Under 21 Euros 2019

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Wacky match overall but, entertaining. I have no stock in this but, I always enjoy the UEFA u21 tournanment since you can see top talent in a strange environment
 

Spiersey

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England were in a good position until the red card. Showing inexperience and stupidity
Poor management from Boothroyd really. No idea why he subbed on two big centre forwards when down to 10 and a goal up. I'm a big advocate of not subbing on defenders but not putting on someone to bolster up midfield is moronic management. Another England generation being killed by stupid managers.
 

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Nice, I never doubted the boys :wenger:
 

limerickcitykid

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Please start some decent attackers next match Bothroyd. Surely Tammy, Reiss Nelson and Calvert Lewin would be much better front three than dross like Solanke? All of them played regularly and Nelson and Tammy had really good seasons.
Nelson has don't anything but play regularly. He had a whopping 140 minutes since the new year. Solanke had over double in the same period. Not to say Nelson shouldn't be playing but he's been sat on his ass for the last 6-7 months not getting a game either.
 

do.ob

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Poor management from Boothroyd really. No idea why he subbed on two big centre forwards when down to 10 and a goal up. I'm a big advocate of not subbing on defenders but not putting on someone to bolster up midfield is moronic management. Another England generation being killed by stupid managers.
Probably thought they could get some relief/counterplay by playing hoofball.
 

Classical Mechanic

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Midfield started very balanced as I predicted....Choudhary as DM (were you asleep when Leicester played Arsenal and Man. City at end of last season as he looked very good in both games), Foden as the B2B playmaker which he's developing into at Man. City and Maddison obviously as AM. Still don't get why you have such a downer on central midfield when by a mile it's the strongest area of the England squad.
I have to admit that I’m confused as to why you are posting this after our only defence minded midfielder just got a red and we have zero cover for him.

Feels like I'm gunning for you @Classical Mechanic but sorry can't let this pass either. MGW featured in 26 premier league games last season. Of course many were as late sub but you have to remember Wolves have Neves and Moutinho as their regular starters. Certainly compares well to Foden.
Gibbs-White has less than 1500 minutes of senior football in his career, that’s about 17 games. We’re playing against sides where all their starters have 100+ games in top 5 European leagues.
 

Spiersey

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Probably thought they could get some relief/counterplay by playing hoofball.
Makes no sense though as he subbed off all the pace to put the two strikers on so it was impossible to play counter football as they had no-one to get up the field and were . a man down in midfield. A decent manager would not have made those subs, I really hope he is asked about them post match.
 

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Nelson has don't anything but play regularly. He had a whopping 140 minutes since the new year. Solanke had over double in the same period. Not to say Nelson shouldn't be playing but he's been sat on his ass for the last 6-7 months not getting a game either.
Really, fair enough. I thought overall for young english player going abroad he had good season in Bundesliga, didn't he have 7-8 goals up to xmas? Tammy and DCL need to start next game anyway as they have been playing regularly.

Edit: Sorry simply don't rate Solanke. Just seems to have built the hype so far on looking good in the England under 20 team in the World cup. Did he score for Bournemouth in the run in?
 

GledTheRed

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Choudry tackle was school boy shit, nearly as bad as taking off two wingers for two centre forwards with 10 them. Both bonkers decisions.
 

Classical Mechanic

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Really, fair enough. I thought overall for young english player going abroad he had good season in Bundesliga, didn't he have 7-8 goals up to xmas? Tammy and DCL need to start next game anyway as they have been playing regularly.
He started well but he was disciplined by the club at one point so something went wrong.
 

Classical Mechanic

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Choudry tackle was school boy shit, nearly as bad as taking off two wingers for two centre forwards with 10 them. Both bonkers decisions.
Bringing Tammy on was odd, our left hand side was our weakness and he doesn’t know that tracking back role as a winger. Sessegnon has played left back numerous times. Just weird but what you expect from Boothroyd.
 

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I have to admit that I’m confused as to why you are posting this after our only defence minded midfielder just got a red and we have zero cover for him.



Gibbs-White has less than 1500 minutes of senior football in his career, that’s about 17 games. We’re playing against sides where all their starters have 100+ games in top 5 European leagues.
Yes it was stupid but before that midfield was playing very well against highly rated French guys like Aouar. The central midfield that started wasn't the problem tonight.

Back 4 just isn't that strong, Clarke-Salter is mediocre CB and well upfront was completely wrong selection by Boothroyd. Solanke making just the one premier league start for Bournemouth since signing in January, zero goals. Should not have been starting.
 

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Yes it was stupid but before that midfield was playing very well against highly rated French guys like Aouar. The central midfield that started wasn't the problem tonight.

