Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion

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roonster09

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What changes are they when Woodward just cobbled up a bunch of his appointees and instituted a rubber stamping transfer committee full of yes man. If you look at the supposed brilliant football people, they are leftovers from the failed regimes of Moyes and Van Gaal who have been given glorious sound Scouting titles to make them look sophisticated.

Last summer we again overpaid for mediocre talent that a new manager could possibly want gone after a few months due to their limitations. We are still conceding comical goals but we have spent £130m on the so call defensive upgrades leaving ourselves ridiculously short in midfield and forward areas. Nothing has changed, Woodward is now just hiding behind his army of puppets.
Search for Woodward, Ole's interview. I didn't say that's a good change or its something that's working well, i said going by their interview there are changes done but it's the managers decision in the end as that's what Ole said.

I don't even know what your reply has anything to do with my post.
 

AneRu

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Search for Woodward, Ole's interview. I didn't say that's a good change or its something that's working well, i said going by their interview there are changes done but it's the managers decision in the end as that's what Ole said.

I don't even know what your reply has anything to do with my post.
The changes were much publicised but in reality not much has changed because it's still the same people who were here at the height of this shitshow that have been cobbled up into this fabled recruitment team. There are just cosmetic changes and the people driving this are the same people Woodward handpicked from the failed previous regimes.
 

zizi

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Yeah there are changes that are done going by few interviews and briefing by club but Ole said it's always managers call in the end. If manager don't want any player they won't be signed.
Yeah but now, if the 'footballing' people at the club don't agree with the signing, they won't be signed. So a significant change.

Previously is Marcel Bout didn't agree with Fellani or Sanchez or Damien, they would be signed regardless. Now they won't.
 

roonster09

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The changes were much publicised but in reality not much has changed because it's still the same people who were here at the height of this shitshow that have been cobbled up into this fabled recruitment team. There are just cosmetic changes and the people driving this are the same people Woodward handpicked from the failed previous regimes.
If as reported it was from this summer then we will know in few years. Shame we don't hire good managers so any good recruitment will end up looking like bad transfer.
 

DomesticTadpole

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Yeah but now, if the 'footballing' people at the club don't agree with the signing, they won't be signed. So a significant change.

Previously is Marcel Bout didn't agree with Fellani or Sanchez or Damien, they would be signed regardless. Now they won't.
Poor old Damien. I think he does a good job. :(
 

tenpoless

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So We have footballing people to tell Woodward if a player is good or not and They can say no but if the manager says yes, We sign the player anyway?
Then what's the point of them? that's my dream job right there. I will just copy paste FM analysis.
 

TheRedDevil'sAdvocate

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There's a couple of really, really odd things about this quote from Solskjaer...

The first is that he's literally criticizing Mourinho and LvG for criticizing the system that Utd has had in place for the last 6 / 7 years - even if we ignore the fact that said system is clearly, and blatantly so disgracefully flawed and proven totally ineffective in the modern PL era, we can't ignore that Solskjaer, while defending that system, is simultaneously constantly claiming that the state of the club requires a 'big rebuild'...

So... the system is fine... yet, Ole needs multiple transfer windows to rebuild the squad that's in a shambles because of said system... erm, ok. That is just laughable.

Journalists need to pick him up on this stuff!

The second problem with these quotes from him is that he's criticizing the only two managers who've brought Man Utd silverware since SAF. And in saying things like 'some of us think we're better than others' suggests that he believes that he's equal as a manager to them... and so, if they've won silverware while operating in a system that they believed utterly broken - then Ole should certainly be able to do the same given that he's a fan of that system and is supposedly their managerial equal.

It's reached the point of parody in my opinion, you have to laugh.

Books will be written about the Woodward era at Utd.
He's not suggesting that the system is fine. He is claiming that the whole structure is functioning well because he's the one supervising it. Which is actually what his most ardent supporters have been claiming for some time now, it's not something new.

The attack on LvG and Mourinho was in the same vein and, of course, premeditated. They spent more than half a billion Euros for short-term success that didn't come (in the sense of winning major trophies), so his plan is better even if the results seem worse in its early stages because he plans for the future and has the club's best interests at heart.

The problem with all this is that, with a 34% win rate, he's basically asking for the fans to show blind faith in him. And that's when the lines between "trusting an insider during our hard times" and sheer nepotism get blurred.

