Boavista
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- Mar 8, 2021
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YesYes, do you?
YesYes, do you?
It's close between them, Laporte's distribution is definitely better, one of the best passers in the league from the back, Dias has better intangibles, he feels like a better leader and organiser.Am I the only one who thinks Laporte is better than Ruben Dias?
I think Dias is very overrated, but I don't think Laporte is better than him. Dias is very clearly City's best defender. Laporte is better on the ball though.Am I the only one who thinks Laporte is better than Ruben Dias?
Technically, probably. Overall, Dias' organizational skills, no-nonsense defending puts him ahead of Laporte (who has been prone to lapses of concentration in recent seasons despite his quality). This season he's been marginally worse than Stones. They are all excellent CBs though.Am I the only one who thinks Laporte is better than Ruben Dias?
I think he is too. City didn't miss Dias while he was injured IMO and their only constant in defense all season has been Laporte.Am I the only one who thinks Laporte is better than Ruben Dias?
You don't think much of City's defenders if you say Días is very overrated and yet is very clearly their best defenderI think Dias is very overrated, but I don't think Laporte is better than him. Dias is very clearly City's best defender. Laporte is better on the ball though.
Looking back through this thread makes for some astonishing reading. I wonder how many of those placing only VVD ahead of Maguire (for example) still hold this view? Before we signed him, I thought Maguire was probably top half of the Premier League's CB list, but closer to the middle than the top. 20 teams, 40 CBs, he looked like around 11th or 12th best. I wouldn't have thought he'd get in any of the top 5 clubs (not sure why Pep wanted him), but could see him in a 6th or 7th placed club. I don't see how anyone rated him top 5, it's insane.It’s incredible how many people put Maguire in top 5. He is (or has ever been) a top 5 CB as much as Rashford was a top 5 striker or Fred a top 4 midfielder.
There's something about this list...Ben Davies
Joe Rodon
Ben Cabango
Ethan Ampadu
Chris Mepham
They had their best central defensive run with Dias and Stones last season without Laporte. Point is that City never miss anybody. De Bruyne is their best player but they still win games without him, someone quality steps up. Dias shouldn't have won the Player of the Year last year for 'transforming' City's defence, it was good anyway. If anything Cancelo on the left instead of a Delph/Zinchenko/Mendy transformed the defence moreso.I think he is too. City didn't miss Dias while he was injured IMO and their only constant in defense all season has been Laporte.
Dias is a very good defender and has better leadership qualities than Laporte, but the system makes him better than he actually is IMO. He wasn't considered elite before joining City, and when you watch him with the Portuguese NT, he isn't special IMO.
On the ball, Laporte and Stone are clearly superior, in the air too IMO.
Laporte is ok in the air defensively, but his biggest issue is consistently switches off. Of the 3 he is easily the worst actual defender now Stones has muscled up. He is the best on the ball and for City most importantly he is left footed. I would say Dias is the strongest, most aggressive defender, best organizer and has the best mentality and will to win by far. Stones is the best in the air. When you add in how often the other 2 have an error in them, I'd say Dias is a full level above both.I think he is too. City didn't miss Dias while he was injured IMO and their only constant in defense all season has been Laporte.
Dias is a very good defender and has better leadership qualities than Laporte, but the system makes him better than he actually is IMO. He wasn't considered elite before joining City, and when you watch him with the Portuguese NT, he isn't special IMO.
On the ball, Laporte and Stone are clearly superior, in the air too IMO.
I think Laporte is better than the other 2 in the air especially offensively (corners and free kicks), I'll even say Ake is also better.Laporte is ok in the air defensively, but his biggest issue is consistently switches off. Of the 3 he is easily the worst actual defender now Stones has muscled up. He is the best on the ball and for City most importantly he is left footed. I would say Dias is the strongest, most aggressive defender, best organizer and has the best mentality and will to win by far. Stones is the best in the air. When you add in how often the other 2 have an error in them, I'd say Dias is a full level above both.
Dias is also criminally underrated on the ball a kind of myth has developed because he doesn't look as elegant as the others.
In terms of stats.
Passing Accuracy: Laporte 94.9, Dias 93.6, Stones 91.7, Ake 91.4.
Assists: Dias 3
G/A: Dias 5, Laporte 3, Stones 1, Ake 1
Key Passes Per Game: Dias 0.5, Laporte 0.3, Stones and Ake 0.2.
