General Election 2017 | Cabinet reshuffle: Hunt re-appointed Health Secretary for record third time

[RedSky]

To be honest regarding the deal your guess is as good as mine. I'm purely basing it on personalities. If work in commercial finance and I would negotiate with Corbyn all day long till I got the deal I wanted. May would probably annoy me and eventually I'd save the fight for another day, i.e. Backdown a little bit.

It might be an absurd simplified view, but let's be honest what else do we have to go on.

This is one area of the voting that comes down to a punt. There is no firm logic.

Whereas I've studied enough Economics and worked long enough in Finance to understand the difference between marketing and reality when it comes to what can and can't be achieved by a government and their policies.

Labour take an economic model that ignores free movement and tax evasion and assume therefore near perfect gains to every policy. They also seemingly ignore the cost of interest and value everything today as worth infinitely more than the future. Great marketing tools, but doomed to fail.

So we have to use Tories policy of not costing anything and using the old excuse of "we'll get to it eventually...". I'm sorry, but given I distrust the Tories already, their Manifesto and their lack of interest in discussing ANY of their policies puts me on red alert.

Corbyn has his faults, he'a dreamer and very ambitious but he's also a very good speaker and comes across as an honest guy. He's someone people could negotiate with. May has many faults as well, personally if my old business had to deal with someone like her we'd be laughing at her. Someone who wants it all her own way and won't back down, she comes across in every interview as someone who's back is against the wall. That is a great trait to have as a leader in war time, but Brexit isn't war, it's negotiation and with negotiation comes compromise, something that May simply doesn't look comfortable or capable of doing.

I am biased though, I have no love for the woman. Cameroon was a much better PM than she is.

 

[QuackQuack]

Are you sure, been through quite a few threads and seems to have a strong tory contingent as well.

For all the talk about young voters, for me the female vote is massive as they're usually more floaty and can lean either way whereas men tend to be pretty forthright in their views and stick to them.

I've been a member for a few years now and it is. There are more people who are in favour of labour.

https://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/2945130-To-do-our-own-poll

https://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_b...ry-voters-justify-cuts-to-disability-benefits

https://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_b...InTheSackAndIWouldntKickHimOutOfBedForFarting

The last one is questionable.

 

[Nytram Shakes]

People voting emotionally - ie, voting because of a person instead of policies, and perhaps for how something makes them feel as opposed to how it'll genuinely affect them.

fair enough.... is that a 100% a bad thing?
i mean i've voted Labour, i don't agree with all corbyns policies( scrapping tuition fees and £10 minimum wage by 2020 for instance) but part of the reason i have voted for Labour is because i trust Corbyn to at least try and do the right thing for the people of this country, I don't trust May at all, and i don't think she is a good person with best interests of some of the people of this county, especially the lower classes, at heart.

I don't really feel its a bad thing that i let my emotions, or my opinion of the leaders effect my vote.

* Their are a lot of labour policies i do agree with (privatisation of the Railways, scraping zero hour contracts, getting the top 5% of earners to pay a bit more.... I don't want it to sound like i voted for corbyn becuase i think he is a nice bloke, im just saying that it contributed to my vote and don't feel thats a bad thing.

 

[Raees]

I've been a member for a few years now and it is. There are more people who are in favour of labour.

https://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/2945130-To-do-our-own-poll

https://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_b...ry-voters-justify-cuts-to-disability-benefits

https://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_b...InTheSackAndIWouldntKickHimOutOfBedForFarting

The last one is questionable.

 

[Ubik]

Of all the elections to make this point, you choose this one? When a twice elected leader doesn't have even slight backing from massive numbers of his own party?

I make this point most elections because non-voting annoys me. If previous non-voters stay involved, maybe things change? Maybe calculations of politicians change?

 

[Ubik]

fair enough.... is that a 100% a bad thing?
i mean i've voted Labour, i don't agree with all corbyns policies( scrapping tuition fees and £10 minimum wage by 2020 for instance) but part of the reason i have voted for Labour is because i trust Corbyn to at least try and do the right thing for the people of this country, I don't trust May at all, and i don't think she is a good person with best interests of some of the people of this county, especially the lower classes, at heart.

I don't really feel its a bad thing that i let my emotions, or my opinion of the leaders effect my vote.

* Their are a lot of labour policies i do agree with (privatisation of the Railways, scraping zero hour contracts, getting the top 5% of earners to pay a bit more.... I don't want it to sound like i voted for corbyn becuase i think he is a nice bloke, im just saying that it contributed to my vote and don't feel thats a bad thing.

I didn't mean it as a bad thing, just as a thing that needs better understanding.

 

[QuackQuack]

Honestly, I did not create that thread.

 

[RedSky]

Honestly, I did not create that thread.

 

[Dobba]

I make this point most elections because non-voting annoys me. If previous non-voters stay involved, maybe things change? Maybe calculations of politicians change?

Well it's bold, I give you that.

