May 1974 under the Doc but the start of a brilliant swashbuckling couple of years with Pearson, Hill, Coppell, Greenhoffs x2, Buchan, Sammy Mac et all. They'd give today's team a lesson in thrilling football and they're all over 70 now!!!
RIP Bryan
PL D FA Premier League
Manchester United 1:1 Arsenal
Post-match discussion
Mon, 30 September 2019
RIP Bryan
That's no longer true.
The whole point of VAR is to avoid costly and incorrect decisions such as the penalty not being awarded last night. Not to award a penalty in that situation was tantamount to robbery.
radio said this is the first time in 30 years we haven't reached double figures by this stage of the season
Culture in any organisation is set from the top downwards. It starts with the Glazers then rolls down through Woodward to our managerial inconsistency, lack of footballing strategy and profit over trophies approach which filters out through our players. I especially feel sorry for Paul Pogba who is getting criticism, racism (at times from our own fanbase) yet is our best player. Without quality around him he cannot shine.
£65m net spend this Summer. Similar last Summer. We deserve to be 10th.
Oh for some of the football that team produced now! Its a simple game why do people over complicate it?
COME december, OGG will be sacked i believe.
I was initially very disappointed to see Pereira starting yesterday (especially ahead of Greenwood on the right), but he ended up being my man of the match. Great performance from him. Pressing, dribbling and passing well and consistently throughout the game. Shame he wasn’t on for that free-kick we got towards the end.
McTominay, another great performance.
James, on the other hand I was disappointed with. A lot of you on here seem to think he had a good game, but for me he just isn’t making the simple runs forward which can start a proper attack. He also has a habit of literally trying to run through players. Anyway, it’s still early days for him.
Overall, I think we edged a tight game and probably should have won it. Gutted not to take the 3 points, but I am not completed deflated, we’re not dead yet.
McTominay, another great performance.
James, on the other hand I was disappointed with. A lot of you on here seem to think he had a good game, but for me he just isn’t making the simple runs forward which can start a proper attack. He also has a habit of literally trying to run through players. Anyway, it’s still early days for him.
Overall, I think we edged a tight game and probably should have won it. Gutted not to take the 3 points, but I am not completed deflated, we’re not dead yet.
I agree the implementation of VAR in these types of scenarios is flawed and doesn't assist the ref in making the right decision.
I meant we can't rely on penalties to win matches so it shouldn't come into any discussion around performance.
Thanks...
If the whistle was blown before Aubameyang's goal (as he himself said it was) then we played to the whistle (and the flag), and still conceded because of VAR, yet, when there's a handball in the penalty area on VAR doesn't intercede because it's "subjective". I'm very much for VAR, but it requires a level of honesty. The officials should not be putting up flags and blowing whistles if play is to continue.
Sir Alex was manager in 1989 and we finished 13th, but we did beat arsenal 4-1.
i dont really know what im trying to say maybe some perspective is required.
It doesn't need to be flawed though. Everyone who watched the game would have seen the replay of the incident and likely arrived at the same conclusion, that being a stonewall penalty should be awarded.
Given that the 4th official had seen the very same replays that the rest of us saw and that he is a professional referee, his failure to correctly award the penalty is highly suspicious.
The lack of movement in front of Pogba is staggering. He has nothing to aim for. This game cried out for him to take it by the scruff of the neck. Again he failed.
Dan James started off well and got his full back booked early on. We should have given him the ball at every opportunity, to run at the full back from then on - we didn't and he disappeared for 40 mins returning for a 20 min cameo in the second half. So much promise but disappointed me - lack of service perhaps, but he didn't offer himself in the positions either. He's young and can still ofer something.
Rashford is just not fit for the first XI currently - his body language says it all. After the goal, a lot of the team deliberatley rushed over to congratulate him for his pull back in the goal build up, which tells its own story - the lad is shot of confidence. He's no striker, should be played wide right or left. No more Rashford bashing.
Where's Dalot? Injured? Considered not good enough? Young gives 100% every game, but is simply not good enough now. Tuanzebe had a great game.........bar the crucial mistake for the goal. McTominay tried and tried and put the effort in, driving on, but jsut does not quite have the quality for me. He's a firm starter for now. (How did he miss that header?)
Let's not cry over VAR, we did not deserve to win last night. Arsenal were awful too, but marginally better than us.