Long Balls Per Game: Ake 1, Dias 3.5, Stones 3.8, Laporte 4.3
Dias and Stones both get dispossessed 0.1 times per game, Laporte 0.2, Ake 0.3
In terms of poor first touches: Laporte 0.1, Stones 0.2, Dias 0.3, Ake 0.4
In defending terms is similar.
Tackles Per Game: Ake 1.2, Dias and Laporte 1, Stones 0.4
Interceptions: Dias and Stones 0.8, Laporte 0.7, Ake 0.6
Dias also leads clearances, catching the oppo offside and blocks per game.
He does get dribbled past slightly more because he's more aggressive though.
In the midfield and attacking positions, yes though i think they're becoming very dependent on KDB now. But defensively, it's another issue IMO. When they lost the title to Liverpool, i think their defense suffered a lot that season due to Laporte's injury.They had their best central defensive run with Dias and Stones last season without Laporte. Point is that City never miss anybody. De Bruyne is their best player but they still win games without him, someone quality steps up. Dias shouldn't have won the Player of the Year last year for 'transforming' City's defence, it was good anyway. If anything Cancelo on the left instead of a Delph/Zinchenko/Mendy transformed the defence moreso.
He didn't play in 7 Premier League Games this season. City won all of them with an aggregate score of 22-2.In the midfield and attacking positions, yes though i think they're becoming very dependent on KDB now. But defensively, it's another issue IMO. When they lost the title to Liverpool, i think their defense suffered a lot that season due to Laporte's injury.
I don't think Cancelo played LB last season as much as he has this season.
This season Dias has looked a lot more ‘normal’ so I’d agree on recent form. I actually think Stones has become a phenomenal CB as well.Am I the only one who thinks Laporte is better than Ruben Dias?
Laporte I think has the best attacking instincts in the oppo box for sure, but for me mentally he can be rattled and flustered (a bit like Rodri) who is also exceptional. I don't think Dias can be knocked out of his game even after he makes a clanger. I'm happy to have all 3 and Ake who's been excellent recently too though, its a nice argument to have. All 3 would be nailed on first choice pretty much anywhere bar City or Liverpool.I think Laporte is better than the other 2 in the air especially offensively (corners and free kicks), I'll even say Ake is also better.
As for the switching off part, Stones also has the same problem, but i won't say they do it consistently at all, it's actually very rare. Only problem is that when it happens, it's often in a big game.
And judging by those stats, I'll actually say Laporte is the best defender given that he's played more games than the others (especially Stones and Ake).
Like i've said before though, Dias is more of an old school type of defender, doesn't hesitate to throw his body on the line. His type quickly become fan favorites.
I said that based on their recent games, since January basically. His first half of the season wasn't really good, but since January, he's been getting better game after game and has been very influencial for them.He didn't play in 7 Premier League Games this season. City won all of them with an aggregate score of 22-2.
If anything his brilliance is capped at City, teams park the bus so much that there's no space at all, they just need to be patient and wait for those few openings per game or until the defense breaks down out of pure exhaustion. The Liverpool game was a good example of how he can run the show and dictate the tempo of the game if City goes against an opponent who actually wants to attack them and leaves some space.
Agree with all of this.Laporte is ok in the air defensively, but his biggest issue is consistently switches off. Of the 3 he is easily the worst actual defender now Stones has muscled up. He is the best on the ball and for City most importantly he is left footed. I would say Dias is the strongest, most aggressive defender, best organizer and has the best mentality and will to win by far. Stones is the best in the air. When you add in how often the other 2 have an error in them, I'd say Dias is a full level above both.
Dias is also criminally underrated on the ball a kind of myth has developed because he doesn't look as elegant as the others.
In terms of stats.
Passing Accuracy: Laporte 94.9, Dias 93.6, Stones 91.7, Ake 91.4.
Assists: Dias 3
G/A: Dias 5, Laporte 3, Stones 1, Ake 1
Key Passes Per Game: Dias 0.5, Laporte 0.3, Stones and Ake 0.2.
Long Balls Per Game: Ake 1, Dias 3.5, Stones 3.8, Laporte 4.3
Dias and Stones both get dispossessed 0.1 times per game, Laporte 0.2, Ake 0.3
In terms of poor first touches: Laporte 0.1, Stones 0.2, Dias 0.3, Ake 0.4
In defending terms is similar.
