[AKDevil]

Still fuming (mainly at rafael to be honest - pointless blaming officials in my eyes. Only makes a decision coz rafa gives him reason too). However, one consolation I can take. Money well spent on things going forward so hopefully when we do it on defence it will have same effect in terms of improvement.

In the meantime, think there might be more of today between now and January window especially as you can hardly say we have any defenders out who can come in and make a big difference.

 

[Manucho the boss]

No referee should have fear of making a decision regardless of who it is for or against as long as it is the right one!

In a perfect world that would be ideal, and the best team would win every time. But we were never afraid to put pressure on the ref while Ferguson was here so lets not try and act like we're a paragon of virtue.

In fact I feel referee intimidation is one of the biggest factors in the home/away difference in football and not how much the home crowd sing as Sky would have you believe. We're the biggest team, most fans, biggest deals and get most media coverage, we'd be fools not to put more pressure on referees at Old Trafford in particular as they'll know any mistake against us will be magnified whereas a mistake against small teams won't make headlines. Barca and Real have the same situation in Spain.

I guarantee you Fergie wouldn't have been afraid to drag Clattenburg's performance up in the post match interview, if he gets a fine that's fair enough but he'd make sure Clattenburg is on the back pages tomorrow and not criticism of our new players. That gives the FA something to think about next time they're appointing a ref for our game and the next time Clattenburg does get us he might be a bit more careful.

 

[MUFC > Everyone]

Too much to say that either I don't have time for or is simply redundant. But perhaps some unique opinions...

-Rafa did nothing wrong in the PK situation. Clattenburg let Rafa's reputation of retaliation get ahead of actually looking at the play and seeing there was no penalty. The commentators on NBC Sports literally had no idea what they were talking about in that situation.
-Blackett I think will be our best defender because he has that attributes that you can't teach (strength, confidence) but lacks those that you can teach (positioning). All around had a decent game but why during the 4th goal did he start running towards De Leat on the wing leaving Vardy with yards of space open in the middle of the pitch! Stay with Vardy and let De Leat beat you or attempt to score from a hard angle!
-Hard to blame De Gea for any of the goals, but as a world class keeper you have to be making world class saves. He was caught wrong footed on every goal aside from the second PK.
-Still love Herrera and Di Maria is a class above.


Bottom line is Clattenburg sucked but do not be disillusioned and say he's the reason we lost. Bottom line is we conceded 4 goals in 20 minutes. Whether you have to start sitting back more or subbing out a forward, there is no excuse to lose the game from a 2 goal lead with only 30 minutes left to play.

 

[vibe]

But we were never afraid to put pressure on the ref while Ferguson was here so lets not try and act like we're a paragon of virtue.

Oooooh, so that's why Clattenburg was a mockery to the concept or refereeing today? His thought process went something like this.

"Manchester United, Manchester United... Hey, weren't those the guys whose former manager put pressure on the refs? Sir Alex something. Yeah, those are the ones. What an impolite bunch!

I'll teach them a lesson by fecking with this completely unrelated new manager who has barely raised his voice at me and is just sitting there, taking notes, thus making sure he has a completely horrid start to life and an even harder task at rebuilding his side. That ought to show the manager before the manager before him!

Go Liverpool!"

Come the feck on.

 

[dwd]

In a perfect world that would be ideal, and the best team would win every time. But we were never afraid to put pressure on the ref while Ferguson was here so lets not try and act like we're a paragon of virtue.

In fact I feel referee intimidation is one of the biggest factors in the home/away difference in football and not how much the home crowd sing as Sky would have you believe. We're the biggest team, most fans, biggest deals and get most media coverage, we'd be fools not to put more pressure on referees at Old Trafford in particular as they'll know any mistake against us will be magnified whereas a mistake against small teams won't make headlines. Barca and Real have the same situation in Spain.

I guarantee you Fergie wouldn't have been afraid to drag Clattenburg's performance up in the post match interview, if he gets a fine that's fair enough but he'd make sure Clattenburg is on the back pages tomorrow and not criticism of our new players. That gives the FA something to think about next time they're appointing a ref for our game and the next time Clattenburg does get us he might be a bit more careful.

So basically you're saying you're annoyed referees don't feel intimidated anymore about giving us the run of the green? Bizarre. He made a lot of decisions today that went against us, it happens. It doesn't excuse the complete lack of organisation in defence.

