Trequartista

Pogue Mahone

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The Death of the 'Trequartista'

Modern day formations such as the 4-4-2 and the 4-5-1 employed by most Barclays Premier League teams have brought forth the death of the ‘Trequartista’ or the ‘hole’ player as I like to call it. Trequartista, which means ‘three quarters’ in Italian is the position employed by the playmaker of the team, who invariably sports the Number 10 jersey. Most BPL teams tend to utilize a second striker, a position which in my opinion is distinct from that of a trequartista. Although a second striker is a player who attacks from deeper positions as compared to an old fashioned centre forward, his primary role is to score goals for his team, much like Carlos Tevez’s task at Manchester United. A trequartista on the other hand is a player who operates in the ‘hole’ between the defence and the midfield of the opposition and tries to utilize that space to create goal scoring opportunities for his team.

Classic modern day examples of a trequartista are Zinedine Zidane, Pablo Aimar and Manuel Rui Costa who are/were masters at pulling strings from their positions in the hole. Sir Alex Ferguson famously let go of the opportunity to sign Zidane from Bordeaux primarily because he was unsure of what position to play him in. The rigid approach of BPL managers over the years has meant that most line-ups have not had a place for a trequartista, the position that is home to many footballing geniuses. Roberto Baggio is another archetypical example of a trequartista as he very seldom fitted into a team formation, opting instead to move into positions of space offered by the opposition. I am not for one moment doubting the fact that a lot of inside-forwards (a term that is sometimes used to describe the second striker) can alternate as trequartistas (examples include Cantona, Zola and Bergkamp), but invariably these players have played as supporting strikers when playing for their clubs in England.

The Argentineans refer to the trequartista as the “enganche”, a position which was made famous by the great Diego Maradona. The midfield diamond that the Argentinean National Team often employs permits the presence of an enganche who is the creative fulcrum of the team. The enganche acts as the link between the midfield and the front line and has a celebrated place in Argentinean football culture. The breathtaking football that Argentina produced in the 2006 World Cup, with Riquelme playing as the enghance is I am sure permanently etched in most of our minds. The Spaniards have employed a similarly impressive formation in the ongoing European Championships with the brilliant David Silva and the cheeky Anders Iniesta drifting in from wide positions into spaces between the central midfield and defence of the opposition and in the process creating room for the full-backs, Ramos and Capdevilla to make attacking runs on the flanks. Netherlands have also made full use of the phenomenal talents of Wesley Sneijder by playing him as the trequartista. In my opinion, the presence of a trequartista is not a burden on the team as is believed by many managers as it opens up several tactical options to the team as has been seen with both the Spanish and the Dutch set up.

The absence of a place for a trequartista in most BPL line-ups has meant that hugely talented players like ‘Seba’ Veron have been unable to lay their mark in England. Veron much like Riquelme is at his best when employed as an enghance, but the BPL for all the excitement it generates has never quite produced tactics from managers that match with the best from the continent. Ferguson and Wenger, two of the foremost managers of the last decade have both been content to play a flat back four and at most times 2 traditional forwards. Unless variations in the back line are resorted to, it is difficult to play a trequartista without employing a diamond in midfield and in the process sacrificing on the wide players which is rarely seen in the BPL. Whilst there is no doubting the success of the English clubs, a lack of innovation in formations can at times be tedious for the viewers. Even a player like Joe Cole, who with his ingenious abilities can easily fit into the role of an orthodox number 10, is banished to the wings. The injuries to Robin Van Persie this past season had forced Wenger to use the talents of Hleb in the ‘hole’ on a fair few occasions and it certainly brought the best out of him.

The only BPL manager who has tried using a trequartista on a consistent basis has been Rafael Benitez, but sadly for Liverpool, I felt it was Benayoun who should have been deployed there rather than Steven Gerrard, who is much more at home when played as a conventional central midfielder. Maybe Scolari’s appointment at Chelsea will bring forth certain tactical changes and if he does sign Deco as is widely reported in the press, then there will almost certainly have to be adaptations in their team formation to allow Deco to play as the trequartista. The signing of Luka Modric by Jaunde Ramos, the Spurs’ manager, is similarly interesting as Modric is a player born to play in the ‘hole’. But even continental managers seem to get caught up with the rigidity of flat lines across the field the moment they set foot in England. The legendary Fabio Capello himself has been guilty of the offence as has been seen from the tactics used by England in their last few friendlies. Capello as England’s manager has so far failed to replicate the tactical astuteness he showed during his club management days. I would like to see England play in a 3-4-1-2 formation with Rio Ferdinand as the sweeper and either one of Rooney or Joe Cole as the trequartista.