Back 4 just isn't that strong, Clarke-Salter is mediocre CB and well upfront was completely wrong selection by Boothroyd. Solanke making just the one premier league start for Bournemouth since signing in January, zero goals. Should not have been starting.
Yeah I really did not like England's CBs. He should have called up Ben Godfrey for this tournament.
 

Classical Mechanic

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Yes it was stupid but before that midfield was playing very well against highly rated French guys like Aouar. The central midfield that started wasn't the problem tonight.

Back 4 just isn't that strong, Clarke-Salter is mediocre CB and well upfront was completely wrong selection by Boothroyd. Solanke making just the one premier league start for Bournemouth since signing in January, zero goals. Should not have been starting.
It worked with with Choudhury but he had favoured Dowell in that position previously who is an AM. But the post you quoted me on, I said there was only one DM in the squad and that was unbalanced. Now we have to deal with that absurd selection.
 

limerickcitykid

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Really, fair enough. I thought overall for young english player going abroad he had good season in Bundesliga, didn't he have 7-8 goals up to xmas? Tammy and DCL need to start next game anyway as they have been playing regularly.
He scored 6 in the first 2.5 months averaging a goal every 55 minutes or so. He was promptly dropped barely seeing the pitch again for the rest of the season with only 1 start. His loan is a complete myth. He had the greatest start to the season imaginable and he was still instantly dropped. He is the exact opposite of what everyone tries to paint him as a shining example of Bundesliga loans being amazing.

I don't rate Solanke either. I'm just responding to the constant myth of Nelson getting loads of game time and having an amazing loan when he spent the majority of the time sitting on the bench not getting a chance.
 

GledTheRed

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Bringing Tammy on was odd, our left hand side was our weakness and he doesn’t know that tracking back role as a winger. Sessegnon has played left back numerous times. Just weird but what you expect from Boothroyd.
Sessengon was garbage, he always is when I watch him. Such a nothing player.
 

do.ob

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He scored 6 in the first 2.5 months averaging a goal every 55 minutes or so. He was promptly dropped barely seeing the pitch again for the rest of the season with only 1 start. His loan is a complete myth. He had the greatest start to the season imaginable and he was still instantly dropped. He is the exact opposite of what everyone tries to paint him as a shining example of Bundesliga loans being amazing.

I don't rate Solanke either. I'm just responding to the constant myth of Nelson getting loads of game time and having an amazing loan when he spent the majority of the time sitting on the bench.
It's not really a big enigma. He was never really a starter, just an impact sub who got a disproportionate amount of hype after having a good couple of weeks. He was unlucky that Joelinton and Belfodil really took off this season, together with Kramaric that's three out of three attacking spots taken by default. After the winter break Amiri came back from injury, making things harder still.
 

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It worked with with Choudhury but he had favoured Dowell in that position previously who is an AM. But the post you quoted me on, I said there was only one DM in the squad and that was unbalanced. Now we have to deal with that absurd selection.
Is there that many DMs about who should've been called up? Maybe Rice should've gone to this tournament. Yes Dowell certainly isn't a DM which I haven't disputed.

With the way tournament works England need to win next match otherwise pretty much out so might just have to be a game where you play more attacking system and just hope the players upfront can actually score. 4-4-f***ing 2 as Mike Bassett would say.:lol:
 

Classical Mechanic

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Is there that many DMs about who should've been called up? Maybe Rice should've gone to this tournament. Yes Dowell certainly isn't a DM which I haven't disputed.

With the way tournament works England need to win next match otherwise pretty much out so might just have to be a game where you play more attacking system and just hope the players upfront can actually score. 4-4-f***ing 2 as Mike Bassett would say.:lol:
Don’t see why Winks didn’t go. He has like 3 senior caps and said that he’d play.
 

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He scored 6 in the first 2.5 months averaging a goal every 55 minutes or so. He was promptly dropped barely seeing the pitch again for the rest of the season with only 1 start. His loan is a complete myth. He had the greatest start to the season imaginable and he was still instantly dropped. He is the exact opposite of what everyone tries to paint him as a shining example of Bundesliga loans being amazing.

I don't rate Solanke either. I'm just responding to the constant myth of Nelson getting loads of game time and having an amazing loan when he spent the majority of the time sitting on the bench not getting a chance.
Just looked at Soccerbase, you're right he didn't start after xmas but he was at least still coming on as sub around 60th min mark in 7-8 games. I get the feeling he didn't really respond to Nagelsmann tactical demands and German coaches are pretty ruthless in not starting young players if they don't adapt to that side of the game. Oli Burke at Leipzig would be classic example.

It was a better loan anyway than Emile Smith Rowe at RB Leipzig who hardly played although think he was largely injured?
 

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Don’t see why Winks didn’t go. He has like 3 senior caps and said that he’d play.
Mmmm injured for most of the run in, think Spurs might've had an issue given he didn't get called up to nations league squad.