 

[Ish]

Still fuming (mainly at rafael to be honest - pointless blaming officials in my eyes. Only makes a decision coz rafa gives him reason too). However, one consolation I can take. Money well spent on things going forward so hopefully when we do it on defence it will have same effect in terms of improvement.

In the meantime, think there might be more of today between now and January window especially as you can hardly say we have any defenders out who can come in and make a big difference.

That's a bit harsh, to say the least. How exactly did Rafael give the ref reason? By doing nothing wrong?

Clattenburg got that decision shamelessly wrong. This is becoming a case of Rafael's reputation playing against him. It was a dive.

 

[Man of Leisure]

It's been a few hours now and I'm still so livid with absolutely everything that I don't know who to blame.

I'm furious with Clattenburg for being himself in yet another one of our games. Incompetence doesn't even half cover his performance today. I'm not going into specifics. He doesn't deserve the time it takes, and quite frankly, I dislike the bastard so much I might get banned for saying how I really feel. Hope he loses his refereeing license.

I'm furious with a few of Leicester's players, mainly that thuggish twat Vardy, but given the line Clattenburg laid down - or rather, failed to lay down, it's somewhat understandable that they went for that approach. It worked, after all. Still unsporting and cnutish behaviour.

I'm furious with our own players for allowing a collapse like that. We never used to do that before. The 6-1 thumping against City at Old Trafford was the first for a couple of decades. Since then we've seen a few, sadly. Wigan and Everton in the run-in for City's title win and the entire last season, for example. I just feel like a few of our players lack the spine to play top level football, and especially our defenders. That's the main reason we're struggling at the moment. It's not a lack of talent. It's a lack of will and ability to apply that talent even when the wind is blowing the wrong way.

I'm furious with van Gaal for his substitutions and lack of ruthlessness when it comes to dropping certain players. No way should van Persie be playing 90 minutes against QPR, and much less today. He's been poor and off the pace. Had a couple of moments where he hogged the ball and failed to make quick decisions. Choked up our attacking play and was just detrimental to our attacking plays. If van Gaal goes through the entire season without swinging the axe in the direction of under-performing players we can kiss CL football goodbye. There are teams who won't fuss about if they have a chance of grabbing a top four spot, so we can't either. Oh yeah, and we lose three quarters of what was arguably our most solid defensive line-up ever in one summer and sign two extremely unproven replacements for the least defensively sound of the three and neglect the other two? Amateurish. Every United fan and their collective dogs and mums could have told you that we needed at least one experienced centre half to lead from the back. Atrocious from the club to not plan ahead. No team in the world can cope with losing the experience of a trio like Evra, Rio and Vidic without having some sort of plan in mind.

So there. A bit of blame for everyone. I hope they all go feck themselves. Thanks for ruining my weekend.

Your fury amuses me.

 

[NotoriousISSY]

The penalty really sparked the capitulation BUT it's not something new. We've been very poor in such situations long before Moyes and van Gaal.

The defence in general didn't help anyone today and I thought the captains showing in the second half was very very disappointing. Evans and Smalling are really giving us some major problems at the moment too - highlighted throughout the game.

That penalty does have me raging. Everything after the 3rd goal was verging on hilariously bad though.

 

[Feed Me]

You know what fecks me off?

The tossers playing for us will go back to their mansions, count their millions and fornicate with their ridiculous wives / girlfriends.

Less collective backbone than a jellyfish. It honestly feels like United get worse and worse with each passing week. I'm amazed some people have managed to put a positive spin on things, saying we looked good in attack.

We lost a 3-1 lead and conceded five goals against a promoted team - it's nothing short of a disgrace.

 

[Getsme]

You know what fecks me off?

The tossers playing for us will go back to their mansions, count their millions and fornicate with their ridiculous wives / girlfriends.

Less collective backbone than a jellyfish. It honestly feels like United get worse and worse with each passing week. I'm amazed some people have managed to put a positive spin on things, saying we looked good in attack.

We lost a 3-1 lead and conceded five goals against a promoted team - it's nothing short of a disgrace.