 

[QuackQuack]

If it was about Keir Starmer then I'd admit it. Ive got a soft spot for him

 

[Nytram Shakes]

I didn't mean it as a bad thing, just as a thing that needs better understanding.

fair enough

 

[Manny]

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[Kentonio]

To be honest regarding the deal your guess is as good as mine. I'm purely basing it on personalities. If work in commercial finance and I would negotiate with Corbyn all day long till I got the deal I wanted. May would probably annoy me and eventually I'd save the fight for another day, i.e. Backdown a little bit.

It might be an absurd simplified view, but let's be honest what else do we have to go on.

It is an absurdly simplified view for many reasons, not least that neither Theresa May nor Jeremy Corbyn will be anywhere near the actual negotiations.

 

[Abizzz]

It's hilarious isn't it? Though saying that, it pales into comparison of May triggering an election, then screaming that we can't run the risk of Corbyn in charge of Brexit and that she can't be distracted away from the negotiations.

Pssst. The EU don't give a feck how many MPs the arms dealing vicar's daughter has. You'll note they didn't wait until Friday to hold their meeting to agree on their stance, they did it weeks ago. The only person 'damaging the outcome' is her, by your logic, by even giving people the chance to have someone else in charge of the process.

Yeah it's straight up delusional of Tories to think so. Votes are a currency (for governments) in Brussels because they allow them to make concessions to others without loosing power. It literally works the other way around than the Tories are attempting to do it: force concessions out of the other with their own majority.

I didn't want to go there, but from my perspective:
The UK needs a deal, but doesn't really want it.
The EU wants a deal, but doesn't really need it.

As unimaginable as I thought it would be 12 months ago I now think no deal is the most likely result should the conservatives stay in power.

 

[Fener1907]

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Although I'm not in that demographic anymore, it took my ages to get registered to vote in last year's referendum (abroad). If you can't be bothered to go to your local polling station to put one little X on a piece of paper, you deserve a slap.

 

[SteveJ]

As unimaginable as I thought it would be 12 months ago I now think no deal is the most likely result should the conservatives stay in power.

And it'll be dressed up as Mrs Strong and Stable telling EU bigwigs where to stuff their bendy bananas...while leaving us to beg trade deals off TrumpLand & the People's Republic of Atlantis.

 

[Minimalist]

It is an absurdly simplified view for many reasons, not least that neither Theresa May nor Jeremy Corbyn will be anywhere near the actual negotiations.

Regardless of that, the idea Corbyn would be easier to deal with than May is based on feck all. May is the one who can barely speak in public, looks hopeless under pressure and is the definition of a try-hard. Any negotiator worth their salt would tear her to shreds.

I'm not even a Corbyn supporter but he's looked much more statesmanlike than that daft aul bint.

 

[Tommy]

Aaaaand we've voted. Now to drink through the night as the results come in.

 

[Nytram Shakes]

As unimaginable as I thought it would be 12 months ago I now think no deal is the most likely result should the conservatives stay in power.

i disagree say what you want about the conservertive party, but they are defintly in the pockets of big buissness and city trading, and those guys want a deal so the tories will get a deal.

 

[Ducklegs]

i disagree say what you want about the conservertive party, but they are defintly in the pockets of big buissness and city trading, and those guys want a deal so the tories will get a deal.

As were the last Labour Government.

To the point where they didn't even bother to try to hide it. In the unlikely event Corbyn and his 6th form debating team get in to power tomorrow they will be exactly the same.

 

[Abizzz]

i disagree say what you want about the conservertive party, but they are defintly in the pockets of big buissness and city trading, and those guys want a deal so the tories will get a deal.

Usually I'd agree with you, but this isn't even the 'usual' Tories anymore. Big business and the city didn't want brexit, once that couldn't be undone they didn't want the government to trigger article 50 until things are "sorted", and they sure wouldn't have wanted WTO rules to be even mentioned as a possible outcome. I don't think the Tories represent the majority of the UK big business anymore, they have their clientele within big business who's interests I've not fully come to understand yet.

I hope you are right though.

 

[Kentonio]

As were the last Labour Government.

To the point where they didn't even bother to try to hide it. In the unlikely event Corbyn and his 6th form debating team get in to power tomorrow they will be exactly the same.

Exept they won't be exactly the same, because they're politically very different. The idea that 'they're all the same' is not actually true. Blair seemed similar to the Tories because he ran on a centrist platform and then the Tories moved to the centre to compete. During that period they were indeed very similar. Now the Tories are back on the right, Labour is back on the left, and they're nothing like each other.

 

[Fergies Gum]

Just voted and the place was much busier than usual.

Though its a safe seat for Labour.

 

[Giggsy92]

Feel like my vote's even more useless than two years ago, at least then I could convince myself that every vote mattered in a hung parliament scenario. Expecting a lot of Ukippers to flock back to the Tories and the Tories already got 50% here last time... Made worse by the fact that our MP is one of those just parachuted into a safe seat with no connection to the area. Was nice to see the Monster Raving Loony Party on my ballot though, thought they'd disappeared.

