Retained the ball using his footwork alone, didn't really matter that he was lightweight. I was impressed.
And he has miles better control than Park.
And he has miles better control than Park.
tosic
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) was joined by comedian Ali Woods to look back at the best and worst moments of a rollercoaster season with the annual United Hour Awards.
Has Ten Hag been sacked yet? We're not sure and we hope not, but it's looking more likely as the days pass.
Who should replace him and why is it taking so long to make a decision?
Only SAF knows. I dont really think anyone else does.
To be fair, he's been mediocre for the reserves. Joshua King has been outshining him. Tonight he looked a lot more focused and up for the game. Maybe he's not performing in the reserves because he thinks its beneath him. But if you're not trying in the reserves then Fergie is not going to put you in the first team.
I agree but we will never know how good or not he is till he gets a chance,would like to see that happen
I would agree with that but then if his application/attitude was in question, would he even be in the carling cup squad?
We could have forgiven Sir Alex for putting king on as he can play out wide and is energetic and as we know, playing well for the reserves so God knows
I think what was in evidence in addition, he was getting stuck in. He got the booking and gave away that freekick (which I'm not sure was) but that side will have done him a world of good.
He's not gonna kill himself for the reserves, I think that's obvious. When it was time to prove that he is good, he proved it. Next step would have been including him in FA or Carling Cup games at least! He is an international player and he was one of the best in Partizan, he has more experience than anyone else in the reserves! Yea I know United is the greatest club in the world but you cannot tell me that at no point in his United career Tosic ever deserved to play in the first team!!
If you're underforming in the reserves then Fergie is not going to pick you.
Did decent when he came on, but in all honesty I don't think he'll make the grade..as a regular first-teamer anyway.
there must be some issue - might be stamina or strength?
i assumed he was just shit when he didnt make the CL squad but the little i have seen of him seems to suggest otherwise
I thought he was good tonight. I think he's a class player.
I really hope his performance will give Fergie something to think about and maybe make an appearance against Blackburn.
He is a very talented player - good control, great delivery from set plays, and he's a tidy finisher as well. Obviously Fergie and the staff see more than we do so he must not be putting in good performances in training or he might have a few personal issues that have limited his chances so far.
Hopefully he can make the breakthrough, though. I have high hopes for him and his former Partizan team mate Ljajic.
I really hope his performance will give Fergie something to think about and maybe make an appearance against Blackburn.
He is a very talented player - good control, great delivery from set plays, and he's a tidy finisher as well. Obviously Fergie and the staff see more than we do so he must not be putting in good performances in training or he might have a few personal issues that have limited his chances so far.
Hopefully he can make the breakthrough, though. I have high hopes for him and his former Partizan team mate Ljajic.
I dont think that United's reserve team standard is higher than that of Partizan or the Serbian national team. Meaning, if Tosic is good enough for Partizan and Serbia, he should be definitely good enough for FA and Carling starters.
I love his intelligence/technical ability.. but I just don't think he has the strength, it's not an issue of size because Messi etc show size isn't everything, but it's a question of whether he has the low centre of gravity (inner core strength) to hold his own in the premiership.
Ljajic on the other hand, glides past players for fun.. i have no doubt about him on the physical front.
I dont know what that means in normal language. He's been playing professionaly for a number of years now, nationaly and internationaly, and it's not as if the EPL is from another universe or another dimension. To me it's if he got the skills, which he has, and if he can adapt to the system (which can be learned).
I've seen him play for the serbian Under 21's, for the reserves.. regardless of height, he hasn't found these matches easy.
His technical ability is class, nothing wrong with him but the fact he's already 22 and struggles to impose himself physically against inferior opposition is worrying.
Players like Welbeck, Nani for instance are criticized over their decision-making not their actual ability to hold their own against premiership/championship level full backs. They regularly beat men, it's their end product that is called into question.
