What do we still need? Aka The never ending story

[Olecurls99]

1st Team

De Gea
Dalot Varane Martinez Shaw
Sancho Casemiro Eriksen Rashford
Bruno Kane

2nd Team

Heaton
Bissaka Lindelof Young CB Malacia
Antony Sabitzer Fred Garnacho
Amad Martial

That's good enough to challenge on 4 fronts for me

 

[NoPace]

1st Team

De Gea
Dalot Varane Martinez Shaw
Sancho Casemiro Eriksen Rashford
Bruno Kane

2nd Team

Heaton
Bissaka Lindelof Young CB Malacia
Antony Sabitzer Fred Garnacho
Amad Martial

That's good enough to challenge on 4 fronts for me

I think that's still probably a DM short.

Eriksen and Casemiro are in their 30s now, Fred and Sabitzer close, it makes sense to have a 5th guy and him to be someone who can give us some grit and defending in midfield even when Casemiro is out.

So yeah, a summer of continuity after this season has been good and Ten Hag not just replacing 5-6 makes sense. McTominay out, DM in. Weghorst (or Martial if Ten Hag thinks he'll never be healthy) out and the best striker we can get in, Maguire out and another aerially strong RCB in.

Then you look at that squad and you see the obvious 2024 summer changes, another 4 or so:

-Fred or Sabitzer out, first choice #8 in with Eriksen, Sabitzer (or Fred if Sabitzer won't accept this role, and he didn't at Bayern), the new DM as the 4-5-6 guys in
-Wan-Bissaka out, better RB going forward in
-De Gea out, passing keeper in
-Martial/Weghorst out, new backup #9 in or if Garnacho is a star, Rashford is just the new backup #9 as well as starter at LW

So maybe 3 this summer, 1 in January and 3 next summer, which is not insane.

 

[Olecurls99]

I think that's still probably a DM short.

Eriksen and Casemiro are in their 30s now, Fred and Sabitzer close, it makes sense to have a 5th guy and him to be someone who can give us some grit and defending in midfield even when Casemiro is out.

So yeah, a summer of continuity after this season has been good and Ten Hag not just replacing 5-6 makes sense. McTominay out, DM in. Weghorst (or Martial if Ten Hag thinks he'll never be healthy) out and the best striker we can get in, Maguire out and another aerially strong RCB in.

Then you look at that squad and you see the obvious 2024 summer changes, another 4 or so:

-Fred or Sabitzer out, first choice #8 in with Eriksen, Sabitzer (or Fred if Sabitzer won't accept this role, and he didn't at Bayern), the new DM as the 4-5-6 guys in
-Wan-Bissaka out, better RB going forward in
-De Gea out, passing keeper in
-Martial/Weghorst out, new backup #9 in or if Garnacho is a star, Rashford is just the new backup #9 as well as starter at LW

So maybe 3 this summer, 1 in January and 3 next summer, which is not insane.

Yeah someone who can definitely play 6 would be nice. I think Sabitzer can do it but if what you say is right and he isn't willing, then we need somebody in.

I think that squad is capable of winning the league and then it's just a matter of lining up replacements as the years go by.

 

[avgp_1]

Could try and see if we can get Caqueret from OL. Lepenant has shown to be a decent deputy and Cherki's progress could allow them to let him leave for a reasonable fee

 

[croadyman]

For First XI

Commanding distributing GK
Progressive CM
Top ST

For squad depth

CB
CDM
ST

Some of these squad depth signings don't need to cost the earth,we just need to demonstrate that shrewdness in the market

 

[Macedonian Red]

Kane
De Jong
Ter Stegen
Hakimi

 

[Adnan]

For First XI

Commanding distributing GK
Progressive CM
Top ST

For squad depth

CB
CDM
ST

Some of these squad depth signings don't need to cost the earth,we just need to demonstrate that shrewdness in the market

Commanding keeper with the ability to distribute to a good level?

