Let's be honest, it wouldn't be at all hard to get someone in that's better
Rasmus Hojlund (Out)
- Thread starter Raoul
- Start date
He very nearly joined United
Would we take Jonathan David to replace Rasmus on a free in the summer, funds are going to be tight. Sell Ramus, get Jonathan David and Gyökeres in.
I just don't see Rasmus becoming a proper striker for us, his agility and technique just isn't there.
I just don't see Rasmus becoming a proper striker for us, his agility and technique just isn't there.
Hahahaha
64m transfer fee (without bonuses) + 22m 5 years wages / 5.
We ain’t getting a buyer for him.
For a substantial fee, of course, you sell him. He still has so much developing to do, and our needs are so acute, that a substantial fee would help us bring in a ready made, peak age striker that we desperately need. However, the fee would have to be exactly that....substantial. I am talking 60M minimum, and I would want add-ons on top of that in the eventuality he blows up. Maybe another 15-20m of achievable add-ons. And at that price I don't think anyone, other than SA is going to pay it. In real terms therefore, we should keep him.
He's 22, and he's gone through a very rapid rise in a very short space of time. This kid has a lot going for him. He's still unpolished, but you can see the fundamentals are slowly improving. What he has been lacking recently is confidence. Confidence changes a player, and it's particularly acute for strikers, who prove their worth through goals and goal contributions. If you don't hit the net for ages, it can destroy a number 9. It's good for him to have lived through it this early in his career, and to have learned from it. It also looks like he might yet come out the other side and survive. His last couple of games have shown a significant improvement (as has the team).
We've invested a lot in this young man, not least in time and energy, and I believe it is worth pursuing for another season. He has the tools and attributes to be an ideal striker for Amorim's system, if only he can also find his clinical shooting boots. You don't buy a 20 year old striker from a foreign league and expect him to rip it up from day one. You are aware it is a developmental signing that will take time to pay off. What should have happened from day one, is that he should have been an understudy to a more experienced striker. He obviously needs minutes in the first team to develop, but on the flip side you only hurt his development if you make him the only number 9 in the squad, and heap all the hope and expectations of scoring goals for Manchester United on his young shoulders. If he goes through a bad patch of form.....which all young players do as a matter of course.....then he is under a magnifying glass. He'll get torn to shreds by the media and fans. And that's exactly what's happened to Hojlund. The kid needed to be pulled out an protected, but we put ourselves in the position where he was first, and largely only, choice to lead the line. Absurd.
Anyway, keep him unless a huge fee comes in. I like the cut of his jib, and can see him developing into a very well rounded and excellent striker in the next 12-24 months.
He's 22, and he's gone through a very rapid rise in a very short space of time. This kid has a lot going for him. He's still unpolished, but you can see the fundamentals are slowly improving. What he has been lacking recently is confidence. Confidence changes a player, and it's particularly acute for strikers, who prove their worth through goals and goal contributions. If you don't hit the net for ages, it can destroy a number 9. It's good for him to have lived through it this early in his career, and to have learned from it. It also looks like he might yet come out the other side and survive. His last couple of games have shown a significant improvement (as has the team).
We've invested a lot in this young man, not least in time and energy, and I believe it is worth pursuing for another season. He has the tools and attributes to be an ideal striker for Amorim's system, if only he can also find his clinical shooting boots. You don't buy a 20 year old striker from a foreign league and expect him to rip it up from day one. You are aware it is a developmental signing that will take time to pay off. What should have happened from day one, is that he should have been an understudy to a more experienced striker. He obviously needs minutes in the first team to develop, but on the flip side you only hurt his development if you make him the only number 9 in the squad, and heap all the hope and expectations of scoring goals for Manchester United on his young shoulders. If he goes through a bad patch of form.....which all young players do as a matter of course.....then he is under a magnifying glass. He'll get torn to shreds by the media and fans. And that's exactly what's happened to Hojlund. The kid needed to be pulled out an protected, but we put ourselves in the position where he was first, and largely only, choice to lead the line. Absurd.
Anyway, keep him unless a huge fee comes in. I like the cut of his jib, and can see him developing into a very well rounded and excellent striker in the next 12-24 months.
We don't know the payment schedule of the transfer fee.
Agree with this completely. You’ve gone through the pain with him, give him another season, there would be nothing worse than getting rid of him for a loss just as his form picks up.
Perhaps. Is there any evidence that Rasmus has put in a transfer request or that United are looking to sell him?
It’s mad how quick we are to judge players.
I’m not suggesting he might hit the same ceiling but Salah at 22 was still a Chelsea player. KDB had just signed for Wolfsburg
FF 10 years and those two both still feel like they have been world class for such a long period of time.
I’m not suggesting he might hit the same ceiling but Salah at 22 was still a Chelsea player. KDB had just signed for Wolfsburg
FF 10 years and those two both still feel like they have been world class for such a long period of time.
