Put a price on how much it would cost us to genuinely compete for the title

Fortitude

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Per the title, let's assume we're purchased and the new owners are deadly serious about having us compete for the league next season (yes, yes: transactions mightn't go through this summer in the real world, and also FFP, but for this hypothetical, we have a normal summer window), and they fully intend to buy out deadwood and their contracts to free up places in the squad.

How much do you think it would cost, all-in, from a team and squad basis, for us to challenge for the title?
 
Given it would likely be impossible to purchase a team that could immediately compete with this City team without having the bed in first, I think the amount needs to include however much it would cost to buy out Abu Dhabi Group and release all of the City players.
 
It’s all about how it’s spent and on who, we have spent truck loads for managers gone by as they wanted this player, that player for their style of play and when it didn’t work out we had a real mix of players all with different styles of play coached into them.
ETH is now our latest, £200 million and that includes getting rid of 4/5 and bringing in 3/4 that fit his pressing style.
Top Striker, GK, one defender and one midfielder.
 
Let's genuinely give this a try:

So, to actually compete for the title against City (not just fighting to stay top 4) we would need the following in my opinion:

Striker - £100m
Backup striker - £30m
Midfielder who can play #6 and is versatile - £60m
Good right winger to compete with Antony
Right back - £40m
Centre back (backup or alternate) - £40m
Goalkeeper - £50m
And possibly a backup left back -£25m

We can't just have Antony as our right wing options and play Bruno out of position there. I don't think Amad will be good enough. I think the above numbers would be roughly right.

We can offer this by selling a few players:

McTom - £20m
Martial -£15m
Maguire - £25m
Sancho -£25m
De Gea? - £25m
Amad - £20m

All in all, I think £200m of GOOD spending and we could be looking to challenge. I don't think we'd win it but we could be fighting it out until the last part of the season.

If we were to get someone like Osimhen or Kolo Muani for the striker then we might be in with a fighting chance but we would need Antony to figure out how to pass and not just do the same shot every time, Rashford would need to replicate his purple patch from this season etc.
 
More than a set figure, what it costs is the ability to make mistakes without consequence. If we buy a player and get it wrong, we have to sacrifice somewhere else when we replace them. We have to make do for a while and the pressure racks up. We are always chasing our tails and it makes it harder for us the next time round, as it does for every club in the league. All except City. When they buy a dud they sweep it under the carpet and buy another one next window. It's like the genius entrepeneur with a big hit on the 10th go, the previous 9 failures having been bailed out by rich parents. That's what we need most of all. Not just x million pounds.
 
Not much really, money isn't the only answer. As shown by Antony, Sancho and Maguire transfers - there's £250 million there.

There's no reason why we couldn't be as good as Arsenal with 1-2 smart signings - up front and keeper/midfield depth. That could be done for less than £100 million.
 
150m that's all that's needed. It's not about how much we spend but if we spend it on the right players.

Alan varela (15m)
Enzo le fee (20m)
Rasmus Hojlund (35m)
Jurriens timber/Axel disasi (30m)
Robert Sanchez - GK (is being benched by Steele and will be cheaper than raya. 20 to 30m)

Get rid of Maguire, Mctominay, martial. Don't renew de gea. Bring back Amad.
 
Around 7-8 genuinely good/great signings. To get that... it's honestly hard to even imagine.
 
I say £500m. So two summer transfer windows pretty much.

Players like Laporte, Foden, Alvarez and Mahrez are struggling to get in the side and they managed to loan out Cancelo. We'd be over the moon if we could bring any of those players into our starting lineup.
 
250M + some time for EtH to drill all of his ideas.

Premium forward (100M), premium mid (90M), backups / options at RB, DM (60M).

We need to go from 72 points -> 90 points to compete. I think just a striker and midfielder + EtH will get us in the 80s with that easily. City are a fecking machine though, 90 points is no joke.
 
KeanoMagicHat said:
Not much really, money isn't the only answer. As shown by Antony, Sancho and Maguire transfers - there's £250 million there.

There's no reason why we couldn't be as good as Arsenal with 1-2 smart signings - up front and keeper/midfield depth. That could be done for less than £100 million.
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Exactly, it's about quality, not cost. We need better quality and depth in midfield. We need an actual striker who can stay fit and score over 15 goals and some depth there too. We need a keeper who can initiate the play and some depth in central defence.

It doesn't have to cost the world to do that.
 
Depends on whether city keep their incredible momentum and quality or if they fall off a bit, if the former probably upwards of 300mil and a shit ton of luck are required.
 
Von Mistelroum said:
Let's genuinely give this a try:

So, to actually compete for the title against City (not just fighting to stay top 4) we would need the following in my opinion:

Striker - £100m
Backup striker - £30m
Midfielder who can play #6 and is versatile - £60m
Good right winger to compete with Antony
Right back - £40m
Centre back (backup or alternate) - £40m
Goalkeeper - £50m
And possibly a backup left back -£25m

We can't just have Antony as our right wing options and play Bruno out of position there. I don't think Amad will be good enough. I think the above numbers would be roughly right.

