What do we still need? Aka The never ending story

MadDogg

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P1. Build a team around Garnacho and he's best on the left so I'd sell Rashford.
I'm actually not sure if he is. This season at least he's definitely been better on the right. I think a lot of people forget that Garnacho started the season playing quite poorly, and it wasn't until he got moved to the right that he really got into form.

It's a fairly small sample size so I'm not saying he's definitely better on the right, but I also don't think we can say he's definitely better on the left. The hope is that he's equally good on both sides, but really only time will tell.
 

Insanity

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Not really. The year Manchester United signed Bryan Robson (for example), the club also signed the likes of Frank Stapleton, Paul McGrath, Remi Moses. The year Manchester United signed Gary Pallister (another example), the club also signed the likes of Paul Ince, Mike Phelan, Neil Webb. It's far from some sort of zero-sum game where you foolhardily exhaust all resources on a certain individual, and it's perfectly possible for the club to maximize its budget, and procure a Galáctico (or a Galáctico-in-the-making) who is likely to make a genuine difference, on top a few players who won't cost as much — as long as we offload certain players to improve the balance sheets (and overall financial health of the instutition), and employ clever accounting tricks. Orthodox measures like austerity are oftentimes counterproductive in the sporting realm (much like in the “real world”), and might needlessly throttle the possibly rampant evolution of the project.

For example, Florian Wirtz might cost £90 million or thereabouts, but his wages will be much lower than Bruno Fernandes' (which are in the £13 million per year range), and the latter could be sold for a decent amount of money too — all things considered it's unlikely to be a prohibitively expensive acquisition, and the player is only going to turn 21 in a few months (so he would represent a better investment than someone who seems to be visibly declining and unlikely to be a centerpiece of medium-term projections). Press-resistant, a good ball carrier as well as a good passer, seems sharp from a tactical perspective, one of the organizational reference points of his team already, 10 goals (no penalties) and 17 assists for Bayer Leverkusen this term, 3 x Bundesliga Player of the Month over the course of the ongoing campaign, and would go nicely with the exciting trio of Højlund, Mainoo and Garnacho.

I don't know about the situation or the finances that far back, or have looked at the windows before or after that one big transfer window at the time; however, in our current situation where we have been blowing cash on duds or crocks for more than a decade some sort of financial prudence is warranted to get the house back in order. I am not averse to a big singing or making a splash, if e.g. a big player like Rashford or Bruno leaves for a huge sum and we get a windfall to make a huge signing. Although, in our current situation where our budget is stretched and we need to reinforce quite a few positions on the field I believe it would be better to go the route of finding hidden gems or players on the cusp rather than spending a huge amount on a single player.

I also agree with your assertion that we won't go very far if austerity is our only measure moving forward. To take the team to a level where we are genuine contenders for the big two trophies we would need to take risks and spend huge sums of money on one or two special/marquee players who elevate the team to the next level. However, I feel we may be a season or two away from that stage at the moment. Whether we like or not, our current situation warrants a bit of prudence while we try to empty the menagerie of duds we have accumulated and reinforce those positions with players who can form the basis of our long term future success.
 
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Roboc7

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We need 3 midfielders, 3 centre backs, a left back and a striker. That’s not solving everything but it’s a start. Clearly that won’t happen in one window but we have to be looking at minimum of 5-6 first team signings.
 

daba

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We need 3 midfielders, 3 centre backs, a left back and a striker. That’s not solving everything but it’s a start. Clearly that won’t happen in one window but we have to be looking at minimum of 5-6 first team signings.
This summer should be a minimum of:

2 x CBs (Todibo + Adarabioyo?)
1 x LB (Dorgu?)
2 x CMs (Thuram + Hjulmand/Onana?)
1 x ST (Zirkzee?)

