Rate our Summer 2022 Transfer Window so far (Out of 10)

Giggsy13

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The quality of a window is decreased if it has a detrimental effect on future windows.
No it hasn’t. There are also a lot of variables to spending in future windows including whether we qualify for the champions league.
 

Dion

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I don’t object to anything however I feel you’re just making things up to suit your narrative. There’s absolutely nothing been mentioned about the next summer window or that EtH is going to be hamstrung by the club in the future. You should know better than to take these things as gospel as the majority are smoke and mirrors as evidenced by our spend this summer and the surprise signing of Casemiro.
There have been multiple briefings that any potential budget for January was spent and that our next summer window will be curtailed.

Murtough himself said we were 'ahead of schedule in our recruitment plans', shouldn't expect similar numbers of incoming/outgoings and our focus was on the summer window.

Now you're free to treat that how you like, but looking at the black hole in our finances at the moment I'm firmly in the camp that that is corporate double speak for 'we panic spent all the money so there's nothing left for January and don't expect much next summer either'. Looking at what we got for our money this window and the knock on effect it's going to have on future recruitment I simply cannot consider it anything other than a really poor one.
 

Dion

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No it hasn’t. There are also a lot of variables to spending in future windows including whether we qualify for the champions league.
What do you mean 'no it hasn't'? That wasn't a descriptive statement. It was a conditional one.
 

TheReligion

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There have been multiple briefings that any potential budget for January was spent and that our next summer window will be curtailed.

Murtough himself said we were 'ahead of schedule in our recruitment plans', shouldn't expect similar numbers of incoming/outgoings and our focus was on the summer window.

Now you're free to treat that how you like, but looking at the black hole in our finances at the moment I'm firmly in the camp that that is corporate double speak for 'we panic spent all the money so there's nothing left for January and don't expect much next summer either'. Looking at what we got for our money this window and the knock on effect it's going to have on future recruitment I simply cannot consider it anything other than a really poor one.
If you rate all the new signings on average over 7/10 as you say how is that a panic buy?

I don’t think anyone expects or feels we need several more windows spending £200m+ do they?

I don’t follow how you can be happy with the recruitment then rate the window as one of our worst in history.
 

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Note - The average ages also include other players returning/leaving on loan.

ARRIVALS

Antony
£85m

Casemiro
£63.59m

Lisandro Martínez
£51.63m

Tyrell Malacia
£13.50m

Christian Eriksen
free transfer

5 Players
Sum: £213.72m
Average age: 23.8


DEPARTURES


Andreas Pereira
£8.55m

Eric Bailly
Loan fee:
£1.80m

Paul Pogba
free transfer

Jesse Lingard
free transfer

Nemanja Matić
free transfer

Alex Telles
loan transfer

Dean Henderson
loan transfer

Álvaro Fernandez
loan transfer

Edinson Cavani
Without Club

Juan Mata
Without Club

Lee Grant
Retired Retired

11 Players
Sum: £10.35m
Average age: 29.6



My take:
Arrivals 6/10 - All good signings but not enough to get us in the top 4. Still need Starting ST and CM, and backup/competition for RB and GK
Departures 4/10 - Glad we released Mata, Lingard, sold Pereira. Would like to sell Maguire and Shaw if replacements can be signed this week
But Shaws been playing well recently? Wouldn’t rush into selling him as he’s useful in the rotation.
Definitely should pursue the Gakpo transfer as well as finding a new new CM and another RB and maybe a GK too.
 

Dion

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If you rate all the new signings on average over 7/10 as you say how is that a panic buy?

I don’t think anyone expects or feels we need several more windows spending £200m+ do they?

I don’t follow how you can be happy with the recruitment then rate the window as one of our worst in history.
Where did I say I rate them 7/10?

And also simple mathematics addresses the foundation of this issue. If you believe that the club has over-spent on a player, then even if that player puts in 7/10 performances every week, you're still denying yourself players who could also put in good performances of you hadn't spent so much on the first player.

We could sign Mbappe for £500m and he could put in 10/10 performances every week and it wouldn't be a good transfer because you need to build a squad and that money takes away your ability to do that.
 