There's been talk of signing a younger keeper and I think that may well be a good way to build going forward. Keeping De Gea on a reduced contract and signing a younger more proactive keeper with the ability to distribute to a good level would be a sensible approach imo.

And without mentioning some of the more talked about names like Maarten Vandervoordt or Diogo Costa. I think we should pay more attention to Shakhtar Donetsk' goalkeeper Anatoliy Trubin who is still 21, but looks to be developing as a well rounded keeper where his distribution, shot stopping and commanding presence has caught the eye. He's 6'6 tall and he's already amassed alot of experience playing against some of the biggest clubs in Europe where his all round ability is very evident. The talk around him is that he will be leaving his current club at the end of the season with many clubs interested. I've name dropped him in the past but he seems to have developed further since then as I explain below.

He played against Rennes yesterday in the Europa league and played well where he helped his club win the tie by saving 3 penalties in a shootout. And he seems to possess all the attributes one would expect from a keeper. And if he develops as I think he might, he's going to be a keeper with good shot-stopping ability, ball playing ability and cross claiming ability due to his physical presence.

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vs Rennes below

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The highlights below display many facets of his keeping but pay close attention to how he baits and resists the press.

 

[SparkedIntoLife]

GK: The noises are that DDG will sign a new deal on a reduced wage. I'm not too unhappy with this. Although he arguably doesn't fit ETH's ideal profile of goalkeeper, he's playing well and is seemingly a good personality. I would sign a young challenger though. Lucas Chevalier of Lille has been really impressive thus far.

RB: The power of good coaching, eh? A year ago, I'd have considered selling both Dalot and Wan-Bissaka but both have been decent. If we get a good offer for AWB (40m plus), then adios but otherwise I'm happy for him to stay. If he does go, I'm sure youngsters like Fresneda, Timber, Frimpong and Vanderson will be considered. But my preference is for no signings here. We need to keep up a quota of English players and there's not many on the market I'd want so AWB isn't an essential departure.

LB: Shaw has been amazing. Malacia is a great squad option. Hopefully Alvaro Fernandez gets a top flight loan (La Liga?) to see what he can do, following a fairly decent spell at Preston. No signings here.

CD: We all know Maguire is off. Jones better be off too I also wonder about Lindelof but suspect he's probably content to stay as a backup and that ETH likes him as a good pro and someone able to fill in at DM. Although Shaw has done admirably at centre back, I'd buy a young left footed CD for more permanent Martinez cover. Valentin Gomez of Velez looks like a taller Lisandro Martinez regen

DM: Casemiro really is our only specialist here so I'd sign a young challenger for him to mentor. I like the little I've seen of Arthur Vermeeren. He's technical, a good size and I can't imagine the fee would be astronomical.

CM: Eriksen has been great, albeit getting on a bit and maybe not robust enough against more physical midfields. Sabitzer is a very impressive player and the rumoured fee to make him permanent is very reasonable. Fred, of course, can be sloppy but is a huge asset in certain games and should be kept around the squad IMHO. McTominay's time is probably up and Hannibal needs another loan, I think. So do we need anyone? Do we really need to pay the reported £130m+ fee for Jude Bellingham? Despite maybe the predominant view, my view is yes. He's a generational talent, in my view. He's already shown he's a leader and will only grow in that respect. Plus, being English does help to some degree and a premium price is inevitable but, in this case, absolutely worth it. I would skip Sabitzer therefore.

AM: Bruno Fernandes is first choice, absolutely. I'd sell Donny if we can and consider Sancho the backup from this and the wing positions. No signings here.

RW: Antony is first choice. I love Amad. Ideally he probably needs a top flight loan but I'd probably try to integrate him in the squad next season and review the situation in January. No signings here.

LW: Rashford and Garnacho is more than fine. Elanga to move on for his career's sake. No signings here.

ST: We definitely need someone but the hard part is who and for what price. I love Victor Osimhen. He'll be way too expensive but needs must and there's very little out there of the right profile. I'd keep Weghorst as third choice.

