LVG Out Thread | BBC: Sacked!

Do you want LVG sacked?

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Sweet Square said:
Dare I say that most here would have taken that at the start of the season.
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I doubt that's true. In fact, I'm almost positive it's not. Most expected an improvement on his first season, both in terms of results and - not least - performances.

Barely stumbling into a 4th place finish, after a generally frustrating - and dreary, performance wise - season can't possibly be called an improvement.

Winning the FA Cup (if we actually do that) is a nice bonus, nothing more - and hardly anyone would've regarded it as anything more at the beginning of the season either.

As for the board - who knows, you may be right about them. I actually doubt that too, based on what we know (which isn't much, granted): 3rd is apparantly the default target - and they don't value the FA Cup very highly in terms of bonuses and whatnot (which is arguably an indication). At best, I'd guess the board would consider a 4th place finish an absolute minimum - which leaves the question of actual improvement: If the latter is part of LVG's job description, he has failed by reasonable standards. Winning the FA Cup can't possibly change that.
 
Will Absolute said:
Not a great foundation. After a huge financial outlay the quality of the team leaves a lot to be desired. To bring us up to standard we'll have to spend like drunken sailors over the summer. Let's hope the money is available.
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Aye. I meant in terms of setting us up for CL meaning the transfer window will be a lot easier to navigate and the place will be a lot more positive. Not in terms of an incredible team to work with.
 
Sweet Square said:
Might be for the ''board'' of United who are a slight more realistic into terms of target's. If we take that the first year of LVG was just about getting Top 4 then the second season can't really be much better, can it ? It's likely United expected a title challenge and further into the CL but that's really the ideal outcome, a possible second season in the CL and potential FA Cup can't be that far down the list,. Dare I say that most here would have taken that at the start of the season.

As for football the type of football we are playing, we'r on and off(Mostly off). While most of the season we've played shite football at times we've played the best stuff in years. So it's hardly enough of a reason to sack someone(Also the guy you would replacing LVG with is hardly known for his great attacking football).

Again just saying it seems odd that mid way through your 3 year plan you throw it all way because you (potentially) end the season with a FA Cup and Top 4 finish.
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It just seems like the sort of things that would be claimed by people who don't watch football, just follow results and look at tables.

The league has been crap, and snatching fourth in what should have been a season of progress would be nothing of the sort.

I'd like to think that even though it's easy to dismiss our board as a bunch of suits who have no idea in football, they could have gained some knowledge. It's just football, after all. You don't need to be a genius in order to realise when something is bad.
 
Chesterlestreet said:
I doubt that's true. In fact, I'm almost positive it's not. Most expected an improvement on his first season, both in terms of results and - not least - performances.

Barely stumbling into a 4th place finish, after a generally frustrating - and dreary, performance wise - season can't possibly be called an improvement.

Winning the FA Cup (if we actually do that) is a nice bonus, nothing more - and hardly anyone would've regarded it as anything more at the beginning of the season either.

As for the board - who knows, you may be right about them. I actually doubt that too, based on what we know (which isn't much, granted): 3rd is apparantly the default target - and they don't value the FA Cup very highly in terms of bonuses and whatnot (which is arguably an indication). At best, I'd guess the board would consider a 4th place finish an absolute minimum - which leaves the question of actual improvement: If the latter is part of LVG's job description, he has failed by reasonable standards. Winning the FA Cup can't possibly change that.
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Nobody expected the top teams to all go to pot and Leicester and Spurs to up their game. It has been a very strange season. Our football has still been terrible though and that is down to the manager. Not sure if it is his tactics or that he just isn't capable of getting his methods across to the players. The fact we take everything he says the wrong way, it is certainly possible the players are doing the same. If we do the right thing with regards a manager and strengthen the team in the right way things could be a whole lot better next season. I will be happy if we get 4th and the cup. Is it enough not really?
 
If we come top 4 (still skeptical) and win the cup, IMO he would have earned the right to see his final season out.
I am taking the fact that the squad was paper thin before he season started(I know that's his fault) and the truly abominable injury situation at times.
It would be a pretty decent turnaround. Mid January after we lost to Norwich, I thought our season was going completely into the gutter, heading for mid table and was desperate for the club to do something, even though I didn't know what they should have done. We had something daft like 1 win in 10 at that point.

