Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion

[Foxbatt]

Players have to be taught how to create space and move into space. Do you think they suddenly learn it? And different teams play different styles. Now there is no way in hell anyone can compete in a two man midfield the way we play. Someone can say we beat City and Spurs and yes we did but in actual fact we did not have much possession and in attack the midfield did not create is as it was moved very quickly to the forwards who did the damage.
Look at today. Fred and Scott are playing parallel and at one time, Maguire had nothing to pass the ball to. It is not just Fred and Scott has to move but the whole team has to be on the move all the time. Without that you do not create space. When you have Lingard who moves the wrong way all the time it makes it worse. You look at Lingard, he always moves after the player with the ball and there is no way he is going to get the ball by trying to tackle from behind. It is better that he moves to deny the space instead of trying to be clever.
Now it is the manager's responsibility to correct these mistakes and in fact practice the movements on the training ground.
We go taken apart by Watford. Anyone that says they did not deserve to win has watched a different match. There was a period in the second half they just went through us at will.

 

[UnitedSofa]

And moronic fans are moronic. Evidently.

Calling fans, who want our team to succeed and do better than beating 20th placed Watford, entitled, is really something.

Being upset about losing to Watford is not being entitled, getting the a**e with Ole and calling for him to get the sack is entitled. The two don’t go hand in hand. You can be upset at the performance, but you cannot go calling a cretin and that he needs to go (which some posters do) at the end of *every single loss* - It’s almost guaranteed that if we lose someone will call for his head.

The notion that long-term stability has to be preceded by short-term struggles invalidates your entire argument. Why could we not get a good manager in who would be successful in the short term and build on that relative success to go on to do even better things with proper backing and short-term success that would see us being able to get the best up and coming players to join the side?

This is the real world, not a Rocky movie.

Didn’t say it was a rocky movie. But we tried short term success to build something on 2 times over now (LVG, Mou) and that hasn’t worked either. Can’t keep chopping and changing managers, you’ll be stuck in a forever loop of putting a square peg in a round hole, it doesn’t build stability.

You could argue Mou did that, we won a Europa league and finished 2nd!

Surely that’s “short term success”

I find this nearly as bad as the posters insulting ole personally. Daft post with a childish nature. If you want ole to stay that's fine. Football is all about opinions.

There are plenty of overly dramatic posters on both sides of the argument. I was down the middle but today is the result that made me think its time for a change. Does that make me entitled?

It's not good enough and I dont believe ole has enough to make it better. I'd happily be proved wrong. I love ole he gave me one of my greatest footballing memories, doesnt give him a free ride though.

Of course it doesn’t make you entitled but I see it time and time again, posters who get all happy when we win and Ole’s the greatest and then when we lose it’s back to sacking him again. That’s entitlement. Expecting the team to win every match just because “we’re manchester united”

Back Ole 100% or not at all imo.


A lot of posters here need to wake up.

We simply aren’t as good as we used to be and you’ve got to support the club, which includes our current manager and players no matter how good or bad you think they are, through thick and thin.

 

[Cantona in disguise]

Being upset about losing to Watford is not being entitled, getting the a**e with Ole and calling for him to get the sack is entitled. The two don’t go hand in hand. You can be upset at the performance, but you cannot go calling a cretin and that he needs to go (which some posters do) at the end of *every single loss* - It’s almost guaranteed that if we lose someone will call for his head.



Didn’t say it was a rocky movie. But we tried short term success to build something on 2 times over now (LVG, Mou) and that hasn’t worked either. Can’t keep chopping and changing managers, you’ll be stuck in a forever loop of putting a square peg in a round hole, it doesn’t build stability.

You could argue Mou did that, we won a Europa league and finished 2nd!

Surely that’s “short term success”



Of course it doesn’t make you entitled but I see it time and time again, posters who get all happy when we win and Ole’s the greatest and then when we lose it’s back to sacking him again. That’s entitlement. Expecting the team to win every match just because “we’re manchester united”

Back Ole 100% or not at all imo.