I'm absolutely dreading watching live my beloved team get taken to the cleaners by a miles ahead Liverpool in a few weeks time. It's not are we gonna lose, it's by how many, sadly. I'm gonna have to to take it on the chin.
Dan James started off well and got his full back booked early on. We should have given him the ball at every opportunity, to run at the full back from then on - we didn't and he disappeared for 40 mins returning for a 20 min cameo in the second half. So much promise but disappointed me - lack of service perhaps, but he didn't offer himself in the positions either. He's young and can still ofer something.
Rashford is just not fit for the first XI currently - his body language says it all. After the goal, a lot of the team deliberatley rushed over to congratulate him for his pull back in the goal build up, which tells its own story - the lad is shot of confidence. He's no striker, should be played wide right or left. No more Rashford bashing.
Where's Dalot? Injured? Considered not good enough? Young gives 100% every game, but is simply not good enough now. Tuanzebe had a great game.........bar the crucial mistake for the goal. McTominay tried and tried and put the effort in, driving on, but jsut does not quite have the quality for me. He's a firm starter for now. (How did he miss that header?)
Let's not cry over VAR, we did not deserve to win last night. Arsenal were awful too, but marginally better than us.
I'm absolutely dreading watching live my beloved team get taken to the cleaners by a miles ahead Liverpool in a few weeks time. It's not are we gonna lose, it's by how many, sadly. I'm gonna have to to take it on the chin.
Think draw was a fair recent. Decent use of James pace on the the counter. Decent goal by McTominay but not much else. One positive is we are still only 3 points away from 4th position.
I'm aware of that but unfortunately, this seems to be the way the PL have implemented it. Rather than point out to the ref that it was, in fact, a handball which he may not have spotted as they do in the CL, the Vid Refs seem to be extremely reluctant to overrule these types of incorrect decisions made by the ref.
It's strange because if the Ref missed a handball in the lead-up to a goal they'd be all over it.
A succinct summation of the match by Barney Ronay:
Terrible game. I really didn't see any improvement from us and Arsenal are just as bad. Both teams are a long long way off the top and don't look like a top 4 place are for any of them.
Aha was it you?Thanks...
Having finally watched most of the game (all I can take), I am amazed certainly people here (one who constantly enjoys attacking me for what he calls my pessimism) can find much of it acceptable. 28 minutes to have a shot on target at home (little wonder that since the chelsea game, we haven't scored more than one goal a game), making a very ordinary arsenal side "good", no one taking the game by the scruff of the neck and yet again hardly looking interested in getting a second. Worst of all, I could hardly keep my eyes on the game! Not even close to enough quality players. need two midfielders and a goal scorer as the bare minimum. slipping into mediocrity and I afraid Ole's post-match waffle is just that. he's beginning to sound like the Peter Reid and Sam Allardyces of the world. what he sees bears very little relation to what we have watched.
yes, there were some good moments and one or two decent performances but that's never enough to win games let alone trophies
yes, there were some good moments and one or two decent performances but that's never enough to win games let alone trophies
That was the worst part about it. As Keane said after the game, they were there for the taking. There doesn't seem to be any confidence amongst the players that they can go and win these games.
True, but here's the A-B comparison this year to last, through 7 games:
Last year - 10 pts, 10 goals for, 12 goals against, 1 clean sheet
This year - 9 pts, 9 goals for, 7 goals against, 2 clean sheets
Not a whole lot of difference, really. And while we play Pool in three weeks, it's sandwiched by Newcastle and Norwich. For all the talk of relegation form, those two really are relegation fodder. We need Martial back so bad...
true... I just worry whether we will manage to make Newcastle look great and Stevie Bruce look like a master tactician! I am dreading the Liverpool game. I don't see how we can get within four goals of them
Neither of the teams on display last night deserves to be gracing Europes premier club competition, United were slow and methodical alongside very predictable, as i've seen happen a lot against United if Young is playing they allow him to have the ball and predictably mess up his cross. Arsenal just played for time, happily took a draw against a side they should have gone at and probably got something.
Going back to our friend Ashley Young, I'd argue his decline in ability in an attacking sense is quite possibly faster and more impactful on his game than Wayne Rooney's decline was, we looked far more dangerous from Arsenals corners than we did from our own. I suspect Scott's missed header wasn't out of lack of ability but more from shock that the ball didn't fly a mile over his head.