Keeping fingers crossed for him to turn this around but what he showed this season is one of the worst performances from a striker I have ever seen. So a few decent games will not make him suddenly a good prospect, so anything above 40m+ add-ons would be great money to get to reinvest. We could immediately buy Delap for the same money to get this young and up and coming striker developing on a good trajectory back on our books and then prepare for a bigger money striker, Sesko or Gyokeres as a no1.
Gyokeres is more realistic, so imagine Gyokeres, Delap and Zirkzee + Obi - would be a decent set of strikers with a lot of potential. Zirkzee would accept being a third #9 and occasional #10 while pushing himself further on the back of this season Gyokeres and Delap would have a fierce fight for no1. Although Gyokeres coming with big reputation would be prepared at the beginning.
Now Imagine you replace one of the names with Hojlund. We have zero time develop him next season and the set of forwards would look so underwhelming. Main striker injury away from being in deep shite again.
Gyokeres is more realistic, so imagine Gyokeres, Delap and Zirkzee + Obi - would be a decent set of strikers with a lot of potential. Zirkzee would accept being a third #9 and occasional #10 while pushing himself further on the back of this season Gyokeres and Delap would have a fierce fight for no1. Although Gyokeres coming with big reputation would be prepared at the beginning.
Now Imagine you replace one of the names with Hojlund. We have zero time develop him next season and the set of forwards would look so underwhelming. Main striker injury away from being in deep shite again.
If you're going by twitter and Instagram alone to gauge fan sentiment this is a bit of a you problem.
I guess we will want to make sure he’s not a net negative in terms of PSR. If we’re going to lose money on him we might as well send him on loan to an easy league to get his value back up.
You can’t say funds are tight then suggest David and Gyokeres. David on a free will demand at least double the amount in wages as Hojlund aswell as signing on fee, agent fee etc. That’s on top of 60+mill for Gyokeres on top of huge wages and so on, its not feasible imo when we have other gaps to fill and little money. Selling Hojlund l, as Ornstein just reported, does not represent a positive on the books so it doesn’t help us raise funds
He doesn't really need to end up like Kane or Haaland or Lewandowski though, really. If he ends up like Gyokeres, Watkins, Vardy (or going back further, Luca Toni, Klose, Immobile etc.) then we'll all be more than happy.
Heck, even Bruno Fernandes was failing to do much of anything in Serie A around Hojlund's age.
Accounting wise its paid over the course of the contract. So that is what I based it off because that is what he’ll cost us when accounting for PSR
If he’s going to be just a Klose or Immobile, that’s useful - but it depends on when. Is he going to become that player at 25/26? Or is he ready to hit those levels next season?
If you are a top club you do not invest 5 or 6 years to develop Ciro Immobile. That’s a poor investment. You buy a Rooney who is not ready, but buying a kid who you hope will one day become Miroslav Klose doesn’t seem worth it. What you do is just buy Gyokeres now at 26 (incidentally for the same price we paid for a 20 year old version of Gyokeres) and cut out the years of crap. The finished article of the players you mentioned don’t even cost more than we paid for Hojlund. The money makes/made sense if we are buying a potential 100m+ striker.
The only reason big clubs should be spending good money on undeveloped talent is because they are trying to get in early on a player with a very high ceiling. I doubt we paid 60m for Leny Yoro in the hope that in 5 years he’ll become our own Tarkowski. So I’d argue that Hojlund DOES need to become Kane or Lewandowski for his signing to make any sense at all, because he’s not even Miroslav Klose now, and it’s not worth the ride otherwise.
The thing with Höjlund is that he is not really good at anything, besides his work ethic.
He doesn't score, assist, dribble, create chances etc, and he is not a good target player. He should be the first player to be replaced this summer.
He doesn't score, assist, dribble, create chances etc, and he is not a good target player. He should be the first player to be replaced this summer.
70m should get you a generational talent or a top class 15 PL goals a season striker. What we paid was really stupid.
Which I guess wouldn’t be so bad. He could probably score goals in Netherlands, Scotland or Portugal.
Indeed. 70m on a player U21 needs to be projected to pretty much double in value. Certainly for a forward player. 70m for a 26 year old striker is more in the bracket of the best you can still get on the market, and hopefully can score 15-20 a season. Broadly speaking, the generational/Ballon D’or level players are already settled at the elite club of their choosing by 26. Which is why the best young players cost so much. It’s an arms race. 26 year old Mbappe’s are not still going to be at Monaco for you to buy for 70m.
We can also pretend in hindsight as much as we like, but the club clearly felt they were buying a talent in the Kane, Suarez, Persie bracket when they spent that money on Hojlund. I recall Ten Hag referring to him as the best in the world at his age, and we did not buy him to become Immobile.
