This place is going to be a nightmare in the CL next season

[RedPhil1957]

Currently we are quite poor and Sevilla can do us especially knowing our shocking record against Spanish teams. We should believe in the club to win these 2 remaining games but realistically speaking after the last 7 disastrous years some people have lost faith that we can do it and who can blame them? Not sure which is worst, moaners or the ones who are borderline deluded thinking we are way better than we actually are.

A prime example of the hyperbole many supports use about United on here. Disastrous? most clubs in PL would bask in the success of winning 3 cups in 7 years in fact pre Fergie we would have thought it a successful period.
Ron Atkinson is probably considered our most successful manager for the years between Busby and Ferguson his record was 2 FA cups and 4 top four finishes in 5 years.
The Fergie years gave us out of this world success which was always going to be virtually impossible to match. By that standard the last 7 years are disapointing but loosing faith we can win a match ????????????????

 

[lysglimt]

What I don't understand is this - Copenhagen beat Istanbul BB 3-0 at home - this is the best team in Turkey. In our last 6 games against opposition from Turkey we have 4 wins and 2 defeats - only once have we won by more than 1 goal.

Yet people are so negative about our performance against Copenhagen - I agree, they are not Inter Milan or Sevilla - but they are not a bad side if they are able to destroy the best team in Turkey - something we have struggled to do even under Ferguson (we beat Galatasaray 4-0 once, and that Rooney-debut against Fenerbache where we won 6-2). So we have 3 big wins in 14 matches against Turkish opposition.

It wasn't a 10/10 performance - maybe not even a 8/10 - but it certainly wasn't a bad performance. It was a game where we easily could have won by 3-4 goals - but while people complain about fatigue - I actually think that part looked good as we looked much brighter after 90 minutes

 

[CG1010]

Mourinho did that. EL win in 2017 and 2nd in 2018.

Yeah true, I meant coming in top 4 in the league as that's the only sustainable way to get into CL every year.

 

[lysglimt]

Currently we are quite poor and Sevilla can do us especially knowing our shocking record against Spanish teams. We should believe in the club to win these 2 remaining games but realistically speaking after the last 7 disastrous years some people have lost faith that we can do it and who can blame them? Not sure which is worst, moaners or the ones who are borderline deluded thinking we are way better than we actually are.

Sorry but this is BS

1) We have not had 7 disastrous seasons - we have had 7 seasons where we still have ended between 2-7 every season. It's not good enough - but in my world - being 7 out of 20 is not a disaster. Especially when we have been 2,3,4 in 3 of those years.

2) What shocking record against Spanish team ?

Let me rephrase that - in total 50 matches, 13 wins, 17 draws and 20 defeats. Not shocking at all.

 

[JakeC]

Pretty sure he was he was being sarcastic...

That was my impression too.

Yeah I had a mare there.

 

[dove]

A prime example of the hyperbole many supports use about United on here. Disastrous? most clubs in PL would bask in the success of winning 3 cups in 7 years in fact pre Fergie we would have thought it a successful period.
Ron Atkinson is probably considered our most successful manager for the years between Busby and Ferguson his record was 2 FA cups and 4 top four finishes in 5 years.
The Fergie years gave us out of this world success which was always going to be virtually impossible to match. By that standard the last 7 years are disapointing but loosing faith we can win a match ????????????????

I guess you were one of the people celebrating TOP 4 finish, weren't you? For a club of our stature, recent success and insane amount of money spent, last 7 years have been mostly disastrous with a few exceptions.

Sorry but this is BS

1) We have not had 7 disastrous seasons - we have had 7 seasons where we still have ended between 2-7 every season. It's not good enough - but in my world - being 7 out of 20 is not a disaster. Especially when we have been 2,3,4 in 3 of those years.

2) What shocking record against Spanish team ?

Let me rephrase that - in total 50 matches, 13 wins, 17 draws and 20 defeats. Not shocking at all.

Well, to me 13 wins out of 50 looks quite shocking especially considering that for the 20 years or so we have won the league more times that not.

 

[Mihai]

Moaners should be penalized by being forced to support Feyenoord for a year. Get it all out of your system.

Moaners should be penalised by seing only Fridge's posts in the transfer forum.