A lot of posters here need to wake up.

We simply aren’t as good as we used to be and you’ve got to support the club, which includes our current manager and players no matter how good or bad you think they are, through thick and thin.

I like many were ecstatic with the results against city and spurs because I support united. Not any individual player/manager. I love ole as I've said but he (in my opinion) is simply not good enough. When he gets results he gets the plaudits, when things like today happen he gets stick. I will continue to sing his name and support him til the day he leaves. Because he is the united manager. However for me his time should be up I'm not saying my opinion is right as its subjective.

No need to jump down peoples throat for having an opinion. Ignore the drama queens because they exist on both sides of the fence.

 

[hobbers]

Do you not think Liverpool fans had ambition even when Klopp didn't win a trophy for 3 years ? Rome wasnt built in a day . Be patient

Klopp was a proven top manager having taken Dortmund to 2 league titles and a CL final.........????

Ole got Cardiff relegated and would have left them doubly-relegated had they the same level of sentimental non ambition that we apparently have.

Playing for Klopp was an attractive proposition for good players and top talent, whereas no players out there are looking at Ole and thinking he has a chance of success. Well, no players that would take us forward at any rate.

 

[Anustart89]

Didn’t say it was a rocky movie. But we tried short term success to build something on 2 times over now (LVG, Mou) and that hasn’t worked either. Can’t keep chopping and changing managers, you’ll be stuck in a forever loop of putting a square peg in a round hole, it doesn’t build stability.

You could argue Mou did that, we won a Europa league and finished 2nd!

Surely that’s “short term success”

Like I said, what's to say we can't get short-term success and then have that same person build on that short-term success to achieve long-term success?

- We tried with Moyes and failed in the short term. Should we have given him more time because long-term success would've been guaranteed, despite him being out of his depth at the time of his sacking?
- We tried with LvG and got some, but no real short-term success, and when it was obvious that we weren't progressing he was given the sack.
- We tried with Mourinho and got some success in getting the EL and 2nd place finishes, and he was given a new contract. After that, he showed that he wasn't building on that short-term success and we got rid of him.
- Now we're trying with Ole, and after some real short-term success during his interim period it's getting obvious that we're not seeing any real progress.

Based on the above, why should we persist with Ole instead of trying again to get someone (Poch, Nagelsmann, Rose, Ten Hag (I don't know, it's not my job)) to get short-term success and build on that?

If we'd been progressing under Ole, ie instilling a clear idea of how we want to play against all sides (not only 25% of them), then I'd be wanting to give him more time, but we're extremely consistent in our performances (good against good teams, poor against the poor teams) and those performances are not going to land us any success in the short term or the long term. I don't see how adding players is going to suddenly transform the tactical side of Ole's coaching. If it'd been there, it would've been visible by now.

And for all the talk about every goal being an uncharacteristic mistake, our general play is poor enough that one 'uncharacteristic' mistake (which seems to be happening every game now...) is enough to drop points against any team because we're simply too poor at the other end of the pitch.

 

[Giggsyking]

if he was sacked, which premier league club at all would want him their manager?

Zero. No Premier league nor division 1. The only league at his level is the Norwegian league.

 

[passing-wind]

I've switched off from even being emotive when we lose we are being led by at best a mid table coach therefore we manifest mid table results and have an impoverished mid table mentality.

All of the fans backing Solskjaer are an embarrassment to the ambition that is required for the club to move forward. We aren't making progress under Solskjaer we have regressed to a point we are in a state of perpetual inconsistency. To be in a "decline" would offer a complement to our current circumstances. Hypothetically for Barcelona to go from winning titles to finishing in a European spot continually is a decline, we have already surpassed our transition of decline a decade of misfailings confirm this, however inconsistency is an even worse conundrum and the reason as to why relegation is even a concept.