TheReligion

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Where did I say I rate them 7/10?

And also simple mathematics addresses the foundation of this issue. If you believe that the club has over-spent on a player, then even if that player puts in 7/10 performances every week, you're still denying yourself players who could also put in good performances of you hadn't spent so much on the first player.

We could sign Mbappe for £500m and he could put in 10/10 performances every week and it wouldn't be a good transfer because you need to build a squad and that money takes away your ability to do that.
Sorry that was @Jeppers7

So the question is how do you rate the individual signings of Malacia, Eriksen, Martinez, Casemiro and Antony?
 

Adnan

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No it hasn’t. There are also a lot of variables to spending in future windows including whether we qualify for the champions league.
You make a good point about taking into consideration some of the variables that could come into play in the near future. And it's not just champions league qualification but also taking into consideration the development of some of the younger players at the club who could be deemed good enough to challenge for a spot in the team in the near future. And that in itself could change what we aim to do in the summer transfer window of 2023. So when it comes to planning for the mid to long-term, a DoF needs to look at things holistically and take into consideration things that the average fan is blind to.

And as far as judging what happened in the window just gone, it's better to get as much of your business done in one window rather than split it in two. We went into the last window by sacking the heads of scouting and hiring a new head coach, so the process was never going to be smooth due to a lack of stability on the structural side of the club.

And this might come as a surprise to many, but a DoF doesn't identify transfer targets but rather empowers the people working within the recruitment department at the club to lead on recruitment who in-turn provide the hierarchy with transfer targets who are aligned with the methods of the head coach. So in essence, the role of the DoF is to connect and align the whole process where everybody from the scouts to the head coach and everyone else connected to the football side of the club is working in tandem with the aim of providing the head coach with the best possible conditions to succeed in his work.

The owners along with the CEO will decide on the transfer budget. But it's important for the DoF to have people in charge of recruitment in place before the start of the season, which is the case and it has been reported on. I think a smaller budget might even work in our favour due to the focus then shifting to making value signings, something that the RedBull model is based on by targeting younger players for the long-term. But we can't just target players for the long-term, but for we have to sign players for the now as well.


The recruitment department at United is being run by Simon Wells and a Argentine head scout by the name of Jose Mayorga. And that was according to James Ducker in The Telegraph. And I know very little about either man and what they conjure up by the end of the season will ultimately decide how our recruitment is viewed.
 

Dion

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Sorry that was @Jeppers7

So the question is how do you rate the individual signings of Malacia, Eriksen, Martinez, Casemiro and Antony?
As in individual signings based purely on whether I think they're good value for money (but without taking points off for us not being able to do business because of it, which I think is important for evaluating a window as a whole) with 5 being neither good nor bad?

Malacia - 6.5, thought he might be a 7 or 8 and a real potential starter but he looks a bit limited for that. Still looks like a great character to have around and as a backup.
Eriksen - 4, I think this is the one that's going to upset you the most but he's just not at the level we need anymore. He'll do a job in certain games where we need a bit of guile in midfield but aren't being pressed. Should have been offered a 1+1 and I think signing Casemiro has made him a bit redundant as the games where you don't want Casemiro being the link up from defence (vs high pressing sides where Real used to use Kroos and Modric to pick the ball up from defence instead) you certainly don't want Eriksen doing it. Does a tiny bit of the job FdJ would have done but not enough.

Martinez- 7, good price, probably overpaid a little bit but obviously very unique both in personality, style and knowing the managers tactics.

Casemiro - 4, for the money we paid to be worth it we're going to need at least 3 years out of him at his top level. For a physically dominant player in a role like DM I think that's a massive ask and extremely unlikely. I suspect we'll see a noticeable decline before that.

Antony - 5, clearly very talented and a good character but even if he becomes a player at the top level of his potential that's still a monumental fee and he'll do extremely well to justify it.
 

Giggsy13

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As in individual signings based purely on whether I think they're good value for money (but without taking points off for us not being able to do business because of it, which I think is important for evaluating a window as a whole) with 5 being neither good nor bad?