So signings:
Lucas Chevalier, 30m approx
Valentin Gomez, 15m approx
Arthur Vermeeren, 20m approx
Jude Bellingham, 130m approx
Victor Osimhen, 120m approx
Wout Wegorst, 10m approx
(325M approx - need that takeover money... FFP would probably prevent this, though)

First 11:
De Gea; Dalot, Shaw, Varane, Martinez; Casemiro, Bellingham; Antony, Rashford, Fernandes; Osimhen

Second 11:
Chevalier; Wan-Bissaka, Malacia, Lindelof, Gomez; Vermeeren, Eriksen; Amad, Garnacho, Sancho; Martial

 

[daba]

In terms of GK I like the idea of getting De Gea on significantly lower wages and bringing in a young keeper (like a Trubin from Shaktar as someone posted above) for roughly 15-20m to understudy De Gea for a year or so before taking over permanently.

There are obviously other options such as Diogo Costa or the like of Raya but you’d be looking at double or triple the fee required compared to a Trubin, which given the other gaps in the squad we could do with saving on.

 

[JohnnyLaw]

In terms of GK I like the idea of getting De Gea on significantly lower wages and bringing in a young keeper (like a Trubin from Shaktar as someone posted above) for roughly 15-20m to understudy De Gea for a year or so before taking over permanently.

There are obviously other options such as Diogo Costa or the like of Raya but you’d be looking at double or triple the fee required compared to a Trubin, which given the other gaps in the squad we could do with saving on.

Wasn’t Raya touted as available for exactly that estimation?

 

[Bojan Djordjic]

In terms of GK I like the idea of getting De Gea on significantly lower wages and bringing in a young keeper (like a Trubin from Shaktar as someone posted above) for roughly 15-20m to understudy De Gea for a year or so before taking over permanently.

There are obviously other options such as Diogo Costa or the like of Raya but you’d be looking at double or triple the fee required compared to a Trubin, which given the other gaps in the squad we could do with saving on.

Raya's out of contract soon so shouldn't cost more than your quoted fee for Trubin.

 

[daba]

Wasn’t Raya touted as available for exactly that estimation?

Raya's out of contract soon so shouldn't cost more than your quoted fee for Trubin.

There were ‘rumours’ of him being available for 15-20m yeah, but more recently Thomas Frank came out and said he won’t be sold for anything less than £40m comparing him to Kepa Arrizabalaga’s fee.

The value will most likely hinge on how much Raya himself pushes for a move away and what other clubs are interested. If we extend De Gea’s contract would we be Raya’s first choice with other clubs like Chelsea sniffing around?

For me, I can only see Raya coming in if we decide to bin off De Gea or he doesn’t accept the lower terms and he’s not here next year. If De Gea agrees to his wages going down to 150-200k then going for a Trubin-esque understudy makes a lot of sense.

 

[jesperjaap]

Think the first eleven is only a cm and striker short of competing, but I still feel the squad is short in certain areas and that there is also still a large number of players to move on. For me:


Spend new owners money, unrealistic never happening football manager like window, but the dream for me is:

Out
Henderson
Heaton
Lindelof
Bailly
Jones
Tuanzabe
Maguire
Dalot
Telles
Williams
Amad
VDB
McTominay
Martial
Elanga

£290m

In
Vicario £20m
Lukeba £50m
Bella Kotchap £40m
Vanderson £40m
Bellingham £110m
Omishen £90m
Vitor Roque £40m

£380m

£90m net spend

DeGea/Vicario
Vanderson/Bissaka
Varane/Bella Kotchap
Martinez/Lukeba
Shaw/Malacia
Bellingham/Fred
Casemeiro/Mainoo
Fernandes/Eriksen
Rashford/Garnacho
Antony/Sancho
Omishen/Roque

Mengi/Hannibal/Pellestri


Realistic window

Out
Henderson
Bailly
Jones
Maguire
Tuanzabe
Telles
Williams
VDB
McTominay
Pellestri
Bissaka

£150m

In
Diogo Costa £40m
Timber £60m
Caqueret £40m
Omishen £90m

£230m

£80m Net Spend

Diogo Costa/DeGea
Timber/Dalot
Varane/Lindelof
Martinez/Shaw
Malacia/Fernadez
Casemeiro/Fred
Caqueret/Eriksen
Fernandes/Hannibal
Rashford/Garnacho
Antony/Sancho
Omishen/Martial

Mengi/Mainoo/Amad

 

[ManRed]

Its equally important to sell well and buy new players.