Where things get confusing, imho, is when his idealism meets Woodward's reluctance after the LvG and Mou debacles. He spent 80 million Maguire and he wants another 100+ for Sancho, 60 more for Longstaff, close to 80 for Bruno and so on. And by reiterating in public every other day that he's after the right players and only them, the only thing he achieves is making said players even more expensive. In the meantime, because he didn't get his preferred #10 he's more than willing to accept contract renewals for Pereira, Mata and (soon to follow) Lingard because you must have a squad, after all. Which goes along with Woodward's "protect the assets" policy just fine. It also helps Ed to go after only a couple of signings each season without the risk of bloating the squad. If you think about it, they are the perfect match for each other.

Meanwhile, the great Manchester United are on route to finishing their season on 45 points... People are crying out for a DoF to help Solskjaer. I'd say we need a DoF to save us from Solskjaer's rigid thinking. People are complaining about the injuries and the lack of options when the most criminal decision, the one that has led us to this, is that both the manager and the CEO found it acceptable, for different reasons, to go into the season with such a poor squad. It reminds me of the time when Ed went to Moyes to tell him that Kroos is willing to come here and dithering Dave was pondering whether the German would fit in his masterplan... Someone (DoF) should have stepped up and say: "You wanted Fabregas but couldn't get him and you have fecking Cleverley and Fellaini for that role. Get one of the best passers in the world in his mid-20s and find a freaking way to fit him in your plans".

Solskjaer, now that the results are awful, is attaching the need for a rebuild to himself and it looks like he backs Woodward and the current regime. Woodward doesn't want a major overhaul because he doesn't really trust any manager to do it and he hides behind the need for a long-term rebuild. Sadly, none of them has the answers and the club will continue to be in disarray unless something miraculous happens.
 
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Revaulx

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There's a couple of really, really odd things about this quote from Solskjaer...

The first is that he's literally criticizing Mourinho and LvG for criticizing the system that Utd has had in place for the last 6 / 7 years - even if we ignore the fact that said system is clearly, and blatantly so disgracefully flawed and proven totally ineffective in the modern PL era, we can't ignore that Solskjaer, while defending that system, is simultaneously constantly claiming that the state of the club requires a 'big rebuild'...

So... the system is fine... yet, Ole needs multiple transfer windows to rebuild the squad that's in a shambles because of said system... erm, ok. That is just laughable.

Journalists need to pick him up on this stuff!

The second problem with these quotes from him is that he's criticizing the only two managers who've brought Man Utd silverware since SAF. And in saying things like 'some of us think we're better than others' suggests that he believes that he's equal as a manager to them... and so, if they've won silverware while operating in a system that they believed utterly broken - then Ole should certainly be able to do the same given that he's a fan of that system and is supposedly their managerial equal.

It's reached the point of parody in my opinion, you have to laugh.

Books will be written about the Woodward era at Utd.
He is specifically defending “the system that has been put in”. Which is apparently an improvement over what was in place before.

The only change I’m aware of is that instead of buying average overpriced foreign players, we are now buying average overpriced British ones.
 

roonster09

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So We have footballing people to tell Woodward if a player is good or not and They can say no but if the manager says yes, We sign the player anyway?
Then what's the point of them? that's my dream job right there. I will just copy paste FM analysis.
Going by reports that player won't be signed. Players are signed when everyone is convinced.
 

zizi

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So We have footballing people to tell Woodward if a player is good or not and They can say no but if the manager says yes, We sign the player anyway?
Then what's the point of them? that's my dream job right there. I will just copy paste FM analysis.
Thats how it used to be, under SAF, and since then. Others could advise and provide opinion, but the manager made the decision.

Now it's not, now the decision is everyone's. If someone doesn't agree then the transfer doesn't go ahead. Stops short term signings by a mgr.

Exactly how it should be imo.
 

jamesjimmybyrondean

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Thats how it used to be, under SAF, and since then. Others could advise and provide opinion, but the manager made the decision.

Now it's not, now the decision is everyone's. If someone doesn't agree then the transfer doesn't go ahead. Stops short term signings by a mgr.

Exactly how it should be imo.
Was it like this under LVG and Mourinho?

Also if our recruitment has gotten better than what we had under LVG and Mourinho wouldn't it be wiser to get a good coach now. I can imagine those coaches doing better than they did if they recruited in a similar manner to Ole's regime
 

ranxerox

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He's not suggesting that the system is fine. He is claiming that the whole structure is functioning well because he's the one supervising it. Which is actually what his most ardent supporters have been claiming for some time now, it's not something new.