If we’re able to shift Antony and AWB on then you can throw another winger and RB in there too.
 

jamesjimmybyrondean

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LCB - Branthwaite/Lucimi

RCB - Todibo/Diomande (wouldn’t mind Tosin on a free if we keep Varane)

DM - Onana

LB - Miguel Guitierrez

ST - Sesko/Zirkzee

These five positions imo are an absolute must this window. We would still be needing a CM and RW but I can’t see us making more than 5 major signings this window
 
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eire-red

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Rangnick said we needed open-heart surgery, but the anecdote he should have used is spinal surgery.

The spine of this team needs a major overhaul. Even if we only bring in 3/4 players, they need to be CB's and CM's.

Wirtz, Joao Neves.. these are the profile of players we need to be looking at and moving heaven and earth to sign. Tonight's game showed just how lacking we are in composure and technical ability in midfield. If we don't fix this, we're never going to be a serious team.

FFP rules are changing to a revenue-based rule in the summer. I know the tone from Ineos and SJR has been about practicality and 'not signing Mbappe', but I hope that is to some element subterfuge and that can't mean we aren't still looking to sign the best young talents in the game. It's like starting a project in work and management give you no resources? I refuse to believe that we're not going to have aggressive financial backing in the summer, and if we're not, then what was the point in the ownership change?
 

spe88

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It frightens me how many players we need AGAIN this summer with the assumption the following players are leaving:

Maguire (Contract ending 2025)
Lindelof (Contract ending 2025)
Evans
Varane (Contract ending 2025)
Casemiro
Eriksen (Contract ending 2025)
McTominay (Contract ending 2025)
Amrabat (Returning to Fiorentina)
Rashford
Sancho
Martial (Contract expires)

That means 10-11 players :houllier:
3-4x CB
3x CDM
1x CM
1x RW
1x LW
1x CF
 

daba

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Rangnick said we needed open-heart surgery, but the anecdote he should have used is spinal surgery.

The spine of this team needs a major overhaul. Even if we only bring in 3/4 players, they need to be CB's and CM's.

Wirtz, Joao Neves.. these are the profile of players we need to be looking at and moving heaven and earth to sign. Tonight's game showed just how lacking we are in composure and technical ability in midfield. If we don't fix this, we're never going to be a serious team.

FFP rules are changing to a revenue-based rule in the summer. I know the tone from Ineos and SJR has been about practicality and 'not signing Mbappe', but I hope that is to some element subterfuge and that can't mean we aren't still looking to sign the best young talents in the game. It's like starting a project in work and management give you no resources? I refuse to believe that we're not going to have aggressive financial backing in the summer, and if we're not, then what was the point in the ownership change?
I was firmly in the Joao Neves camp but after watching more of Wirtz, my word what a player he is.

We really have to hope he stays at Leverkusen another year, we have a great season next year and Guardiola leaves City to stand any sort of chance though.
 

LeeroyBrown22

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Unfortunately, I believe we need 7 players this summer.
2 centre backs,2 centre midfielders,1 left back, 1 right winger and another striker. Unbelievable!
 

ThierryHenry14

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Nico Williams has a release clause £43m. Probably a better option than Olise on the wing.
 

aeh1991

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After watching the last 3 games, it reminded me once again what is truly needed: a complete squad revamp.

Following players need /expected to get sold:
- Bayindir
- Wan Bisaka
- Maguire
- Lindelof
- Varane
- Casemiro
- Eriksen
- Amrabat (so glad it was just a loan)
- McTominay
- Van de Beek
- Antony
- Martial

Players I expect to leave, but have a slight chance to stay:
- Sancho
- Greenwood

Players we should sell when a good offer comes in, but I highly doubt the board would do:
- Onana
- Bruno
- Rashford

While it would be a hard cut, we should take the momentum of the new ownership and do that. Sign some free signings to fill the holes temporarily and make clever signings (players with 1 year left on their contracts, low release clauses, Nice players, buy back players, don't pay over 50m on one player). That should be the goal for the next two years.