I've also got a huge fecking moan about what we do on set plays, just how many times are we gonna float it to the back post in an attempt to get Maguire's huge shed head on it to head it back across goal, i'd rather we mix things up a little bit, but instead we repeat the same shit over and over.
Our goal was a great moment of counter attacking football and players not giving up on lost causes, Rashford should have bagged one earlier but the lad looks a yard slower and absolutely devoid of confidence, i suspect injury is still bugging him but also perhaps at his age the pressure is a bit too much.
Arsenals goal was one of the most infuriating things i've seen at a game. I've no problem with VAR correcting the officials call, VAR is there to get things correct and it's a good thing that the goal stood cause he was clearly a mile onside. Axel will have to take fault for it sadly, but he's young and playing out of position he didn't put a foot wrong besides that. However my frustration comes from the fact when United players saw the flag they stopped, perhaps non of them would have got a block in or cleared the ball off the line but the fact the players stopped shows how messed up the rule for VAR is. At least 5/6 occasions afterwards when the flag was up players all stopped no question, i say you go put the ball in the net, just in case, let VAR decide instead. Apparently the whistle was blown as well, so the whole 'play to the whistle' argument doesn't work. Honestly it was a mess and highlighted the flaws in VAR and how it effects the game, weirdly as much as its frustrating the way they use the offside in Europe where the linesman flags later on is clearly the only way to make sure events such as Arsenals goal last night don't happen again.
I also now believe VAR has somehow made refs worse, the ref last night was shocking for both teams, every game i've been too they've been shocking far worse than last season.
Wasn't there a handball in the box too?
One other note, United put the fear of god into Arsenal every time they ran at them, not sure why we didn't do it more, even if we lost the ball every now and then their defence are absolutely prone to silly fouls, opportunity missed tbh.
Going back to our friend Ashley Young, I'd argue his decline in ability in an attacking sense is quite possibly faster and more impactful on his game than Wayne Rooney's decline was, we looked far more dangerous from Arsenals corners than we did from our own. I suspect Scott's missed header wasn't out of lack of ability but more from shock that the ball didn't fly a mile over his head.
I've also got a huge fecking moan about what we do on set plays, just how many times are we gonna float it to the back post in an attempt to get Maguire's huge shed head on it to head it back across goal, i'd rather we mix things up a little bit, but instead we repeat the same shit over and over.
Our goal was a great moment of counter attacking football and players not giving up on lost causes, Rashford should have bagged one earlier but the lad looks a yard slower and absolutely devoid of confidence, i suspect injury is still bugging him but also perhaps at his age the pressure is a bit too much.
Arsenals goal was one of the most infuriating things i've seen at a game. I've no problem with VAR correcting the officials call, VAR is there to get things correct and it's a good thing that the goal stood cause he was clearly a mile onside. Axel will have to take fault for it sadly, but he's young and playing out of position he didn't put a foot wrong besides that. However my frustration comes from the fact when United players saw the flag they stopped, perhaps non of them would have got a block in or cleared the ball off the line but the fact the players stopped shows how messed up the rule for VAR is. At least 5/6 occasions afterwards when the flag was up players all stopped no question, i say you go put the ball in the net, just in case, let VAR decide instead. Apparently the whistle was blown as well, so the whole 'play to the whistle' argument doesn't work. Honestly it was a mess and highlighted the flaws in VAR and how it effects the game, weirdly as much as its frustrating the way they use the offside in Europe where the linesman flags later on is clearly the only way to make sure events such as Arsenals goal last night don't happen again.
I also now believe VAR has somehow made refs worse, the ref last night was shocking for both teams, every game i've been too they've been shocking far worse than last season.
Wasn't there a handball in the box too?
One other note, United put the fear of god into Arsenal every time they ran at them, not sure why we didn't do it more, even if we lost the ball every now and then their defence are absolutely prone to silly fouls, opportunity missed tbh.
Sad but trueEven Moyes beat those at Old Trafford. This supposed "rebuild" will end in tears. This "team" is going nowhere it is crystal clear. Some say "we create chances but we don't finish" but that's not true. We are plain awful at creating clear goalscoring opportunities.
We didn't create anything against Rochdale. We didn't create anything against West Ham. We created some chances against 3rd placed team in that shitty Kazakhstan League. Nothing against Leicester other than a suspect penalty. Nothing against Southampton & Palace either. Chelsea game's scoreline flattered us. Can't remember us creating so many chances against Wolves either.