We can offer this by selling a few players:

McTom - £20m
Martial -£15m
Maguire - £25m
Sancho -£25m
De Gea? - £25m
Amad - £20m

All in all, I think £200m of GOOD spending and we could be looking to challenge. I don't think we'd win it but we could be fighting it out until the last part of the season.

If we were to get someone like Osimhen or Kolo Muani for the striker then we might be in with a fighting chance but we would need Antony to figure out how to pass and not just do the same shot every time, Rashford would need to replicate his purple patch from this season etc.
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So you are saying Maguire is worth the same as Sancho. Unbelievable Jeff.
 
£250M, Pep leaving, and a decent helping of luck throughout the season
 
Anywhere between 50m€ and 500000m€. It depends entirely on whether you target the correct players, at the right time and your ability to develop or rejuvenate them.
 
Von Mistelroum said:
Let's genuinely give this a try:

So, to actually compete for the title against City (not just fighting to stay top 4) we would need the following in my opinion:

Striker - £100m
Backup striker - £30m
Midfielder who can play #6 and is versatile - £60m
Good right winger to compete with Antony
Right back - £40m
Centre back (backup or alternate) - £40m
Goalkeeper - £50m
And possibly a backup left back -£25m

We can't just have Antony as our right wing options and play Bruno out of position there. I don't think Amad will be good enough. I think the above numbers would be roughly right.

We can offer this by selling a few players:

McTom - £20m
Martial -£15m
Maguire - £25m
Sancho -£25m
De Gea? - £25m
Amad - £20m

All in all, I think £200m of GOOD spending and we could be looking to challenge. I don't think we'd win it but we could be fighting it out until the last part of the season.

If we were to get someone like Osimhen or Kolo Muani for the striker then we might be in with a fighting chance but we would need Antony to figure out how to pass and not just do the same shot every time, Rashford would need to replicate his purple patch from this season etc.
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Dorothy is calling as that is utter fantasy. No way on this earth with the current owners or the next we are selling 8 and buying 5. Now way we are selling based on some of them sell valuations.
 
Mwooyo said:
150m that's all that's needed. It's not about how much we spend but if we spend it on the right players.

Alan varela (15m)
Enzo le fee (20m)
Rasmus Hojlund (35m)
Jurriens timber/Axel disasi (30m)
Robert Sanchez - GK (is being benched by Steele and will be cheaper than raya. 20 to 30m)

Get rid of Maguire, Mctominay, martial. Don't renew de gea. Bring back Amad.
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That's the sort of refresh the squad will need to stand still. Add another 3 very top tier players, then we'd be in with a chance.
 
£400m+

It's not just the first XI, it's the squad you need to compete with City. Liverpool had one of the best first XI's in Europe, and came behind 1 point twice, because they didn't have rotation options for the front 3.
 
Kane, Mbappe and Bellingham would do it, plus a few squad players.

a cool half a bil plus massive wage budget
 
£400m+. That City team has ridiculous depth. Putting together a good enough first XI isn't enough. People that think we can compete by only improving the first XI are deluding themselves. Last night, they were able to bring on Alvarez, Foden, and Mahrez off the bench. Against Everton, they could bring on Grealish, Silva, and Phillips, while leaving KDB and Stones on the bench all game. Only getting the first XI up to standards will cost £250m at the very least.
 
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Think it'll take about £5.5b to £6b apparently.
 
r3idy said:
Dorothy is calling as that is utter fantasy. No way on this earth with the current owners or the next we are selling 8 and buying 5. Now way we are selling based on some of them sell valuations.
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Well I didn't say we would be doing this, but the question is what it would take. That's what it would take from a financial standpoint.

I normally tend to be the pessimist regarding these things, but thought I'd try to be a little more optimistic. Some of those prices for our players might be fanciful, but the idea is pretty much the point and that is that we would need to sell the dross who are holding us back, and strengthen in quite a few positions in order to make any kind of title challenge.
 
When looking at this it's tempting to want a complete squad with absolutely no weaknesses, but I don't think it's actually necessary to "compete". It's just when you have an incomplete squad you're likely to find yourself falling short rather than going all the way, like Arsenal have found. Even City's squad has issues, they have basically 1 full back in their squad at the minute in Walker, I'm sure they'd love a pacy winger to give them something different etc.

To compete for the league you really need to aim for 90 points, and to actually win it you have to hope City have an off-season where they dip below 90. Basically we need to find another ~20 points from somewhere next season.

In terms of first 11, I think we'd need minimum a goalkeeper, midfielder, and striker. If you got 3 elite signings in the first 11 then it's not that far-fetched that can be worth an extra 15, 20 points over a season which would put us in a title challenge next season. I think a top class striker in this team this season could have been worth 10 points alone given we've had absolutely nothing up there all season.