That's all well and good, but Gyokeres back when we bought Hojlund was a decent Championship striker and we have Hojlund now. I'm all for buying an older striker to take the pressure off him a bit, but it doesn't make much sense to sell him now after 2 years of development when his stock is probably at it's lowest.
And I assume comparing Klose to Tarkowski is probably wasn't intended as something serious enough to be worth a proper response
That's all well and good, but Gyokeres back when we bought Hojlund was a decent Championship striker and we have Hojlund now. I'm all for buying an older striker to take the pressure off him a bit, but it doesn't make much sense to sell him now after 2 years of development when his stock is probably at it's lowest.
And I assume comparing Klose to Tarkowski is probably wasn't intended as something serious enough to be worth a proper response
It always makes sense to sell a player who isn’t good enough, if that is indeed what we decide.
And assume as you wish, clearly just playing clever in an effort to avoid the point. I’ll leave you to pick an example all of your own choosing.
Could see him doing well in a number of leagues so not too shocking people are interested.
If Napoli offered a loan with option to buy for £30-£35 million then I’d say give us Osimhen on a loan with an option to buy at £50 million in return then both teams win, if we get £35 million for Hojlund then we’ve done very well to recoup that.
And we can't be certain of that yet, because he's still really young and there are lots of other examples of players developing later.
I mean the point is nonsense, that's the problem. Tarkowski isn't remotely close to Klose in any respect. We're not spending £60m on Leny Yoro because we're certain he's going to be the next Van Dijk or Saliba. We're buying him because there's a chance he might end up at that level, but there's also a much higher chance that even if he doesn't he'll end up in the rung of excellent players below that. Likewise, Hojlund might have a very small chance of a Shearer/Kane esque kick on and become world class, but there's also a much more reasonable chance he ends up just being a very good Premier League striker and that would be totally fine too. Especially when players like Solanke are going for similar fees.
Except in Hojlund's case he isn't getting any better, rather he's going backwards.
On what basis from what you’ve seen so far can either of these be true?
I don’t wanna insult anyone on here. Yourself included, but this kind of prediction is just bizarre. Why part of our fanbase just thinks that anyone under 24 can become world class no matter how bad they are, I’ll never know.
He’s shown absolutely nothing and in reality, couldn’t have been any worse even if he tried.
“Swappin him with an older player who is on huge wages is making the same mistakes of old” ….
This is such a lazy and factually incorrect point it’s boring. The 3 old strikers on huge wages post Ferguson were all actually a success individually, despite the mess that was going on around them.
Cavani, Ronaldo and Zlatan cost a total of just £12mil, so that naturally means, by the nature of their cheap arrival, larger wages.
Combining all 3 of their debut seasons… 123 appearances, 71 goals.
That works out at a season average of, 41 apps and 24 goals.
Rasmus has 8 in 39 this season…
I’d rather go into next season with a proven goal scorer capable of getting 20-25 goals than someone who’s only still here “because he’s young”.
I know what you are saying but not always.
Scumpool signed Salah, Mane and Firmino whilst on a road to nowhere. They joined them for modest fees and with modest reputations.
These are the sorts of signings we should be looking to make.
I remember being linked with Mane when he was at Southampton and all our fans being positive about the thought of him joining. Then Liverpool signed him and we signed fecking Mkhitaryan 4 days later.
Last edited:
Yes it was out of him and RVP. In the short term we made the right choice, but obviuosly long term, not so good.
Gyokeres we have no chance, he has said he wants to go to a club with a chance of winning CL. I think it will be Delap or Osimhan, slight chance of both if we can get some good sales on.
I would ignore all the previous reports about him. Journos have no clue and all fans have to go by are morsels of nonsense spread by random journos in need of generating Man United stories. If we buy, it will be Gyokeres or Osimhen imo.
I agree with the general point and don't mind a short term solution if a long term punt is too risky. But you're diminishing the wages. I believe Ronaldo alone cost us abould £25m in wages.
well Napoli's manager is Conte....
Kane was upcoming but by the time he was 24 he had 30 pl goals. In fairness to Hojilund he already has 12 so will probably have around the same at that age if he stays.
He’s been here for the best part of two seasons.
That’s plenty of time to judge a players ability and potential.
And sadly, he’s lacking in both.
His first season for his age was excellent. It was on par goals wise with Rooney in his first for us.
The second has been terrible but I do think it’s Been a terrible season for the whole club. Under ETH he was upfront 30 yards to goal with his back to goal feeding off scraps whilst Rashford and co wouldn’t cross the ball. ETH left and his confidence was already gone. Let’s see now he’s scored how he plays in the last 9. FYI I acknowledge he’s been terrible but I think he’s a back up next season who I hope proves us all wrong.
https://www.redcafe.net/threads/sadio-mané.408248/
Literally a poll showing how not positive the fans were about Mane.