indeed- all of them
Mourinho's post match comments
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Q: Why this rant today and not after Sevilla?
A: Anyone can have a bad game, especially when the lights are brightest and you lack the prior experience in that situation (Champions League second leg, needing a win to progress, against a side you are favored to beat -- that's the pressure of expectations). So as long as the players tried and gave their best, you can't rip into them for failing. You just chalk it up as a learning experience.
But to then not respond like a blazing fire against a mid-table side, with a trip to Wembley on the line, and instead to "hide behind defenders," afraid to play, that's what triggered Mourinho. That lack of response shows a lack of personality and character, a lack of the United mentality of old, which Lukaku, Matic, and de Gea have.
It should be noted, Mourinho is hoping this spurs the guilty players on, and recognizes the risk of it backfiring (said so during the press conference), but thinks it's the best way to address the issue.
A: Anyone can have a bad game, especially when the lights are brightest and you lack the prior experience in that situation (Champions League second leg, needing a win to progress, against a side you are favored to beat -- that's the pressure of expectations). So as long as the players tried and gave their best, you can't rip into them for failing. You just chalk it up as a learning experience.
But to then not respond like a blazing fire against a mid-table side, with a trip to Wembley on the line, and instead to "hide behind defenders," afraid to play, that's what triggered Mourinho. That lack of response shows a lack of personality and character, a lack of the United mentality of old, which Lukaku, Matic, and de Gea have.
It should be noted, Mourinho is hoping this spurs the guilty players on, and recognizes the risk of it backfiring (said so during the press conference), but thinks it's the best way to address the issue.
He said nothing wrong, although whether he should have said it through the media was another thing.
So, he trained them for 2 days to attack quickly and aggressively but the players failed do it
How could one expect results over 2 days when this team plays with a slow build-up for ages, including the last 18 months?
How daft must one be to buy in the excuses that the players lack character, that most of them are pussies? Players can be brave in one context and cowards in another context, much depends on the atmosphere at the club and the manager himself.
Jose's comments are suicidal. Him staying for another season is the dream scenario for United's rivals.
How could one expect results over 2 days when this team plays with a slow build-up for ages, including the last 18 months?
How daft must one be to buy in the excuses that the players lack character, that most of them are pussies? Players can be brave in one context and cowards in another context, much depends on the atmosphere at the club and the manager himself.
Jose's comments are suicidal. Him staying for another season is the dream scenario for United's rivals.
Well that post press conference was brutal and thought I'd seen it all after his comments this week. Not sure where this leaves him tbh but I'm in no doubt there are players who mentally the seasons over and are already thinking about where they will be playing their football next season.
That said, I think he literally can't win as what he said is absolutely true for me and he'd be criticised by some for not saying in publicly as much as the perception would be that he was defending the players if he didn't.
As difficult it is hearing publicly, it needs to be said. There is a mentality that's become entrenched in the club and like Jose said, the shirts too heavy for the players. He suggested that players were didn't want the pressure of playing and it makes me question the validity of some of these players 'injuries'.
Honestly we might see some surprise exits this summer and I genuinely wouldn't be shocked if it was Pogba and/or Martial.
That said, I think he literally can't win as what he said is absolutely true for me and he'd be criticised by some for not saying in publicly as much as the perception would be that he was defending the players if he didn't.
As difficult it is hearing publicly, it needs to be said. There is a mentality that's become entrenched in the club and like Jose said, the shirts too heavy for the players. He suggested that players were didn't want the pressure of playing and it makes me question the validity of some of these players 'injuries'.
Honestly we might see some surprise exits this summer and I genuinely wouldn't be shocked if it was Pogba and/or Martial.
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Is it that easy for them though to be suddenly expected to be very attacking after what they were clearly asked to do on Tuesday, and many times before.
Jose playing up to the fans asking to be entertained for once, then throwing his toys out when we were pretty crap at it, it just doesn't come natural to us anymore.
When Mourinho spoke about mentality, about Juve, Real, Barca and Bayern always being there at the end of the CL. Where is our Ramos, where is our Chiellini, where is our Pique? These winners, these players who will never hide, who will drag their team when it matters.
When Lukaku has been called a donkey all year and he is the one who stands out now for a reason. It’s about being brave and not letting mistakes and pressure get on top of you. That’s why he praised McTominay. How can a kid show more of this mentality when there are players out there for us with superior talent.
