I always liked him and with our thin options we should have kept him. But let not his form for leverkusen dilute the past. He was very poor for us in his last season and was constantly getting hammered in this forum. A change has worked wonders for him which is great to see.
Javier 'Chicarito' Hernandez: thank you and goodbye.
- Thread starter NessunDorma
- Start date
Giggs should have smacked LVG when he made that stupid face. So a player misses a chance and LVG loses his shite. What about Rooney and the crap he is dishing out!That fecking face by Giggs, man.
Hernandez is part of the past. Let's try and live in the present.
Amazing!
I'm happy for him, well deserved.
I agree with van gaal selling him. Scoring isn't part of the philosophy. Hernandez scores goals. See the problem?
What even are goals?
Let's not pretend any of us saw this coming. He was deemed surplus by pretty much everybody here after a couple of below par seasons. I don't blame van Gaal for getting rid, but not signing a replacement was daft.
I saw it coming he's always scored goals when he was given a chance, you can't expect a player to play well when he is not getting games. I found it really disrespectful when people were calling him deadwood, berating his first touch. Saying he is not good enough for Manchester United which is fecking hilarious, his first season proved he is good enough he was one of the main reasons we won the 19th title. Even when Fergie used him less (because he did not kick up a fuss) he still scored goals, then we had that useless fecker who drained all the confidence from most of our players. I knew he would start scoring again, he's pushing Bayer Leverkusen to the Champions League places with his goals. Plus there are rumours Arsenal and Chelsea want him.
This. But the writing was on the wall when he was loaned out.. to Madrid of all clubs. You don't loan out a seasoned pro and then expect him to come back and fit into the first team especially to Madrid when he was not going to play, it was basically just getting him out the squad sending him there and a message from LvG saying he was not wanted.
He came back, and it seemed the backroom staff most likely Giggs coaxed LvG into giving him another chance as they knew what he was capable of but after a penalty miss, that was enough for LvG to get rid of him which is terrible manangment.
His record has always been good, and although he was missing more chances towards the end of his career here, he was still getting himself in goalscoring positions and not lacking confidence. It was clear once he got a run of games for someone, and scored a few goals he would be an asset for any team in the world. He's never going to be a world class striker, there is too many limitations in his game but if you play attacking football and get the ball in the box, he will score goals.
In addition, he's quality coming off the bench, he can sense team's weaknesses and tries to make an impact straight away, and he has been able to do that many times in his career. Also he is quite content having that substitute roll where he plays 20-30 minutes to try influence the game with the occasional start.
Yeah, plenty of people saw this coming and said as much consistently. He scores goals everywhere when he's given the chance
Yes because that's why he was sold.
As the creator of this thread, and someone who really liked Hernandez, I think we need to be careful in presuming it was a mistake to sell him because of his current form.
Ask yourself this: would you be happy with Hernandez as our long term, first choice striker? You can say 'But he's better than Rooney!', and that might be true at the moment.
But is he good enough to be a long term, first choice striker for a club with pretensions of winning the Premier League and Champions League - i.e. us? If the answer is 'no', then surely we should be aiming higher (and yes, that includes aiming higher than the current version of Rooney as well).
There are a few strikers around Europe who are capable of scoring regularly, without necessarily being good enough all round players for an elite side (what you gain in goals, you lose in other areas).
LvG didn't think he was up to it at the top level, and apparently Real Madrid didn't either, or they would've signed him. And we know he wasn't much interested in continuing to be a squad player. Hence the sale.
I'd love for him to still be here as part of the squad, but ultimately, he didn't want to be.
And I want us to sign someone in the bracket above come summer, so that our attack is spearheaded by someone who is world class or on the verge of it.
Ask yourself this: would you be happy with Hernandez as our long term, first choice striker? You can say 'But he's better than Rooney!', and that might be true at the moment.
But is he good enough to be a long term, first choice striker for a club with pretensions of winning the Premier League and Champions League - i.e. us? If the answer is 'no', then surely we should be aiming higher (and yes, that includes aiming higher than the current version of Rooney as well).
There are a few strikers around Europe who are capable of scoring regularly, without necessarily being good enough all round players for an elite side (what you gain in goals, you lose in other areas).
LvG didn't think he was up to it at the top level, and apparently Real Madrid didn't either, or they would've signed him. And we know he wasn't much interested in continuing to be a squad player. Hence the sale.
I'd love for him to still be here as part of the squad, but ultimately, he didn't want to be.
And I want us to sign someone in the bracket above come summer, so that our attack is spearheaded by someone who is world class or on the verge of it.
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Hernandez has got nearly as much as United have got all bloody season (league)
Errr I've repeatedly posted he should have been kept, and also played more in previous seasons. i dont even think his last few seasons were even bad, he was still putting up numbers despite not being played and or limited to sub appearances. Sure i didnt expect him to be first choice over Wayne but then again i thought wayne would have been able to get us 20 goals played upfront. you win some you lose some
You're the exception rather than the rule, i'm afraid. You must have seen the pretty wide consensus here that he was no real loss.Errr I've repeatedly posted he should have been kept, and also played more in previous seasons. i dont even think his last few seasons were even bad, he was still putting up numbers despite not being played and or limited to sub appearances. Sure i didnt expect him to be first choice over Wayne but then again i thought wayne would have been able to get us 20 goals played upfront. you win some you lose some
Happy for the guy though, he's getting minutes every week for Leverkusen and is shining again.
By those standards only DDG, Shaw, Smalling and ADM should have been purchased or kept. The rest OUT.