Malacia - 6.5, thought he might be a 7 or 8 and a real potential starter but he looks a bit limited for that. Still looks like a great character to have around and as a backup.
Eriksen - 4, I think this is the one that's going to upset you the most but he's just not at the level we need anymore. He'll do a job in certain games where we need a bit of guile in midfield but aren't being pressed. Should have been offered a 1+1 and I think signing Casemiro has made him a bit redundant as the games where you don't want Casemiro being the link up from defence (vs high pressing sides where Real used to use Kroos and Modric to pick the ball up from defence instead) you certainly don't want Eriksen doing it. Does a tiny bit of the job FdJ would have done but not enough.

Martinez- 7, good price, probably overpaid a little bit but obviously very unique both in personality, style and knowing the managers tactics.

Casemiro - 4, for the money we paid to be worth it we're going to need at least 3 years out of him at his top level. For a physically dominant player in a role like DM I think that's a massive ask and extremely unlikely. I suspect we'll see a noticeable decline before that.

Antony - 5, clearly very talented and a good character but even if he becomes a player at the top level of his potential that's still a monumental fee and he'll do extremely well to justify it.
When you choose to be miserable for the sake of miserable.
 

TheReligion

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As in individual signings based purely on whether I think they're good value for money (but without taking points off for us not being able to do business because of it, which I think is important for evaluating a window as a whole) with 5 being neither good nor bad?

Malacia - 6.5, thought he might be a 7 or 8 and a real potential starter but he looks a bit limited for that. Still looks like a great character to have around and as a backup.
Eriksen - 4, I think this is the one that's going to upset you the most but he's just not at the level we need anymore. He'll do a job in certain games where we need a bit of guile in midfield but aren't being pressed. Should have been offered a 1+1 and I think signing Casemiro has made him a bit redundant as the games where you don't want Casemiro being the link up from defence (vs high pressing sides where Real used to use Kroos and Modric to pick the ball up from defence instead) you certainly don't want Eriksen doing it. Does a tiny bit of the job FdJ would have done but not enough.

Martinez- 7, good price, probably overpaid a little bit but obviously very unique both in personality, style and knowing the managers tactics.

Casemiro - 4, for the money we paid to be worth it we're going to need at least 3 years out of him at his top level. For a physically dominant player in a role like DM I think that's a massive ask and extremely unlikely. I suspect we'll see a noticeable decline before that.

Antony - 5, clearly very talented and a good character but even if he becomes a player at the top level of his potential that's still a monumental fee and he'll do extremely well to justify it.
I can’t really take any of that seriously given you’re being hyper critical about the price of these players yet bizarrely give Eriksen, a free transfer, a 4/10.

With the rest of them you’re again making little to no sense. So Malacia at 23 is written off as being limited (even though he’s cost a minimal amount) yet Casemiro at the peak of his powers at 30 is too old and will decline quickly. Then Martinez is a 7 yet he’s arguably been our best and most consistent player this season.

Honestly. Read back what you’re writing. It makes no sense at all.

You can take a slight backwards step you know and often you’ll look better for it rather than trying to double down on something so farcical.
 

Jeppers7

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Still doesn’t really add up to be honest.

The OP @MrSingh2002 was specifically rating arrivals and departures whilst your issues seem to be with timing of the deals.

Still unsure how if you rate the signings at an average of 7.7/10 and rate the Glazers at 2/10 you still get an overall figure of 2/10 (ie one of the worst windows in the clubs history?)
Well perhaps he should have asked that as a question and my answer would be different
 

marktan

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8/10.

Both Antony and Casemiro have been better than I expected despite their price tags.

Erisken I knew would be good.

Malacia a good quality, cheap option.
 

MrSingh2002

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But Shaws been playing well recently? Wouldn’t rush into selling him as he’s useful in the rotation.
Definitely should pursue the Gakpo transfer as well as finding a new new CM and another RB and maybe a GK too.
Recency bias won't affect my opinion on Luke Shaw. He's done this under every manager he's played for. Get in shape, play well, get complacent, get fat, play poorly, manager gets sacked, new manager, get in shape.....