BUY
ST
CM (Sabitzer maybe, though I would prefer a more creative player)
Backup DM
Backup LCB
Backup CAM

SELL
Van de beek
Scott
Harry

Split on De Gea as either way I am fine

 

[Nou_Camp99]

I don't think we can spend much this summer even if we end up in the hands of the filthy rich. We still owe fortunes in past transfer payments and we are getting dangerously close to breaking FFP I read the other day.

I think we are going to have a lot of confused and angry fans when the realise this. It's not going to be a blockbuster summer.

 

[Olecurls99]

I don't think we can spend much this summer even if we end up in the hands of the filthy rich. We still owe fortunes in past transfer payments and we are getting dangerously close to breaking FFP I read the other day.

I think we are going to have a lot of confused and angry fans when the realise this. It's not going to be a blockbuster summer.

Yeah, we don't need much anyway and we've loads to ship.

 

[croadyman]

Its equally important to sell well and buy new players.

BUY
ST
CM (Sabitzer maybe, though I would prefer a more creative player)
Backup DM
Backup LCB
Backup CAM

SELL
Van de beek
Scott
Harry

Split on De Gea as either way I am fine

Do we not need backup ST as well when Weghorst leaves and Martial can't stay fit

 

[Steve 007]

Those saying we need a spare centre back for squad depth are forgetting the mighty Phil Jones is only a few years away from returning.

 

[Scholsey2004]

I think we're getting pretty good now. The obvious limitation we have is we dont dominate possession in games especially well. I'm sure Ten Hag will be looking at that. A really technical midfielder and right back would probably move us in that direction.

 

[croadyman]

I think we're getting pretty good now. The obvious limitation we have is we dont dominate possession in games especially well. I'm sure Ten Hag will be looking at that. A really technical midfielder and right back would probably move us in that direction.

Mac Allister and Frimpong maybe

 

[Scholsey2004]

Mac Allister and Frimpong maybe

Frimpong is a terrific dribbler but i dont think he's much of a possession guy. Ideal scenario would be someone similar to Cancelo. Thats a big ask though, obviously. Mac Allister i'd happily see here. Getting him might not be cheap or easy though now hes in the Prem.

 

[RiqCantona]

ST - Osimhen (120m)
CM - Bellingham (100m)
Backup GK - 25m

That's close to 250m in total.

Sell fringe players and those surplus to requirements.
Henderson
Maguire
Telles
Bailly
McT
Either Pellistri or Elanga
Recover about a 100m from sales.

Spend 150m net.

 

[Idxomer]

Players who can look after the ball.

 

[Mr Smith]

I don't think we can spend much this summer even if we end up in the hands of the filthy rich. We still owe fortunes in past transfer payments and we are getting dangerously close to breaking FFP I read the other day.

I think we are going to have a lot of confused and angry fans when the realise this. It's not going to be a blockbuster summer.

Yep, people need to wake up. It's a good thing we're getting good on the pitch, because off the pitch we've got a few years of paying for mismanagement in the transfer market.

But really, we should only need 2-3 players. Sign a striker of decent quality and a young-ish, ball-playing CM and we're title challengers.

 

[meamth]

I don't think we can spend much this summer even if we end up in the hands of the filthy rich. We still owe fortunes in past transfer payments and we are getting dangerously close to breaking FFP I read the other day.