If he does stay as I think he will if we achieve those things, I hope he's learnt some big lessons.
 
Adisa said:
If we come top 4 (still skeptical) and win the cup, IMO he would have earned the right to see his final season out.
I am taking the fact that the squad was paper thin before he season started(I know that's his fault) and the truly abominable injury situation at times.
It would be a pretty decent turnaround. Mid January after we lost to Norwich, I thought our season was going completely into the gutter, heading for mid table and was desperate for the club to do something, even though I didn't know what they should have done. We had something daft like 1 win in 10 at that point.

If he does stay as I think he will if we achieve those things, I hope he's learnt some big lessons.
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Yes the Norwich game on Saturday clearly showed he had learnt his lessons...
 
Cassidy said:
Yes the Norwich game on Saturday clearly showed he had learnt his lessons...
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I am talking more in the line of squad planning. As for Norwich, we were facing a team fighting for their lives, I don't understand how anyone would have expected us to go there, play with all the swagger in the world and smash them.
 
Adisa said:
I am talking more in the line of squad planning. As for Norwich, we were facing a team fighting for their lives, I don't understand how anyone would have expected us to go there, play with all the swagger in the world and smash them.
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Did you watch the game? No one expected us to smash them, but we only scored due to error by Bassong. We were dull the whole game (sounds familiar?), not that Norwich played beyond their level. Big difference.

Rashford was rested out of all the time for a must win game!
 
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Adisa said:
I am talking more in the line of squad planning. As for Norwich, we were facing a team fighting for their lives, I don't understand how anyone would have expected us to go there, play with all the swagger in the world and smash them.
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I was more looking at his interesting squad selection for a must win game, we got lucky
 
Adisa said:
I am talking more in the line of squad planning. As for Norwich, we were facing a team fighting for their lives, I don't understand how anyone would have expected us to go there, play with all the swagger in the world and smash them.
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I would have been more annoyed that he left two of our better players at home, while he knew we were already one short with Fellaini, rather than just putting them on the bench. Then lo and behold Martial gets injured, Herrera has to come in when he wouldn't have been prepared to start the game and leaves us short on the bench. You have to just love Louis.
 
krazyrobus said:
WTF, can you seriously say that with his track record...
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Well, we've become more of a counterattacking team in the last few months so there's that. But I was talking more in line of selling player before you bring replacements in and general squad planning. I hope he rectifies our shocking lack of depth in attack.
If he stays(you or I don't have control over it). We just have to hope he has learnt some lessons from this season.
 
Adisa said:
Well, we've become more of a counterattacking team in the last few months so there's that. But I was talking more in line of selling player before you bring replacements in and general squad planning. I hope he rectifies our shocking lack of depth in attack.
If he stays(you or I don't have control over it). We just have to hope he has learnt some lessons from this season.
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If we get 4th and win the cup, he will likely brag that him having a small squad has worked. Despite that most of the times we have been close to disaster.
 
Adisa said:
Well, we've become more of a counterattacking team in the last few months so there's that. But I was talking more in line of selling player before you bring replacements in and general squad planning. I hope he rectifies our shocking lack of depth in attack.
If he stays(you or I don't have control over it). We just have to hope he has learnt some lessons from this season.
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LVG version of counter attacking is different than SAF and most managers. Other managers counter attacking with direct passes. LVG asked the team passes around even with counter attacking. There was a moment in this game, we were counter attacking late in the game and our midfielders passed along themselves and ended up losing the ball in midfield!

We were lucky that of one of the direct long ball ended up with Bassong mistake and led to the goal! This is the fluke, not a norm for LVG's counter attacking tactic if you can stay up and watch the whole game.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
If we get 4th and win the cup, he will likely brag that him having a small squad has worked. Despite that most of the times we have been close to disaster.
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Haha. My biggest worry about him staying still remains the possibility of Giggs taking over. That is a risk I can't handle.
 
Adisa said:
Haha. My biggest worry about him staying still remains the possibility of Giggs taking over. That is a risk I can't handle.
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Same here. He was splattered all over the papers again yesterday. If he became manager there will be women crawling out of the woodwork with their stories, true or not. He would not get a minutes piece and the club will be dragged through the mud.
 