We need a strong leader to coach this team to success, the team cannot manage itself, which I see very often posted on these forums like Ole has absolutely no responsibility to create a system that is sustained and persistent enabling us to win. That's why no individual players will make us a success. We can have Sancho, Maddison, Haaland, Modric and it will make no difference to our performances when we don't have the cohesion necessary to break down defences structured from the direction of the manager.

I'll stick by what I've said all along if we miss out of on top four Ole deserves the door. Why should LVG have been sacked finishing with a domestic cup (with a reasonable record against top 6) and Ole be kept when he offers LESS managerially. This whole situation including the mentality of many fans is ridiculous.

 

[Castia]

Needs to change his system up against the smaller teams.

In the bigger games our #10 is valuable, we use him to close down the opposition and spearhead counter attacks.....against teams that sit deep it’s a completely wasted position and has been for the best part of 10 months.

The quality of Lingard, Pereira or Mata isn’t there, all 3 have failed miserably in the role yet he keeps going with it even though it’s proven to be a waste of time. Should play a basic 442 dropping the #10 for Greenwood playing alongside Martial.

 

[bondsname]

Klopp was a proven top manager having taken Dortmund to 2 league titles and a CL final.........????

Ole got Cardiff relegated and would have left them doubly-relegated had they the same level of sentimental non ambition that we apparently have.

Playing for Klopp was an attractive proposition for good players and top talent, whereas no players out there are looking at Ole and thinking he has a chance of success. Well, no players that would take us forward at any rate.

Let me just start off with saying I'm not sure if I'm Ole in, or Ole out.

It did take Klopp 2 seasons to win the Bundesliga, finishing 5th and 6th the seasons before. In his third season he won the league comfortably. He was given time in his first "major" job and it worked.

But as history has shown us, Klopp is apparently a fantastic manager with a great knowledge of tactics and good man-management skills. He turned out to be one of the best coaches this decade.

If Ole has that in him, nothing but time will tell. And it's a risky road to go on because we might miss out on currently available managers out there if Ole is proved a failure.

 

[Ancient Of Days]

Just listened to his post match interview and again he can't help but talk about rebuild and the lads working hard, which had nothing to do with the question asked by the journalist.

This guy is using Charles Manson repetition and manipulation and brainwashing to keep his job. This fraud is only interested in protecting his position in order to keep lining up his pockets. He doesn't give a shit about United's best interest, otherwise he'd have packed up and left a long time ago.

He now has a cult following who repeat word for word the same phrases, buzzwords and values like a religion

Dare question Ole, or ask any of his followers what he has done here that is so great and why he deserves to stay and you will get

''He's made 3 solid signings''

''We've gotten ridden of the deadwood''

''He's improved the culture''

''Ole cares about the club''

''We need to stick with him through the rebuilding process''

''No other manager can come in and do any better''

'We're finally heading in the right direction as a club and seeing progress''

All this shit, while they complain and blame the players for their attitude, meanwhile on the other hand telling all and sundry that Ole already got rid of all the bad people poisoning the dressing room

 

[Utdstar01]

Pisses me off when he gets asked about the fans and he says every fan hes spoken to have had nothing but positive things to say. Makes my blood boil. feck off.

 

[Godfather]

So ones who were in are insane? I mean let's no go there.

Not insane. But likely blinded by some melancholic sentiments

 

[Andycoleno9]

For me, as I said in this thread I don't have much problem with Ole, nor I still want him gone as much as I wanted previously (even when I still feel it's inevitable he'll be sacked at one point) but the results and performance have improved recently, so he deserves time and chance for now. Though we need to improve our ability to deal with defensive teams or we'll keep fecking up small games. I don't see any problem with saying that. Don't care what other says, because I can't control what they say!

Et tu mi fili brute... You deserve ban from Ole out club.
Your account was hacked, right?

 

[Giggsyking]

The amount of flip flop fans is hilarious.

Also, seems a lot of you all want short term success over long term stability and success.