It's the same story today. Absolute devoid of quality from both teams. We only score or create something from individual quality like James' pace, McTominay's shot today, James' shot against Palace & Southampton etc. and not through our coaching-tactics-gameplan etc.
Just like Moyes period, we'll break all the negative records this seson. 9 points after 7 gamesAnd we didn't even play City, Pool or Spurs yet. I fear from these games' possible scorelines tbh.
Worst Man United squad in the Premier League era + Worst Man United manager in the Premier League era = Worst Man United team in the Premier League era.
It's simple as this really.
Quality side, dad still says best game/most emotional game he has ever attended was 77 cup final when the Doc was in floods of tears holding the cup after the match.
The most worrying aspect is the lack of any playing style and the lack of creativity in attack. Lampard has gone to Chelsea with a clear idea of how to play, but Ole persists in playing two holding midfielders at home and others out of position.Confidence is low, but why Rashford, Lingard and Periera seem unable to play a forward pass is puzzling. Are they actually coached to turn away from goal when they receive a pass?
Yep, means feck all if you're not doing your job properly in the first place. We need it to click and quickly before we get left behind even more.
Bit shocked here, scores an absolute worldie, he must have created a few great attacking positions with his constant driving towards their box, beating men and driving us forward, proper box to box old school midfield performance last night, covering from Pogba who as usual didn't turn up, and providing more in attack, basically doing the job of two men against 3 Arsenal CMs, scored a worldie which you forget to mention and yeah missed a great chance with the header.
Our best midfielder at the minute, and the only who looks to give a shit, played very well last night imo.
Is it just me or do all of our attacks look like we're playing a man short?
And don't forget the absolute best reason that FA cup was won.....it stopped the dippers winning the treble which would have been the first done by an English club....lolssssss
Now I’m a little late to the party in relation to the Post-Match thread, but I got home fro. The match at 1am after a 300 mile round-trip! Whilst it was far from the best game I Ever watched but I’ll take more positives out than if I’d seen it on TV (although, and I didn’t know this was possible, but Young is actually even worse live):
But from what I saw yesterday made me believe their is a direction with this. From the first choice starting line-up of De Gea, AWB, Lindelof, Maguire, Shaw, McT, Pogba, Rashford, Lingard, James, Martial I genuinely believe only TWO signings can turn us into top four certainties and build up to title challengers again - a RW and either a deeper CM to allow Pogba to go further forward, or an attacking CM to add to a deeper Pogba.
Playing FM here, but from what I saw of that team, replace Pereira with Sancho and Lingard with either Ndidi or Maddison, and we would have a damn good first XI on our hands.
Then add a LB a first team striker and another CM and suddenly our squad would be looking much more healthy.
I’ll put on my flame shield but I genuinely am very positive after seeing this live.
- Apart from the goal when he didn’t really play to the whistle De Gea was great. Had a few iffy moments in early mins but came out for corners / crosses and took everything, made the great double save which, last season, would have gone in.
- Axel is a UNIT and was great as a defensive LB. Made the mistake which led to the goal but I’m not gonna destroy the kid for that. Genuinely think he can take Lindelof’s place next to Maguire if Ole gives the two a chance as a pair
- Pogba to me, and those around all agreed, the best on the pitch by a country mile. It’s amazing how much he leads the team that you don’t see on TV, calling moves, directing players. And the times we was a bit long on the ball you could see he was always looking for someone to make a run for him but so often had static forwards.
- McT seems to be getting better with this run of games which is great to see.
- James is so fun to watch, even when it doesn’t work he nearly always makes the defender do something
- We still have out two first choice fullbacks and striker out injured
But from what I saw yesterday made me believe their is a direction with this. From the first choice starting line-up of De Gea, AWB, Lindelof, Maguire, Shaw, McT, Pogba, Rashford, Lingard, James, Martial I genuinely believe only TWO signings can turn us into top four certainties and build up to title challengers again - a RW and either a deeper CM to allow Pogba to go further forward, or an attacking CM to add to a deeper Pogba.
Playing FM here, but from what I saw of that team, replace Pereira with Sancho and Lingard with either Ndidi or Maddison, and we would have a damn good first XI on our hands.
Then add a LB a first team striker and another CM and suddenly our squad would be looking much more healthy.
I’ll put on my flame shield but I genuinely am very positive after seeing this live.