Adisa said:
I am talking more in the line of squad planning. As for Norwich, we were facing a team fighting for their lives, I don't understand how anyone would have expected us to go there, play with all the swagger in the world and smash them.
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Lets not get carried away here.
I saw the Norwich game and agreed with the commentary team who stated that Norwich were totally useless in the final 3rd. They gave up before the match started and were not fighting for anything.
Had Madrid played Norwich, it'd probably have been 10-1 or similar.
Norwich were absolutely dire.
We scored 1 goal (which was LVG's plan).
 
sunama said:
Lets not get carried away here.
I saw the Norwich game and agreed with the commentary team who stated that Norwich were totally useless in the final 3rd. They gave up before the match started and were not fighting for anything.
Had Madrid played Norwich, it'd probably have been 10-1 or similar.
Norwich were absolutely dire.
We scored 1 goal (which was LVG's plan).
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We had 14 chances, but only two on target. I think if Rashford or Martial had played we would have had more goals.
 
I think since the forum reboot only 1 thread had more views and replies than this one...

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    That's the "Moyes So Far" thread.

    Will this thread top it?
 
Norwich played like they were already relegated and they had Jerome as a striker, a player who makes Giroud seem like Suarez. In that light, our performance was bloody pathetic; a competent team would've dispatched them 4-0, and a competent striker would've bagged all four.
 
Just read somewhere that Barcelona have scored 201 goals this season. So far away we are from Madrid, Barcelona, Bayern now. We used to rub shoulders with them once upon a time.

Thanks LVG.
 
SteveJ said:
Norwich played like they were already relegated and they had Jerome as a striker, a player who makes Giroud seem like Suarez. In that light, our performance was bloody pathetic; a competent team would've dispatched them 4-0, and a competent striker would've bagged all four.
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As I said above, if Martial or/and Rashford had played I think we would have scored earlier and then I think they would have collapsed. Unfortunately we had Memphis/Rooney/Lingard/Mata. Mata saved us. Memphis and Lingard have shown no composure when in scoring positions.
 
I really think it will all depend on how we finish the season. If we manage 4th or/and win the FA-Cup he will get his third year. If we fail on both fronts he will probably get sacked.

Since I'm almost certain that we will reach at least one of these two targets I have almost made my peace with having to endure another year under LvG.
 
If we'd finished 4th or 3rd but put up a proper title challenge and played good exciting football then yes I think finishing top 4 and winning a cup would have been accepted by the fans.

But finishing top 4, not that it's a huge triumph anyway, and winning a cup doesn't make up for the absolute dogshit football we've had to watch all year. That's why he has to go.
 
Sweet Square said:
Might be for the ''board'' of United who are a slight more realistic into terms of target's. If we take that the first year of LVG was just about getting Top 4 then the second season can't really be much better, can it ? It's likely United expected a title challenge and further into the CL but that's really the ideal outcome, a possible second season in the CL and potential FA Cup can't be that far down the list,. Dare I say that most here would have taken that at the start of the season.

As for football the type of football we are playing, we'r on and off(Mostly off). While most of the season we've played shite football at times we've played the best stuff in years. So it's hardly enough of a reason to sack someone(Also the guy you would replacing LVG with is hardly known for his great attacking football).

Again just saying it seems odd that mid way through your 3 year plan you throw it all way because you (potentially) end the season with a FA Cup and Top 4 finish.
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Everything we've done this season, is inspite of the idiot in charge. It's a testament to the quality of the players we have at the moment, that we might get an FA Cup and a top 4 finish despite having an idiot manager who's decision making has cost us repeatedly
 
Amir said:
It just seems like the sort of things that would be claimed by people who don't watch football, just follow results and look at tables.

The league has been crap, and snatching fourth in what should have been a season of progress would be nothing of the sort.

I'd like to think that even though it's easy to dismiss our board as a bunch of suits who have no idea in football, they could have gained some knowledge. It's just football, after all. You don't need to be a genius in order to realise when something is bad.
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Well no snatching fourth wouldn't be progress of a sort but it's a hardly a complete failure. And nowhere near enough to warrant getting rig your long term plan(we are one game away from a trophy, something this club hasn't had in the last two years),
My point is that if United are sticking to this long term plan of Giggs becoming the manager then this season is just another stepping stone to that end goal. Not saying I agree with it but there is sense to it.