 

[Robbie Boy]

Moaners should be penalised by seing only Fridge's posts in the transfer forum.

Harsh.

 

[Eire Red United]

The paranoia is justified. If we can't even beat the worst team left in the competition in 90 minutes, it's going to be a long ride in the Champions League. I actually fear for us against Sevilla.

Ah Christ

 

[Denis79]

No, we aren't as bad as some would make us but neither as good as others believe. It's always one or the other on here, either the player/performance is shit or fantastic and both sides can be equally annoying to read at times.

 

[SAFMUTD]

It's about taking strides towards being candidates. If we continue sometimes qualifying sometimes not qualifying then of course people won't be elated at being in the CL when we get in. If we can actually build towards something special then it is indeed a necessary step to take. You don't go from 6th to 1st in an instant. At the same time you can be perpetually yo-yoing between 6the and 3rd with a few false dawns papering over a lack of quality and management.

In itself, Top 4 is important.

I agree, consistency is key to build confidence, attract players and give patiente to a manager and a project.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

How can someone be a ‘supporter’ when moaning and criticising is the very opposite?

Criticism is fine if it's not overboard.

 

[sammsky1]

Criticism is fine if it's not overboard.

But so much of the criticism on this forum, from people claiming to be supporters, is way overboard

 

[Crashoutcassius]

The paranoia is justified. If we can't even beat the worst team left in the competition in 90 minutes, it's going to be a long ride in the Champions League. I actually fear for us against Sevilla.

then again, we beat man city with a good performance, so by the same logic we should beat everyone in the champions league? is that how the 'if we dont do this in this match then..' logic works?

 

[Smores]

Getting all North Korea up in here isn't it.

I thought we'd moved past this supporters support nonsense with LvG. It's a discussion forum not a love letter to the team. At least it's not yet as bad as having to read philosophy and foundations every other post.

 

[Robbie Boy]

But so much of the criticism of this forum from people claiming to be supporters is way overboard

Stick them on ignore if they bother you so much, which they clearly do. You spend endless time in threads moaning about people moaning.

 

[sammsky1]

Stick them on ignore if they bother you so much, which they clearly do. You spend endless time in threads moaning about people moaning.

Doesn't bother me. I'm just intrigued at what inspires such a cynical and depressing outlook.

 

[jem]

1 - Just before lockdown, Lindelofs % of duels won was higher than any other defender in the league
2 - Daniel James is 22
3 - Brandon Williams is our second choice left back, is 19, and has impressed our coaches to earn 2 contracts in 12 months.
4 - His xG shows he hasn't been elite, but he's by no means trash
5 - If my nanny had balls she'd be my grand dad
6 - We're trying to sign a right sided forward
7 - No
8 - Our squad is still being rebuilt

These are all lazy rebuttals, because honestly that's all they deserve.
9 - See above.

You seem to have missed the sarcasm, no?

Edit: just saw you realized - sorry about that!

 

[White Fury]

If the board and Ed fail to sign Sancho and at least one or two other players, then the moaning will be justified in my opinion.

 

[SAFMUTD]

A prime example of the hyperbole many supports use about United on here. Disastrous? most clubs in PL would bask in the success of winning 3 cups in 7 years in fact pre Fergie we would have thought it a successful period.
Ron Atkinson is probably considered our most successful manager for the years between Busby and Ferguson his record was 2 FA cups and 4 top four finishes in 5 years.
The Fergie years gave us out of this world success which was always going to be virtually impossible to match. By that standard the last 7 years are disapointing but loosing faith we can win a match ????????????????

It all depends on how you rank United. If you consider United among the top teams then the last 7 years have been a complete disaster, have not only not won any major trophy but we havent even seriosly challenge it. A couple of second tier cups is not enough to make up for it.

But if you are comparing it with average clubs, then yeah we could have been worst. I like to compare us with the top teams, since we have the history, the fan base, the money and the wages to be among them.

 

[glazed]

we're slowly again looking like a team that waits for an individual to turn up and do the business for us because the cohesion is not there, the tempo, the intensity.

Well put

 

[glazed]

If we win the Europa League next Friday week ....it means nothing , players still aren’t good enough , Ole is a shit coach

Well put

 

[TheReligion]

Doesn't bother me. I'm just intrigued at what inspires such a cynical and depressing outlook.

