season with such a thin and unproven strike force is just incredible for a club of Uniteds stature.
 

Dirty Schwein

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Crazy how Newcastle, who have been God awful this year, Wolves, who only started playing properly last week and newly promoted Sheffield are in and around us.