Eden Hazard

[Righteous Steps]

Anyone said he isn't a big game player in PL? People are questioning his CL performance which is correct as Hazard is superb player and his performance in CL isn't as good as it should be.

English teams have underperformed in Europe, for example Pogba went from CL final to having probably the worst cameo of his career against Sevilla in the quarters, I think a lot of the analysis on Hazard is often lazy and hypocritical imo, the team and manager matters than any one indivual, Hazard hasn't had he luxury of playing for a CL juggernaut, all his peers we compare him to have.

You combine Hazards quality with a team like Madrid and he would no doubt put in more memorable performances..

 

[roonster09]

Yes under Klopp one of the best attacking managers in the world, and a Dortmund team who were in their prime and a fine attacking outfit themselves, that's sort of he point Hazard hasn't played for Klopp or Guardiola, and he hasn't played for teams as expansive and as well oiled as an attacking collective as that same Dortmund team Lewandowski played for.

The same peak team which finished last in their group stage a year before?

Dorgba also played for Chelsea and played so many great games in CL.

 

[roonster09]

English teams have underperformed in Europe, for example Pogba went from CL final to having probably the worst cameo of his career against Sevilla in the quarters, I think a lot of the analysis on Hazard is often lazy and hypocritical imo, the team and manager matters than any one indivual, Hazard hasn't had he luxury of playing for a CL juggernaut, all his peers we compare him to have.

You combine Hazards quality with a team like Madrid and he would no doubt put in more memorable performances..

Not sure saying Hazard should play better in CL is hypocritical. If he was some nothing player then yes, he is the best player in the league when Chelsea won league titles in 2 out of 3 seasons. Excuse few of us who have higher expectations from one of the best player in PL.

 

[Fortitude]

Willian had one good performance against Barca last week wouldn't exactly call it memorable though.

And that same Atletico with the best defensive record in Europe at that time, whether they were on a wane is irrelevant to them still being probably the hardest team to break down and most tactically drilled in Europe. Give Hazard enough of the ball and he will make things happen, heck he even done it yesterday he made one should of been assist for Alonso and as many key passes as anyone on the pitch not named Messi.

Last week? Do you mean in addition to yesterday and thus 2 legs, 2 performances?

I think far, far more is expected of Hazard than what you've listed, as should be for a so-called world class player.

We're not going to agree about Atletico because the beastly-level Atletico - the name team - was not the one Hazard performed against, and he has 0 performances against teams of repute that are in form going into clashes that are decisive for Chelsea.

 

[Righteous Steps]

Last week? Do you mean in addition to yesterday and thus 2 legs, 2 performances?

I think far, far more is expected of Hazard than what you've listed, as should be for a so-called world class player.

We're not going to agree about Atletico because the beastly-level Atletico - the name team - was not the one Hazard performed against, and he has 0 performances against teams of repute that are in form going into clashes that are decisive for Chelsea.

No one leg, Willian was marginally better than Hazrd yesterday, Eden was actually the one who created their best chance while Willian completed more dribbles..

Chelsea have zero performances also so maybe that's where lies the problem, put him in Madrid where he would have to only do the Isco or Di Maria role of offering penetration through dribbling and intricate passing and the narrative would be different, don't see why even great posters like yourself fail to see that.

 

[giorno]

When they were going through their slump?

One game finished 1-1. The other they won with him on the bench. As good as can get

Chelsea have zero performances also so maybe that's where lies the problem, put him in Madrid where he would have to only do the Isco or Di Maria role of offering penetration through dribbling and intricate passing and the narrative would be different, don't see why even great posters like yourself fail to see that.

Di Maria was a workhorse and a great crosser, and Isco's value lies in his ability off the ball more than on it...

And i've yet to see Hazard unlocking a packed defence with his passes

He's an almost player -and looks better than he is

 

[UsualSuspect]

And i've yet to see Hazard unlocking a packed defence with his passes

 

[UsualSuspect]

Anyone said he isn't a big game player in PL? People are questioning his CL performance which is correct as Hazard is superb player and his performance in CL isn't as good as it should be.

Maybe not as good as it should be but he's still been our best player in this campaign. 6 goals and assists in 7 matches + 3 Key passes per match (which is double that of Messi). And that playing for Chelsea. We will only ever see the best of him in a team that dominates possession.

 

[breakout67]

Wasn't it already established that Hazard only plays well when he can be arsed?