 

[matherto]

Nobody in the voting place when I went to vote at 11ish. Safe seat for Labour in any case.

First time voting so I didn't realise you only vote for your local constituency and it counts towards the total, thought I'd not been given the extra ballot sheet asking which party you want and which leader you want as PM.

 

[Fergies Gum]

Nobody in the voting place when I went to vote at 11ish. Safe seat for Labour in any case.

First time voting so I didn't realise you only vote for your local constituency and it counts towards the total, thought I'd not been given the extra ballot sheet asking which party you want and which leader you want as PM.

Yep, we only vote for the MP.

 

[Lennon7]

Nobody in the voting place when I went to vote at 11ish. Safe seat for Labour in any case.

First time voting so I didn't realise you only vote for your local constituency and it counts towards the total, thought I'd not been given the extra ballot sheet asking which party you want and which leader you want as PM.

That's how every election goes down. How old are you, out of curiosity?

It seems this year will have the highest turnout ever. That can only be a good thing for labour.

 

[rcoobc]

Nobody in the voting place when I went to vote at 11ish. Safe seat for Labour in any case.

First time voting so I didn't realise you only vote for your local constituency and it counts towards the total, thought I'd not been given the extra ballot sheet asking which party you want and which leader you want as PM.

There is so many interesting questions here.

Why was this your first time voting?

Why are you voting now?

Who did you vote for?

What do you know of the electoral system? Ho would you like it to be?

 

[Raees]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4582360/Your-hour-hour-guide-election-night.html

 

[Zebs]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...ation-mi6-led-wouldnt-clear-security-vetting/

My eyes are literally rolling out of my head. Load of propagandist bollox. The first time in decades that the people have the chance to have a decent, honest man as the leader of your country and people are still bringing this shit up. Without Corbyn, there quite possibly wouldn't be peace in Northern Ireland. He did what others wouldn't and engaged.

 

[rcoobc]

The communist vs the corkscrew

 

[RedSky]

My eyes are literally rolling out of my hand. Load of propagandist bollox. The first time in decades that the people have the chance to have a decent, honest man as the leader of your country and people are still bringing this shit up. Without Corbyn, there quite possibly wouldn't be peace in Northern Ireland. He did what others wouldn't and engaged.

Your hand?

 

[Raees]

There is so many interesting questions here.

Why was this your first time voting?

For the first time, there is a leader who I genuinely believe has a good moral standing and I agree with most of his take on the major issues which plague society and on the causes of certain issues. I disagree with some things naturally, but I can't see how on an intellectual level anyone can argue May is a superior leader to Corbyn. She comes across as abit of a dunce.

Didn't rate Miliband or Brown and whilst I liked Cameron, I wasn't ready to commit to a vote for the Tories.

Why are you voting now?

See above. The Corbyn factor.

Who did you vote for?

Labour.

that is my answer.

 

[Zebs]

Your hand?

feck sake.

 

[altodevil]

So far 36 responses to our prediction competition. Closes at 5pm today. Enter here: https://goo.gl/forms/PEGh6RjrAnMpRnRr1

 

[Ubik]

Quite a few young 'uns when I got there, also the usual battalions of oldies. May have accidentally put my polling card into the ballot box as well.

 

[montpelier]

Fully Fledged said: ↑
There wouldn't have been a vote if they hadn't called the referendum.

This was a gamble on May's part. The European conversations were clearly challenging and the momentum seemed to be behind Labour so she figured now would be a good time to cement here position in the strongest possible way. Reality frustratingly is many of our population are too stupid to understand this and having voted Brexit are now trying to damage our outcome by voting Labour.

@RedTillI'mDead

You know it was Cameron what done the referendum do you? Not that it matters in order to assess the reply you threw out here, I just wasn't sure.

But you then seem to say...

May called the Election due to the Labour momentum (with regard to something or other) so as to shore up her position?

You think people are voting Labour now to damage the Brexit that they voted to in favour of? (because they are stupid, I believe you said)

Is there any chance you could attempt a clarification of what you're actually trying to say here?

 

[Sigma]

Just voted for the first time. Spent like a whole minute checking I put a cross next to the correct name

Scary stuff!

 

[Ubik]

Just voted for the first time. Spent like a whole minute checking I put a cross next to the correct name

Scary stuff!

Still yet to stop doing this after a decade of voting

 

[Nick 0208 Ldn]

Nick, I will forever struggle to work out how you decide on your vote

Things might be different once the Brexit talks are n the past, or should there be a new centrist party. In the meantime though, it's always a case of where to prioritise: social policy, foreign policy, economy and local issues. I accept that Labour aren't particularly radical with regard to the socially liberal causes of import, but see the danger presented by May's inclinations. The Tories are likely best for negotiations with the EU, however a landslide would concern me.

It also helps that i don't have someone like Osborne as my local MP.