For last 30 minutes we looked like a non league side, truly awful. Thankfully for the team their poor performance is being overshadowed by some terrible referring decisions, otherwise, I'd imagine the meltdown in here would be unbearable.
Saying that I think we have to take some positives from the game, we are going in the right direction it's just going to take time and patience.

 

[Red_Aaron]

penalty was ridiculous, typical clattenburg though, judging the player and not the actual occurrence

coming forward we're awesome and that will surely see us win more games than we lose

the capitulation shows there's still issues with confidence/mentality and a lot of work still to be done

we're going in the right direction and its gonna be a seriously fun ride

 

[Manucho the boss]

So basically you're saying you're annoyed referees don't feel intimidated anymore about giving us the run of the green? Bizarre. He made a lot of decisions today that went against us, it happens. It doesn't excuse the complete lack of organisation in defence.

Yeah I definitely think we're missing out. A few fines or even a touchline ban wouldn't bother Louis too much I don't think, there's been a noticeable difference in how our games are officiated since Sir Alex has retired and I don't like it. Can only be because Moyes was such a wet lettuce in interviews and never made a fuss even when mistakes went against us.

 

[Feed Me]

For last 30 minutes we looked like a non league side, truly awful. Thankfully for the team their poor performance is being overshadowed by some terrible referring decisions otherwise I'd imagine the meltdown in here would be unbearable.
Saying that I think we have to take some positives from the game, we are going in the right direction it's just going to take time and patience.

I think we need to be above blaming the referee. Yes, it was a poor decision, but we should have managed the game and got the result. We were astonishingly weak. One of the worst giveaways I've ever seen from a United perspective.

 

[Getsme]

I think we need to be above blaming the referee. Yes, it was a poor decision, but we should have managed the game and got the result. We were astonishingly weak. One of the worst giveaways I've ever seen from a United perspective.

Yep, we have had decisions go against us in the last and never folded like that. The defence don't believe in themselves, there was no conviction and you could see the fear in their faces. Rooney is not a number 10, Rojo is not a left back and one of Rooney, RVP or Falcoa needs to start from the bench.

 

[united_99]

I am watching Levante - Barca but can't really concentrate.

(And in this moment Barca's big players Messi and Neymar deliver, but horrible pen by Messi )

We had such an easy start and all we have is 5 points. At this rate we won't get anything against a half decent team.

Now let's have a look at our rivals:

Chelsea and City will probably finish way above us anyway. Still, both had mid week games, with City's being even harder away at Bayern. Still 4 days later both look so fresh and much better against the strongest team in the league, even more impressive with City with 10 men.

Arsenal playing a difficult away game at Dortmund, but still winning their PL game 4 days later.

Liverpool have been as bad as us, but at least they have the excuse of a midweek game and an average squad

Everton and Spurs both lost, but they have a really good excuse with the EL games on Thursday

But what about us? Yeah new manager, new players, but again, we couldn't have have had an easier start even if we wanted.

We will improve as we hardly can get any worse, but no excuse will be tolerated by the board if we don't manage top 4 with all that money spent. And to be honest, I wouldn't even be comfortable with playing a play-off game due to getting 4th as with our squad you just don't know what you'll get. So we actually need to get 3rd.

All in all it's really annoying that we couldn't take advantage in a week when our rivals played CL/EL games AND we faced a promoted team.

 

[dwd]

Yeah I definitely think we're missing out. A few fines or even a touchline ban wouldn't bother Louis too much I don't think, there's been a noticeable difference in how our games are officiated since Sir Alex has retired and I don't like it. Can only be because Moyes was such a wet lettuce in interviews and never made a fuss even when mistakes went against us.

So you think that if a manager moans about a referee and then gets a fine or a touchline ban it results in the referee being more cautious the next time he referees a game for that said managers team? Clattenberg of all people won't give a flying feck, he didn't even when Fergie was here. Pass the dutchie fella.

 

[SammyUnited_83]

Awful, awful decision but shouldn't have led to us going on to lose the game. It was weird, even at 3-1 I was looking at the clock, hoping it would run down, I just don't trust our defence at all.

Beginning to lose patience with Rafa, he always has this stupid sarcastic look on his face and is positionally poor. We need intelligent defenders...