The attack on LvG and Mourinho was in the same vain and, of course, premeditated. They spent more than half a billion Euros for short-term success that didn't come (in the sense of winning major trophies), so his plan is better even if the results seem worse in its early stages because he plans for the future and has the club's best interests at heart.

The problem with all this is that, with a 34% win rate, he's basically asking for the fans to show blind faith in him. And that's when the lines between "trusting an insider during our hard times" and sheer nepotism get blurred.

Where things get confusing, imho, is when his idealism meets Woodward's reluctance after the LvG and Mou debacles. He spent 80 million Maguire and he wants another 100+ for Sancho, 60 more for Longstaff, close to 80 for Bruno and so on. And by reiterating in public every other day that he's after the right players and only them, the only thing he achieves is making said players even more expensive. In the meantime, because he didn't get his preferred #10 he's more than willing to accept contract renewals for Pereira, Mata and (soon to follow) Lingard because you must have a squad, after all. Which goes along with Woodward's "protect the assets" policy just fine. It also helps Ed to go after only a couple of signings each season without the risk of bloating the squad. If you think about it, they are the perfect match for each other.

Meanwhile, the great Manchester United are on route to finish their season on 45 points... People are crying out for a DoF to help Solskjaer. I'd say we need a DoF to save us from Solskjaer's rigid thinking. People are complaining about the injuries and the lack of options when the most criminal decision, the one that has led us to this, is that both the manager and the CEO found it acceptable, for different reasons, to go into the season with such a poor squad. It reminds me of the time when Ed went to Moyes to tell him that Kroos is willing to come here and dithering Dave was pondering whether the German would fit in his masterplan... Someone (DoF) should have stepped up and say: "You wanted Fabregas but couldn't get him and you have fecking Cleverley and Fellaini for that role. Get one of the best passers in the world in his mid-20s and find a freaking way to fit him in your plans".

Solskjaer, now that the results are awful, is attaching the need for a rebuild to himself and it looks like he backs Woodward and the current regime. Woodward doesn't want a major overhaul because he doesn't really trust any manager to do it and he hides behind the need for a long-term rebuild. Sadly, none of them has the answers and the club will continue to be in disarray unless something miraculous happens.
Devastating that.
 

fallengt

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Are you deliberately ignoring the fact that 'structure' has changed? Like it or not, the previous managers had control of signings and the poor recruitment was down them, not Woodward and not the Glazers. Since Ole has come it has changed, and a transfer committee is in place, where any of the committee (including manger, & head scout ect) can veto a transfer.

Also note how Ole say "put in place" showing there has been in change. But I guess this doesn't suit your narrative...
He literally said manager always has final say on transfer in the full quote. It's not much different from before, just different men piloting it now
This is the same system that had denied Harry Maguire because he's "not better than Smalling" then paid record fee for him one year later
 
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Verminator

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Part of the new structure should be reducing contracts for squad players.
We can't sell shit players like Lingard and Jones while they're on elite player wages.
If at renewal time Lingard is told he can stay but his wage drops from 100k to 60k, reflecting his importance to the team, he either signs and accepts, improves to justify his wage, or finds a club who pays better.

We can't continue golden-handcuff deals for mediocrity. Some top talents in Europe are on less than some of our second string.
 

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Part of the new structure should be reducing contracts for squad players.
We can't sell shit players like Lingard and Jones while they're on elite player wages.
If at renewal time Lingard is told he can stay but his wage drops from 100k to 60k, reflecting his importance to the team, he either signs and accepts, improves to justify his wage, or finds a club who pays better.

We can't continue golden-handcuff deals for mediocrity. Some top talents in Europe are on less than some of our second string.
A football club can only spend relative to its means.

United are considerably more wealthy than the vast majority of European clubs thus they pay their players larger salaries.
 

AlexUTD

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Part of the new structure should be reducing contracts for squad players.
We can't sell shit players like Lingard and Jones while they're on elite player wages.
If at renewal time Lingard is told he can stay but his wage drops from 100k to 60k, reflecting his importance to the team, he either signs and accepts, improves to justify his wage, or finds a club who pays better.

We can't continue golden-handcuff deals for mediocrity. Some top talents in Europe are on less than some of our second string.
Excatly. Jones earns more than Mane,fecking shitshow..
 

Foxbatt

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Thats how it used to be, under SAF, and since then. Others could advise and provide opinion, but the manager made the decision.