When Lukaku has been called a donkey all year and he is the one who stands out now for a reason. It’s about being brave and not letting mistakes and pressure get on top of you. That’s why he praised McTominay. How can a kid show more of this mentality when there are players out there for us with superior talent.
He himself has about 1% of the charisma he first had when he came to England.
These comments are extremely concerning. I completely agree with the general premise that Jose inherited an unbalanced squad that lacked confidence and it needed a lot of work.
But almost 2 years and 8 signings later, he seems to only be happy with the mentality of 2 of his players and a youth team kid. If that's the case, it has to reflect badly on the manager.
If this was a calculated choice to motivate the players, to test their motivation levels, to see which players have the mental strength required to play for a big club, I would support it and whether right or wrong would know it was being done for the right reasons.
Unfortunately, I can't shake the feeling that this reaction is completely down to the personal criticism Mourinho received post Sevilla and his ego can't handle it. It is incredible, despite all of the success he has had in his career, how insecure he seems to be and how badly he reacts to criticism.
But almost 2 years and 8 signings later, he seems to only be happy with the mentality of 2 of his players and a youth team kid. If that's the case, it has to reflect badly on the manager.
If this was a calculated choice to motivate the players, to test their motivation levels, to see which players have the mental strength required to play for a big club, I would support it and whether right or wrong would know it was being done for the right reasons.
Unfortunately, I can't shake the feeling that this reaction is completely down to the personal criticism Mourinho received post Sevilla and his ego can't handle it. It is incredible, despite all of the success he has had in his career, how insecure he seems to be and how badly he reacts to criticism.
do you still think he's trying to turn into the ultimate players' coach? You're just latching onto whatever you can to feel better about things. He was just being a dick, saying the kind of thing he's said since he started management. There was nothing new in content or strategy there.
This.
To me Jose just strikes me as a bit clueless on how to build a cohesive attacking team at United and appears to be lashing out at everyone else to shift blame.
Sometimes I do wish we had a less restrictive manager. LVG and Jose - they really suck the joy out of football and I can imagine the players often feel the same way.
It is all well and good saying that the team does not have winners and leaders and I agree with that to a certain extent. However, isn't that Mourinho's responsibility to sign players with the mentality to play for him? Lukaku and Matic seem capable of this but what about the rest? Mkhi already gone, Pogba seems to have given up, Sanchez dropped after being poor, Lindelof cannot get ahead of Smalling...
Are we saying that all these players including the ones whom he signed do not have this mentality? So what do we do? Spend another 300m to replace the likes of Pogba?
Agreed.So, he trained them for 2 days to attack quickly and aggressively but the players failed do it
How could one expect results over 2 days when this team plays with a slow build-up for ages, including the last 18 months?
How daft must one be to buy in the excuses that the players lack character, that most of them are pussies? Players can be brave in one context and cowards in another context, much depends on the atmosphere at the club and the manager himself.
Jose's comments are suicidal. Him staying for another season is the dream scenario for United's rivals.
Again, that's all I'm asking for. Like I've said to many Mourinho defenders on here. My bar for Mourinho is very low and I very well understood that he's not going to get us to play the most exciting football. That's not what I'm asking for. I accepted that after having to witness United under Moyes and LVG. I recognized that we needed to continue with boring football in order to bring United back to competing for the biggest trophies, otherwise we could lose our best players and it becomes increasingly difficult to lure players over when they could choose CL football and the rising revenue of the other top PL clubs.
I'm asking for the players to play as a team when on the attack. That just means for them to play like they have chemistry. It's been 2 seasons. How is that a crazy expectation? I'm not asking for Pep or Klopp type football. If Mou cannot deliver this in 2 seasons, why should I believe it's ever going to be better? It takes 3 seasons for the attack to look like it has chemistry? Come on. It clearly isn't working.
Not enough excuses? go blame the players. That will not end up well.
Sounds about right.
It’s a weird one, because you buy flair players (Pogba, Sanchez) and you have talented young attackers (Martial, rashford) but you seemingly don’t give them too much freedom or guidance on how to attack as a unit (this is if all those ‘mourinho lets the attack sort itself out bits’ are true) and you drill defensive responsibility into them all the time....they might get disheartened.