Fantastic player when he turns up, but he must be bipolar because sometimes he just walks around the pitch doing nothing.

 

[Stacks]

Season Team Tournament Apps Mins Goals Assists
2017/2018 Chelsea UCL 7(1) 611 3 3
2017/2018 Chelsea EPL 22(4) 1868 11 3

2016/2017 Chelsea EPL 36 3007 16 5

2015/2016 Chelsea UCL 6(2) 526 - 1
2015/2016 Chelsea EPL 25(6) 2192 4 3

2014/2015 Chelsea UCL 7 654 3 2
2014/2015 Chelsea EPL 38 3379 14 9

2013/2014 Chelsea UCL 8(1) 682 2 -
2013/2014 Chelsea EPL 32(3) 2898 14 7

2012/2013 Chelsea UEL 5(2) 449 1 1
2012/2013 Chelsea UCL 4(2) 457 - 2

For a player with his skillet, his productivity is poor.
When the likes of Messi and Ronaldo score 50 goals every year, he has failed to crack 20 goals with his best being 16!
And he even has a season with 4 goals in the entire season
In the UCL, the maximum goals he's ever scored is 3!

Yeah he is a magical player, so easy on the eye, but none of that matters if you can't produce numbers, which Eden has so far failed to do

hes a creator and just needs a clinical finisher to get the numbers. He'd be great as a 10 or the creative outlet of the team. His dribbling is also immense

http://www.squawka.com/comparison-m.../876/876/2431/37/p#chances_created/assists#90

http://www.squawka.com/comparison-m.../819/819/2431/37/p#chances_created/assists#90

 

[BlueViper]

Anyone said he isn't a big game player in PL? People are questioning his CL performance which is correct as Hazard is superb player and his performance in CL isn't as good as it should be.

I feel as though if you're a big game player in one setting, you're a big game player elsewhere too. All this shows is that maybe a player can't singlehandedly win a tie against one of the best European sides unless there's a freak performance or freak player (i.e. Messi). Not winning =/= not turning up. More often than not in the games we have been eliminated (against the likes of PSG, prime Athletico), he's been the most consistent attacking player.

 

[Sunspear17]

He can certainly do more with the talent he has. He doesn't show it enough for my liking. Still our best attacking player (barring Willian this season) and he's very important. Would not be simple to replace at any cost. I don't even know who is out there to replace Hazard. He might not score a ton of goals like Salah this season or other wide players have done, but his overall game is so immense.

 

[Fortitude]

No one leg, Willian was marginally better than Hazrd yesterday, Eden was actually the one who created their best chance while Willian completed more dribbles..

Chelsea have zero performances also so maybe that's where lies the problem, put him in Madrid where he would have to only do the Isco or Di Maria role of offering penetration through dribbling and intricate passing and the narrative would be different, don't see why even great posters like yourself fail to see that.

A hell of a lot less is expected of Willian, though, so surely it shouldn't be a marginal difference between the world class player and the player nobody earmarks as the player who *should* be turning these huge games for Chelsea.

Don't you think these teams, a lot of the time, go down with how their star players perform? Kante and Willian did their jobs yesterday, I don't think you can just excise Hazard like that when it always happens with him.

I just don't get the cycle with him that he does this, every season, and yet it gets swept under the rug and everything carries on as if it never happened. That's the definition of flattering to deceive!

 

[giorno]

hes a creator and just needs a clinical finisher to get the numbers. He'd be great as a 10 or the creative outlet of the team. His dribbling is also immense

http://www.squawka.com/comparison-m.../876/876/2431/37/p#chances_created/assists#90

http://www.squawka.com/comparison-m.../819/819/2431/37/p#chances_created/assists#90

Your point about numbers isn't wrong per se, but nevermind the questionable worth of the chances created stat when it comes to judging creators, but try that with Ozil, De Bruyne, Fabregas, Willian, Eriksen, Coutinho and Alexis. Only chances created, nevermind assist. Look at both total, per game and per 90. Then tell us how hazard ranks among them

 

[Righteous Steps]

hes a creator and just needs a clinical finisher to get the numbers. He'd be great as a 10 or the creative outlet of the team. His dribbling is also immense

http://www.squawka.com/comparison-m.../876/876/2431/37/p#chances_created/assists#90

http://www.squawka.com/comparison-m.../819/819/2431/37/p#chances_created/assists#90

Exactly people give Iniesta leniency to not get the best numbers due to other parts of his game, but not Hazard? Hazard is just as close to Iniesta in a role perspective as he is any footballer in the world, while Iniesta is a better playmaker so would fare better in that realm, Hazard is a much better attacker more assist key passes and more goals, but there roles are similar.