I'm with you pal.
I reckon with a new manager and 7 or 8 new starters we could be amazing.
Amazing I TELLINGS you.
Two mediocre teams, really, we were a bit better than them, although VAR turned out the correct call, was it after the useless ref blew his Whistle?
Abamuyang or whatever his name is has said he heard the whistle but carried on because that's what he does. There was also a nasty challenge on Greenwood, which resulted in nothing just a foul!
The game was poor, but surely it's another 2pts dropped, were in a mess and not getting out of it soon. VAR needs a serious look at, and the same ref has messed it up big time twice.
Abamuyang or whatever his name is has said he heard the whistle but carried on because that's what he does. There was also a nasty challenge on Greenwood, which resulted in nothing just a foul!
The game was poor, but surely it's another 2pts dropped, were in a mess and not getting out of it soon. VAR needs a serious look at, and the same ref has messed it up big time twice.
Have to say the ref was bonkers last night. So many weird and rescinded calls.
Pogba was completely anonymous most of the game, doing nothing as usual. McTominay was the one driving forward, running at the Arsenal defence, & making things happen. People are so fixated with Pogba, won't give a truthful opinion of his performance whatever he does.
At least we scored our normal one goal. Thankfully, Arsenal didn't score two, otherwise we would be doomed. We are basically a very average Premiership side, not one that a couple of changes will make us into a very good side.
Yet another game I miss due to apathy. How did James do?
Haha yeah I don't want to get crazy with optimism here, but if we just splunk 300M on new players we will definitely be in the frame to challenge for fourth!!
It, like everything, is relative. In the context our new status as mid-table dross, he did well. He tried really hard, supported his fullback, made some things happen based on pure effort, and at least caused one or two problems for the Arsenal defense. These very basic expectations were not even close to being met by the majority of his teammates, so one can not find fault with young James.
But, for the famous Manchester United, formerly home to wing wizards like Giggs, Becks, Park, and David Bellion, he was severely lacking in actual footballing ability.
He got his man booked in the first 10 minutes and I naively thought we could exploit that. But Chambers sussed it out right away and he shut James down without much of a fuss. Just don't let him cut back on his right foot? Got it. Then watch James try to do a SpeedyGonzalez down the line where he either runs it out of touch or mis-hits an attempted cross with his left foot even though there is not a single United player in the box to even try to pick out (see the point above).
Man of the Match
Runners-up
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14%
Daniel James
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4%
Axel Tuanzebe
-
2%
David de Gea
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2%
Andreas Pereira
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2%
Harry Maguire
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2%
Paul Pogba
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1%
Ashley Young
Player Ratings
Total Average Rating
Highest Rated Player
Lowest Rated Player
Compiled from 417 ratings.
Score Predictions
215,254,125
- Man Utd win
- Arsenal win
- Draw
Detailed Results
- 15% Man Utd 1:1 Arsenal
- 13% Man Utd 2:1 Arsenal
- 12% Man Utd 0:2 Arsenal
- 11% Man Utd 1:2 Arsenal
- 8% Man Utd 1:0 Arsenal
- 8% Man Utd 1:3 Arsenal
- 6% Man Utd 2:0 Arsenal
- 4% Man Utd 0:3 Arsenal
- 4% Man Utd 2:2 Arsenal
- 3% Man Utd 3:1 Arsenal
- 3% Man Utd 0:5 Arsenal
- 2% Man Utd 0:0 Arsenal
- 2% Man Utd 5:0 Arsenal
- 2% Man Utd 0:1 Arsenal
- 2% Man Utd 3:0 Arsenal
- 2% Man Utd 3:2 Arsenal
- 1% Man Utd 2:3 Arsenal
- 1% Man Utd 0:4 Arsenal
- 0% Man Utd 1:4 Arsenal
- 0% Man Utd 5:5 Arsenal
- 0% Man Utd 1:5 Arsenal
- 0% Man Utd 4:0 Arsenal
- 0% Man Utd 4:2 Arsenal
- 0% Man Utd 5:3 Arsenal
Match Stats
- Man Utd
- Arsenal
- Possession
- 55% 45%
- Shots
- 16 10
- Shots on Target
- 4 5
- Corners
- 8 7
- Fouls
- 18 13
Referee
Kevin Friend
Man Utd Lineup
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replaced by Fred
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replaced by Mason Greenwood
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