What team was better: Manchester United 2008 or Liverpool 2019?

matbezlima

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What team was better: Manchester United 2008 or Liverpool 2019?
 

mariachi-19

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Considering that their defence is not even remotely close to the 08 side and their best defender is worse than the two defenders in the 08 side, CL PL double side for sure.

Seriously, looking at the feck ups VVD has made this year, anybody who thinks that the calibre of defending is anywhere close to mid to late 2000's is kidding themselves. Even fecking Johnny Evans looks like a decent center back in the current day.

The only way they win is if they find a way to stop Scholes with the press... but then they they'd be committing midfield options which would open up themselves to the counter and teams have proved this year that they cant deal with it. You want to take early Peak Ronaldo and Rooney on in those circumstances? On the counter those two were as deadly as any combination that has played the game. They just knew where the other was going and their execution was on point.
 

Baneofthegame

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Like I said in a previous thread, I’d pick 08 and think they’d win in a two legged tie defense is superior and Trent has Rashford issues and he’d be up against Ronaldo.
 

TsuWave

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Manchester United 2008

(the core of that team went to 3 CL finals in 4 years) and even if you’re just speaking individual seasons 2008 is still >
 

Jeppers7

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It's closer than a lot here would admit, I think that Liverpool team would give anyone a game. I'd love to see how they'd deal with prime Barca.
Really ? VDS Evra Vidic Rio Scholes Giggs Ronaldo Rooney Tevez would all get in that Liverpool side. It would’ve best then easy. The Barca side isn’t even close....everything they did Liverpool are worse at. Ffs.
 

Champagne Football

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If you asked the question on a Liverpool forum, you're gonna get a different answer.

I think Klopp is clearly ahead of Fergie when it comes to Champions League tactics and getting the best out of what he has to work with in that competition.

But Fergie still clearly a better manager when you consider all other criteria like developing youth, longevity, trophy count etc. .
But man for man, only 4 Liverpool players would get into that 2008 Man Utd team and that's a fact.
 

Klopper76

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2008 United was arguably Ferguson’s best United side, winning three league titles in a row.

There’s no comparison to be made.
 

2 man midfield

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Really ? VDS Evra Vidic Rio Scholes Giggs Ronaldo Rooney Tevez would all get in that Liverpool side. It would’ve best then easy. The Barca side isn’t even close....everything they did Liverpool are worse at. Ffs.
I'm not saying this Liverpool team are close to prime Barca? Merely that I'd quite like to see that hypothetical match.

I never said Liverpool are better than our 2008 team either, they're not, but I do think it's pointless comparing players individually when talking about this current Liverpool. It seems obvious that they're greater than the sum of their parts and depend massively on their system to win games instead of individual brilliance. On paper of course United have the better players, but Liverpool have taken the piss out of the league this year and slapped some big teams in Europe too, all while playing the likes of Henderson and Milner. I still think United's side were better (I'd only really take Trent and Mane from their side into ours) but doing a combined XI doesn't really tell us anything.
 

adexkola

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That 08 side went an insane amount of games without conceding an away goal in Europe (I forget the exact number).

Beat Barcelona in the final and this isn't even a discussion
 

SambaBoy

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Sometimes in the team v team threads, it's easy to reel off names and just say this team wins based purely on their names without considering whether they were in their prime at the time or coming to the end of their career but in general that United team they were all close to their best. VDS was playing the best he had ever played and was just a figure of calm at the back, Wes had his best season of his career and was a solid 7/10 every week, Rio and Vidic were two best CB's in the world, Evra was one of the best LB's in the world. Scholes was Scholes, Fletcher was playing out of his skin and we had Carrick in there. Anderson and Nani who was showing signs of potential, Giggs in his central midifeld role for certain games (although I think he was pretty poor in 08, better from 09-11) then obviously Ronaldo, Rooney and Tevez.
 

Zehner

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Player for player, United 08 is better. But as a collective, Liverpool's better, IMO. They're like a clock work, everybody knows what to do. Sort of like Guardiola teams, although the playstyle is obviously really different. In contrast, Ferguson's United was more about individual quality, I think. A great assemblage of world class players but they didn't stand for a unique playing approach like Klopp teams do. Of course Ferguson's teams were also more than the sum of their parts, but Klopp (like Guardiola) is doing that on a different scale.
 

Bondi77

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This question is being asked on a Manchester United site....WTF?
 

matbezlima

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That 08 side went an insane amount of games without conceding an away goal in Europe (I forget the exact number).

Beat Barcelona in the final and this isn't even a discussion
They beat Chelsea in the final in 2008. The historical CR7 and Terry penalty misses.
 

billybee99

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It's closer than a lot here would admit, I think that Liverpool team would give anyone a game. I'd love to see how they'd deal with prime Barca.
They had it all to do to beat non-prime Barca in 2019. Prime Barca would wipe the floor with them. So would 2008 United.
 

