Inigo Montoya
Leave Wayne Rooney alone!!
- Joined
- Oct 1, 2008
- Messages
- 38,543
It’s a prosesshSo what is the solution? Better press conference performances?
It’s a prosesshSo what is the solution? Better press conference performances?
What's the point though? press conferences have been clichés for decades and it's not a great deal of difference with any top manager. I'd worry if we knew that's all he said to the players, but I think there'd have been a revolt by now if that was the caseIt's because after 3 years here, he hasn't said anything about what he wants beyond "making good decisions", "showing desire" and having a "winning mentality". He has to give the fans / journos more credit than that - he might feel that we're all idiots and we shouldn't have an opinion on football tactics, but I'm not sure what he'd gain by providing dismissive answers to perfectly straight forward questions.
Yeah, this makes sense. Agree that he does seem to be after that sort of player too, it's just they're so rare!Completely reasonable point to put across, I'm not sure that's the bulk of responses though. Think the majority want him to get a fecking whiteboard out and talk about phases of play. I think it doesn't highlight a valid point of over specialisation, but phrased in a bit of a harking back way. He has actively chased players that fit that mould though, we made a hell of an effort for Jude, but it didn't work out. I don't think anyone would say he is being a dinosaur trying to get someone like that into his system.
Not sure what you mean here. Are you saying we shouldn't discuss it because it doesn't win or lose games?I can always understand comments from posters who just love to take things out of context.
When has the game ever been won or lost on Ole’s presser?
Why bother having them then?! It's surely no great surprise that people discuss what managers say in a forum that's specifically designed to generate discussion?!Never understood the obsession with what managers say in the pressers. But I guess its especially strong now Ole is under pressure and every tiny word he says is scrutinised.
It wasn't dismissive.It's because after 3 years here, he hasn't said anything about what he wants beyond "making good decisions", "showing desire" and having a "winning mentality". He has to give the fans / journos more credit than that - he might feel that we're all idiots and we shouldn't have an opinion on football tactics, but I'm not sure what he'd gain by providing dismissive answers to perfectly straight forward questions.
I’m saying why the feck do people get so triggered by press conferences? It’s not going to impact the gameNot sure what you mean here. Are you saying we shouldn't discuss it because it doesn't win or lose games?
I listen to the podcasts “Talk of the devils” and “The totally football show” which he appears on quite a bit and apart from the volume levels of his voice which vary from loud to inaudible his tactical chat can be quite annoying, like he’s teaching us thick fecks how it works out there on the pitch.I knew there would be a mini meltdown over that comment about philosophy. It was obvious he didn’t want to answer the question and provide filler for Carl Anka’s latest puff piece in the Athletic. Anka is the latest journo who fancies himself as a tactical guru, it’s a trend nowadays with these pretentious journos. Every article of his is him explaining to us simple people what happens on a football pitch.
What discussion? I just see the same bunch analyzing every word to reaffirm their own agendaWhy bother having them then?! It's surely no great surprise that people discuss what managers say in a forum that's specifically designed to generate discussion?!
They're contractually obliged to do press conferences. It's not by choice.Why bother having them then?! It's surely no great surprise that people discuss what managers say in a forum that's specifically designed to generate discussion?!
That’s how I read the ‘ proper midfielders’ comment. Now they have to be able to fill more than one role in tandem. Not the battlers of the past. We won’t see their like againIt wasn't dismissive.
The question was 'How do you want that two man pivot to work?'
The answer was 'We look for midfielders who are complete. We try to develop that in our midfielders.'
It's pretty clear. Ole doesn't want specialists. He wants two all-rounders next to each other doing a bit of everything. There's no point going into specifics because a Bellingham/Camavinga double pivot (both recent targets) would have a different job against Bayern Munich rather than Norwich.
The main point is that he doesn't want Makalele style limited players. Nothing wrong with that as a philosophy.
So it should given its complete drivel.this is going to wind up a lot of people.
Tuchel, Klopp and Pep have one too.All this philosophy talk I think is nonsense and I think ole thinks the same. He wants to win football matches and he wants to win them in a United way by playing fast attacking football if possible. We don’t always see that but he wins a lot of games. I don’t know why it has to be any deeper than that. Bielsa has a philosophy and he gets spanked by any half decent side, to me that makes him foolish rather than admirable as it’s just rinse and repeat for him
Why do people post on the forum at all? It won't impact the game. The reality is that press conferences do have an impact beyond just the next game. They're the public face the club presents to the world so I'm surprised you're shocked that people discuss them.I’m saying why the feck do people get so triggered by press conferences? It’s not going to impact the game
All managers do, what I’m saying is it’s not that big of a deal. Winning games is.Tuchel, Klopp and Pep have one too.
Other than player fitness updates, did you really think you were going to learn something from it?So it should given its complete drivel.
I think you're seeing what you want to see, pal. People are discussing the presser...I've never been a vocal Ole Out guy but I didn't think he handled that well and thought it reflected badly on his tactical acumen.What discussion? I just see the same bunch analyzing every word to reaffirm their own agenda
You win games when you actually have a better tactical nouse. Not just a general "show eagerness, show drive" approach. We've had a good sample period to know that doesn't cut it.All managers do, what I’m saying is it’s not that big of a deal. Winning games is.
Well, yes. But the question was why people pick over them. My question was, why would they be a thing if people didn't? If there was no discussion allowed around them, why would they be carried out? It's sort of their point...They're contractually obliged to do press conferences. It's not by choice.