I would equally love to see Ferguson make changes to his favoured formations to permit Rooney to play as the trequartista behind Carlos Tevez and another centre forward whom United would hopefully sign, especially if Cristiano Ronaldo leaves Old Trafford this season. I still think Ferguson hasn’t found Rooney’s best position and this is largely in my opinion due to the fact that he prefers playing a front two or a three in central midfield, thereby neglecting the ‘hole’ which would be the position where Rooney could thrive for Manchester United. Unless more innovation is brought forth by managers in England, the Premier League will never get to witness the best form of some of the most brilliant talents of world football.

http://suhrith.blogspot.com/2008/06/death-of-trequartista.html
The above article is a year old - and I don't agree with all of it - but it covers something I've just been thinking about. We've got a couple of really talented young kids coming through at our club in Davide Petrucci and Ljajic, both of whom have been compared with players who excel as trequartistas (Kaka and Totti). We also have in Anderson a huge talent that seems to be at his best when he is freed from the discipline needed to operate as a conventional central midfielder.

The thing is, I don't see how any of them will fit in with the way we usually set up. If we continue playing the way we do I can see both Ljajic and Petrucci being converted into wingers and Anderson ending up as a conventional "box to box" midfielder. There's also the perennial Rooney debate. Personally, I think Rooney is so talenfed that he can be exceptional anywhere across the front line but I know a lot of people think he would be at his best playing as a trequartista. Arguably, the same is true for Berbatov.

Do we need to think about changing to, and sticking with, a formation that will allow us to play someone in a free role, between midfield and attack?

Alternatively, is it possible that this is exactly what we were doing last season, with Berbatov playing as our trequartista?
 

sincher

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I don't think Petrucci will end up as a winger. Ljajic might well do since that's normally where he lines up for Partizan.

I don't think we need to start thinking about imposing a rigid system on our team that is based round a no.10 - you'd only do this if that player was the master of your team, and we don't have that at present.

Maybe when Petrucci is a bit older though - who knows?
 

Bearded but no genius

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I thought Ljajic was already a winger and Petrucci is working in a more formal CM system in United's reserves.

If he ends up being so damned good we need to build the team around him then I dare say we'll do it.
 

Pogue Mahone

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My understanding is that Ljajic is playing on the wing right now (because he's presumably not good enough to build a team around him) but the "little Kaka" tag would imply that his long-term future might be more central.

From what little I've seen of him, he doesn't play very much like a conventional winger but I'd be keen to hear the opinions of any Serbian 'tards who are more familiar with his game.
 

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The above article is a year old - and I don't agree with all of it - but it covers something I've just been thinking about. We've got a couple of really talented young kids coming through at our club in Davide Petrucci and Ljajic, both of whom have been compared with players who excel as trequartistas (Kaka and Totti). We also have in Anderson a huge talent that seems to be at his best when he is freed from the discipline needed to operate as a conventional central midfielder.

The thing is, I don't see how any of them will fit in with the way we usually set up. If we continue playing the way we do I can see both Ljajic and Petrucci being converted into wingers and Anderson ending up as a conventional "box to box" midfielder. There's also the perennial Rooney debate. Personally, I think Rooney is so talenfed that he can be exceptional anywhere across the front line but I know a lot of people think he would be at his best playing as a trequartista. Arguably, the same is true for Berbatov.

Do we need to think about changing to, and sticking with, a formation that will allow us to play someone in a free role, between midfield and attack?

Alternatively, is it possible that this is exactly what we were doing last season, with Berbatov playing as our trequartista?
It is a system that we could make work. We have plenty of players that we could employ in a central midfield three. You could quite conceivably have any trio from Carrick, Scholes, Giggs, Anderson, Fletcher, Hargreaves and even Park.

I don't think we actually have a traditional number 10 though. The article makes a nice distinction between a second striker (which is where I think Wayne is best) and an "in the hole player". There is probably about 10-15 yards difference between the two. We have seen with Wayne's goal spurt for England that it would be a waste of his talents to haul him too deep. Berbatov is a centre forward. I'm not sure about Anderson in there, purely because I don't think his passing is precise enough.

You could argue that we saw some sort of variation of this formation in the season just gone. Though I personally think that formations are far more fluid than these set ups imply:

Rooney-Ronaldo
----Berbatov---
Giggs--Fletcher
----Carrick----

We certainly have the attacking thrust from the full back positions with the likes of Evra and Rafael.

You don't tend to see these "number 10s" in England because they are something of an indulgence - i.e Riquelme and Veron. I also feel that you are often limiting yourself if you try and direct the play through one player. It is easier for opponents to deal with you as well.

The most obvious "10" in the PL at the moment is probably Arshavin.
 

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I haven't seen enough of Ljajic or Petrucci to comment on either but Anderson seems to be a different player when played in the "hole". I would love to see us go back to 4-2-3-1 like we did in 02/03, because I feel that it suits our current personnel best.
 