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As much as Liverpool plays like a team, especially that midfield unit, what gets lost is the fact that their team was not as flexible as United in terms of tactics and player depth/quality. Liverpool play very similar styles centered around pressing players, closing down space, high energy in midfield, quick over the top passes behind into space to win the second or third ball while the defense is out of shape/line, and allow their fullbacks to play crosses into the box and into space. Regardless who starts for Liverpool, it's all a bit the same. Oxlade-Chamberlin in midfield gives more going forward but they lose a little bit as a high pressure unit without a Henderson or Wjiladum.

United 2008 on the other hand, could play with a variety of players in central midfield that allowed them to counter, soak up pressure and break lines in one pass, try to match the midfield energy and pressure, or deploy a midfield to overrun and dominate possession. The front three could do it all and all three were a focal point in that they were fluid, much more than Liverpool.

Wes Brown was the least athletic of the back four, but then you could put Hargreaves there and he'd be very reliable defensively and run up and down providing the energy and support against Robertson. If you're wondering who could go against TAA, then choose a left midfielder of Anderson, Fletcher or Park.

Queiroz was a very good #2 with Meulensteen as a highly rated coach as well.
 

Web of Bissaka

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There are only two angles of arguments here isn't it that may supports the 2019.

1. Brown vs TAA.
TAA is much better consistently in attacking and Brown better solid defensively. Interestingly Brown made rare but huge attacking contributions eg. CL final.

2. Tevez vs any of Pool's trio.
Tevez weren't that "great" in that season. So arguments can be made for him to be replaced in exchange for any of the latter.
He wasn't at his peak. Having the rest of the team to helped him (I remember Giggs supported him well and especially Ronaldo to provide plenty of the goals, then there's Rooney who kept on improving in goals) helps. I remember him to be limited especially the CF role he generally play. Rooney would be able to play it better but his versatility costed him in a way and Tevez can't play wide. Tevez is a new player and fairly in good form (Park weren't in consistent good form that season).

Don't get me wrong, no doubt he made huge contributions, crucial goals and assists. And his workrate help balance the team well.

There is also a thread here that talked about the trio Ron-Roon-Tev and they didn't really combined well in actual performances but the high goal/assist stats say otherwise. It skews evaluations. Goal wise, they're highly functional. But I don't feel mesmerize by their combinations. Rooney and Tevez have good understandings. Ronaldo is like the marauder then that can connects with anyone's passes and whose movements are just too easy for teammates to feed him.

Possibly 3. The long unbeaten domestic run, but that's just a bragging right.
 

Josh 76

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2008 : EPL + CL
2019 : ?
Best to judge it over 3 year period.
Utd
2007 EPL
2008 EPL + CL
2009 EPL + League Cup

Liverpool
2018 CL
2019 EPL
2020 ....

Let's see what they do In 2020. If they win another PL or CL, then there maybe an argument to have.
 

romufc

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Best to judge it over 3 year period.
Utd
2007 EPL
2008 EPL + CL
2009 EPL + League Cup

Liverpool
2018 CL
2019 EPL
2020 ....

Let's see what they do In 2020. If they win another PL or CL, then there maybe an argument to have.
The thing is we look at it as those 3 title winning campaigns but even the season of 10/11 we finished 1 point of Chelsea shows how consistent that team was. Not to forget 3 CL finals as well.

It was a winning machine that team. This Liverpool team has not yet reached those standards IMO.
 

RobinLFC

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I know dammit, I meant if they beat Barcelona in 2009
Adds nothing to the discussion. "Liverpool would've won back to back CLs if they'd beaten Real in the final". So what? They didn't.

I think it would be close. Over the course of the season, I'd be inclined to say Utd since you won the double in 2008 but we were easily on course for the best single PL season ever this year. In a two-legged European tie, both teams could give the other a lot of trouble. Hard to call.

For each argument there's a counter-argument to be made. Utd had a crazy defence yet there hasn't been a team in the history of the CL that scored more goals in a single season than this Liverpool side either.
 

diarm

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They won a double.

It's like people see a side like Liverpool or City racking up a load of league points while falling short in Europe, and completely disregard how difficult it is to compete on multiple fronts.

A side who win the European Cup and the league in the same season, will always be better than a side who win only a league, even if the second side wins every match in that league campaign.

It's an extraordinary achievement.

Liverpool are also peaking at a time where the usual European heavyweights are on the wane. Bayern, Barca, Real Madrid and ourselves are several levels below where we are used to seeing them.

They would be anihilated by that Barca 08-11 side.
 

Fortitude

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If you asked the question on a Liverpool forum, you're gonna get a different answer.

