Even at today’s inflated prices nobody is paying that for Declan Rice.
Most likely why Chelsea backed out, he’s nowhere near good enough to command that fee. Nowhere near.
Urgent need for a defensive midfielder?
- Thread starter Gerald G
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Most likely why Chelsea backed out, he’s nowhere near good enough to command that fee. Nowhere near.
What do you mean by "fraction of the price".?
Brighton are no mugs when it comes.to.selling a player. They wanted 50m for Dunk
Sevilla beat us in midfield. We struggled to get anywhere in the middle.
Can imagine the same was being said about Jota. We choose to miss out on what's under our noses look abroad and get VDB instead, or Fred for 50mil for that matter.
I’d be surprised to see us bring in another CM, we’re well stocked that area. I’d also expect Garner to get some games next season too which would effectively replace Pogba (in terms of numbers).
Jota has shown he’s a class talent though, Ward-Prowse fell off the map and is only climbing back into frame because of his current role at Soton and his spectacular free kicks/set pieces. He’s not top level quality but would cost it.
Agreed. I think we ll make an attempt to sign a CB if we manage to shift out Rojo and Jones
Will Matic even be here next year? Pogba? Mata?
This is all I see staying :
Fred, Mctomminay, VdB, Bruno
I don't think we are that well stocked for things like creativity, passing skills, defensive skills etc as a whole squad.
I think theres room for 1 or 2 players easily.
This is all I see staying :
Fred, Mctomminay, VdB, Bruno
I don't think we are that well stocked for things like creativity, passing skills, defensive skills etc as a whole squad.
I think theres room for 1 or 2 players easily.
Yeah saying that no clubs in the PL are mugs nowadays, still you would think he would be cheaper than the overinflated price for Rice.What do you mean by "fraction of the price".?
Brighton are no mugs when it comes.to.selling a player. They wanted 50m for Dunk
I agree with you on Declan Rice, because the reported price is way too high for him, which doesn't make sense from our POV due to us needing several players and there's the Covid factor too.
Fred might add some terrier like bite to our midfield but some of his decision making and passing can be woeful like at Leicester. He's a good squad player but falls short of the calibre of DM we need if we want to seriously challenge for the title again.
I did watch the match and Lacazette pressing our defenders was just as influencial. Saka pressing from wide too. He was average in his 3 other matches for Arsenal, they also lost all 3
Urgent need for a defender, Defensive Midfielder and Right Wing. Nothing new.
A holding midfielder who can pass through the lines and a fast, athletic CB are essential for moving this team forward, much moreso than players like Haaland, Grealish and Calvert-Lewin.
May have something to do with Arsenal being shit overall and not being able to score goals for love or money. You can't blame a DM for that.
And you cant attribute a team performance against us to 1 player either
There are many games we struggle in midfield, some games we win despite this, but against Sevilla we did not remotely struggle in midfield. Our attack and defence lost us that particular game.
Actually, I cannot understand which type of a DM you'd like to see here. A Carrick or a Matic. Some would like to see a Verratti-style player, too.
Well, in an ideal world we'd have a press resistant metronome, a pure destroyer and a deep-lying playmaker. Ideally, I hoped that Pogba became the latter. I feel that Fred is a nice destroyer there as his energy and passion symphatises.
Still do not understand how Scott sees himself. He is physical and I'd like to see him as a young Matic, but lacks composure, although it comes with experience.
Well, in an ideal world we'd have a press resistant metronome, a pure destroyer and a deep-lying playmaker. Ideally, I hoped that Pogba became the latter. I feel that Fred is a nice destroyer there as his energy and passion symphatises.
Still do not understand how Scott sees himself. He is physical and I'd like to see him as a young Matic, but lacks composure, although it comes with experience.
People complain on here when we play Fred and McT together because it means we are playing two defensive midfielders. Now Matic is our only DM.
There's a big difference. Neither of Fred or McTominay are creative, nor can they control possession against decent sides. While on the flip side, they don't protect the defence well enough.People complain on here when we play Fred and McT together because it means we are playing two defensive midfielders. Now Matic is our only DM.
Having a top DM should offer more protection, help us control possession and enable us to partner him with a more creative midfielder.