 

[Manucho the boss]

So you think that if a manager moans about a referee and then gets a fine or a touchline ban it results in the referee being more cautious the next time he referees a game for that said managers team? Clattenberg of all people won't give a flying feck, he didn't even when Fergie was here. Pass the dutchie fella.

I was there to see Clattenburg bottle a few decisions in our favour at OT too. Remember the Nani goal against Spurs when for some reason he ignored his linesman who had flagged for a foul against Nani? He also laughed off Rooney's assault on McCarthy, not to mention the Mendez goal/non goal. He gives in to pressure from the home fans, we'd be stupid not to take advantage of that, winning is all that matters I don't think we care how we get that win.

 

[dwd]

I was there to see Clattenburg bottle a few decisions in our favour at OT too. Remember the Nani goal against Spurs when for some reason he ignored his linesman who had flagged for a foul against Nani? He also laughed off Rooney's assault on McCarthy, not to mention the Mendez goal/non goal. He gives in to pressure from the home fans, we'd be stupid not to take advantage of that, winning is all that matters I don't think we care how we get that win.

That might be true, but we were playing away today so I don't see what good LVG moaning about the ref and getting a fine/touchline ban would do.

 

[Danny Boi]

Took some time to think the game over and calm down.I don't think we need to be panicking.To look at the game properly I think you have to split it into two parts: pre and post Clattenburg.For the first 60 minutes or so we looked good go forward and scored 3 good goals.The defense was a bit shaky and Leicester had there fair share of chances but that was to be expected our defense is not great and Leicester are a decent side who will trouble most teams in the league.In general we were doing quite well.

Then the penalty happened, which of course was never penalty and a massive fcuk up by Clattenburg.What followed was horrendous but I think it can be put down just one defiency in our team:A lack of leadership we genuinely have no one who can reorganise the team after something like that.Rooney's shouting was the last thing we needed in that situation.

That lack of leadership is going to hurt us this season, particularily against Chelsea and City but I still think we have enough quality in the squad to make 4th.Then we need to bring a commanding CB or CM.Until then hopefully our attack will make sure we are not in too many situations like today where we are need of leadership and a calming influence.

 

[Manucho the boss]

That might be true, but we were playing away today so I don't see what good LVG moaning about the ref and getting a fine/touchline ban would do.

Let him know he owes us one for next time maybe? Sir Alex always took that attitude with officials so maybe that's where I've developed this opinion from. At the end of the day the man in black is extremely lowly paid and poorly trained compared to the 22 other men on the pitch yet he may have more influence on the result than any of them. They can be and are susceptible to pressure, at the end of the day Clattenburg was a man who was employed as an electrician before he was doing this, he's hardly the most intelligent person.

 

[2E_MUFC]

People saying don't blame Clattenburg? Well he is partly to blame. It was a clear foul on Rafael. After the penalty the players heads went bascially. Arguably De Laet should of have been sent off also. The ref completely bottled it today. But the players should of kept their composure. Giving them a goal just after we made it 2-0 knocked us abit aswell imo. The ball had also arguably crossed the line for their first goal aswell.

On a side not it's a shame that Falcao didn't score when he hit the bar. It would of gave him alot of confidence... Hopefully he can get his first goal in the next game

 

[Mali_Zeus]

We looked great in attack, shaky in defence but at HT I thought we just need one more goal and that's that. We scored the 3rd but penalty changed the game. We shouldnt have folded like that after it though, it seemed we're scared and we let them back in the game right away. After that it was embarassing.

Some positive signs are there, I finally enjoyed watching us play, and it seems we dont have a problem scoring anymore, 7 goals in 2 games, but we dont have a problem of conceding either.

LVG needs to sort out the defense, put some self belief in them not to crumble like that again. There are new players and team spirit is still to be formed but LVG has a massive task and no time to waist.

We need a new CB in january too it seems.

Problem for next game is we'll have a completely new CB pair opposite to today and god knows how will that look. At least Shaw will finally play. We should put 2 or 3 in quick order vs West Ham but given our form I wouldnt be surprised if we dont win it....

Dont know.. This completely ruined my weekend.

 

[AKDevil]

That's a bit harsh, to say the least. How exactly did Rafael give the ref reason? By doing nothing wrong?

Clattenburg got that decision shamelessly wrong. This is becoming a case of Rafael's reputation playing against him. It was a dive.