Do they? When was the last time you posted about a result directly quoting a link to what was said in a PC?Why do people post on the forum at all? It won't impact the game. The reality is that press conferences do have an impact beyond just the next game. They're the public face the club presents to the world so I'm surprised you're shocked that people discuss them.
Why have we won so many games then and picked up so many points?You win games when you actually have a better tactical nouse. Not just a general "show eagerness, show drive" approach. We've had a good sample period to know that doesn't cut it.
Because it only works to an extent. You take Tuchel/Klopp/Conte/Pep and they will also deliver victories with trophies attached, in less time.Why have we won so many games then and picked up so many points?
I don't know that the Glazers will want to pay out his contract by sacking him. As long as he makes top 4, they will be happy.Because it only works to an extent. You take Tuchel/Klopp/Conte/Pep and they will also deliver victories with trophies attached, in less time.
The proof is in the pudding thus far. He's in his 4th year, no cups. If he fails to challenge seriously now he's out and it's that simple. If he had won something in his 3 years he might have some good will which I think he would have had if there was better coaching in our approach.
Obviously we have no tactical nousWhy have we won so many games then and picked up so many points?
I wonder that too. (!!)Why bother having them then?! It's surely no great surprise that people discuss what managers say in a forum that's specifically designed to generate discussion?!
Hah, I dunno, ideally do your talking on the pitch but at this point after watching his side for 3 years repeatedly being good in some set of things while being consistently shit in others, I'm not convinced that he can do that.So what is the solution? Better press conference performances?
He obviously doesn't say that to the players otherwise he'd have been out of a job in about 2 months, so I give him more credit than thatWhat's the point though? press conferences have been clichés for decades and it's not a great deal of difference with any top manager. I'd worry if we knew that's all he said to the players, but I think there'd have been a revolt by now if that was the case
That was before Ronaldo. I'm sure things changed now. I don't care what he says, we are in a title race this season, and if we go on a string of bad results he'll be fecked.I don't know that the Glazers will want to pay out his contract by sacking him. As long as he makes top 4, they will be happy.
How do you know that?I don't know that the Glazers will want to pay out his contract by sacking him. As long as he makes top 4, they will be happy.
Yeah that’s fine, I like that he takes issue with the philosophy nonsense that is so prevalent these days.
Here's a clipped version of Ole's midfield comments. It's really not as bad as some of drama queens in here are making out.
Judge from the original source, not the chinese whispers.
Can’t judge a young manager like Ole against experienced ones like those! I knowHas anyone mentioned how Ole is shit compared to Tuchel, Klopp and Pep a already?
That's absolutely fine as an idealised belief to aspire towards.The next sentence, he elaborates what he means. He goes on to talk about "midfielders who are complete". In other words, total footballers rather than specialists.
Nothing wrong with that.
What this basically means is that he doesn't believe in the likes of Makalele having one specific job in a 3, or Lampard having one specific job in a 3. Instead, he wants all-rounders. Hence the pursuits of Bellingham last season and Camavinga this season. Those two are the future of football. Anything but throwbacks.
Solskjaer's philosophy is spot on, imo. The more limited the individuals are, the more exploitable their weaknesses become. The ideal midfield is one where everybody can do a bit of everything and is a constant threat to the opposition.
They got Tom Brady to sell more Tampa swag. Winning the Superbowl was a bonus. If they never won a Superbowl with Tom Brady he would have been welcome there as he sells tickets, shirts, and gets them on National TV. The Glazers are about the bottom line and profits going in their pocket, with both the Bucs and United.How do you know that?
They signed Brady to win the Super Bowl. Surely Utd winning a trophy only increases revenue
No no, it's so rarely done I want to see it more.Can’t judge a young manager like Ole against experienced ones like those! I know
Tuchel - Chelsea (bankrolled by a billionaire)Because it only works to an extent. You take Tuchel/Klopp/Conte/Pep and they will also deliver victories with trophies attached, in less time.
The proof is in the pudding thus far. He's in his 4th year, no cups. If he fails to challenge seriously now he's out and it's that simple. If he had won something in his 3 years he might have some good will which I think he would have had if there was better coaching in our approach.
Yeah, it fecking sucks that they are. Similar to no 9s, but no doubt we'll have a good batch of them when Haaland inspires a generation.Yeah, this makes sense. Agree that he does seem to be after that sort of player too, it's just they're so rare!
You need both. What good are tactics when players aren't putting 100% in or the manager isn't getting the message across properly. There's a reason why Klopp acts like a complete maniac on the sidelines at times. It's to drive his players on. His whole philosophy is based around playing with passion. If his team are flat then his pressing game isn't as effective. Same can be said about every team tbh. You can be the greatest tactician but if you have a team that doesn't respond then it's useless.You win games when you actually have a better tactical nouse. Not just a general "show eagerness, show drive" approach. We've had a good sample period to know that doesn't cut it.
I am not discounting desire to win.And Ole's right.
He could come up with the perfect game plan, and the perfect set of tactics. But if all the players go onto the pitch with Martial's mentality they could easily lose. Whereas if they go onto the pitch with Ronaldo's passion to win, they'd likely be victorious.
In other words, it's fine margins. There are some things the manager can never account for. If that wasn't the case, home teams wouldn't have better records than away teams. 'Desire' makes a bigger difference than you think.