To me, it’s no surpise the players who’s generally been excellent and who mourinho trusts are his profile/type of players/signings:
Lukaku - big bruising hard working CF,
McTominay - young, hard working player who listens to Jose’s every instruction and doesn’t lose the ball because he’s not extravagant/flair (though Jose mentioned his passing stats last night)
and Matic, player in his prime knowing exactly what Jose wants to setup and play.
he's spent all season covering for his players, talking up their performances and has been hammered on here for it, regularly called deluded by all an sundry for saying a performance was good when we've all been bored shitless a lot of times this season.
Then when he come out and agrees with us, saying all the things we've levelled at the team over and over again, he's out of order for attacking the players.
Sevilla was a nadir imo. He defended the players directly after the game but then made it clear that it was the last time. Now he's on the attack with them, throwing them to the dogs and it's high risk because its very likely that he'll be the one down the road if it doesn't work, but maybe he feels he's got no other choice? the players do look scared out there atm and for all his faults you could never call his teams scared before. it may be a last throw of the dice but i believe he's doing it for the right reasons, we'll have to wait and see if it works
Then when he come out and agrees with us, saying all the things we've levelled at the team over and over again, he's out of order for attacking the players.
Sevilla was a nadir imo. He defended the players directly after the game but then made it clear that it was the last time. Now he's on the attack with them, throwing them to the dogs and it's high risk because its very likely that he'll be the one down the road if it doesn't work, but maybe he feels he's got no other choice? the players do look scared out there atm and for all his faults you could never call his teams scared before. it may be a last throw of the dice but i believe he's doing it for the right reasons, we'll have to wait and see if it works
You'll find @NK86 in another thread claiming this was fine from SAF and not at all comparable to José.
Is it ok if I think he was being a bit of a dick but I'm still ok with it?
I've never minded manager's giving players a bit of shit. Mourinho has been more of a dick in the past when he's named and shamed. (like SAF did after the Aberdeen cup win above).
He picked a team with poor distribution from defence and lacking creativity in midfield so he can’t complain, he has other players he could have played.
What Pep/Klopp/Pochettino would have that team doing is pressing high up the pitch, winning the ball in final third to compensate. Mourinho’s coaching and tactics haven’t been good enough and that is why he gets criticised.
No, Pogba and Sanchez are not in form but they are not players I am that worried about long term. Mkhi was sold for a reason yes, on Lindelof, we just have to wait and see really. I think what he is doing with Pogba is trying to get out what is already inside him. He uses McTominay as a symbol to not just Paul, but the rest of the team. Pogba knows he is 100x more talented than Scott, lets be real.
I've only seen the post-match press conference, not the individual broadcaster interviews, but I'm with him here. It's a risky strategy calling out players, because we could lose one of our better players if they're a bit of a shrinking violet and can't handle the criticism, but we need more players to step up and take responsibility on the pitch so this is a good way of identifying the ones he can rely on.
I think calling out a lack of desire is always a pretty risky move, but it's a perfectly valid one. It's a reasonable assessment of what was out there on the pitch and tackling that in public can light a fire under them. It might send them spiralling though. It really depends on what relationship he's built up with his players.
It doesn't fit very well with the idea that he's becoming the ultimate players' manager, though. What he's said over the past few days has been protecting himself, not protecting the players. Spinning that into something else is an act of sheer desperation.
Exactly.So, he trained them for 2 days to attack quickly and aggressively but the players failed do it
How could one expect results over 2 days when this team plays with a slow build-up for ages, including the last 18 months?
How daft must one be to buy in the excuses that the players lack character, that most of them are pussies? Players can be brave in one context and cowards in another context, much depends on the atmosphere at the club and the manager himself.
Jose's comments are suicidal. Him staying for another season is the dream scenario for United's rivals.
But I don't think it was risky, I think he dropped the likes of Sanchez and Pogba for a reason and to prove a point that these players never hide despite all the abuse they are currently receiving.
A fair few of the players last night are no doubt not in his long term plans.
Don't forget these are some of the very best paid players in the country, if they are this fragile of psyche and cannot handle those type of demands given the paycheck, then we have a serious problem at hand. We are at a junction where the wheat need to be separated from the chaff, and these players have it all in their own hands.
It’s a great rant but what gets forgotten is Ferguson regretted it and apologised to his players a few days later.
Another big difference is this was about players who had set standards failing to meet the high standards they were capable of, whilst Mourinho seems to be saying certain players don’t have the desire, mentality or talent to be Manchester United players.