Rinse and repeat. I hope Ten Hag goes with a new left back and Malacia.
 

Dion

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I can’t really take any of that seriously given you’re being hyper critical about the price of these players yet bizarrely give Eriksen, a free transfer, a 4/10.

With the rest of them you’re again making little to no sense. So Malacia at 23 is written off as being limited (even though he’s cost a minimal amount) yet Casemiro at the peak of his powers at 30 is too old and will decline quickly. Then Martinez is a 7 yet he’s arguably been our best and most consistent player this season.

Honestly. Read back what you’re writing. It makes no sense at all.

You can take a slight backwards step you know and often you’ll look better for it rather than trying to double down on something so farcical.
I think you're taking this dismissive but ultimately empty tone because you've got very little to say.

Eriksen is a poor player well past his best, on a relatively big wage and long contract. That's a bad signing.

Malacia is clearly limited, that doesn't make him a bad player or a bad signing, which is why I rated him above average. On a scale where Ronaldo's original transfer is a 10, I don't think a competent leftback for a reasonable price being a 6 is remotely unfair.

Casemiro isn't at the peak of his powers, any Madrid fan will tell you that was 2-3 years ago and while he's still a very capable player there's been an incredible investment in him which won't be justified by a year or two of performances at that level.

I suggest, while we're being condescending, that you take a step back and be less offended that someone doesn't agree with you and when you spend £220m in a year on a handful of players, two in their 30's, there's a lot of scope to go wrong. This whole quoting people a month later because you're insecure must be a burden. Trying to get loads of people to agree with you a month later (when nothing has really changed) is rather silly and when you read it back you'll realise doubling down was rather embarrassing.
 

TheReligion

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I think you're taking this dismissive but ultimately empty tone because you've got very little to say.

Eriksen is a poor player well past his best, on a relatively big wage and long contract. That's a bad signing.

Malacia is clearly limited, that doesn't make him a bad player or a bad signing, which is why I rated him above average. On a scale where Ronaldo's original transfer is a 10, I don't think a competent leftback for a reasonable price being a 6 is remotely unfair.

Casemiro isn't at the peak of his powers, any Madrid fan will tell you that was 2-3 years ago and while he's still a very capable player there's been an incredible investment in him which won't be justified by a year or two of performances at that level.

I suggest, while we're being condescending, that you take a step back and be less offended that someone doesn't agree with you and when you spend £220m in a year on a handful of players, two in their 30's, there's a lot of scope to go wrong. This whole quoting people a month later because you're insecure must be a burden. Trying to get loads of people to agree with you a month later (when nothing has really changed) is rather silly and when you read it back you'll realise doubling down was rather embarrassing.
Eriksen is a poor player and one of this years Ballon d’Orr nominees Casemiro isn’t at the peak of his powers?

The crux of this is you don’t like being quoted back on this as you feel daft now but sadly that’s the nature of a forum. Say stupid things and it can come back to bite. It’s happened to us all so don’t get worked up about it.
 

Cassidy

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But we were never signing one.
And we won’t sign one this Jan for the same reason. All transfer windows are budget constrained so saying is it your money is probably the most pointless comment ever.

Its clear Ten Hag wanted Gakpo and a RB this summer but we couldnt do the deals because of the fee paid for Antony.

Going into the season without another forward who can play central this summer was a mistake and one cause by budget constraints. Massively overpaying for Antony did not help.
 

Dion

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Eriksen is a poor player and one of this years Ballon d’Orr nominees Casemiro isn’t at the peak of his powers?

The crux of this is you don’t like being quoted back on this as you feel daft now but sadly that’s the nature of a forum. Say stupid things and it can come back to bite. It’s happened to us all so don’t get worked up about it.
Ronaldo, one of the Ballon d'Or nominees isn't at the peak of his powers.

I don't like being quoted by people desperate for validation because they're insecure that someone doesn't share their views. But if you really have nothing better to say than the last sentence then I assume we're done?
 

TheReligion

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Ronaldo, one of the Ballon d'Or nominees isn't at the peak of his powers.