Good post and poses a great question which I'm sure many can't answer.

Some people seem to thrive off negativity and it's very odd.

 

[sglowrider]

Yes thats what I try, hopefully we'll turn this around in a couple of years and all the wait will be paid off.

I started supporting United in the 70's, when we were basically a cup side, and Liverpool were the team to beat. It never stopped me having the thrill of a win or going to a match.

Maybe you should accept that we are currently not the greatest team in the Premier League (or beyond) and just enjoy the good days?

It makes a difference in the length of time you have supported United. I have been supporting United since the early 70s. Had pictures of Gordon McQueen, Lou Macari on my wall in the bedroom. We bought and broke transfer records and yet were a cup team.

The early 90s is probably the best time to get some perspective for what we are undergoing now. There is a period of culling then to get rid of the bad apples and then the inconsistencies of the re-build but with every season, we pushed the edges of our envelope a little further till we cracked it and we consistently winning after. But lots of false dawns along the way. Luckily the owners then, the Edwards stuck with the man.

 

[Green_Red]

We need these moaners, who/what else are the rest of us going to moan at/about without them?

 

[He'sRaldo]

There are some posters who can't bear anything other than positivity. Thus they equate criticism to negativity.

It can get quite grating. Especially as historically the critical and/or negative posters have been correct so far.

Not to pick on you @TheReligion, but here's a similar thread of yours moaning about negativity right before things went tits up with Mourinho. https://www.redcafe.net/threads/are-there-any-positives-plenty.440206/

Why the constant craving for fake positivity, even if it's at the expense of objective analysis?

 

[Wibble]

I can't see why the moaning now when we had such a great end to the PL season that not only qualified us for the CL, revealed that we also really need to strengthen the squad and still has the possibility of a cup if our tired squad can limp over the line? Not to mention the electric movement and attacking we demonstrated towards the end of the season.

 

[christy87]

I’m more interested in what format next seasons CL will be, will it be the normal format or are we going to get a group stage tournament if it gets postponed because of a second wave of lockdowns.

 

[Yagami]

There are some posters who can't bear anything other than positivity. Thus they equate criticism to negativity.

It can get quite grating. Especially as historically the critical and/or negative posters have been correct so far.

Not to pick on you @TheReligion, but here's a similar thread of yours moaning about negativity right before things went tits up with Mourinho. https://www.redcafe.net/threads/are-there-any-positives-plenty.440206/

Why the constant craving for fake positivity, even if it's at the expense of objective analysis?

Agreed.

 

[Yagami]

And also, another moaning about moaners thread. The so called 'staunch anti-moaning' brigade are very ironic. All they do is moan about the moaners which equates to? You've guessed it, equally as bad moaners.

Yep!

Sometimes I wonder why some come on here if it's as bad as they say it is, which it isn't. Wouldn't they be better off at r/reddevils where it's just a bubble and any objective opinions that don't line up with the narrative are shushed.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Doesn't bother me. I'm just intrigued at what inspires such a cynical and depressing outlook.

Probably going from 13 league titles under SAF to yoyo-ing between 4th to 7th place for the next 7 years, and generally being a poorly mismanaged and disjoint team.

 

[Robbie Boy]

Doesn't bother me. I'm just intrigued at what inspires such a cynical and depressing outlook.

I mean, some of the cynicism is completely warranted and constructive. I also find it hard to believe that it 'doesn't bother you' as you do tend to moan a hell of a-lot from what I can see. Moaning about moaners and creating 'reverse drama queen' threads is equally as bad as the real drama queen threads and the cynics. Both extreme camps - for me - are equally as tedious as the other. Like whet purpose do threads like these serve? More moaning, but just from the other set of extreme fans on here.

There's literally posters who won't hear a single negetive view - no matter how constructive it may be - and they fill up threads with preachy waffle and smart remarks. This is just as arduous to read through as the doom monger posts. I've also noticed a new fad where the so called anti-moan brigade will reply to a post praising Ole with such shite as "Oh but he's a clueless PE teacher" in a failed attempt at humour and irony. Again, it's just as tedious as the moaners and really not remotely amusing.