They’re a safe bet that together you could argue make up a defensive midfield but individually they are not defensive midfielders. They’re not even holding mids. People want to see a strong DM so we can play say VdB and Bruno together which would be an unreal midfield. Instead, due to the lack of a top real defensive mid we have to play those two to sort of sure it up there and sacrifice a player like Donny or Pogba (/replacement - imagine Grealish). Make sense?People complain on here when we play Fred and McT together because it means we are playing two defensive midfielders. Now Matic is our only DM.
McT is not creative? Did you watch us against Leeds? Last year against PSG? He is not deployed in a creative role because we have Bruno. Thats the difference. Fred is a DM.
No you don't know what you're talking about if you say Fred isn't a DM.
What do you mean? Should players stop playing because someone else on the team moves? It makes no sense. You can't just not do your job based on somebody else trying to do three jobs at once. This is the problem for United at the moment. Certain players like Fred and Bruno covers so much ground other players feel they don't need to move much.
Making late runs into the box doesn't make you creative. Please explain to me how McTominay is creative? Fred is more creative than McTominay
Okay mate. Is Ander Herrera a DM in your eyes too?
Fred wins the ball, he is not a defensive midfielder and could not be relied on to protect the defence and hold position without another midfielder sharing that role.
Compare him to the likes of Casemiro, Fabinho (when he can play there) and Rodri when fit. Worlds apart in their roles. Fred’s all over the pitch, which is fine for what he does, but we need a calmer head there more like the names I mentioned above. Just being a ball winner doesn’t make you a DM.
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No. But they should adjust to their team mates. It would make no sense for Pogba to track the same man as Fred. Pogba could not know that Fred suddenly would change his mind and move inside (and when he did it was to late for Pogba to get back anyway).
I understand people dont like Pogba, but it makes no sense to blame him for anything here.
Hey mate I know your a Napoli fan and not a Lazio fan but can you let me know what type of player Milinkovic Savic is? Hes quite rated in the Serie A isnt he? What his best position? Is pogba really his similar type of player?
How is Pogba adjusting to his team mate? He let his man go because Fred ran past him. I don't like Pogba as a midfielder because he doesn't cover ground and move around properly. This instance is just a basic example of that, I'm not blaming him for the goal. I'm saying the should do better, he should be better and he isn't. Why can't Pogba move to the space Fred left or stay to his man regardless of where Fred runs? It's not inconceivable for Pogba to expect that Fred will move with the ball since pressing is what he does. To just let go of your man because someone else ran past you is not a good look.
Our midfield was pinned back and struggled with progress.
He was not Pogbas man. Why would you want two guys to track Perez into the box? Considering Fred already tracked Perez?
Pogba was tracking Perez up until Shaw made that tackle on him. Pogba is blocked by Shaw (who makes the tackle), and starts watching the ball. Naturally, as Fred is already tracking Perez. He is about to cover Shaw, then realize Fred has left Perez. At this point, he probably should have reacted faster and sprinting towards Perez.
But it is very misleading to say that Perez was Pogbas responsibility. Fred was the one best suited tracking Perez after that tackle made by Shaw. And he did. Until he decided not to. That is very difficult for Pogba to predict.
Glad to see we're reaching a conclusion.
It really isn't unless you are Pogba.
I do not have a bias and able to make an objective assessment of the situation.
Lets not blame Fred for doing something stupid, because Pogba should predict that and cover for him...
As the Molde coach and analytic says, Fred should have stayed central. As a midfielder, you have to be careful not to get dragged out wide.
At £54 mill Fred was a bad buy. He doesnt excel at anything and for that money you would expect something special. When you look at Bruno and Partey for example at lesser fees, you can see we were fleeced. In fact i would go as far to say under Ole we wouldnt have bought him.
You're probably biased and I'm not. Especially considering you're the one who brought this whole conversation up just to concede to my original point after a bunch of back and forth. We've reached a conclusion and I'm the sole winner of it. I'm not having this.
You're probably biased and I'm not. Especially considering you're the one who brought this whole conversation up just to concede to my original point after a bunch of back and forth. We've reached a conclusion and I'm the sole winner of it. I'm not having this.
Are you sure we're talking about the same game!? Sevilla parked the bus against us and we created plenty of chances. Sevilla scored from a couple counters which we defended awfully, both goals from our recurring inability to defend crosses.