Risky strategy in a world of super agents and dressing room leaks.
I think behind the scenes the club will be a little taken aback but will stand with him on his comments. What Jose said is bang on. Too many players go missing or just go through the motions. Lingard despite his goal tally, too inconsistent, What this and previous teams have sorely lacked is a leader and proper captain on the pitch. None of this Smalling Pish. How can he be captain if players and fans expect him to drop at least one clanger per game.
Shaw can feck off as well. Fed up of hearing how badly he is treated in public, Jose is bullying him, destroying his career etc. He's had many chances. Even under LVG he publicly said he wasn't fit enough and out of shape. So he goes on a cycle of losing weight, getting in shape for a few months then back to square one. Jose agreed, more scathing publicly but clearly there is an issue with the lad. If he can't cut it at Utd then fine go and get your career on track where the pressure is less. Give me an Evra player every single time who gets the club and the shirt than a Shaw.
I think behind the scenes the club will be a little taken aback but will stand with him on his comments. What Jose said is bang on. Too many players go missing or just go through the motions. Lingard despite his goal tally, too inconsistent, What this and previous teams have sorely lacked is a leader and proper captain on the pitch. None of this Smalling Pish. How can he be captain if players and fans expect him to drop at least one clanger per game.
Shaw can feck off as well. Fed up of hearing how badly he is treated in public, Jose is bullying him, destroying his career etc. He's had many chances. Even under LVG he publicly said he wasn't fit enough and out of shape. So he goes on a cycle of losing weight, getting in shape for a few months then back to square one. Jose agreed, more scathing publicly but clearly there is an issue with the lad. If he can't cut it at Utd then fine go and get your career on track where the pressure is less. Give me an Evra player every single time who gets the club and the shirt than a Shaw.
Absolutely. It's a bit depressing to be honest. Our football and the whole tedious manager vs player thing that's so typical of Jose these days. I have no idea why what he's getting of our players shouldn't be the main issue. Our biggest signing and the record one at the time Pogba isn't good enough to even start. Sanchez who is on huge wages and a supposed elite looks ordinary. The others sometimes play well but usually look to have no understanding.
Yet were supposed to believe he's so unfortunate to have what he does. Excuses.
Yeah I wouldn’t lay all the blame at the managers door but there’s some seriously wrong at the club.
Give him more money! Clear the deadwood!
I can’t understand the overreaction to Jose’s comments. If he’s not happy with players he’s right, some of them have been given too many chances.
There’s no difference. SAF set high standards and so does Jose.
This.
I back Jose 100%. The attitude of the players has sucked since Fergie left. Yes Moyes and LVG made mistakes but the underlining issue of the players was there and still is. Jose has protected his players till now and its made no difference. I say its about time we as fans fully back the manager this time and trust him to get rid of there deadwood overpayed pre-madonnas.
If we get rid of Jose the next manager will have the same problems, no doubt about that. Standards have slipped and Jose is trying to put them back up.
All my players are terrible. I've only been in charge for two seasons and have spent a small fortune.
Great rant though. We win at managerial 'character' and new signings announcement videos if not at the actual football stuff.
Of course there’s a difference, one is a manager frustrated at his side playing below the standard he knows they’re capable of having beaten Real Madrid 10 days earlier, the other is a manager saying that other than Matic, Lukaku and De Gea the side HE has spent 300m building over the last two years isn’t good enough to reach the standard necessary. The context makes it completely different. And as I said, Ferguson apologised to his players anyway.
As for setting high standards, he was perfectly delighted with finishing 6th last year, scraping past Celta Vigo at home in a performance much worse than yesterday’s and winning “3” cups. I know he was delighted because he let every man under the sun know what a terrific job he’d done. I remember the players holding up 3 fingers on the pitch in the post-game pictures. It’ll be interesting if Mourinho and the same people who declared what a great season it was, far better than finishing second with no trophies will do the same about Arsenal and us if they win the Europa League and we finish second.
Aye it’s going to be an interesting end to the season.
I suspect 2nd place (or even top 4) will save him his job & rightfully so but I don’t see how much summer transfer activity is going to change things miraculously. I’d love to be pleasantly surprised.
Agree with everything. Sod th pampering these grown men, the standard is not good enough. They can be told behind closed doors but let's see how they respond now it's made public they are being cowardly.
Gut up and play ball.
Gut up and play ball.
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