With Tosic, his footballing brain is of a good level.. but he doesn't beat 2-3 men, which even Park can do for instance.. Zoran finds it hard to dominate lesser players let alone make it as a regular for the first team. if he knocks it past a player for instance.. a slight barge would knock him off balance, it's why some of his better displays have come cutting inside off the right-wing.. where he doesn't have to rely on pace/strength to beat his man on the outside.. but can utilise his agility and throw the defender off-balance.
Ljajic on the other hand, whenever I've seen him play full matches, consistently gets past opponents regardless of how tough they are.. he glides past players and knows how to position his body and shield the ball when needed. He also has an eye for a pass (which Tosic has also) but he has the strength to buy himself time.
Very well explained! But surely, if all this is true, there's nothing he can really do about it? It's almost as if he is physionomicaly conditioned (sense of balance, etc).
It was a good cameo from him, hopefully it may be a bit of a turning point for him and he can kick on and force SAF to involve him a bit more.
Well there's a limit to what you can do, before you just accept it's not going to happen.
Some people just develop physically at a later stage, Tosic may be such a case (may be 26 before he fills out, gains a more solid physique).. but generally after the age of 21, you should have the basic strength to show that you can hack it at a top league.
Height is generally never an obstacle if you want to make it as a top player.. it helps obviously, but if you have good core strength and can shield the ball against older players/stronger players and beat them despite the fact you haven't fully developed these are all positive signs. For me.. Tosic hasn't demonstrated enough to suggest this will be the case, especially for someone who wants to make it at United.
Take Ronaldo at 17 for example, Messi too..both are extreme examples as they turned out to be the best in the world but just for arguments sake.. they could beat any defender regardless of that players class (age, strength, ability etc) and show glimpses of top class talent, though of course they'd struggle for consistency and get kicked out of certain games.
Robben for instance, very skinny as a youngster..lacked any sort of physique, but he still had the ability to beat players and keep the ball regardless of his frail frame, of course his frail frame has been detrimental as it has led to him suffering from injury but when he's fully fit, he can beat any defender and keep his balance..Ronaldo for his superior physique generally finds it hard to stay on his feet, doesn't quite posess the same balance though this could be attributed to his inclination to dive at any given oppurtunity.
Look at Josh King next time in the reserves, how he beats players so easily.. he is too good for that level, will he make it as a United player? who knows, but he's put himself in a position where he can realistically knock on the door, Tosic needs to show he is a class above reserve level football.. technically of course he's too good for the reserves, but is he able to escape the defenders of reserve level football with ease, does he beat 2/3 and then generally keep the ball, hold on to it in tight situations?
Welbeck did it today, in a league cup game with ease.. this is the sort of players Tosic is competing with. I think Ljajic will fit in easier, I know how passionate you eastern europeans are about your players.. and there is loads of talent coming through, i'd be more confident about Ljajic though, hope Tosic makes the grade though..I'm a big fan of the way he goes about his game, smart player.
Good post
Good analysis of Tosic, Raees. Well done.
I agree that I find the probability of him making it as a first team player low but that's not because of his technique which is great, like his understanding of the game which is great. His size is simply such a disadvantage.
I can actually see him play as a CM in a three man midfield or as a winger if he plays together with a combination of Rooney, Berbatov/Owen and Valencia. If he has players that move, he can do really well and wouldn't be found out due to his size. He could maybe do well in a 4-3-3 with Berbatov as forward since Berbatov also plays well when together with players that move or give him smart balls.
I agree that I find the probability of him making it as a first team player low but that's not because of his technique which is great, like his understanding of the game which is great. His size is simply such a disadvantage.
I can actually see him play as a CM in a three man midfield or as a winger if he plays together with a combination of Rooney, Berbatov/Owen and Valencia. If he has players that move, he can do really well and wouldn't be found out due to his size. He could maybe do well in a 4-3-3 with Berbatov as forward since Berbatov also plays well when together with players that move or give him smart balls.
Good post that, Raees.
I think Tosic's problem is as much mental as it is physical.