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I absolutely love 4231 as a formation. It can offer so much interchanging and freedom from the '3' and even the front man. I much prefer it to a rigid 4411.

From what I've seen of youngsters like Welbeck, Petrucci and Ljajic, all would be comfortable playing across the attacking '3'. I haven't seen as much of them as others have though.

I'd love to see Rooney at the centre of the '3' more often. Anderson and Giggs have also looked very good in that role.
 

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Petrucci has been played in the trequartista role this season if Im not mistaken playing behind Macheda a lot in the academy before he got injured dropping deep to link up play.
 

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I have no idea either, yet.
Read that article at the time, great read, also I love that word ... Trequartista , used to amuse me as pundits spent hours trying to best define Hoddle and the like.
 

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Interesting word Trequartista. But is it an attacking creative midfielder or a second striker or a nr.10? Wiki says Roberto Baggio was a natural trequartista
 

moses

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Interesting word Trequartista. But is it an attacking creative midfielder or a second striker or a nr.10? Wiki says Roberto Baggio was a natural trequartista
And hoddle, and totti, and maradona, and johann ... for me the interesting thing is the linguistic element, the culture needed a word therefore it has one, the northern european's tend not to have it. Another great word is gambetta
 

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Davide Petrucci played at times as a right attacking midfielder for Roma, though mostly in the trequartista role (no.10) behind the main striker from what I've heard/read. For us, he began playing as a central attacking midfielder in the Scholes mould in a 4 man midfield - not really a trequartista. As the season went on, it's fair to say his best form and performances were reached playing behind Macheda in the no.10 role. I think his ability to play in midfield or as a forward will help his development because he'll be able to get more chances if his progression keeps going the way as planned (want to see him back in full fitness). It is an interesting subject of whether we are able to employ this formation, I agree with the suggestion of 4-2-3-1 especially with our fluent play and with the players we have and the ones who are coming through it could be ideal in the future. I don't think Petrucci will ever be a traditional winger, he is best in the centre with the whole pitch around him to maximise his craft and creativity.

Adem Ljajic is more of a dribbler than Petrucci I'd say, watched some obscure matches of Partizan from time to time on poor streams but have mainly kept up to date with highlights. Ljajic is a good passer of the ball too though, but his main instincts seem to be to get past his man and then create. He played on the right wing for Partizan's youth teams and when he broke through into their first team he was also on the right wing, once again though - as the season progressed he was moved to the left wing where (in my opinion) he seemed to be at his best cutting in onto his favoured right foot and scored in something like 4 games straight while also creating and also being able to cut into the centre and cause damage from there. The trequartista role is familiar to him in the Serbian youth sides, which we will probably see in the U19 Euros this summer where he will probably be wearing the no.10 as he has been in the qualifying and also scored in his last 4-5 matches. I think Ljajic is more likely to be used as a winger out of the two, it seems to be more natural to him but the key thing is that we have these youngsters who seem to be able to fit into our fluent attacking game which ironically may not encompass the in comparison "rigid" role of the quintessential trequartista.
 

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The worrying thing is though that we have so many talented players fighting for that role, which is actually a worry we would like to have so its not such a worry. But players might not get the chance to develop bacause of other players and move on, like Rossi. The only out and out striker we have actually is Macheda unless Berbatov would start to play there.

Rooney, Berbatov, Welbeck, Anderson, Scholes, Giggs, Petrucci and Ljajic can all play there to some extent although some are better at wide areas and some in the midfield so we are blessed with that.

I think we'll see more of 4-3-3 in the future since we have so many player that can fill the positions upfront and with our lack of "true" wingers.
 

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Interesting word Trequartista. But is it an attacking creative midfielder or a second striker or a nr.10? Wiki says Roberto Baggio was a natural trequartista
And what about punta mezzo or 9.5? To my mind the original playmaker was an inside forward in a 424 (usually the inside left or no.10). As we move forward to more crowded midfields and 442, 4411 etc the no.10 played in the hole - either an advanced midfielder or withdrawn forward.
 

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Can you explain the difference to me in pure terms, without involving the evolution of the game and formations?
I'd guess that the ACM has slightly more responsibility to track back when the other team has the ball.
 

dno

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4231 accommodates either a second striker in the hole or a playmaker. We've played van Persie there or a Hleb or Fabregas. You've played Giggs there.
This is the key point for me. The 4-2-3-1 allows the central player of the 3 to function as a "threequarter".

The traditional Italian argument differentiating the 10 from the second striker is that a 10 like Totti needs options and space. 2 strikers provide both by pulling defenders away and giving the options that make use of the 10's vision and imagination. But with advanced wide players in the 4-2-3-1 I think the 10 will have this too, no?
 