I think Klopp is clearly ahead of Fergie when it comes to Champions League tactics and getting the best out of what he has to work with in that competition.

But Fergie still clearly a better manager when you consider all other criteria like developing youth, longevity, trophy count etc. .
But man for man, only 4 Liverpool players would get into that 2008 Man Utd team and that's a fact.
O.o which 4 players would they be then?

The side of that era was well oiled and faced superior opposition.

Klopp would have some serious tactical decisions to make in that matchup, far more than Ferguson.
 

RobinLFC

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Best to judge it over 3 year period.
Utd
2007 EPL
2008 EPL + CL
2009 EPL + League Cup

Liverpool
2018 CL
2019 EPL
2020 ....

Let's see what they do In 2020. If they win another PL or CL, then there maybe an argument to have.
But now you're looking at it like dynasties though? I thought the question was "08 Utd vs 19 Liverpool, who wins a game or a European tie?".

If you're speaking from a general POV, Liverpool 18-? has a lot to prove (and win) before they come close to 07-09 United, that's not even discussion worthy at this point imo.
 

cyberman

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I think the 08 midfield plays games with Liverpools workhorses.
Todays clubs are a level below that era. They have a midfield that doesnt create and a no 9 that doesnt score.
 

Fortitude

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But now you're looking at it like dynasties though? I thought the question was "08 Utd vs 19 Liverpool, who wins a game or a European tie?".

If you're speaking from a general POV, Liverpool 18-? has a lot to prove (and win) before they come close to 07-09 United, that's not even discussion worthy at this point imo.
Be interested to hear your take.

That United side could well be our club representative period, some may argue '99 or '68, but the '08 side would be no surprise at all as our voted consensus best ever.

In terms of English sides, they would not look out of place as the league representative outright!
 

Jeppers7

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I'm not saying this Liverpool team are close to prime Barca? Merely that I'd quite like to see that hypothetical match.

I never said Liverpool are better than our 2008 team either, they're not, but I do think it's pointless comparing players individually when talking about this current Liverpool. It seems obvious that they're greater than the sum of their parts and depend massively on their system to win games instead of individual brilliance. On paper of course United have the better players, but Liverpool have taken the piss out of the league this year and slapped some big teams in Europe too, all while playing the likes of Henderson and Milner. I still think United's side were better (I'd only really take Trent and Mane from their side into ours) but doing a combined XI doesn't really tell us anything.
Fair enough...I certainly agree it’s the system that makes that team.
 

RobinLFC

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Be interested to hear your take.

That United side could well be our club representative period, some may argue '99 or '68, but the '08 side would be no surprise at all as our voted consensus best ever.

In terms of English sides, they would not look out of place as the league representative outright!
You won 3 PL's in row and added a CL in '08 so, if I had to pick the most dominant PL team ever, 2008 Utd would probably be the one, yes. Of course we don't know what will happen next season, but the current Liverpool side will always have the following arguments going against them:

- Absolutely historic 19/20 season abruptly stopped, possibly even without a title to show for it;
- General consensus that the rest of the big clubs are weaker than a decade ago;
- Didn't win the title in 18/19 because of another historically good side in City.

I don't like whataboutism in these discussions, so just like it's pointless to imagine the situation if City hadn't been that good during '16-'18, it's also pointless to ponder how Utd would be regarded if they hadn't faced the best team of all-time in Barca '09-'11 during that period. Imagine if Liverpool wins the league this season and next, we'd have 2 league titles and a CL (and some other minor cups that I don't even know Utd won during '07-'09), it would still be very hard to argue we're better than your Utd side since we don't have the PL treble. You can argue about it in the sense of a two-legged tie or one-off game, but on the whole, one PL extra, especially making it a treble which no other team has ever done in the PL, carries a lot of weight in such a discussion. Say that we win the treble during 20/21 though, that would make up for the PL less imo.

That's all assuming that there'll be a 20/21 season of course, might be wishful thinking at this point :D
 

TheReligion

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Adds nothing to the discussion. "Liverpool would've won back to back CLs if they'd beaten Real in the final". So what? They didn't.

I think it would be close. Over the course of the season, I'd be inclined to say Utd since you won the double in 2008 but we were easily on course for the best single PL season ever this year. In a two-legged European tie, both teams could give the other a lot of trouble. Hard to call.

For each argument there's a counter-argument to be made. Utd had a crazy defence yet there hasn't been a team in the history of the CL that scored more goals in a single season than this Liverpool side either.
So what? You didn't. It means nothing.
 

redman5

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A key factor for me would be how would the United back four of 2008 cope with being pressed in their own half. From what I remember the likes of Rio & co quite often had all the time in the world to stroll out of their own half to help set-up an attack, for teams generally sat very deep in order to try & contain United's attacking threat.