By reacting petulantly to a decision against him and chargingr back at Vardy in the box. If he wants to get back in position, why not do that by running around him rather than trying to run through him? When have you ever been able to do that? And in the box too? I just don't get it. He's been booked and sent off for numerous and similar moments of petulance. At what point do you learn? Yes Vardy exaggerated but he made the most of a dumb challenge. Yes clattenburg called the penalty decision wrong - it happens - but only because he had a decision to make in the first place. Wouldn't be so annoying and would be forgiven if I hadn't seen it over and over and over again in incidents involving Rafael.

 

[Drifter]

Yeah it was Clattenburg. Keep telling yourselves that over and over and you might just believe it.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

Yeah it was Clattenburg. Keep telling yourselves that over and over and you might just believe it.

He started it, but they let it get to them and lost their composure which is a recipe for disaster. Especially when the captain, who you would want to be able to organise and rally the troops was more intent on moaning at the referee. I would hope the manager has told them this and it won't happen again.

 

[Smoke On the Water]

I am sure everyone has had their little hissy fit in here and fair enough but it isn't the end of the world. Our attack really clicked and for what we paid for it; Fair enough it should have. The defence definitely has problems. Another injury and sending off will compound that next week but it is reeling. There is not much we can really do with that but hope to god it holds for the next few weeks.

I can't blame Blackett, one little error coupled with a bad game will dent his confidence and he is only a young lad. He had done well up until this game. I am also embarrassed to see people turn on Rafael for shockingly attempting to not let a player stroll into the box unopposed after being fouled and then having the disservice of the guy completely dive and be blamed for 'fouling him' resulting in the match turning penalty.

I've said it in the past (obviously not on here), the blight of diving is never going to be eradicated if referee's keep giving this garbage. I am not sure what goes through their mind when they see things like this and award them. There has to be some form enlightenment as to why referee's continue to fall for blatant diving and give match changing decisions because of their interpretation and often wrong view of an event.

Frustrating but let's pick ourselves up and come back next week. Confidence was sky high in a spike as if on a drug and by the end of that game we were on the hard come down sitting in the corner shivering and sweating profusely. We have to kick the habit, bring ourselves back into line and find the balance.

 

[manichester]

We have a defensive unit that has never played together, Blackett has done very well for a young guy that has not played PL football before and not had a consistent or senior defender to help him. It was Rojo second game and yet another change with Evans going off. We have to find a way to keep players fit or dispense with the sickies and bring in some new players.

 

[Rams]

First of all, DeLaet has to be sent off. Clattenburg gives the foul, but doesn't produce a yellow card. It was a 100% yellow card offence by any stretch of the imagination. If Leicester are down to 10 men at that stage it's game set and match. DeLaet also had a big hand later on in the match.
Secondly, for the first penalty not only does Clattenburg not give a foul for the most blatant shove you'll ever see, he also gives a penalty when Rafael hasn't even made a challenge, it was a horrible dive. That goal completely changed the match and gave Leicester wings.
Finally, another blatant shove on Blackett preceding the 2nd penalty and red card, and thus ending any hope of United getting back in the match.

Of course, United should have defended much better. But at the end of the Clattenburg has cost us 3 points.

 

[Eila]

What I get from this is that Cambiasso plays for Leicester. When did that even happen?

 

[Ballache]

I felt that after going 3-1 up we should have taken off a striker and played 4-5-1. it offers more protection for the back 4 (especially the full-backs) and helps us control the game better. We have a lack of cojones in our team and that's been the case for two seasons now. Not enough players took responsibility and we were losing too many 50-50 balls. For the next match, I'd like to see Mata as #10 and RvP Dropped to the bench. He scored today but did little else and seems uninterested. We have ourselves to blame tbh, shit decision for the penalty aside, we gifted them the match.

 

[surf]

This is the 60's over again. Great attack, porous defence, plenty of goals, never know what to expect. After the predictability of the Fergie era it takes some getting used to.

Di Maria man of the match again (think he has been in every game he's played).

Shaw at left back please.

Not sure what happens next with Mata. Today's front 3 will probably be given more time so he may need to be patient.

Clatters got the first penalty wrong. It was a game changing decision only because we allowed it to become so. We were still ahead 3-2 and should have been able to see out the match. I like the fact that van Gaal didn't whine about the refereeing. Instead he was saying that he and the team should take responsibility for the defeat, which is correct IMO.