Examples:
- GK: Kovar (buyback)
- RB: Frimpong (35m release clause)
- LB: Miguel Gutierrez (35m release clause) or Melvin Bard (15m, Nice)
- RCB: Todibo (30m, Nice) or Yoro (35m, 1y left)
- LCB: Olivier Boscagli (20m, 1y left)
- additional CB: Adarabioyo (free) or Anselmino (10m)
- DM: Guido Rodriguez (free)
- DM: Martin Zubimendi (50m release clause) or Danilo (30m, if relegated)
- CM: Barkley (free)
- CM: Kephren Thuram (30m, Nice) or Youssouf Fofana (25m, 1y left) or Frank Anguissa (25m, 1y left)
- LW: Nico Williams (43m release clause)
- CF: Moffi (30m, Nice) or Jonathan David (25m, 1y left)

Integrate:
- Harry Amass
- Kambwala
- Fletcher
- Gore or Hannibal
- Amad
- Lacey
 
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golden_blunder

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After watching the last 3 games, it reminded me once again what is truly needed: a complete squad revamp.

Following players need /expected to get sold:
- Bayindir
- Wan Bisaka
- Maguire
- Lindelof
- Varane
- Casemiro
- Eriksen
- Amrabat (so glad it was just a loan)
- McTominay
- Van de Beek
- Antony
- Martial

Players I expect to leave, but have a slight chance to stay:
- Sancho
- Greenwood

Players we should sell when a good offer comes in, but I highly doubt the board would do:
- Onana
- Bruno
- Rashford

While it would be a hard cut, we should take the momentum of the new ownership and do that. Sign some free signings to fill the holes temporarily and make clever signings (players with 1 year left on their contracts, low release clauses, Nice players, buy back players, don't pay over 50m on one player). That should be the goal for the next two years.

Examples:
- GK: Kovar (buyback)
- RB: Frimpong (35m release clause)
- LB: Miguel Gutierrez (35m release clause) or Melvin Bard (15m, Nice)
- CB: Todibo (30m, Nice)
- CB: Adarabioyo (free) or Anselmino (10m)
- DM: Guido Rodriguez (free)
- DM: Martin Zubimendi (50m release clause) or Danilo (30m, if relegated)
- CM: Barkley (free)
- CM: Thuram (30m, Nice)
- LW: Nico Williams (43m release clause)
- CF: Moffi (30m, Nice) or Jonathan David (25m, 1y left)

Integrate:
- Harry Amass
- Kambwala
- Fletcher
- Gore or Hannibal
- Amad
- Lacey
That’s a whole new squad, ain’t happening in one summer. That’s a 3 year rebuild right there
 

golden_blunder

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I wrote within 2 years. But the more happen next summer window, the better.
I understand everyone’s in a rush, but look at Chelsea and Forest to examples of what happens when you try to gut the squad and integrate too many players at one time
 

aeh1991

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I understand everyone’s in a rush, but look at Chelsea and Forest to examples of what happens when you try to gut the squad and integrate too many players at one time
I am aware. But most of the players I listed we gotta sell anyway. Unlike Chelsea I'd keep some experienced players (Bruno, Mount, Shaw, Dalot, Maguire if needed, Evans for one more year) and buy lots of mid-twenties instead of young players only.
 

nmm85

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I don't get why people are so keen to sell Maguire, especially when we need so many new CB's already. We need to get rid of the constantly injured ones first. This season has shown how useful he is as a squad player. He performs well above average pretty constantly and is available most of the time.
 

Wing Attack Plan R

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I don't get why people are so keen to sell Maguire, especially when we need so many new CB's already. We need to get rid of the constantly injured ones first. This season has shown how useful he is as a squad player. He performs well above average pretty constantly and is available most of the time.
Don’t think he will accept being a squad player. He has some resale value and is currently 4th or 5th choice for the role: he should be sold.
 