I think we are going to have a lot of confused and angry fans when the realise this. It's not going to be a blockbuster summer.

That's why we need Qatari owners. They will settle every debt.

Kane for 80-100 million
FDJ/Bellingham for 80 million
Jurien Timber for 50 million
Weghorst for 15 million
Kvicha Kvarastkhelia 80 million

Might be too bold for me, but let's sign Kvicha, move Sancho to the middle.

FW: Kane - Martial - Weghorst
LW: Rashford - Kvicha - Garnacho
RW: Antony - Garnacho - Pellistri
AM: Bruno - Sancho
CM: Casemiro - FDJ/Bellingham - Fred - Mctominay
LB: Shaw - Malacia
RB: Dalot - AWB
CB: Licha - Varane - Timber - Lindelof
GK: De Gea - Heaton

Out: figure out yourself.

With signing of Kane and FDJ/Bellingham we're automatically should win the title given that Kane will obviously mixed in really well with Casemiro, Varane core of leaders.
I would avoid Osimhen and see whether he will be performing in PL or not.

 

[Nou_Camp99]

That's why we need Qatari owners. They will settle every debt.

Kane for 80-100 million
FDJ/Bellingham for 80 million
Jurien Timber for 50 million
Weghorst for 15 million
Kvicha Kvarastkhelia 80 million

Might be too bold for me, but let's sign Kvicha, move Sancho to the middle.

FW: Kane - Martial - Weghorst
LW: Rashford - Kvicha - Garnacho
RW: Antony - Garnacho - Pellistri
AM: Bruno - Sancho
CM: Casemiro - FDJ/Bellingham - Fred - Mctominay
LB: Shaw - Malacia
RB: Dalot - AWB
CB: Licha - Varane - Timber - Lindelof
GK: De Gea - Heaton

Out: figure out yourself.

With signing of Kane and FDJ/Bellingham we're automatically should win the title given that Kane will obviously mixed in really well with Casemiro, Varane core of leaders.
I would avoid Osimhen and see whether he will be performing in PL or not.

That's not how it works mate. Hahahaha.

If we got bought by Qatar and the debt was cleared tomorrow we'd still have to comply with FFP. We won't be able to spend all the money all at once. I'm not sure you know how it works pal.

 

[meamth]

That's not how it works mate. Hahahaha.

If we got bought by Qatar and the debt was cleared tomorrow we'd still have to comply with FFP. We won't be able to spend all the money all at once. I'm not sure you know how it works pal.

Then how did Chelsea do it? hmmmmm enlighten me please. Genuinely curious.

 

[Nou_Camp99]

Then how did Chelsea do it? hmmmmm enlighten me please. Genuinely curious.

They have spread all the payments over 8 yr contracts. The PL have already announced that avenue is closed this summer and the transfer payments can only be amortized over 5 years.

I suggest you do some research mate.

 

[meamth]

They have spread all the payments over 8 yr contracts. The PL have already announced that avenue is closed this summer and the transfer payments can only be amortized over 5 years.

I suggest you do some research mate.

That's why we're in a forum, so I can get answers like this. No harm asking.

Also, finance is such a boring topic for me to read...

 

[Nou_Camp99]

That's why we're in a forum, so I can get answers like this. No harm asking.

Also, finance is such a boring topic for me to read...

No worries.

You're not totally wrong anyway. There will be money to spend as always but I think for maybe 1 star player and a few younger players.

I dont think many fans realise just how dire the current situation is. The club has been ran so so badly and the financial situation isn't good at all. Even under new owners it's going to take a few years to sort it. Winning trophies and getting CL football will definitely help us though.

 

[meamth]

No worries.

You're not totally wrong anyway. There will be money to spend as always but I think for maybe 1 star player and a few younger players.

I dont think many fans realise just how dire the current situation is. The club has been ran so so badly and the financial situation isn't good at all. Even under new owners it's going to take a few years to sort it. Winning trophies and getting CL football will definitely help us though.

