So couple of rumours I've picked up this weekend. Johnson and Johnsons single shot vaccine is 100% effective and there is a study of US students to be published who caught covid, regardless of symptoms, 60% developed heart issues. See if these come true in the coming weeks.
The vaccines | vaxxed boosted unvaxxed? New poll
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That includes all of the minor reactions like a sore arm, slight fever and the like. They had 3 hispitalised cases and the reporting doesn't make it clear if these were allergic reactions or just hospitalisations of people who happened to have been given the vaccine.
Friends in Hong Kong (i used to live there) say you will be getting the Chinese vaccine too, so knowing the media there that is probably a factor. Some will be trying to discredit the Western vaccines.
My son is at Uni in California and he knows lots of young people who have had covid with he hasn't heard of anyone getting a heart condition. Obviously far from scientific sampling and I'm sure it is a genuine concern, but 60% sounds way too high.
If it is also sterilising street parties are in order.
Their phasec1/2 data showed 100% effectiveness from a single shot in the 18-55 aged groups and it was neutralising (which I think means the same as sterilising). I think they are due to report their topline phase 3 data soon so fingers crossed.
https://www.jnj.com/johnson-johnson...-published-in-new-england-journal-of-medicine
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Like a good boy, I've just had mine.
Pfizer.
Pfizer.
Ooh, that's interesting. I have a nice chunk of J&J stock.
Pfizer? I barely even know her!
I think it can be dangerous to underplay the vaccine reactions and side effects too much - it can even play into the hands of the antivax "why is no one admitting this" mob.
It's particularly the case with the Moderna jab, where is clinical trial data showed around 10% having adverse reactions - of the kind that might keep you off work the next day. Not life threatening in themselves, but scary if it comes out of the blue, and it'll be important that people understand when a "normal" adverse response becomes a dangerous one.
The immediate severe allergic reaction responses are low - but much higher than the equivalent flu jab. Again, they've all been handled quickly by the healthcare teams monitoring the patients, but not something to be too blase about. Particularly for people with a history of allergic responses, even if they hadn't previously reacted to a vaccine.
We're also seeing early data from places like Norway, where they're concerned about what happens to some of the oldest, most vulnerable patients. Crudely though, that's almost entirely a statistical exercise that has to be carried out. Comparing the actual deaths to expected deaths in their age/vulnerability group. Sadly there are going to be people for whom the next illness/fever/bout of inflammation or upset stomach will be their last, and for a tiny number them the vaccine may be that last straw. Just as covid would have been had they caught that.
It's particularly the case with the Moderna jab, where is clinical trial data showed around 10% having adverse reactions - of the kind that might keep you off work the next day. Not life threatening in themselves, but scary if it comes out of the blue, and it'll be important that people understand when a "normal" adverse response becomes a dangerous one.
The immediate severe allergic reaction responses are low - but much higher than the equivalent flu jab. Again, they've all been handled quickly by the healthcare teams monitoring the patients, but not something to be too blase about. Particularly for people with a history of allergic responses, even if they hadn't previously reacted to a vaccine.
We're also seeing early data from places like Norway, where they're concerned about what happens to some of the oldest, most vulnerable patients. Crudely though, that's almost entirely a statistical exercise that has to be carried out. Comparing the actual deaths to expected deaths in their age/vulnerability group. Sadly there are going to be people for whom the next illness/fever/bout of inflammation or upset stomach will be their last, and for a tiny number them the vaccine may be that last straw. Just as covid would have been had they caught that.
Congratulations
Had the Pfizer one on the weekend, came as a bit of a surprise. I've got bad asthma, so my GP called to ask if I wanted a jab as they were due to throw away the days jabs if they weren't used.
I had a horrific fever on Saturday night leaning into Sunday, shivering and aches everywhere and an awful headache. This morning I've woken up feeling completely fine. Its as if the side effects remedied themselves overnight, crazy.
Either way I feel completely relieved, if not a little guilty since im in my 30s, but in all honesty if they were going to throw them away anyway then I suppose I shouldn't feel regretful.
I had a horrific fever on Saturday night leaning into Sunday, shivering and aches everywhere and an awful headache. This morning I've woken up feeling completely fine. Its as if the side effects remedied themselves overnight, crazy.
Either way I feel completely relieved, if not a little guilty since im in my 30s, but in all honesty if they were going to throw them away anyway then I suppose I shouldn't feel regretful.
It's just Bill Gate's technology adjusting itself to your body, no needy to worry subject.
Totally speculation on my part, but i wonder if the different reactions to the vaccine gives a little insight into how people would have reacted to the virus?
Not sure how accurate this is, so take with a pinch of salt, but I've heard your reaction to the vaccine could be based on whether you've had exposure to the virus beforehand. The insinuation being that if you've not been exposed to the coronavirus, then the adverse effects of the first jab are minor, and more serious for the second. Whereas if you had previously been exposed, its essentially the flip scenario.