Freak

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Hopefully our summer will be something like this:

Sell/Release:
- Varane
- Evans
- Lindelof
- Casemiro
- Eriksen
- Sancho
- VDB
- Greenwood
- Martial


Sign:
- RCB (Tosin for free?)
- LB
- DM
- 2 CM
- RW
- ST

which leaves our squad for next season:

GKs as is

Fullbacks: Dalot, AWB, Malacia, New LB

Centre Backs: Maguire, Lisandro, Tosin, Kambwala, Shaw

Midfielders: New DM, 2 New CMs, Mainoo, Bruno, Mount, McT

Wide Forwards: Garnacho, Rashford, Amad, New RW, Antony (?)

Strikers: Hoijlund, New Striker
 

AngeloHenriquez

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Hopefully our summer will be something like this:

Sell/Release:
- Varane
- Evans
- Lindelof
- Casemiro
- Eriksen
- Sancho
- VDB
- Greenwood
- Martial


Sign:
- RCB (Tosin for free?)
- LB
- DM
- 2 CM
- RW
- ST

which leaves our squad for next season:

GKs as is

Fullbacks: Dalot, AWB, Malacia, New LB

Centre Backs: Maguire, Lisandro, Tosin, Kambwala, Shaw

Midfielders: New DM, 2 New CMs, Mainoo, Bruno, Mount, McT

Wide Forwards: Garnacho, Rashford, Amad, New RW, Antony (?)

Strikers: Hoijlund, New Striker
This is excessive for midfield, Bruno plays every game and you are suggesting 6 players for the other 2 positions? Also no suggestion that Malacia will even return and the fact we can utilise Mount on the wing suggests we probably don't need another winger.
 

The-Mezzala

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I don't get why people are so keen to sell Maguire, especially when we need so many new CB's already. We need to get rid of the constantly injured ones first. This season has shown how useful he is as a squad player. He performs well above average pretty constantly and is available most of the time.

Probably the only Centre Back we can get some money for. He isn’t good enough to start for a champions league team. Him and Lindelof should of gone last year.
 

daba

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Hopefully our summer will be something like this:

Sell/Release:
- Varane
- Evans
- Lindelof
- Casemiro
- Eriksen
- Sancho
- VDB
- Greenwood
- Martial


Sign:
- RCB (Tosin for free?)
- LB
- DM
- 2 CM
- RW
- ST

which leaves our squad for next season:

GKs as is

Fullbacks: Dalot, AWB, Malacia, New LB

Centre Backs: Maguire, Lisandro, Tosin, Kambwala, Shaw

Midfielders: New DM, 2 New CMs, Mainoo, Bruno, Mount, McT

Wide Forwards: Garnacho, Rashford, Amad, New RW, Antony (?)

Strikers: Hoijlund, New Striker
Not a chance Tosin is our only CB signing. He will be a supplement signing to another like Todibo, Scalvini, Silva etc.
 

The Irish Connection

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Winger to replace Rashfords potential is as important as any position for me. Look at any top team, their front 3 are always effective. We have potential in Garnacho and Hojlund and a failing Rashford.
 

SirBillNic

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Winger to replace Rashfords potential is as important as any position for me. Look at any top team, their front 3 are always effective. We have potential in Garnacho and Hojlund and a failing Rashford.
Aside from a #6 and CB, I think that's probably the most important position you need to upgrade with the way Ten Hag seems to want to play. I'd go for Olise on the right and Garnacho left.
 

The Irish Connection

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Aside from a #6 and CB, I think that's probably the most important position you need to upgrade with the way Ten Hag seems to want to play. I'd go for Olise on the right and Garnacho left.
Agree. I don’t understand people thinking we’re fine on the wings.
I like Olise, and the rumoured price sounds ok (60m). The only thing with him though is he can only play on the right, whereas maybe a winger who can do both might be better.
Ill be watching him for Palace over the next few weeks anyway.
 

The-Mezzala

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Ins one of

RCB Guehi, Todibo, Diomonde, Antonio Silva

LCB Branthwaite , Lukeba, Hincapie, Inacio

CDM/CM Onanna , Varela, Joao Gomes, Thuram,

Striker Jonathan David or Ivan Toney now valued between 30/40 million.