Just look at the heat maps. Our midfield were pushed back, theirs was more advanced.
You'll have to link it, as I'm not usually interested in that sort of thing.
My memory was Fred sitting deep as the anchor, so his heat map would show a deep position but that was tactical, and Pogba and the full backs having a license to get forward, so I'd be surprised if a heat map shows otherwise.
I'm open to be shown something that disproves this but I think you're wrong on this one.
A DM is definitely Manchester United's most urgent issue, but it would help United much more in attack and in possession-related play rather than in terms of defensive capability.
1. It would free Fred and Mctominay to do what they do best. The two of them together make one defensive midfielder and they're too shackled in a double pivot most games to apply their box to box strengths. A true DM would allow Solksjaer to free the progressive member of the pivot to bomb forward like McTominay did against Leeds and like Pogba would like to do more of when part of the pivot (which he was free to do when Matic was having a Renaissance). McFred are inefficient in a double pivot and put too much creative responsibility on Bruno, plus they both lack vision in the short pass and sometimes compel Bruno to run himself ragged to get into position to receive the ball.
2. A really good DM is a good progressive passer of the ball who can find fullback on either side and wide forwards further up rather than just passing it around the center. This again frees up the progressive member of the pivot to position higher up the pitch when the team are in possession and gives the team much more flexibility in attack. McTominay only seems to display this passing range sometimes when he has momentum behind him, which he doesn't get to accumulate as a shackled pivot.
3. Manchester United rarely get comprehensively outplayed system-wise when in Solksjaer's favored 4-2-3-1 formation because they have a zonal defense that they've been coached to implement and don't get overrun in midfield with McFred. They do, however, concede a lot of goals through individual error, losing the ball in bad areas and miscommunication. This may be a coaching deficiency or a player one, or a combination of the two, but neither would be solved with the addition of a DM. Hopefully the weaknesses would get exposed less often, which would result in less goals conceded, but a fast CB is ultimately the answer to sort out the majority of the defense's weaknesses. It would allow McGuire to play a higher line which would in turn help the midfield. It would free AWB from having to tuck in where he's lacking and instead shut down wing play and bomb forward for crosses and shots.
Personally I think a DM is the most important acquisition because I don't think anyone at United right now is going to grow into a truly great DM, but there is still a chance Tuanzebe or Mengi might become an actually reliable CB.
1. It would free Fred and Mctominay to do what they do best. The two of them together make one defensive midfielder and they're too shackled in a double pivot most games to apply their box to box strengths. A true DM would allow Solksjaer to free the progressive member of the pivot to bomb forward like McTominay did against Leeds and like Pogba would like to do more of when part of the pivot (which he was free to do when Matic was having a Renaissance). McFred are inefficient in a double pivot and put too much creative responsibility on Bruno, plus they both lack vision in the short pass and sometimes compel Bruno to run himself ragged to get into position to receive the ball.
2. A really good DM is a good progressive passer of the ball who can find fullback on either side and wide forwards further up rather than just passing it around the center. This again frees up the progressive member of the pivot to position higher up the pitch when the team are in possession and gives the team much more flexibility in attack. McTominay only seems to display this passing range sometimes when he has momentum behind him, which he doesn't get to accumulate as a shackled pivot.
3. Manchester United rarely get comprehensively outplayed system-wise when in Solksjaer's favored 4-2-3-1 formation because they have a zonal defense that they've been coached to implement and don't get overrun in midfield with McFred. They do, however, concede a lot of goals through individual error, losing the ball in bad areas and miscommunication. This may be a coaching deficiency or a player one, or a combination of the two, but neither would be solved with the addition of a DM. Hopefully the weaknesses would get exposed less often, which would result in less goals conceded, but a fast CB is ultimately the answer to sort out the majority of the defense's weaknesses. It would allow McGuire to play a higher line which would in turn help the midfield. It would free AWB from having to tuck in where he's lacking and instead shut down wing play and bomb forward for crosses and shots.
Personally I think a DM is the most important acquisition because I don't think anyone at United right now is going to grow into a truly great DM, but there is still a chance Tuanzebe or Mengi might become an actually reliable CB.