However that still leaves holes in the team, right back needs an upgrade, another midfielder to replace Fred/Mctom/VDB, a CB to replace Maguire's place in the squad, maybe a back up striker etc. are all needed.

Our problem is we can only ever go for the obvious targets who cost an absolute fortune, and we're incapable of negotiating a reasonable price for anyone. So it would be another £200m just to get us the striker, midfielder and goalkeeper. And realistically, I don't think that would be enough to actually go all the way and win it as I said because it still leaves an incomplete squad which would end up falling short to City.

The reason I'm not that convinced we're only 2-3 of signings away is we still can't actually pass or retain possession of the ball. That suggests the whole squad is severely lacking in technical ability which is not something you can fix in 1 window. You're not winning the league if you can't retain possession.
 
City have two out of the three best players in the world playing for them.

So it would take buying Mbappe + Vinicius + 10 50 million players that City have two of each in all positions.

Also a ball playing gk.

So around a billion.

Out of the current squad, Martinez, Varane, Shaw, Rashford, Casemiro and Fernandes would remain. Not all as starters.

(I am talking about genuinely competing not hoping for an off season by City)
 
As much as we've been spending or less, but with the manager and football people making decisions. The Glazers have made such poor decisions that they've forced their own end, it didn't need to be this way and we still don't need to sell our soul to a nation state, no matter how much the fat boys in the candy store lick their greedy lips.
 
Mwooyo said:
150m that's all that's needed. It's not about how much we spend but if we spend it on the right players.

Alan varela (15m)
Enzo le fee (20m)
Rasmus Hojlund (35m)
Jurriens timber/Axel disasi (30m)
Robert Sanchez - GK (is being benched by Steele and will be cheaper than raya. 20 to 30m)

Get rid of Maguire, Mctominay, martial. Don't renew de gea. Bring back Amad.
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This looks like total mediocrity.
Could get behind a couple of those brought in a as prospects, but if that's the full list then God help us.
 
To legitimately compete with City next season, without knowing which superstar they're going to inevitably add to their squad this summer, I'd say we'd need a striker, a winger, a box-to-box mid, and a right back.

Kane, Leao, De Jong, and Frimpong ought to do it. I don't know what that haul comes to when you ring it up, but I'm gonna guess around 350 million.

And that's just the players who walk into the first eleven. We'd need to flesh out the bench as well with players like Hojlund, Rabiot, Min-jae, and a new GK
 
Right now even if we get a good team the best players like Casemiro, Bruno and Varane are around 30 and will age out so the team would only compete for 1-2 seasons max. Then we would need to retool and then Rashford, Sancho and Anthony would be old and we would only have a short window etc etc.

It would be better to just do a hard hard reset. Everyone over 25 needs to be placed by academy players and cheap young talents. Not expensive talents like Bellingham but cheap like Alvarez.
 
You are asking the question wrong. Chelsea spent 600 mill in one go and got nowhere. Money alone won‘t help us compete.
 
There's a title winning team out there with a total cost of £100m. Our scouts simply suck.
 
Striker, goalkeeper, CM, depth/swapping out others not suited to the system, development of players (need someone like Garnacho or Antony to turn genuinely world class, one of the best players in the world level). So that's 300m or so in transfers/add ons to what we can sell.

And then we can say squad wise we might be similar to city. Pep is still one of the greatest ever, Ten Hag doesn't have to be but that's what he is up against. Might be no amount of money. Depends how long Pep stays. The only thing that stops them winning the league is motivation in a random year. Klopp has done fantastically well with Liverpool, they pretty much nailed recruitment for 5 years, and just won it once.
 
You need two teams to compete. Bench players that would be first team players in 95% of any other team in any league.

£500m over 4 transfer windows.
 
Whatever the cost is of hiring a kidnapper to abduct Pep and lock him up somewhere for a few years.
 
Are we talking net spend because if we're willing to be ruthless, we can recoup a significant sum.

Out:
Martial - 25m
Sancho - 40m
Vdb - 15m
Mctom - 25m
Telles - 5m
Williams - 5m
Bailly - 8m
Maguire - 25m
Henderson - 25m
Dalot - 20m

173m

In:
Kane - 90m
Backup striker - 40m
New CM - 80m
Rabiot - Free
Backup DM - 40m
KMJ - 42m
RB - 40m
GK - 50m

382m

Net would probably sit between 190-210m

Gives us a squad roughly:

Kane/Backup
Rashford/Garnacho
Antony/Amad
Bruno/Eriksen
New CM/Rabiot/Fred
Casemiro
Shaw/Malacia
Martinez/Lindelof
KMJ/Varane
New RB/AWB
New GK/DDG

I think this team can compete, still not going to beat City unless they have an off season as the team would need to bed in. It goes without saying we will never sell this well, nor buy this many.
 
Don't think we will win the title in the next 3-4 years tbh.

If Pep walks away and we get our act together on and off the pitch then maybe there's a chance. City probably just go and get the next best thing after Pep though. They don't mess about.
 
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