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I lightly scolded you for the Berbatov vs Tevez debate No. 3817 t'other day Pogue

I'm gunna saw your bollocks off if you start any more of these muppet formation threads! :feckedOff:
 
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The above article is a year old - and I don't agree with all of it - but it covers something I've just been thinking about. We've got a couple of really talented young kids coming through at our club in Davide Petrucci and Ljajic, both of whom have been compared with players who excel as trequartistas (Kaka and Totti). We also have in Anderson a huge talent that seems to be at his best when he is freed from the discipline needed to operate as a conventional central midfielder.

The thing is, I don't see how any of them will fit in with the way we usually set up. If we continue playing the way we do I can see both Ljajic and Petrucci being converted into wingers and Anderson ending up as a conventional "box to box" midfielder. There's also the perennial Rooney debate. Personally, I think Rooney is so talenfed that he can be exceptional anywhere across the front line but I know a lot of people think he would be at his best playing as a trequartista. Arguably, the same is true for Berbatov.

Do we need to think about changing to, and sticking with, a formation that will allow us to play someone in a free role, between midfield and attack?

Alternatively, is it possible that this is exactly what we were doing last season, with Berbatov playing as our trequartista?
We need to just go 4-2-3-1 permanently. Letting the CM like Carrick and Fletcher concentrate on defending, then let the front 4 do what the feel like, devoid of any serious defensive responsibilty. That way we will maximise the playmaking talents of Rooney and Berbatov.
 

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One way that it would work is with 3-4-3 formation, where the front 3 are not made up of wingers and a CF, but two CFs and a number 10. This would eliminate our fullbacks, but you could have Evra as a wingback, while the other midfielder is more forward oriented.

VDS
Evans Rio Vidic
Valencia Carrick Fletcher Evra
Rooney
Berbatov Macheda​
 

Mr. MUJAC

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Bloody hell!

Petrucci has played one reserve game and Ljajic hasn't even arrived yet so most of us haven't seen him play.

So what both these lads may or may not be able to do if and when they reach the first team, and if and when they become regulars.....is anyones guess?
 

Pogue Mahone

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I lightly scolded you for the Berbatov vs Tevez debate No. 3817 t'other day Pogue

I'm gunna saw your bollocks off if you start any more of these muppet formation threads! :feckedOff:
Here's a thought Brad. How's about not posting in threads that don't interest you?

Alternatively, get one of the admins to set up a new private forum, where you can give all new threads the once over, before deciding if they're fit for consumption. I can't help thinking you'd enjoy the feeling of power.
 

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Here's a thought Brad. How's about not posting in threads that don't interest you?

Alternatively, get one of the admins to set up a new private forum, where you can give all new threads the once over, before deciding if they're fit for consumption. I can't help thinking you'd enjoy the feeling of power.
How about you don't take yourself so seriously for a day or two Pogue?
 

peterstorey

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This is the key point for me. The 4-2-3-1 allows the central player of the 3 to function as a "threequarter".

The traditional Italian argument differentiating the 10 from the second striker is that a 10 like Totti needs options and space. 2 strikers provide both by pulling defenders away and giving the options that make use of the 10's vision and imagination. But with advanced wide players in the 4-2-3-1 I think the 10 will have this too, no?
I think that's right though some people don't agree. You can track it with Arsenal as Bergkamp moved from being a striker to playing deeper and deeper and supplying the bullets for Pires and Ljungberg.
 

peterstorey

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Good point. Was that Arsenal side the first genuine 4-2-3-1 in English football?
Bergkamp was interviewed recently saying it was, but it think it was still a more 4411 with Vieira/Gilberto higher and more in line with Pires/Ljungberg wide starting positions. I think we moved to 4231 proper when Bergkamp retired (2006), definitely by the time Henry went a year later.
 

Rowem

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One way that it would work is with 3-4-3 formation, where the front 3 are not made up of wingers and a CF, but two CFs and a number 10. This would eliminate our fullbacks, but you could have Evra as a wingback, while the other midfielder is more forward oriented.

VDS
Evans Rio Vidic
Valencia Carrick Fletcher Evra
Rooney
Berbatov Macheda​
What nationality are you/where did you grow up, just out of interest?

I've rarely ever seen this kind of formation in practise but I get the impression it's more popular in North and South America.
 

Nistelrooy10

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What nationality are you/where did you grow up, just out of interest?

I've rarely ever seen this kind of formation in practise but I get the impression it's more popular in North and South America.
I'm Bosnian. My nationality has nothing to do with this formation, however, I've always been a fan of it due to its symmetrical nature, 7 players defending, 7 players attacking. I think it was used by Ajax and is still used in their famous academies. However, they somehow switch between 4-3-3 when defending, and 3-4-3 when attacking, they put that one defender forward as a DM.