Now it's not, now the decision is everyone's. If someone doesn't agree then the transfer doesn't go ahead. Stops short term signings by a mgr.

Exactly how it should be imo.
no it shouldn't. The manager should have the final say because it is his team and he selects the best team he think will give him the best result. It would be highly idiotic to get someone else to buy players and then ask the manager , there you go use these players and win matches. It doesn't happen. Not anywhere else either. The DOFs job is to help the manager in getting the options for the manager to make a final decision. For eg: if Longstaff is not available then find other options for the manager. To coordinate all the scouts in finding the right kind of players needed by the manager.
You cannot win without getting or looking at short term options to get the best out of your team.
 

Jev

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"United believe that Solskjaer cannot be judged until he has been able to work with a squad that he has bought himself."

From the recent Times article. This line of thinking is becoming increasingly common, and I just don't get it. Imagine if a high-profile company believed that you can't judge a CEO until he has sacked and replaced every single employee.
 

Woodzy

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He's a coward of a manager and I preferred the brutal honesty of Jose Mourinho (despite how much of a bell end he came across).
 

Yagami

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I was hoping that he'd have learned something after running Rashford into the ground, but I guess not. I can't believe he's not resting Maguire and Martial here. At least Fred's getting a rest.
 

The Bloody-Nine

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I was hoping that he'd have learned something after running Rashford into the ground, but I guess not. I can't believe he's not resting Maguire and Martial here. At least Fred's getting a rest.
He really can't afford to get knocked out of the FA cup.
 

Yagami

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He really can't afford to get knocked out of the FA cup.
You're right, but if you can't give Martial and especially Maguire who seemingly plays every game a rest against Tranmere, then when can you? I just hope it doesn't come back to bite us in the butt.
 

Samid

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You're right, but if you can't give Martial and especially Maguire who seemingly plays every game a rest against Tranmere, then when can you? I just hope it doesn't come back to bite us in the butt.
Win today and they'll have a 16 day rest after Saturday.
 

DomM

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Picking Andreas and Lingard on a constant basis despite both of them being utter tosh is enough to be sacked, even today ignoring Gomes completely is quite baffling, especially as Chong is on his way out.
 

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This line up is horrible. Three centrebacks (of whom one might even have a small injury/pain), Lingard starting and Gomes not even on the bench against the number 21 of the league 1.

I can understand that Ole wants to win something at Manchester United even if it is just to 'prove his haters wrong' but this selection and line-up is just... well i dont even know a word for it. Cowardly maybe?
 

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Yep. On the other hand, if he did rest key players and we go on to lose, he'd get slaughtered for 'disrespecting the opposition and not taking the competition seriously'.
Aye, that.

Plus the FA Cup is our only realistic hope of silverware this season, not to mention one more loss could see him sacked the following day. He was always going to play a relatively strong team.
 

Yagami

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Win today and they'll have a 16 day rest after Saturday.
I didn't realise the gap between games was so big after Saturday. Let's hope we make it through these next ones unscathed then!
 

roonster09

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Very poor selection today.

Garner should be playing considering our CM crisis. Playing Martial on this pitch when we have Rashford already out is very poor decision.
 

Mainoldo

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Aye, that.

Plus the FA Cup is our only realistic hope of silverware this season, not to mention one more loss could see him sacked the following day. He was always going to play a relatively strong team.
Nobody cares about winning an FA Cup at the cost of burning out all the players. He knows his squad is thin. It’s not a priority except for what he believes will give him credit to keep a job.

Selfish if you ask me.
 

MS4

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Really nice selection. 5-3-2 or 4-2-3-1 if we want to attack, it does not matter which formation
Basically rested 4 players while it ensures the team is still strong enough.
Maybe when win is sealed, we take off Martial and Matic.

Stop the moaning.
 

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Nobody cares about winning an FA Cup at the cost of burning out all the players. He knows his squad is thin. It’s not a priority except for what he believes will give him credit to keep a job.

Selfish if you ask me.
Maybe it is selfish, I don't know, but there is a 2-week break following this game so every who plays will be fit for the next game.
 

JoaquinJoaquin

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Nobody cares about winning an FA Cup at the cost of burning out all the players. He knows his squad is thin. It’s not a priority except for what he believes will give him credit to keep a job.

Selfish if you ask me.
He knows this may be his only realistic chance at a trophy this year. He was never going to play the likes of Garner etc today.
 
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