We've seen small players, especially wingers, excel in the Premier League so his size really shouldn't be too much of an issue. Just look at the likes of Shaun Wright-Phillips and Aaron Lennon.
Tosic is probably lacking the mental strength when he's knocked off the ball or pushed around to put his head down and get on with it. Of course this is just speculation, but he must be lacking the determination to not let defenders bully him off the ball. This must be apparent in training and in the Reserves.
Hopefully with each appearance he gains that confidence and mental strength. We have to remember that the English game is played at such a high intensity and pace, so he's still probably not fully adjusted to this as well. It takes time for some players, especially younger ones to adapt, so let's give him time.
I also agree that he looks better playing on the right. He likes to cut inside and get involved in play. He's not an out and out winger that will hug the touchline.
I think Tosic's problem is as much mental as it is physical.
We've seen small players, especially wingers, excel in the Premier League so his size really shouldn't be too much of an issue. Just look at the likes of Shaun Wright-Phillips and Aaron Lennon.
Tosic is probably lacking the mental strength when he's knocked off the ball or pushed around to put his head down and get on with it. Of course this is just speculation, but he must be lacking the determination to not let defenders bully him off the ball. This must be apparent in training and in the Reserves.
Hopefully with each appearance he gains that confidence and mental strength. We have to remember that the English game is played at such a high intensity and pace, so he's still probably not fully adjusted to this as well. It takes time for some players, especially younger ones to adapt, so let's give him time.
I also agree that he looks better playing on the right. He likes to cut inside and get involved in play. He's not an out and out winger that will hug the touchline.
I think it's far too early to write Tosic off. He is stronger than he looks, but he's never going to have a physique like Valencia, the benefit is that he is far more adroit on the ball, with a low centre of gravity and quicker changes of direction. He's similar in a lot of ways to Rafael, Fabio, Evra etc and they have shown they can adapt.
I think that's the point a lot of people miss, they just see his lack of height and physique.
People are talking like Tosic gets pushed off the ball at every contact.
But when I watch him play I just don't see it mesen, he's short but lots of players are, I don't see how he's weak.
But when I watch him play I just don't see it mesen, he's short but lots of players are, I don't see how he's weak.
Yep, we only have to go back to the signings of Nemanja Vidic and Patrice Evra to see how long it takes the players to adapt.
It took Vidic quite some time to get up to match fitness from the Russian League and settle in.
Evra took even longer, and that was from Ligue 1. He was appalling in his first few games, but he slowly grew into his role and became more comfortable with the English game, and look at him now.
We have to have patience with Tosic; he's clearly talented. I hope Fergie has the same patience too.
Agreed, mental strength is so important...size is overrated.
To be fair Rafael, Fabio have generally dominated the reserves and have always shown they can burst past players and use strength to hold off players.
Evra is a good example, looked abit lightweight when he first joined..but let's not forget he'd already played at the very top level, so he obviously had pedigree ..just needed to get used to the higher tempo of the premiership.
Tosic may adapt..but he'll have more chance doing so off the right flank, I wouldn't write him off..but my above observations were made on what I've seen so far and my gut instinct. I like the idea of him playing in a three-man midfield..focusing on his intelligence and not exposing his weaknesses as much.
His play is very Arshavin-like..that's the sort of player if everything turns out well, he could be moulded into.
I don't think his problem is mental. He is mentally strong and isn't affraid of defenders a bit. He is up to a battle as anyone.
His main problem is that his size limits his strength and he isn't that fast either, like Shaun Wright-Phillips and Aaron Lennon. What he has is a great understanding of the game and technique above other wingers in the league of similar size. In order to play at his best, he needs good players around him and players that move. Which is also why he doesn't perform very well with the reserves. He needs options and given that he would look great.
I'm quite sure that in a PL game when the other attackers play well, he could look maybe even better in many parts of the game. But the thing with him is that he can't get that chance if doesn't do well for the reserves. And as I said, he just isn't that type of player that does well with the players that aren't at a very high level.