Winger Olise, Bardghji , Bakayoko,


Outs
The usual names
 

daba

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Only played 12 games this year which at £60m is a red flag. If he had cleaner year with injuries he would be close to a no-brainer.

Given the injury issues this year I hope we stay clear and trust in Amad who I believe is a similar type of wide player with just as much potential. The lad just needs games.
 

croadyman

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Unfortunately, I believe we need 7 players this summer.
2 centre backs,2 centre midfielders,1 left back, 1 right winger and another striker. Unbelievable!
That's exactly what we need but no chance whatsoever we sign 7 in one summer
 

bosnian_red

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I'd be happy enough with this this summer:

In:
  • Tosin Adarabioyo - 0m​
  • Todibo - 40m​
  • Onana - 45m​
  • Toney - 40m​
  • Miguel Guttierez - 30m? (Assuming Madrid don't just grab him back)​
Out:
  • Varane
  • Maguire
  • Lindelof
  • Casemiro
  • Eriksen
  • Van de Beek
  • Amrabat
  • Martial
  • Sancho
  • Greenwood
Squad would be:
GK - Onana, Altay, Heaton/a youth GK
RB - Dalot, Wan Bissaka
CB - Todibo, Martinez, Tosin, Kambwala, Evans, *Shaw
LB - Guttierez, Shaw, Malacia
Midfield - Bruno, Onana, Mainoo, Mount, McTominay, Hannibal
RW - Garnacho, Antony, Amad
LW - Rashford, *Garnacho, Forsun
CF - Toney, Hojlund

Nothing amazing, but I think it's a nicely balanced squad with a much improved age, fitness, durability & physicality profile and players who suit each other, and drastically lowering our wages. More than enough to develop as a team, to be coached well, to be a comfortable top 4 side and a stepping stone to then push on a make the more key adjustments after.

LCB leaning on one of Martinez or Shaw being fit, but we can't escape that for now (Branthwaite would be great but isn't realistic for us). I'd love Nico Williams, but don't think it's realistic.

Build around Garnacho and Mainoo, Hojlund can rotate and compete with Toney and learn off each other, hopefully Rashford can pull his head out of his ass in a more settled team next year. Bigger role for Kambwala, but definitely would still get Tosin on a free and they can be a partnership as the backup pairing, however it works out.

Step after that would be phasing out Shaw for Amass, replacing Antony with a better winger to join that rotation with Garnacho and Rashford (Olise/Williams), fixing our midfield depth, and then seeing if something has to happen with Martinez or if we can bring Branthwaite in.
 

didz

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We need a left back probably as first priority, given that we've just had a season where we haven't had one at all in over half our matches. That has been incredibly damaging, and will be again next term given injury records.

Hojlund has had 5 separate injuries already this season, is 21, and is the only centre forward at the club. That's gonna have to be fixed next or it's asking for trouble.

I know it would be great to have better central defenders and better central midfielders - and hopefully we get one or two of those as well - but that's not where the actual holes are, and those need plugging first. This is a window where we'll have a lot of transition upstairs, so I'm not really expecting us to go out and sign a new team. Trying to help the one we have would be a decent start for INEOS.
 

Irwin99

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Blame the club structure under the Glazers because the squad is still a hell of a mess. Impossible to solve in one summer without making do for another year with some of these players.
 

croadyman

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We need a left back probably as first priority, given that we've just had a season where we haven't had one at all in over half our matches. That has been incredibly damaging, and will be again next term given injury records.

Hojlund has had 5 separate injuries already this season, is 21, and is the only centre forward at the club. That's gonna have to be fixed next or it's asking for trouble.