Tackles Per Game: Ake 1.2, Dias and Laporte 1, Stones 0.4
Interceptions: Dias and Stones 0.8, Laporte 0.7, Ake 0.6
Dias also leads clearances, catching the oppo offside and blocks per game.
He does get dribbled past slightly more because he's more aggressive though.
Not sure about Maguire, might put him at 5th place myself.1) Varane (4x CLs and 3 league titles, a world cup and still 28)
2) Virjil Van Dijk
3) Ruben Diaz
4) Harry Maguire
5) Marquinhos
Really? I can't ever remember Harry Maguire being lauded as a special talent breaking through. Did he ever even make an England youth team?Maguire has a pretty good skillset. He was very talented at Leicester.
He's not been terrible.Upamecano? You're kidding right?
He's been terrible this season. He's like Serge Aurier in terms of brainfarts. He's been comical.
Upamecano has all the qualities needed to succeed. He's fast, strong, good on the ball.He's not been terrible.
He had quite some blunders, but also some really good games.
I wouldn't put him anywhere in a "top 5 CBs" list (with Hernandez and Süle there are two CBs in our team alone who had better seasons) but he's not having a terrible season.
He's still only 23 and has immense potential. You could see he struggled a bit with the pressure at Bayern and played a bit too risky at the beginning of the season.
I agree that we lack leadership in defense. Hernandez, as much as I like him, couldn't fill Alabas gap in this regard.Upamecano has all the qualities needed to succeed. He's fast, strong, good on the ball.
But I seriously see issues in his concentration and self-control. I have watched every Bayern game this season. I'm not just giving my opinion based on just 1 game. He always looks so nervous and you never feel safe with him. He had a few great games at the start and has been alright of late but in the middle he had so many brainfarts. Last season at Leipzig he had plenty of these amateur mistakes too.
With him I think it's mostly mental. Because of his amazing qualities and the fact that age is on his side, he can definitely improve. Right now, Upamecano isn't even in my top 15 CBs.
I think the real problem with Bayern's defense right now is that they're leaderless. With the departure of Boateng and Alaba the defense sometimes looks utterly clueless. Think even a moderately experienced CB will help in getting the best out of this defense and Upamecano can shine. Lucas is so good, perfect for Bayern's high line; great pace and defends so well 1 on 1.
BTW, I loved the run Dayot made against Villareal. Was like a poor man's Lucio.
Apart from his first season with us, whats the difference?I mean, Harry Maguire might not be good enough for Man Utd, but does anyone really miss how it looked before (Jones and Smalling)?
He's an excellent defender, easily top 3 in the league. I just don't think he's as good as most people or pundits think. People sometimes talk about him as if he's Van Dijk levels, I've heard people label a potential all-time great. That kind of thing. Laporte and Stones are both excellent defenders too but you do have a point about the difficulties in evaluating them because of how City play.You don't think much of City's defenders if you say Días is very overrated and yet is very clearly their best defender
I really don't know how good City's defence is because they just aren't tested enough. I see two reasons for this The 'problem' (that is obviously not a problem for City) is that they defend from the front with their excellent and coordinated press, so half the work is done for Laporte/Días/Stones leaving them with not much defending to do. They do, however see a lot of the ball and are very proficient footballers.
The other reason they don't need to do a lot of defending is that the midfielders will stop the opposition attacking by fair means if possible, but via professional fouls if not. It's a 'thou shall not pass!' approach and is extremely effective.
The midfielders also try to ensure that any fouls committed take place as far away from their own goal as possible, thereby reducing the chance of accruing yellow cards. I have no data to back this up but it appears that they also 'rotate their foulers' to avoid the totting up approach by referees.
Interestingly I've noticed this season that Liverpool have followed suit - the professional fouling by advanced midfielders has definitely become more commonplace than previously by the scousers.
The fair play league appears to back this up.....Klopp's side have won this every single year he's been in charge in the Premier League but this year it looks like City will claim this - too my thinking anyway - dubious award.
Saw a couple of tiktok clips, of a little twitter spat between him and Terry. Rio saying something about Terry's ego, and was lucky he'd put him 5th with the whole racism thing. Terry coming back saying what about the ego of putting himself first.Rio listed his top 5 CB's of the PL era.
He put himself first, as you would
Then
2. Vidic
3. VVD
4. Stam
5. Terry