As for realising something is bad, that's just hyperbole on here.

Example -
Skills said:
Everything we've done this season, is inspite of the idiot in charge. It's a testament to the quality of the players we have at the moment, that we might get an FA Cup and a top 4 finish despite having an idiot manager who's decision making has cost us repeatedly
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Yes we play shite football most of the time(And occasionally play some great stuff - 3 - 0 against Stoke at Old Trafford)but we are hardly on the brink of collapsing and disappearing down the football league. We play some rubbish football that's all. And as you said it's just football.
 
NoLogo said:
I really think it will all depend on how we finish the season. If we manage 4th or/and win the FA-Cup he will get his third year. If we fail on both fronts he will probably get sacked.

Since I'm almost certain that we will reach at least one of these two targets I have almost made my peace with having to endure another year under LvG.
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If we get top 4 and win the FA cup. It would mean we had won 11 of our last 13 games. I just can't see the club sacking him after that. If it was Madrid, then yes but I can't see us doing the same.
 
DomesticTadpole said:
We had 14 chances, but only two on target. I think if Rashford or Martial had played we would have had more goals.
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Perhaps. But Rashford and Martial did not play.
Instead, we played with our first team stalwarts - Rooney, Mata - as well as Depay.
Even with these attackers (who IMO are woeful), I expect more than 1 goal against a Norwich side, who looked resigned to defeat, from the get-go.
In any case, like all our games, the target is to score 1 goal...which we achieved.
 
Adisa said:
If we get top 4 and win the FA cup. It would mean we had won 11 of our last 13 games. I just can't see the club sacking him after that. If it was Madrid, then yes but I can't see us doing the same.
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Madrid, Barca, Juventus, Porto, Bayern, Man City, Chelsea - any club who demand top results would sack their manager for scraping into 4th place, while playing the most boring football seen in the last few decades, at the respective club.
 
I don't get the sense that he wants to stay, to be honest. He's looked a bit haggard at times this season and didn't have quite the same fight in him. At his age, have to think he'll know it's wise to end his career on a positive note. It's not like he'd be walking away from a squad poised to win a treble anyway. Let someone else take over the rebuilding job.
 
Adisa said:
If we get top 4 and win the FA cup. It would mean we had won 11 of our last 13 games. I just can't see the club sacking him after that. If it was Madrid, then yes but I can't see us doing the same.
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he'd be gone at a club with ambition over money. which is why we play the shit football we do. crashing out of an easy group in CL , struggling to score at every level, KO'd by the dippers with ease in the 2nd tier of euro football. 250m spent and keeping him ensures another 100m in the bin.
 
Adisa said:
If we get top 4 and win the FA cup. It would mean we had won 11 of our last 13 games. I just can't see the club sacking him after that. If it was Madrid, then yes but I can't see us doing the same.
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After the season we had, not sacking him (especially when a manager with the caliber of Jose is ready and willing) is pure lunacy
 
Judas said:
It's amazing how quickly standards have slipped on here.
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Absolutely THIS!!!!!!!

I cannot believe what I'm reading in this thread. Standard have definitely dropped SHARPLY if we're now trying to justify and find top 4 acceptable, especially after such failures throughout the whole season.

This season has been a wreck, complete mess. We went out in the group stage in the CL in a very easy group, play abysmal football throughout the entire season, had runs of 3 or 4 consecutive games losing etc. This is why It's a must to get rid of rotten things out and take action as soon as possible when things are going south otherwise people start sleeping their standards and find way to justify even the worse of things out there.

People standards are dropping further and further as we go along. It was all about targeting the league and challenging for it, having a decent run in the CL and play decent football. These were the targets beginning of the season both fans, players, LVG and everyone United involved were eyeing. Then came the pathetic runs of defeats we had and suddenly standards started sleeping to what we have now which is scrapping top 4 after an horrific season being acceptable.

We should have gotten rid of LVG a long time ago when people still had reasonable standard for a club our size. Now people are just a bunch of defeatist and hold ridiculously low standards and somehow convinced themselves it's normal
 
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