I know it would be great to have better central defenders and better central midfielders - and hopefully we get one or two of those as well - but that's not where the actual holes are, and those need plugging first. This is a window where we'll have a lot of transition upstairs, so I'm not really expecting us to go out and sign a new team. Trying to help the one we have would be a decent start for INEOS.
Do you think we should be looking at a young up and coming LB or someone with a bit more experience behind them looking to step up. Would love a move for Toney in terms of strikers but like I said before don't see him leaving London. Olise and Neto are talented wingers but don't seem to have injury issues. There are so many names on the table for CB and CM all of which can probably improve us.
 

didz

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Do you think we should be looking at a young up and coming LB or someone with a bit more experience behind them looking to step up. Would love a move for Toney in terms of strikers but like I said before don't see him leaving London. Olise and Neto are talented wingers but don't seem to have injury issues. There are so many names on the table for CB and CM all of which can probably improve us.
Given not only the season we've had but also the decade of increasingly shoddy luck with injuries, I think we need to be looking at players who have had a couple of 30+ game seasons behind them and aren't fast approaching their thirties. I'd be looking at players who have proven that they're usually available and who have a very small chance of failing off a cliff any time soon in that regard.

So yeah the likes of Neto and Olise wouldn't be my choice as much as I enjoy watching them. I'd go for Nico Williams before either of those two for a winger.

For a left back, the two Milan clubs have players I really like in Dimarco and Hernandez. Both have had some injury issues, but they've still clocked plenty of minutes the past couple of terms. They're basically pie in the sky, however I'd be hoping for a similar type of player. There's probably someone decent knocking about in Ligue 1 - there usually is - but I've not kept up with it much this season. I'd probably try and avoid the likes of Gutierrez and Grimaldo, who have basically just been on it for a year and would have inflated prices due to being on a short, possibly unsustainable high.
 

Todd

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We have to hope and pray that Shaw and Martinez are fit and ready to begin the new season, and operate under the assumption that they're going to be reliable, because we just can't afford to have to replace two more starters on top of having to replace all the other guys we need to replace.

-----------------------------------X-----------------------------------
------------------------------Hojlund------------------------------
Garnacho-------------------------------------------------------X
------X---------------------------------------------------------Amad
-----------------------------------X-------------------------------------
-------------------------------Mount---------------------------------
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------X-----------------------Mainoo------------------
--------------------X----------------------------X-----------------------
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Shaw-----------------------------------------------------------Dalot
---X----------------------------------------------------------------AWB
----------------------Martinez----------X----------------------------
----------------------------X-------------Maguire--------------------
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------Onana-----------------------------------
-------------------------------------X--------------------------------------

We need 5 new starters, and 5 new backups.

We obviously let Martial go away, send Amrabat back to wherever he came from, and sell (or release) Rashford, Antony, Sancho, the rapist, Bruno, Eriksen, Casemiro, McTominay, Donny, Malacia, Lindelof, Varane, and Evans. The remaining kids, whom I can't keep track of, we either keep as reserves or loan out, I don't care.

And, obviously, a new manager.
 

bosnian_red

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Saw links to Dewsbury Hall. I like the thought, just unsure at the fee that would likely be asked. But he'd be a very good signing to compete with Mainoo to join the group.

Bruno, Mount, Mainoo, Dewsbury Hall, and then a new starting DM like Onana would be a nicely balanced group.

Miguel Guttierez at LB heard very good things. Could take pressure off Shaw, who would still start when fit and while Guttierez adapts, but also be able to rotate Martinez at LCB.

Todibo is the obvious choice to start at RCB and Tosin as CB depth to give a group of Todibo, Tosin, Martinez, Kambwala, Shaw as a CB group.

Toney the obvious CF choice, especially with just 1 year left on his contract. Starts over Hojlund, Hojlund competes and rotates, can develop under similar style CF, and the right age difference where they can transition naturally from one to the other

None of Toney, Todibo, Tosin, Onana, Dewsbury Hall, Martinez would be overly expensive. Probably 40m for Toney, Todibo and Onana, 30m or so for KDH and Martinez, and Tosin is a free signing. Should be realistic. At most you're looking at 200m for the group of 6 players. But that's a pretty good transfer wish list I'd say for me this summer.