It doesn't really prove anything other than they were wrong too. A lot of people may also have based their opinion on their thinking that Van Gaal wouldn't play him anyway.
Or visa versa.
Some jouno should directly ask Van Gaal does he regret selling Hernandez.
I am completely unsurprised that he is doing this well. Considering that he was going near 20 goals in limited time here, always thought that he could reach 30 per season if he becomes the main man.
I am completely unsurprised that he is doing this well. Considering that he was going near 20 goals in limited time here, always thought that he could reach 30 per season if he becomes the main man.
Yep, this.
Is he good enough to win the title/be in Barca's starting eleven (and variations of these two) means feck all when we can say only for De Gea that is good enough for the later (and Shaw/Smalling for the former).
He has always been a good goalscorer, the problem is he doesn't add anything else.
Under Roger Schmidt who plays very direct football he obviously fits in perfectly.
Keeping him in his peak years as a sub wouldn't have been fair to him, he deserves his time to be the main man.
Under Roger Schmidt who plays very direct football he obviously fits in perfectly.
Keeping him in his peak years as a sub wouldn't have been fair to him, he deserves his time to be the main man.
He works as hard as any player, and his all round game is decent nowadays.
He isn't a world class striker (and likely, he won't ever be), but he is a very good player. At his best, he has been a top 10 - top 20 striker in the world (and comfortably top 5 in EPL), and he is doing incredibly well this season. If he had played for us instead of Rooney, we would have been in a better position.
The shame thing is that it is very likely that we will spend now/summer a ton of money for a striker who probably isn't as good as him
Were there any big crucial matches where he was a starter for United and delivered?
I don't think we will. If we buy a striker it will be because he got the potential to be World class or already is, Lewandowski is unrealistic, but that is the kind of caliber we will go for i hope.
Too much sense.
Thank you.
I don't think we are in the position to be discussing about the "other aspects" of strikers like link up play e.t.c considering that our players couldn't score in a brothel. Pretty simple, we fecked up selling him
He scored every game against chelsea
I would say the replacement was Martial. Hernandez was finally let go after that signing.
Now why on earth Van Gaal let both RVP and Hernandez go and only replaced them with Martial is just ???. Maybe he expected Rooney and Fellaini to not be shit there or something.
I said they were wrong, that was my point.
Well we are top of the league, better than United/Leverkusen and have the best #10 in the World but sure....
Chelsea fans were delighted to see the back of Hernandez. Literally a thorn in their flesh.
Because most top teams have a guarantee starter and a backup. If you assumed Rooney was the starter and Martial the cover, you can see the logic behind the sales.
I keep repeating it but LVGs biggest issue is trusting Rooney to be an Aguerro/Suarez/Benzema even level player. If Rooney played like a 300k a week player and was banging goals in left right and center, no one would care about this.
When Ruud left United, he went on to score a fine amount of goals for Madrid. No one gave a single feck though did they, why? Because our players were doing the business.
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And unfairly so. A typical example of the sheep at work. The manager says it, so it must be right. Football's equivalent of Stepford Wives.
Hernandez wasn't getting a fair crack of the whip. His confidence was shot to pieces. He wasn't getting the chance to build up any kind of confidence or momentum. Against Aston Villa he was superb - dropped for the next game. How do players flourish in those kind of circumstances.
In his first season with us, he was amazing. He's now amazing for Leverkusen. Proof that he was under-used and not allowed to prove himself in the time between.
Rooney has been garbage all season but is somehow allowed to live off past glories. Chico's past glories, in that first season especially, are discarded.
Well I might just be able to live with that.
No you didn't.
I dunno, back in the day there was Rooney (when he was good) - Berbatov - Chicharito - Owen.
Then there was Rooney - RVP - Welbeck - Hernandez
This season it feels the options off the bench just aren't good enough. The usual sub option is Fellaini. You think he's a good striker?
Ah, but I agree that Rooney has become a problem. He's not useless, but not worthy of being the captain, undropable and enjoying a 300k per week salary.
He'll be a monumental conundrum for the rest of his days here. Just how to include him?
Moving Martial wide was a shame, as he's obviously better through the middle and a real threat there.
Rooney up front at least stops any delaying and messing around of attacks.
But then you have no pace or strength up front.
No 10 means you can have that thrust from Martial up front, but Roon is no assist maestro.
Centre mid? Well, let's hope we never see those days again!
Shocking we even have to talk about the league's top earner in a sort of how can we best conceal him sort of way! Should be the star player lighting the league up!
Let's be honest, when he missed that sitter in the summer the majority were laughing and posting LvG-Giggs reaction over and over. The love-in with him was long gone since his rubbish stint at Madrid and criticized both his abilities AND the stuff he said about Madrid being the biggest a minute after he touched down there. Most did not want him here anymore or did not care either way, he was another Cleverly/Fletcher/Nani/Evans category footballer to them. Get rid and if we don't we'll moan when he next has a bad first touch.
Hindsight is amazing, now everyone suddenly knows what an amazing player our beloved Chicarito is.
Hindsight is amazing, now everyone suddenly knows what an amazing player our beloved Chicarito is.
Wrong to get rid, or wrong to not replace him adequately?
I don't think you can blame Van Gaal for shipping him out when he'd been poor for two years. Most here conceded that he would never amount to more than a squad player with us, or even match the form of his debut season. The consensus was basically that at 27 he needed to get first team football. Sure playing first team football has helped him, but it's clear he's currently playing a fair few levels above what he showed for both us and Madrid in a side much more suited to his abilities.