That’s definitely accurate.
I also think @11101 might be onto something. There’s a lot of variation in our immune response to the virus, so likely to be a variation in our response to the vaccine.
That’s true for most vaccines though. One of my kids was absolutely floored by the chickenpox vaccine. Not a bother for the other one. And they’re genetically similar siblings.
I won't be offered the Modern one as #scottyfrommarketing forgot to buy any. We will either get the Pfizer or Oxford vaccine - most likely the latter. Either way I'm not bothered as I have an epipen. Unlike when I get my flu shot I guess I should stay for the observation period when I get my covid injection. I hope they don't try to deprioritise me.
Is there any data on folks who were discharged from hospital after beating Covid but then had to return after?
Every shot moves us in the right direction. Celebrate rather than feel guilty. You are protecting yourself and others.
The government has purchased Pfizer/BioNTech, Oxford/AZ and a Chinese vaccine. Local media keep challenging the safety of Pfizer/BioNTech and exaggerating its adverse effects. My feeling is that they are defaming foreign vaccines and trying to promote the Chinese vaccine, which is only 50% effective in a study in Brazil.
That you know of.
Which i'm sure everybody is being regularly reminded about by Apple Daily
Yeah, I'm definitely feeling more on the jubilant side. It does feel a little frustrating that they're having to throw away so many disused vials, but I suppose that was always going to be a challenge with the Pfizer product considering its strict storage requirements.
Not sure why anyone would opt for the Chinese vaccine tbh, especially considering their lack of regulated testing and trials. Is it really that much more cheaper than the others?
Because there are always some uneducated patriots who fall for the propaganda, which explains my previous posts. All vaccines are paid by the government in Hong Kong, but the cost of the Chinese vaccine is 2x that of Pfizer/BioNTech and 10x that of Oxford/AZ.
So they're rolling out vaccines for the over 70s in the UK now apparently, and I'm even hearing many have had their second dose. Yet my father-in-law who lives in a care-home, can't walk or speak due to having a stroke and has had pneumonia 5 times in as many years still hasn't had his first one. Their reason for not giving it to him is because some of the staff members have tested positive and people won't go in. Surely that's the whole point? Now it's spread to some of the residents so we are literally waiting for a bad phone call now.
It all seems so ridiculous to me.
It all seems so ridiculous to me.
Seems mad they can't arrange a system that prevents waste
That's a sorry state of affairs, paying 3 times more for a vaccine thats around 50% effective
I mean the closest thing they have resembling a 'system' of sorts is to get to the end of the day, realise they've got a surplus, and then just start ringing up patients in their surgery asking if they want one. It's not exactly perfect, but it's how I was able to get vaccinated.
I suspect it'll be less of an issue with the AZ vaccine since they can just pop those back in their GP fridges and they'll be good to go the next day.
I wouldn't feel guilty, they've contacted you for a reason. Take the opportunities when they come, that's all you can do.
Not surprising though. We buy expensive water from China every year just to pour them away. This is how our government works.That's a sorry state of affairs, paying 3 times more for a vaccine thats around 50% effective
Thanks. I work in the NHS (albeit Risk Management).
Hopefully we all (worldwide) can be vaccinated very soon.
Couple of staff in our place had flu like symptoms after getting the Oxford one but they only lasted a day.
They’ve no intention of throwing them away. Hence you got the call. Apparently there’s no shortage of volunteers to take any spare vials. That won’t be the case indefinitely but by then there should be more than enough vaccine to go around.
Yeah I'm hoping that one is an exaggeration. Got 2 kids one a teen one a toddler. I'll probably be offered as will my partner the vaccine soon, but if it means my kids are in danger of developing something serious I'm staying locked down until they can get a vaccine as well.
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Yeah, that's a big hope. Guy who I got the rumours from is a US doctor working in the fields of sport and entertainment in California. So here's hoping.
It could also be based on storage temperatures. The Oxford and Chinese vaccines are going to be vital to get this worldwide as there's a lot of countries that won't have a chance of getting the others out there.Not surprising though. We buy expensive water from China every year just to pour them away. This is how our government works.
Ironically, the Oxford/AZ vaccine is 1/10 the cost of the Chinese one.
Yeah, which as you say makes it seem politically motivated for you unless it is supply based.
I think (hope) the heart issues one is an extension of an earlier study on college athletes who caught covid. In that study they had the benefit of heart scans from before the student got ill and afterwards. They released an early, not peer-reviewed, small cohort report, as a warning to other sports science/medicine people.
In all cases the students had relatively mild/moderate symptoms (not requiring hospital treatment etc) but a number of them showed cardiac inflammation and similar problems when they did scans on them. They were going to follow up by looking at some more students and by continuing monitoring the cases to see how long it took for them to recover etc.
I know United's medical team have adopted a safety first policy for players who are recovering. Including bringing them back into training slowly, not letting their heart rate go up too high during sessions etc.
Or are they...