England have loads of DMs for senior team so I don't really think it's that much of a thing for needing under 21s to develop that area. What seniors lack is that tempo playmaker like Modric, Xavi, Pirlo, De Jong etc.

Foden reminds me a bit of Wilshere when he first broke though at Arsenal until injury destroyed his top level career so pleased he had a good game tonight.
 

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Mmmm injured for most of the run in, think Spurs might've had an issue given he didn't get called up to nations league squad.

England have loads of DMs for senior team so I don't really think it's that much of a thing for needing under 21s to develop that area. What seniors lack is that tempo playmaker like Modric, Xavi, Pirlo, De Jong etc.

Foden reminds me a bit of Wilshere when he first broke though at Arsenal until injury destroyed his top level career so pleased he had a good game tonight.
I don’t get the Foden - Wilshere comparison. It seems a bit shallow to me just because they are small with a low centre of gravity. When did you ever see Wilshere scoring goals like that or hitting passes like Foden did tonight. That one to Solanke was brilliant but he botched it.
 

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I don’t get the Foden - Wilshere comparison. It seems a bit shallow to me just because they are small with a low centre of gravity. When did you ever see Wilshere scoring goals like that or hitting passes like Foden did tonight. That one to Solanke was brilliant but he botched it.
I really do not think goals will be a common occurrence for Foden either.
 

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I don’t get the Foden - Wilshere comparison. It seems a bit shallow to me just because they are small with a low centre of gravity. When did you ever see Wilshere scoring goals like that or hitting passes like Foden did tonight. That one to Solanke was brilliant but he botched it.
Simply if you play a 3 in midfield those two will always be a tempo middle player of the three. Does seem Foden has a bit more in final third although can remember Wilshere scoring a few in his breakthrough 10/11.
 

Classical Mechanic

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I really do not think goals will be a common occurrence for Foden either.
He’s scored goal at every level he’s played at, including 7 for City this season in limited minutes. Just seems an odd opinion to me. He’s good at ghosting into the box to score, scoring from distance, dribbling and scoring and a lot of his finishing is really smart like his goal tonight.
 

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If we don't win this fecking tournament we should punt Di Biagio into the sun :lol:
He scored 6 in the first 2.5 months averaging a goal every 55 minutes or so. He was promptly dropped barely seeing the pitch again for the rest of the season with only 1 start. His loan is a complete myth. He had the greatest start to the season imaginable and he was still instantly dropped. He is the exact opposite of what everyone tries to paint him as a shining example of Bundesliga loans being amazing.

I don't rate Solanke either. I'm just responding to the constant myth of Nelson getting loads of game time and having an amazing loan when he spent the majority of the time sitting on the bench not getting a chance.
Going by what our resident german football expert said it seems like the problem was the club they loaned him to. A club that already has players of similar quality in his position performing well has zero incentive to bench them in favour of a loanee
 

do.ob

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Just looked at Soccerbase, you're right he didn't start after xmas but he was at least still coming on as sub around 60th min mark in 7-8 games. I get the feeling he didn't really respond to Nagelsmann tactical demands and German coaches are pretty ruthless in not starting young players if they don't adapt to that side of the game. Oli Burke at Leipzig would be classic example.

It was a better loan anyway than Emile Smith Rowe at RB Leipzig who hardly played although think he was largely injured?

Pretty weird to bring up Burke, who simply wasn't good enough. I mean two years down the road he's playing for Celtic.

Hoffenheim's names in attack may not look like much, but Joelinton and Belfodil have been genuinely quality players this year and Kramaric for a few years now. I mean sure, Nagelsmann is probably one of the coaches who won't think twice about benching a player who can't follow his instructions, but I think this one was mainly about individual quality.
 

Classical Mechanic

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Simply if you play a 3 in midfield those two will always be a tempo middle player of the three. Does seem Foden has a bit more in final third although can remember Wilshere scoring a few in his breakthrough 10/11.
2 goals in his breakthrough. 15 career goals in total. Foden already has 7 in about 12 games if you do it by minutes played.
 

Classical Mechanic

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Pretty weird to bring up Burke, who simply wasn't good enough. I mean two years down the road he's playing for Celtic.

Hoffenheim's names in attack may not look like much, but Joelinton and Belfodil have been genuinely quality players this year and Kramaric for a few years now. I mean sure, Nagelsmann is probably one of the coaches who won't think twice about benching a player who can't follow his instructions, but I think this one was mainly about individual quality.
I followed his season through stat sites and it seemed they were banging them in but also missing barely any games either.
 

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2 goals in his breakthrough. 15 career goals in total. Foden already has 7 in about 12 games if you do it by minutes played.
I think Schalke and Spurs are the only decent sides he scored against. I think the rest were against the likes of Oxford United, Rotherham United and Burton Albion