Sky Sports Power Rankings 2020 - Bruno 4th

[Dante]

Well Transfermarkt is wrong, they have Rashford down for an assist in the 3-0 win at Aston Villa which he didn't make.

Like I said earlier their goal and assist totals for 2020 in the Premier League and Europa/Champions League are:

Rashford - 32 games 18 goals 10 assists.
Kane - 28 games 17 goals 12 assists.

You say Rashford has done more in 12 months but he quite literally hasn't. No bias or 'feeling' in that at all. Plain facts.

Email Sky Sports and voice your concerns. You can't let this injustice stand. The stats they're using are wrong because you say so because you don't like the results because your preconceptions are being challenged.

 

[Berbaclass]

Email Sky Sports and voice your concerns. You can't let this injustice stand. The stats they're using are wrong because you say so because you don't like the results because your preconceptions are being challenged.

No I'm challenging the figures you provided, which are wrong. Do your research!

 

[Zlatan 7]

I htink Kane is probably the better player overall. But Rashford has done more in the last 12 months.

The point of the list is that it presents the raw numbers without bias... but also without context.

Obviously, context helps sometimes and there are plenty of other lists that use it. But context also introduces prejudices and agendas. These rankings give you the unvarnished side of the argument. It forces reasonable people to reassess what they thought they saw.

No, the list is just crap. As @Chipper has pointed out after a quick look. The way the assign points is meaningless

 

[Dante]

No, the list is just crap. As @Chipper has pointed out after a quick look. The way the assign points is meaningless

If that's important to you, compare defenders to defenders, midfielders to midfielders, etc.

 

[WR10]

Surely this doesn’t take it into account first touch. Lukaku is 5th

 

[Berbaclass]

The problem with things like this is that it can’t factor in the “intangibles” in a player.

 

[Zen86]

The problem with things like this is that it can’t factor in the “intangibles” in a player.

Stats often don’t, which is why stats should be taken with a pinch of salt, as should this list.

 

[Mogget]

The problem with things like this is that it can’t factor in the “intangibles” in a player.

If you were to create a list of players who had performed the best in 2020, what "intangibles" would you use as criteria?

 

[Berbaclass]

If you were to create a list of players who had performed the best in 2020, what "intangibles" would you use as criteria?

I'm just saying there are many things about players you just can't quantify with numbers. That's no secret.

 

[Dr. StrangeHate]

Bruno's importance to United is only second to Messi's importance for Barcelona. Bruno has single handedly transformed United, I can't say the same for Lewandowski's or Ronaldo's importance to their respective clubs.

 

[GhastlyHun]

Bruno's importance to United is only second to Messi's importance for Barcelona. Bruno has single handedly transformed United, I can't say the same for Lewandowski's or Ronaldo's importance to their respective clubs.

Have you seen us without Lewandowski in recent seasons?

 

[Dr. StrangeHate]

Have you seen us without Lewandowski in recent seasons?

I have seen you only in CL and in those matches Lewandowski always played. His impact is not as much as Bruno's on United due to so many exceptional players in your team. Obviously Lewandowski is comfortably the better player, I am just talking impact on the team. Its like when you moved from Kovac to Flick, that is the difference Bruno has made.

 

[GhastlyHun]

I have seen you only in CL and in those matches Lewandowski always played. His impact is not as much as Bruno's on United due to so many exceptional players in your team. Obviously Lewandowski is comfortably the better player, I am just talking impact on the team. Its like when you moved from Kovac to Flick, that is the difference Bruno has made.

My comment wasn't aimed at comparing Bruno and Lewandowski, due to their obviously very different roles, and I appreciate that Bruno has been great for United and has uplifted your standards.
But I'd argue Lewandowski is as important for us as Bruno is for you. Him and Neuer were the single most important players for our success last season, even though there are other hugely talented and important guys, as you said, like Kimmich, Müller, Goretzka, Davies, Gnabry... But in the few instances where we were without Lewandowski, our game dropped a notch. It's much harder for us to score and even create chances without him on the pitch. When he missed a few games mid season due to a scheduled surgery, we had several league games that were decided by last gasp winners, after us struggling to create danger and clear cut chances for most of the games and in the end just wearing out our opponents with our superior bench. Works most of the time in the league, not a promising strategy for the CL. Even when he doesn't score an important goal, like in the CL final, his presence automatically creates more space for our other offensive players, and on top, with his transformation to a fully dedicated team player over the last 1-2 years, he also improves our team's pressing all over the pitch to an extent only matched or surpassed by Müller.

 

[Chipper]

If that's important to you, compare defenders to defenders, midfielders to midfielders, etc.

We could but how do we know the numbers for various actions within the same position are correct either?

A forward scoring a goal in a game gets 1600 points for that goal. A forward with 3 assists in a match gets 1500 for those assists.

Do we know that 1 goal is a bigger, better, or more important contribution than 3 assists? Personally I'd say the 3 assists outdoes the 1 goal by a long way, that it's much rarer, harder to do and that it guarantees your team 3 goals rather than 1 but even if I didn't have that opinion then I'd still like to see the stats they're basing the awarding of points on for the sake of more understanding.

To extend it across the course of a seson, assuming everything else was equal a forward with 20 goals in a season and 5 assists would get 34500 points from those goal involvements. A forward with 10 goals and 37 assists gets the same. Did those players perform exactly as well as each other? These rankings say they will have done.

Edit to add: That's just 2 stats, we can bring a load more in too. A successful duel for a forward is 50 points so 1 goal = 32 duels won and 1 assist = 10 duels won, are they right? A successful pass = 2 points for a forward, so 800 accurate passes is as valuable or as good as 1 goal. Is that correct? Not saying these ones are right or wrong, more a case of how do we know? I'll admit that I don't!

 

[Blackwidow]

My comment wasn't aimed at comparing Bruno and Lewandowski, due to their obviously very different roles, and I appreciate that Bruno has been great for United and has uplifted your standards.
But I'd argue Lewandowski is as important for us as Bruno is for you. Him and Neuer were the single most important players for our success last season, even though there are other hugely talented and important guys, as you said, like Kimmich, Müller, Goretzka, Davies, Gnabry... But in the few instances where we were without Lewandowski, our game dropped a notch. It's much harder for us to score and even create chances without him on the pitch. When he missed a few games mid season due to a scheduled surgery, we had several league games that were decided by last gasp winners, after us struggling to create danger and clear cut chances for most of the games and in the end just wearing out our opponents with our superior bench. Works most of the time in the league, not a promising strategy for the CL. Even when he doesn't score an important goal, like in the CL final, his presence automatically creates more space for our other offensive players, and on top, with his transformation to a fully dedicated team player over the last 1-2 years, he also improves our team's pressing all over the pitch to an extent only matched or surpassed by Müller.

I actually think that each player of the axis - Neuer, Kimmich, Müller and Lewandowski - was very important for our games and not really replaceable. We won the matches without Lewy even if it was harder than with him, we had problems without Kimmich and I bet it would be the same without Müller or Neuer.

 

[Alemar]

How on Earth is Bruno so low in the rankings? With his numbers for the calendar year he must be in top 3 without a shadow of doubt