Progression or league position?

[AshRK]

Tosh.

Mourinho ended his second season with 82 points and even the dimmest of folk should have recognised that he was on the road out. The sensible lot among us called the abhorrent football out for what it was and were eventually proven to be right all along.

Likewise, it was increasingly obvious that Liverpool were turning into a team during the second half of the 17/18 season. They finished below us, but the progression in their football was obvious. Title fight the following season.

Neville is right on this occasion. Get the playing style and mentality right and the results will gradually improve. If we miss out on top four (and I don’t think we will) by a few points then I’m willing to accept that on the proviso I can still see a plan. At the moment, there’s a plan. Highlighted by the likes of Wan-Bissaka, Maguire and James coming into the team and looking like proper United players.

It’s a case of wait and see. It isn’t a case of looking at the league position and informing black or white decisions on that alone. Albeit I’m sure there are numpties who disagree....

Going back to 2017-18 season, I thought there was some progression in the first half of the season especially in August and September we played some clinical football, probably our best since sir alex retired. That helped us take a head start and we finished 2nd as a result of that. The second half of the season specially after the Sevilla game we regressed big time and that is why he should never have got a contract.

I agree it is not a case of black or white. I like so far what I have seen and I hope for the sake of the club and Ole we finish in top 4

 

[AshRK]

It's actually the other way around, the more good football you play, progression will happen automatically (provided you don't keep selling your best players/not invest properly every year).

Ofcourse good football is a must but so are results. You can keep on playing good football but if it doesn't lead to good results there will be no progression. I do agree in most cases they go hand in hand. You play good football chances are you will finish higher.

Alternatively if we struggle to break down the likes of Astana what would happen?

Then that would mean there is no progression. I still think EL gives Ole more games to try out his brand of football and build on that. Klopp found it helpful in 2016 , whilst struggling in league. Maybe it can help Ole too.

 

[StrettyEnder07]

Progression for me, I mean obviously we have to finish in a decent league position, top 4 or Europa win, either or to make sure we get in the UCL next season but would much rather progression for the long term future than say a Jose season of finishing 2nd and then the squad imploding next year and we are back to square one.

Hate to say it but we need to take a leaf out of Liverpool/City book, Klopp no trophies in 4 years and progression each year to get to where they are now.

Pep similar but obviously with a much bigger budget so has gotten there a bit quicker but it took him 12/18 months before his side started playing how he wanted, we need to look at this and give Ole the 4/5 windows he needs, if he can get UCL football this year then strengthen in the summer again, we will keep improving and so will the football, which in theory should keep on improving results.

 

[Skills]

It can but not necessarily. We finished 2nd recently but we weren't progressing much as a team, because Jose only cared about the short term.

Mourinho's team had quite obviously progressed from his first season though. He just decided to blow up any good work he had done post January.

Mourinho's tenure would be looked at in a different light, if we had decided to not indulge him (his awful contract extension, signing Sanchez) and waved our goodbyes at the end of his second season.

 

[TRUERED89]

I vividly remember there was a thread two years back asking results or better brand of football. Good results brings more confidence and brings progression. This whole notion of I will be happy with finishing 6th but that would be fine as long as we play good football is fine is bs.

I don't understand this notion either, finishing 6th again clearly shows crap football and no progression from the season before..

 

[TRUERED89]

Mostly because we have a manager way out of his depth.

We all celebrated when LVG got top 4 in his first season, and when Jose got CL by winning EL (finished 6th), so because we'd be pleased with top 4 this season too that means Ole is out of his depth??

 

[tomaldinho1]

It's not like progress & league position are mutually exclusive, we look a slightly different team under Ole and I think his signings have been very good which hints at some progress.

Has he changed anything drastically, not yet but we're pressing more (although it takes time to get this right) and the squad seems happy for once. 2 ticks from me. I think the next 10 games or so will really show where we stand, we've not been great in any games so far this season but we're hanging around the top four and we just need a purple patch from a few players to really kick on now.

It's going to be a predictable two horse race for the title but an absolute pile up for the 3rd and 4th spots, can't wait.

 

[Leftback99]

I don't understand this notion either, finishing 6th again clearly shows crap football and no progression from the season before..

You could have good (on their day) but inconsistent (terrible on their off days) football as you might expect from a young squad. Or consistently average football as we have been producing. Both might end up 6th but the potential for the future is different.

 

[lysglimt]

The precedent has already been set, managers get sacked when they fail to get a CL place. I don't think we can afford to miss CL for consecutive seasons.

Of course we can - if we end 10th with 50 Points - he is in trouble.

If we end 5th with 70 Points - he won't get sacked.

The question really depends on what the board sees. If the board sees progress in the football, progress in youth development, progress in the signings we make - he can survive a 6th position and 65 Points one more season. Because they expect progress the season after.

 

[ThinkTank@Cafe]

I don’t care if we are in relegation zone after Christmas. The squad is thin, young, learning new tactics, 3 key important players are newcomers.

If we finish the season with 3 consecutive months of exciting football + champions form, but miss CL, that would be enough for me to give Ole another season. Though I’m confident that we finish on a CL spot, I’m prepared to write this season off for a good reason.

 

[caid]

Whats the difference? Unless were progressing to the championship one will follow the other.