I don't like being quoted by people desperate for validation because they're insecure that someone doesn't share their views. But if you really have nothing better to say than the last sentence then I assume we're done?
Now I understand!

The Caf. Serious fecking business :lol:

As you are.
 

Dion

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Interested to revisit these and see if people have changed their minds somewhat in their assessment of the window.

Yes we were always going to be still short, especially given we’ve been hamstrung by Ronaldo and his wages with not being able to move him, but everyone we’ve signed this summer looks to be fitting in nicely and it’s clear is part of the new vision and philosophy.
How would you rate it now?
 

Dion

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As in individual signings based purely on whether I think they're good value for money (but without taking points off for us not being able to do business because of it, which I think is important for evaluating a window as a whole) with 5 being neither good nor bad?

Malacia - 6.5 3, thought he might be a 7 or 8 and a real potential starter but he looks a bit limited for that. Still looks like a great character to have around and as a backup.

Eriksen - 4 5, I think this is the one that's going to upset you the most but he's just not at the level we need anymore. He'll do a job in certain games where we need a bit of guile in midfield but aren't being pressed. Should have been offered a 1+1 and I think signing Casemiro has made him a bit redundant as the games where you don't want Casemiro being the link up from defence (vs high pressing sides where Real used to use Kroos and Modric to pick the ball up from defence instead) you certainly don't want Eriksen doing it. Does a tiny bit of the job FdJ would have done but not enough.

Martinez- 7, good price, probably overpaid a little bit but obviously very unique both in personality, style and knowing the managers tactics.

Casemiro - 4, for the money we paid to be worth it we're going to need at least 3 years out of him at his top level. For a physically dominant player in a role like DM I think that's a massive ask and extremely unlikely. I suspect we'll see a noticeable decline before that.

Antony - 5 2, clearly very talented and a good character but even if he becomes a player at the top level of his potential that's still a monumental fee and he'll do extremely well to justify it.
I'll hold my hands up though, I did get a few of them wrong...
 

Dion

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What? strange bump
Eriksen is a poor player and one of this years Ballon d’Orr nominees Casemiro isn’t at the peak of his powers?

The crux of this is you don’t like being quoted back on this as you feel daft now but sadly that’s the nature of a forum. Say stupid things and it can come back to bite. It’s happened to us all so don’t get worked up about it.
Hypocrisy thy name is TheReligion.

I don't think you can quote a load of people prematurely to complain about their views and then get all precious when they're proved right and do it back :smirk: take your medicine in good spirits.
 

TheReligion

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Hypocrisy thy name is TheReligion.

I don't think you can quote a load of people prematurely to complain about their views and then get all precious when they're proved right and do it back :smirk: take your medicine in good spirits.
It’s a thread from 2022 about the 2022 transfer window.. and your big ‘gotcha’ is to bump it in 2024.

Interesting :lol:
 

Dion

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It’s a thread from 2022 about the 2022 transfer window.. and your big ‘gotcha’ is to bump it in 2024.

Interesting :lol:
Almost like you need to judge signings who sign multi-year contracts over more than *checks watch* 2 months before you try your big gotcha moment... I'd say that was a more "interesting" choice.

Unless you're saying we're allowed to return Casemiro and Antony and get our money back because only the first 2 months of a transfer count... I'm on board with that.
 

TheReligion

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Almost like you need to judge signings who sign multi-year contracts over more than *checks watch* 2 months before you try your big gotcha moment... I'd say that was a more "interesting" choice.

Unless you're saying we're allowed to return Casemiro and Antony and get our money back because only the first 2 months of a transfer count... I'm on board with that.
Ermmm..

Anyway. Are you asking me to go back and rate the 2022 transfer window again in 2024?

If so I’m happy to do so.

If not I’m not sure what point you’re trying to make in a thread about a transfer window from 2 years ago.
 

Dion

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Ermmm..

Anyway. Are you asking me to go back and rate the 2022 transfer window again in 2024?

If so I’m happy to do so.

If not I’m not sure what point you’re trying to make in a thread about a transfer window from 2 years ago.
The same point you were trying to make 2 months after the start of the window, except this is an appropriate interval to judge the accuracy of our predictions.

