But to flip that we're having a nightmare season this year so you can't use it as a reason for our success last season and ignore it being a factor thisWe were second last season because Chelsea and Liverpool had nightmare seasons. We finished with 74 pts. We were shit, just less shit.
The reason we are where we are is Ole built a team around Maguire, AWB, Shaw, McTominay and Rashford and they’re all either shite or had shite seasons. And all the squad players are either justifiably pissed off and/or toxic characters.
We did sign a right winger, RR's just chosen to play him exclusively from the left and tbh yes Ole should have gone after the Liverpool game but then RR coming in any sooner than he did wouldn't have made a jot of difference based on what we've seen since he has been hereOur 2nd place last season wasn't great. We played awfully in a good 70% of our games, but somehow kept coming back and winning them. No crowds massively helped this. We went the whole of last season not losing an away game. That never happens with crowds in the grounds. We only finished on 74 points. Liverpool and Chelsea had disastrous seasons. If they had more 'normal' seasons, at best, we'd have finished 3rd. The squad as a whole were better last season.
We didn't get the players that we really needed. We needed a defensive midfielder and right winger. We had players that weren't happy, but were kept at the club. We tried to play more attacking football. It massively failed. It then took way too long to sack Ole. He should have been sacked after the Liverpool game. I think some of the poorer performances at the start of the season really hit the players' confidence. There were way too many games where we almost abandoned defending. We got countered so easily. A big chunk of the goals we conceded were on the counter. I kept reading so many people saying that we're playing Fred and McTominay, so we we're being defensive. I must have been watching different games to them. Our whole team were pushed into the oppositions half in most games when we had the ball.
When Rangnick came in, we started to defend a bit better, but our finishing was absolutely dreadful. We went through a good couple months when our xG was looking good, but Ronaldo and Bruno were missing chances for fun. The manager can only do so much. I think losing Greenwood during this period really cost us. I think he would have played and scored some goals when Ronaldo needed a rest. After going out of the CL, I think the confidence was completely gone. The wheels have really fallen off since then. Any of the progress we made under Rangnick has gone.
A big issue is our key players have been woeful this season. Maguire, Shaw, Bruno, and Rashford. We count on them to perform and they've been nowhere near good enough.
Yeh but just say we got 74 points and that was "okay".But to flip that we're having a nightmare season this year so you can't use it as a reason for our success last season and ignore it being a factor this
74 points isn't a bad return for a top 4 finish, the maximum Chelsea can get this season now is 76, the max Arsenal can get is 75. Will either side actually get maximum points? I doubt it so both might actually finish with less than that
Because also Arsenal and Chelsea this season are trash.But to flip that we're having a nightmare season this year so you can't use it as a reason for our success last season and ignore it being a factor this
74 points isn't a bad return for a top 4 finish, the maximum Chelsea can get this season now is 76, the max Arsenal can get is 75. Will either side actually get maximum points? I doubt it so both might actually finish with less than that
Ole mostly played him on the left as well. It makes sense him being on the left. Most elite teams are playing inverted wingers/wing forwards. Ole mostly played Greenwood on the right and Rashford/Sancho on the left. A left footed player for the right side would be nice. Yeah, Ralf likely makes no difference if he arrives earlier, but Ole still needed to be sacked. It put us in an even worse position. We had additional losses to City and Watford under our belts, and lower confidence levels.We did sign a right winger, RR's just chosen to play him exclusively from the left and tbh yes Ole should have gone after the Liverpool game but then RR coming in any sooner than he did wouldn't have made a jot of difference based on what we've seen since he has been here
Nah you're reaching, as RR has proven he'd of made no difference in those games given his own hammerings to City/Liverpool and Brighton today. It was RR's job to turn confidence around and he's failed, like he has in every other conceivable aspectOle mostly played him on the left as well. It makes sense him being on the left. Most elite teams are playing inverted wingers/wing forwards. Ole mostly played Greenwood on the right and Rashford/Sancho on the left. A left footed player for the right side would be nice. Yeah, Ralf likely makes no difference if he arrives earlier, but Ole still needed to be sacked. It put us in an even worse position. We had additional losses to City and Watford under our belts, and lower confidence levels.