If you want short term success, shouldve stuck with Mourinho.....oh wait.

Sure we lost again, but we go again next week.

Entitled fans once again showing their worth.

Wah wah we lost again Ole’s cr@p wah wah

Sack Ole, Bring in Poch, we lose a bunch of games sack poch, bring in someone else.

But hey ho, let’s bring in Red Cafe’s Messiah in Pochettino. He’ll sort this lost out. Won’t he.

Entitled fans are Entitled.

I am sorry my friend, but fans like you should not be heard, because mediocrity acceptance is like a disease that will kill a football club, and we love our club too much to accept seeing it vanish into mediocrity. If you are ok with mefiocrity, dont make it sound like it is normal at a club in the size and prestige of our beloved club.

 

[el3mel]

Et tu mi fili brute... You deserve ban from Ole out club.
Your account was hacked, right?

I tried to be positive for once. Shame man.

 

[Samid]

Pisses me off when he gets asked about the fans and he says every fan hes spoken to have had nothing but positive things to say. Makes my blood boil. feck off.

The prawn sandwich eaters at Old Trafford could start showing some discontent then. Apart from a few months of green and gold scarves a decade ago they haven't shown any signs of dissatisfaction.

 

[Eckers99]

Those to wins v Spurs and City were not a good thing, as I've stated before. I'm sure people will eventually understand why.

If you can't enjoy a derby win, irrespective of context, your opinion probably isn't worth reading.

 

[Cantona in disguise]

Just listened to his post match interview and again he can't help but talk about rebuild and the lads working hard, which had nothing to do with the question asked by the journalist.

This guy is using Charles Manson repetition and manipulation and brainwashing to keep his job. This fraud is only interested in protecting his position in order to keep lining up his pockets. He doesn't give a shit about United's best interest, otherwise he'd have packed up and left a long time ago.

He now has a cult following who repeat word for word the same phrases, buzzwords and values like a religion

Dare question Ole, or ask any of his followers what he has done here that is so great and why he deserves to stay and you will get

''He's made 3 solid signings''

''We've gotten ridden of the deadwood''

''He's improved the culture''

''Ole cares about the club''

''We need to stick with him through the rebuilding process''

''No other manager can come in and do any better''

'We're finally heading in the right direction as a club and seeing progress''

All this shit, while they complain and blame the players for their attitude, meanwhile on the other hand telling all and sundry that Ole already got rid of all the bad people poisoning the dressing room

I think his time is up to be honest but to say he doesnt care about united is rubbish and you know it. Unfortunately my last post of the day but I couldn't let that complete rubbish slip through without at least a comment.

 

[JohnnyKills]

In terms of rebuilding the squad he's done a good job. Sánchez, Lukaku and the other squad players have all gone and the three signings have all been good. Greenwood, Tuanzebe, Williams and Garner are all integrated in the first team. If we eventually get back to the top, we'll thank OGS for doing a dirty job that needed doing.

Whether he's the right man to finish the project is another matter, of course. I'd be inclined to wait until the end of the season and see how things pan out before replacing him.

For what it's worth I thought we played OK today. We created plenty of chances and gave them a goal with DDG's error.

 

[Alabaster Codify7]

Pisses me off when he gets asked about the fans and he says every fan hes spoken to have had nothing but positive things to say. Makes my blood boil. feck off.

You know what the best/worst part of this is?

It's a lie. He's lying. We are 7pts off fourth, 10pts from the relegation zone with a humiliating win ratio since he was made permanent.

Even the most red-tinted specs, topred United fan in the world would have something negative to say to Ole, however small. He's inventing imaginary conversations he's had with fans.

"Nothing but positive things to say" - hahahahahaha! So these hypothetical fans you've spoken to, Spoofjaer, are feeling happy about losing to teams like Watford and Newcastle, are they? Nothing negative in the slightest to say, no?

Absolute spoofer of a manager. He's getting worse with every interview now, he's properly entering Moyesy territory.