I'll quote you to make it easier
Interested to revisit these and see if people have changed their minds somewhat in their assessment of the window.

Yes we were always going to be still short, especially given we’ve been hamstrung by Ronaldo and his wages with not being able to move him, but everyone we’ve signed this summer looks to be fitting in nicely and it’s clear is part of the new vision and philosophy.
Who do you think was more accurate in their assessments, given the benefit of hindsight. Yourself or the people you tried to "gotcha" after 2 months of the season?
 

TheReligion

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The same point you were trying to make 2 months after the start of the window, except this is an appropriate interval to judge the accuracy of our predictions.

I'll quote you to make it easier

Who do you think was more accurate in their assessments, given the benefit of hindsight. Yourself or the people you tried to "gotcha" after 2 months of the season?
So you’re revisiting the 2022 transfer window two years later in 2024 to ask if it was a success?

I’m not really sure you thought this through very well.

Yes it was a success. The team finished 3rd that season and won silverware.
 

Dion

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So you’re revisiting the 2022 transfer window two years later in 2024 to ask if it was a success?

I’m not really sure you thought this through very well.

Yes it was a success. The team finished 3rd that season and won silverware.
So you're saying that the only measure of a transfer window is how well the team does the season after, signing a 30 year old on massive wages on a 4 year contract for £60m is totally fine because we won the league cup? Signing Antony for £90m on a 5 year contract is all good because we finished 3rd in the league?

That doesn't seem to me like a particularly well thought out argument... although it would explain why you got so excitable after 2 months. Shame we can't send any of them back after 1 season though...
 

TheReligion

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So you're saying that the only measure of a transfer window is how well the team does the season after, signing a 30 year old on massive wages on a 4 year contract for £60m is totally fine because we won the league cup? Signing Antony for £90m on a 5 year contract is all good because we finished 3rd in the league?

That doesn't seem to me like a particularly well thought out argument... although it would explain why you got so excitable after 2 months. Shame we can't send any of them back after 1 season though...
Again I don’t think you thought about this very well.

The thread is about the 2022 summer window. It was a success based on the fact the 22-23 season was a success.

The fact you’re bumping this thread after three more transfer windows, and two years, is really odd.

If you want to start a thread going over previous transfer windows retrospectively to look at them against where we are now feel free. I’ll happily contribute.
 

Dion

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Again I don’t think you thought about this very well.

The thread is about the 2022 summer window. It was a success based on the fact the 22-23 season was a success.

The fact you’re bumping this thread after three more transfer windows, and two years, is really odd.

If you want to start a thread going over previous transfer windows retrospectively to look at them against where we are now feel free. I’ll happily contribute.
If your position is the 2022 window was a success because in the 22-23 season we finished 3rd and won the league cup I'm happy to leave this here and for everyone else to judge you on that sentiment :D
 

TheReligion

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If your position is the 2022 window was a success because in the 22-23 season we finished 3rd and won the league cup I'm happy to leave this here and for everyone else to judge you on that sentiment :D
Sure thing Dion.

I feel most people will be left scratching their heads regarding your bizarre antics.

When you wish to have a legitimate discussion let me know. :smirk:
 

Dion

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Like I said, I'm more than happy to let you be judged on your own argument here :D
 

Dion

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Why anyone who reads it of course.
Judge signings after 2 months or 2 years... Its so controversial!
 

TheReligion

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Why anyone who reads it of course.
Judge signings after 2 months or 2 years... Its so controversial!
I’m not sure too many people will be interested in reviewing the 2022 transfer window at this point if I’m honest.

As I say, given you want to drum up an audience my advice would be to create a new thread.
 

Dion

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I’m not sure too many people will be interested in reviewing the 2022 transfer window at this point if I’m honest.

As I say, given you want to drum up an audience my advice would be to create a new thread.
Nah I'm totally fine with this, thanks. It's the politest way of saying that I recognise that you've backed yourself into such a ridiculous corner with nonsense and you know that, I know that you know that and so my point has been made and you don't need to admit you were premature for it to be undeniable.