 

[Mibabalou]

I for one thought it was really bazar when Januzaj and Mata came on and we set up like this;

RvP - Januzaj
Rooney
Mata ---- Herrera
Blind


​

Januzaj is the closest thing we have to a like for like swap with Di Maria and it's been shown all last season Mata is nowhere near as good wide left then in the #10 position.



IMO we should have lined up like this;

Rooney - RvP
Mata
Januzaj ---- Herrera
Blind​

Im not sure this would have made a difference but playing people in their best positions always helps.

 

[Lennon7]

Painfully frustrating watching that analysis on MOTD2. What have we been doing defensively in training? Why are they all so shaky on the ball? The organisation is fecking awful. We need to bring in a leader for the centre of defence who can influence players on the training pitch and organise them on the field.

 

[Sultan]

I thought once United went 2 up they lost their shape due to over confidence and wanting to play champaign football. It would not have been hard to play possession football and to pick off Leicester on the break. Taking our most effective player (Di Maria) off was strange when we were needing a result.

 

[Sultan]

Painfully frustrating watching that analysis on MOTD2. What have we been doing defensively in training? Why are they all so shaky on the ball? The organisation is fecking awful. We need to bring in a leader for the centre of defence who can influence players on the training pitch and organise them on the field.

This was Rafael's second game in months, Smalling just coming back from injury, Tyler is still an apprentice, and Rojo was playing his second game. It's the first time they have all played as a group, and it showed.

 

[reelworld]

Defensive side of the game is always about coordination and understanding less about individual talents. I think we could get Benatia and would still concede 5 goals of the defence were not playing like a unit.
Furthermore, United had a history of playing shit when they feel injustice being done to them. However under Fergie, they always have the perfect response the next game.
I think we will be fine, playing as a unit in defense is always takes time. The mental side of the game will be Van Gaal homework, and I'm giving him the chance that he will fix that given his reputation

 

[Gerald G]

Proper gutted about today's game. At 1-3 up we were cruising. I usually don't like blaming the ref but if he didn't make two terrible decisions we wouldn't be talking about United losing it would be a totally different discussion. In saying that, we were pathetic after we conceded the 2nd. We couldn't pass anymore, we lacked organisation defensively and it was just really poor.

I'm always of the opinion that there is usually 2 or 3 minor errors leading to a goal and that was most valid in their equaliser. The first point was Smalling + Blind. They got in each others way which led to a poor header it fell to Rooney and his 'clearance' was dreadful. After that you might say it was a bit unlucky but we still should have cleared it afterwards. I thought we then went a bit too open at 3-3 leaving us vulnerable on the counter and some of the subs were bemusing. Wrong decision to take off Di Maria, but why put Januzaj up top and Mata as a LCM? It didn't make any sense to me. For their 4th goal we were so high up. Rojo tried to play a 1-2 with Mata but the 1-2 wasn't even on.

As much as we've got to get a better defender I think organisation is also key. We lacked that defensively today. Forget about the personnel, they didn't defend as a unit and that was the biggest problem.

van Persie despite his goal was pretty quite too and he slowed down all of our attacking play. Still, we did a lot of good stuff going forward and it feels like our defence just let the rest of the team down. So disappointed.

 

[nimic]

Let him know he owes us one for next time maybe? Sir Alex always took that attitude with officials so maybe that's where I've developed this opinion from. At the end of the day the man in black is extremely lowly paid and poorly trained compared to the 22 other men on the pitch yet he may have more influence on the result than any of them. They can be and are susceptible to pressure, at the end of the day Clattenburg was a man who was employed as an electrician before he was doing this, he's hardly the most intelligent person.

What a ridiculous thing to say.

 

[jem]

Still fuming (mainly at rafael to be honest - pointless blaming officials in my eyes. Only makes a decision coz rafa gives him reason too). However, one consolation I can take. Money well spent on things going forward so hopefully when we do it on defence it will have same effect in terms of improvement.

In the meantime, think there might be more of today between now and January window especially as you can hardly say we have any defenders out who can come in and make a big difference.

Why? What the hell was he supposed to do? If he'd just sat there on the ground, you and everybody would be having a go at him for giving up.