 

[JohnnyKills]

If you can't enjoy a derby win, irrespective of context, your opinion probably isn't worth reading.

With respect Eckersley, this adds nothing to the debate. We all want the same thing and we're allowed to see things in different ways. Top Reddism just pollutes the conversation.

 

[VP89]

With respect Eckersley, this adds nothing to the debate. We all want the same thing and we're allowed to see things in different ways. Top Reddism just pollutes the conversation.

Good post.

Not specific to the poster but your point is relevant generally too, at a time where countless posters are hell bent on a civil war (Jose/Pogba/Ole "fanbois" vs "haters").

 

[ruudvan10]

One took over a team of reigning Champions, one took over a broken club 6 years lost in the wilderness.

If you think 15 losses in 36 is not enough to get the sack at with the players we have I don't know what to tell you. I was merely comparing Ole to a manager that is considered to be the worst united manager post Sir Alex (tbf I think Ole is a lot worse than Moyes).

I just cant understand why some people actually feel Ole deserves more time. Is it the amazing football we are playing? the great results we are getting? His past achievements? a clear sign of progress from him taking over to now?

I know it's not something as silly as he used to play for us.

 

[FootyGirl88]

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[Snuffkin]

Ole's real gaffe has been trusting people too much. Martial and Pogba in particular. Neither have ever shown signs of playing consistently well, and yet we were utterly reliant on their fitness and form. Big risk that was never going to pay off. Poor judgement. I get how investing in people and showing trust can work, but those two in particular are not able to respond.

 

[passing-wind]

Klopp was a proven top manager having taken Dortmund to 2 league titles and a CL final.........????

Ole got Cardiff relegated and would have left them doubly-relegated had they the same level of sentimental non ambition that we apparently have.

Playing for Klopp was an attractive proposition for good players and top talent, whereas no players out there are looking at Ole and thinking he has a chance of success. Well, no players that would take us forward at any rate.

 

[Andycoleno9]

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Well he is often here compared with Klopp so Klopp had wind, Ole has traffic. But he is in good mood. It is only what matters here.

 

[FootyGirl88]

Well he is often here compared with Klopp so Klopp had wind, Ole has traffic. But he is in good mood. It is only what matters here.

 

[thesheriffjw]

Just seen the stats on sky when utd have greater percentage of possession!!!
Guess what? 8% win rate.
Proof ole has no plan b other than counter football

 

[Un4givableB]

Ole needs to surround himself with more knowledgeable staff. He doesn't know how to set up and play against teams that defend, then get someone who does. We got counters down to an art, now we need to do better against opponents who let us hold the ball. We won't progress if it continues like this. Ole needs to show a mean side and re-structure around him.

One of the highest-paid managers in the world needs to surround himself with more knowledgeable staff, yeah like with a good manager. We should have got Ancelotti to 'surround' him before Everton got him.

 

[Andycoleno9]

Just seen the stats on sky when utd have greater percentage of possession!!!
Guess what? 8% win rate.
Proof ole has no plan b other than counter football

Stats don't tell the truth many times. For example, it is normal to finish game with more possession and shots when you lose 2:0 after 60 minutes. Other team goes in defence and you go all out in attack with shooting from all positions.

 

[Red_toad]

Ole needs to surround himself with more knowledgeable staff. He doesn't know how to set up and play against teams that defend, then get someone who does. We got counters down to an art, now we need to do better against opponents who let us hold the ball. We won't progress if it continues like this. Ole needs to show a mean side and re-structure around him.

Jose had the same issues, as did Van Gaal. So is it the manager or the players or the coaches?

 

[JoaquinJoaquin]

I'm not really sure how where this myth of tight with money is coming from. I get people are critical of how the money is being spent, but in terms of the amount I'm struggling. We have spent a fortune, just not effectively in all areas.

The purse strings have severely tightened since the Sanchez signing. Have you been living in a cave for the past 18months?