Meh when City finished 2nd behind Liverpool they were never in a title fightYeh but just say we got 74 points and that was "okay".
Saying we finished second without context is just an insult to the effort Liverpool have put in this season, or City/Spurs etc have put in in previous seasons to be in second while in genuine title fights. We were never in a title fight last season, we melted as soon as anyone mentioned the possibility.
We were extremely lucky to be second - Liverpool had a freak of a season where all their defenders seemed to break down, Chelsea focused on the cups and managed to win the Big Ears and Arsenal/Spurs seemed in transition. People who expected a jump after Sancho, Varane and Ronaldo with Ole at the wheel were naive imoWe were second last season. This season we're supposed to be even stronger with the arrival of Sancho, Varane and Ronaldo. Lot of talks about us challenging or even winning the PL before the season started.
Why and wth went so wrong in your opinion?
Well said. It's all about consisent quality of football and since it's never been there for years, the results from season to season are all over the place.We were extremely lucky to be second - Liverpool had a freak of a season wher e all their defenders seemed to break down, Chelsea focused on the cups and managed to win the Big Ears and Arsenal/Spurs seemed in transition. People who expected a jump after Sancho, Varane and Ronaldo with Ole at the wheel were naive imo
We may have been lucky to be second with Liverpool’s bad form but we were still the level of the average 3rd team in any season. There’s been a massive decline. We put it up to City in the games we played them under Ole and in almost all big games. This year we lost 15-1 on aggregate to Liverpool and City. You can’t compare.We were extremely lucky to be second - Liverpool had a freak of a season where all their defenders seemed to break down, Chelsea focused on the cups and managed to win the Big Ears and Arsenal/Spurs seemed in transition. People who expected a jump after Sancho, Varane and Ronaldo with Ole at the wheel were naive imo
Can’t disagree with any of this really.My view is pretty simple.
Ole, upon having built a side that was the best in the world at counter attacking and very good at digging out results from losing positions, due to his naivety changed tried to change tactically to a style he wasn't equipped to coach. The man said "press them" against Liverpool ffs.
He made his position untenable in doing so, prompting an inexperienced setup to get in the Lokomotiv Moscow Sporting director as manager. The idea presumably being to get the father of gegenpressing to turn a side built for counterattacking to reverse its nature.
That led to the weakest 'new manager bounce' the world has ever seen, and just as it started to click, the events of January 30th killed the dressing room. The interim we hired began taking shots at the fractured team and eroded its confidence further, unto the point where either Ronaldo puts in a MOTM performance or we lose.
This is just a repeat of 17/18 and 18/19 under Mourinho.We were second last season. This season we're supposed to be even stronger with the arrival of Sancho, Varane and Ronaldo. Lot of talks about us challenging or even winning the PL before the season started.
Why and wth went so wrong in your opinion?
Good post. Quite an interesting thread this.As a Milan fan I consider myself an expert on mismanagement and mediocrity.
The CR7 return reminded me of our Kaka return in 2013.
A purely nostalgic and idiotic decision which went against the values of the team that had previously managed to finish in top 3.
The 2012 Milan team was a youthful, energetic team which compensated what they lacked in experience and talent with sacrifice and a strong unit.
You were going for high press and then you signed a 37 year old Cristiano Ronaldo?
Another thing which reminds me of our decade long mediocrity is the constant change of systems or "tactical revolutions", new gimmicks.
A classic British manager in Moyes, 90s totaalvoetball with Van Gaal, then ultra pragmatism with Mourinho, "the United way" with Solskjaer, now gegenpressing with Rangnick, next season modern totalvoetball with Ten Hag?
It's as if the club is ruled by the dumber half of online communities, who can't look beyond hype and end product. The players and coaches that the club is signing are the ones that create most fan excitement, initially at least. Corporate people with no football vision.
I don't think you'll get out of this cycle until your upper management give the keys to proper technical directors with a vision that doesn't depend on fan sentiments.
Rangnick was never good as a coach, as Milan fan I'm glad we dodged that bullet. But he might be able to steer you out of this in an executive non-coach role.
Ahh yeah, depression n stuff
We weren't.The two times in recent years we finished 2nd never felt like we were the 2nd best team in England to me