For me, there is no question that our first two wingers should be Nani and Valencia. But in the games with a line-up of players that move a lot, he could easily do better than Nani and look like a great little player. Not to mention that he is possibly our best set-piece taker.
He has been improving of late. Looks more suited to the AMC hole with a licence to roam than out wide.
I would like to see him more often.... After yesterday match he does deserve to start a match in the league... Why not against Blackburn
He looked decent against Barnsley but didnt do anything to suggest he warrants a start against Blackburn
Agree.. But Nani did had more then enough chances wasted why not giving Tosic one and if he waste the ball change him with Welbeck.... Its time for the youth 
Tosic is behind Welbeck and probably Obertan as well - but i agree that he deserves more of a chance than he has been given thus far.Agree.. But Nani did had more then enough chances wasted why not giving Tosic one and if he waste the ball change him with Welbeck.... Its time for the youth
Agree with all of that. I certainly don't think his problem is mental or physical strength, but his lack of pace is a problem in that he finds it harder than the Lennons or Wright-Philips to make room for himself. But he has a beauty of a left-foot
Also, did anyone else hear Alan Green raving about him last night? On the Radio5 commentary, Alan Green resumed commentating shortly after Tosic came on and Green said something along the lines of: "he's little but you can see he's a real talent" and then a few minutes later; "I've seen him play a few times and I'm sure he's going to make it at United, real talent"
Surprised me, firstly that Green even knows who he is, and even more so that he would be generous in his praise. Green spends most of his time whining about the crowd, diving, Gary Neville, the stewards etc etc.
I'd like to see Tosic get a crack at our left-wing slot, even if he starts off making a few appearances from the bench.
Obviously, if this is gonna happen the rest of the team will have to start trying not to get someone sent off in every fecking game!
Obviously, if this is gonna happen the rest of the team will have to start trying not to get someone sent off in every fecking game!
I liked what I saw form him aaginst Barnsley. It was only Barnsley, so I wiuld like to see what he cna do against a Premier League club... give him a chance Fergie..
I was impressed with how well he holds the ball. His close control and dribbling is brilliant, I would have liked to have seen him go at the defender more 1 on 1 but in fairness he barely got the ball after Neville got sent off. Also was impressed how he didn't give the ball away at all.
Its clear that he is more than capable for a shot at the first team, whether or not he is good enough remains to be seen in the chances he will get. Very unlucky not too score with that curler, also liked the quick thinking chest off the throw in. Good little cameo.
Its clear that he is more than capable for a shot at the first team, whether or not he is good enough remains to be seen in the chances he will get. Very unlucky not too score with that curler, also liked the quick thinking chest off the throw in. Good little cameo.
Anderson has already disproved this. Also playing well in the reserves doesn't always guarantee a first team chance either. Just ask Eagles and Lee Martin.
How has anderson disproved this. Hes only played one reserve game a season since hes arrived and in the game this season against wigan he was the best player on the pitch
Great point.
Lee Martin was IMMENSE for the Reserves. Literally sensational. But never really got anywhere near a start for the big boys.
It's all about coming up against bigger better faster defenders..He was ripping players for fun at reserve level, then found it hard to make an impact at the top level.
Other players such as Adel Taraabt for instance, can rip players at any level of football.. but it's their footballing intelligence which is found out at the top level.
size is really not an issue. Yes he's small. So is patrice evra, you rarely see him beaten in the air. There will be times but in general he has characteristics to make up for it like a great spring.
Tosic has a lot of ability and people should be paitent. I felt sorry for him because like kiko in the last round, he was hampered by a silly sending off that meant we were on the backfoot more often then we would have been
But again the size and stength is guess work in regards the future. He's as much a chance as anyone.
Tosic has a lot of ability and people should be paitent. I felt sorry for him because like kiko in the last round, he was hampered by a silly sending off that meant we were on the backfoot more often then we would have been
But again the size and stength is guess work in regards the future. He's as much a chance as anyone.