 

[Thiagoal]

Needs to change his system up against the smaller teams.

In the bigger games our #10 is valuable, we use him to close down the opposition and spearhead counter attacks.....against teams that sit deep it’s a completely wasted position and has been for the best part of 10 months.

The quality of Lingard, Pereira or Mata isn’t there, all 3 have failed miserably in the role yet he keeps going with it even though it’s proven to be a waste of time. Should play a basic 442 dropping the #10 for Greenwood playing alongside Martial.

I totally concur with this! If we’re being given so much of the ball then a way of getting round the deep block is to get players into the box to cause confusion and unsettle the defenders! Our full backs also need to be far more product mind you! Like you say the attacking mid ends up doing nothing other than recycling the ball! We need to get the ball foward much quicker and then play from there!

 

[passing-wind]

Ole's real gaffe has been trusting people too much. Martial and Pogba in particular. Neither have ever shown signs of playing consistently well, and yet we were utterly reliant on their fitness and form. Big risk that was never going to pay off. Poor judgement. I get how investing in people and showing trust can work, but those two in particular are not able to respond.

Ole trusting himself is the problem. We are heading into a state of the abyss as a club and we have a happy as larry leader steering the very rot of our mediocrity.

If fans are disillusioned with the quality of the team how about they look at the track record of Solskjaer and become disillusioned with him. I look at Brendan Rodgers and see a manager who lost his job with Liverpool re-galvanised himself in Scottish football and is now leading the charge against his former employee's for a league title. That's the mentality of a manager who strives to achieve ambition.

The question of Solskjaer saying he will be a success here is as confusing as the answer of the Collatz Conjecture. No matter how much time he's given.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

Jose had the same issues, as did Van Gaal. So is it the manager or the players or the coaches?

There has been a big turnover of players though. Jones isn't involved. Smalling isn't here. Mata wasn't here under Moyes, so that must have been Rio and Vidic fault. The players appear to love Ole, so you would think they are trying their best, but are not getting guidance when Plan A is not working.

 

[C'est Moi Cantona]

Deliver him a couple of players in January, and see if he can slay the beast of not been able to break down teams that defend first against us, if he can't then he has to be toast in the summer.

The worst thing we could do is just leave him with this squad for the rest of the season, and have the element of doubt of what could have been, or waste more time with him next season, as he clearly has something going on to nail so many top teams.

 

[Suedesi]

Maybe. Personally I’m for us sticking with him for now, as his recruitment’s been good, and hopefully he’ll add some tools to our team in January that might help us deal with the smaller sides.

Spunking 130m quid on AWB and Maguire hasn't been anything exceptional to be honest.

 

[Andycoleno9]

Deliver him a couple of players in January, and see if he can slay the beast of not been able to break down teams that defend first against us, if he can't then he has to be toast in the summer.

The worst thing we could do is just leave him with this squad for the rest of the season, and have the element of doubt of what could have been, or waste more time with him next season, as he clearly has something going on to nail so many top teams.

Well that is not smart imo. Every manager buys players for his system and style. There are of course group of players who fit in every system( mainly because they are world class players) but most of them don't.
For example look Ole's signings. James can play for any manager who uses wingers but he is useless for 352 formation and especially look at Harry and Awb? With Maguire you can't play with high defensive line because he is slow and Awb is not dream fullback for coach who plays with attacking full backs. Jose loved to have target man, many managers don't want to have them. Jose loved classic strong old fashioned dmc but Ole doesn't even play with classic no6 and uses no10.
So giving Ole another 100mil "just to see" what will happen is just wrong because that means that new manager will have less money to spend on his players and will have more players that he maybe doesn't want.

Only if we are 100% sure that Ole is the guy for future( next season) we should back him in next transfer window.

 

[Andycoleno9]

Jose had the same issues, as did Van Gaal. So is it the manager or the players or the coaches?

No they didn't. Under Jose we dominated those teams. Even in his 3rd season we beat those teams