Some don't like to hear it, but the ones that will back Ole no matter what, equally lack the nuance and ability to rationally debate as the Ole out crowd. From what I can see, there's only a small handful of really negative drama queens. They're easy to spot, easy to ignore and I kind of assume no one takes them too seriously. If a poster has 700 odd posts in one thread repeating they want Ole out, then yeah, I wouldn't let that upset you and would see that as a poster who shouldn't be taken seriously.

 

[Schmeichel's Cartwheel]

From reading about the performance last night to the fact we now face Sevilla on Sunday I'm truly baffled by what enjoyment some get from watching United and if it's that much hard work for you why bother. The usual posters slagging the club, moaning, explaining how poor we are and how Sevilla will do us (and in the final Milan will) blah blah.

Pointless us turning up for the CL next season really. Can we ask the PL to give it to someone else to save our embarrassment or is it too late?

Support the club ffs!

What you’re basically saying is you cannot support the club unless you’re universally positive. That’s not support, it’s delusion. Nobody is ever negative for the sake of it, look at the match threads when we are smashing teams. It’s very positive. If you are happy being a decent top 4 team I would say the more ambitious fans “support the club” more than you.

 

[Robbie Boy]

Yep!

Sometimes I wonder why some come on here if it's as bad as they say it is, which it isn't. Wouldn't they be better off at r/reddevils where it's just a bubble and any objective opinions that don't line up with the narrative are shushed.

I think it's just an outlet for moaners who pretend they don't moan, to moan.

I also agree, I think this is a fantastic forum with loads of great diverse debate and discussion. We all know who the hardcore 'Ole in' and 'Ole out' crowd are and they're probably not worth engaging with when it comes to Ole. The 'Ole in' crowd won't hear anything remotely negative about him or the club and and visa versa with the 'Ole out' crowd. That still leaves plenty of good, open minded posters to engage with who will consider opposing views and debate their side in a constructive manner.

 

[TheReligion]

Sigh. Guess it's just the difference between internet fans and those who are part of the club and go to the game. Oh well. I'm off to my bunker cause I'm shit scared of Sevilla.

 

[sammsky1]

I mean, some of the cynicism is completely warranted and constructive. I also find it hard to believe that it 'doesn't bother you' as you do tend to moan a hell of a-lot from what I can see. Moaning about moaners and creating 'reverse drama queen' threads is equally as bad as the real drama queen threads and the cynics. Both extreme camps - for me - are equally as tedious as the other. Like whet purpose do threads like these serve? More moaning, but just from the other set of extreme fans on here.

There's literally posters who won't hear a single negetive view - no matter how constructive it may be - and they fill up threads with preachy waffle and smart remarks. This is just as arduous to read through as the doom monger posts. I've also noticed a new fad where the so called anti-moan brigade will reply to a post praising Ole with such shite as "Oh but he's a clueless PE teacher" in a failed attempt at humour and irony. Again, it's just as tedious as the moaners and really not remotely amusing.

Some don't like to hear it, but the ones that will back Ole no matter what, equally lack the nuance and ability to rationally debate as the Ole out crowd. From what I can see, there's only a small handful of really negative drama queens. They're easy to spot, easy to ignore and I kind of assume no one takes them too seriously. If a poster has 700 odd posts in one thread repeating they want Ole out, then yeah, I wouldn't let that upset you and would see that as a poster who shouldn't be taken seriously.

 

[Robbie Boy]

Now you know how we feel about your posts. Nothing like learning something new about yourself. Now back to hating on Pogba and attacking people who may hold some views you don't like

 

[Dve]

Im all about being in the UCL for the money, but we dont have a chance there. Its quite sad to know since the start that we're not candidates.

Let me have a guess... in January you were one of the numerous people claiming we had absolutely no chance of ending top 4?

 

[SAFMUTD]

Let me have a guess... in January you were one of the numerous people claiming we had absolutely no chance of ending to 4?

I admit I wasnt confident on getting top 4, but lets not prettend like many on here were absolutely secure about top 4. Most of us predicted top 6 after the shitty first round we had.

 

[cyberman]

I admit I wasnt confident on getting top 4, but lets not prettend like many on here were absolutely secure about top 4. Most of us predicted top 6 after the shitty first round we had.

Lets not pretend the same posters werent claiming we would never make top 4 after our great run since January.