But can a club with bottomless money breach FFP and sign whatever players they want and face the music later?

 

[Cathy Ferguson]

Not convinced that Sancho or Antony are good enough to be starters for us. ETH prefers Weghorst to start ahead of Sancho which is all proof that you need.
Antony did not dominate Dan Burn yesterday. But Antony will be given another year of course to prove his worth.
A striker and a CM strong in possession (which McFred are not) should be focus this summer.

 

[Nou_Camp99]

But can a club with bottomless money breach FFP and sign whatever players they want and face the music later?

Possibly but don't think that's going to happen. Qatar (if it's them) have already said that's not their plan as well. Their statement talked about growing organically and focusing on youth.

Chelsea have also shown signing 12/13 new players is just silly. It's almost impossible to bed them all in at the same time.

Trust Erik and let's build steadily. We will get there.

 

[AneRu]

Not convinced that Sancho or Antony are good enough to be starters for us. ETH prefers Weghorst to start ahead of Sancho which is all proof that you need.
Antony did not dominate Dan Burn yesterday. But Antony will be given another year of course to prove his worth.
A striker and a CM strong in possession (which McFred are not) should be focus this summer.

I was a firm believer in Sancho but I am starting to doubt whether he will ever be a key player for us. On Antony I think we and him don't understand his game as yet, he is not a break away player but he has the skillset to become a secondary playmaker and off the ball workhorse like Beckham so he should focus on developing his creative passing to take advantage of his ball retention skills.

Sancho, we should just sell and use the funds to supplement the purchase of a much needed striker and midfielder. He is still young enough and his reputation hasn't been damaged that much so he can easily attract the attention of a Newcastle, Villa or Spurs for £50m. Garnacho and Amad can spend the next two campaigns as our second choices and then see what happens from there.

Sancho doesn't have the intensity required for this league and his link up play isn't all that. I was invested a lot in the signing but I don't think its ever going to work.

 

[Erik the Red]

No worries.

You're not totally wrong anyway. There will be money to spend as always but I think for maybe 1 star player and a few younger players.

I dont think many fans realise just how dire the current situation is. The club has been ran so so badly and the financial situation isn't good at all. Even under new owners it's going to take a few years to sort it. Winning trophies and getting CL football will definitely help us though.

Not all bad. Every club will be subject to the same rules, and we have bigger revenues than most, so all clubs will be constrained, and I think the selling clubs may get a nasty shock that silly transfer fees may not be quite so silly this summer. With all the players we should be offloading, I think there will be space for two big signings (CM and CF), whilst backup options will need to be cheap (e.g. Malacia) / free (e.g. Eriksen). I also trust ETH to use the available budget wisely.

 

[Rolaholic]

From the great man himself

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[giggslover]

I'd take a shot at Neymar, I really would...I love how Villa use Coutinho, not always starting but managing his time, I think he still has some flashes of real quality, though he looks like he'd need a few weeks dropping about 10 lbs prior to season....finally is there any way we can pry Ivan Toney from Brentford?

 

[onemanarmy]

I'd take a shot at Neymar, I really would...I love how Villa use Coutinho, not always starting but managing his time, I think he still has some flashes of real quality, though he looks like he'd need a few weeks dropping about 10 lbs prior to season....finally is there any way we can pry Ivan Toney from Brentford?

You can't possibly be serious about Neymar and Coutinho.

 

[bosnian_red]

From the great man himself

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Yep, get Osimhen in and this side competes for the title. Not favourites, but we'll be in with a shout

 

[MikeUpNorth]

Needs:
- Striker
- Midfield depth (Sabitzer)
- Goalkeeper, if De Gea leaves

Wants:
- CB depth, if Maguire leaves
- Upgraded RB maybe?

I’m basically quite satisfied with the squad other than that. I would look to get rid of Maguire, Beek and Elanga in the summer. And would let Sancho and Martial leave, if we get a decent offer.

I’d personally keep McTominay around as I think he’s very reasonable as squad depth.