At a club like Chelsea because he is made to do the Messi role, he isn't allowed to be a playmaker in the way he truly is, also at the same token he can't rely on playing in an attacking setup that could pad his numbers like all the other best attacking players in the world. At a better attacking team people would see a Hazard that doesn't have to start his attacks in the oppositions half, can afford to dribble less and create more in decisive areas, and most of all can have the freedom of playing in an setup designed to attack first and foremost, it's a world of difference and some people can't pick up these nuances then get surprised when a player suddenly has a unprecedented season in another setup, or the reverse a player with all the credentials goes and underperforms in another setup.

 

[ti vu]

Your point about numbers isn't wrong per se, but nevermind the questionable worth of the chances created stat when it comes to judging creators, but try that with Ozil, De Bruyne, Fabregas, Willian, Eriksen, Coutinho and Alexis. Only chances created, nevermind assist. Look at both total, per game and per 90. Then tell us how hazard ranks among them

I am not saying you're entirely wrong, but please have a second thought regarding the name you listed are from teams who have a more expansive style which their role in the team are more defined. Hazard can be caught into doing the stretching play or wide attacker, ball carrying from it own box 2 passes away from the final ball trying to break the first pressing wave with passage to only one player up pitch blocked...

 

[RooneyLegend]

He's part of the problem though. He himself makes few runs behind the defence and often will ignore a good run in favour of overdribbling. He's a great player but incredibly overrated at the same time

And about chelsea's playing style, weird that people claim chelsea's playing style doesn't get the best of him and then follow that by saying how amazing he's been in two title winning campaigns for them...

Imho, chelsea's playstyle absolutely gets the best from him and he wouldn't look as good on a team like city. He is, first and foremost, a dribbler. He's a world class dribbler with great passing accuracy, but good-player-average vision and decision making, poor movement off the ball, poor shooting, and little goalscoring instincts.

He has no business running behind the defence if his job is to drive at the defence. Honestly i rarely see him not try to make an obvious pass if it's there, there just aren't many runs from Chelsea players. Take yesterday, Giroud isn't going to run in behind, neither is Willian, so if he's running at a defence what can he actually do? It's one of the worst teams to play for if you're an attacking mid cause either you have 1 (Morata) making a run who's out of favour or none.

It's basic sense that attackers will look better in great attacking sides than one's that aren't. It's crazy to think that Chelsea is where a player like him would play his best football.

 

[giorno]

I am not saying you're entirely wrong, but please have a second thought regarding the name you listed are from teams who have a more expansive style which their role in the team are more defined. Hazard can be caught into doing the stretching play or wide attacker, ball carrying from it own box 2 passes away from the final ball trying to break the first pressing wave with passage to only one player up pitch blocked...

Sure, and yet, going by the chance created stat, Fabregas blows him out of the water. Indeed, Fabregas blows everyone out of the water on a per 90 basis...

I'm not saying he isn't a great player, but to claim he'd be some insane creator on a more attacking team, well, i disagree with that. Hazard is a destroyer, he creates opportunities by pulling the defence apart with his dribbling. I get why people think he'd look better in a more expansive, attacking team, but we have no way of knowing. He has pretty big flaws for the type of player he is and the way he plays for Chelsea(and Belgium), and there's no guarantee he'd be able to adapt to a team that doesn't put as much focus on him

@RooneyLegend i didn't word it well. I'm not saying chelsea are getting the best out of him, i'm saying their playing style suits him best.

 

[meninred]

One way to think is - will you take Hazard to Manchester United ? Yes - will tell a lot about him.

 

[Stacks]

Your point about numbers isn't wrong per se, but nevermind the questionable worth of the chances created stat when it comes to judging creators, but try that with Ozil, De Bruyne, Fabregas, Willian, Eriksen, Coutinho and Alexis. Only chances created, nevermind assist. Look at both total, per game and per 90. Then tell us how hazard ranks among them

Good shout. All bar Eriksen, are superior at generating opportunities per 90 and in total. I had no idea Ozil still did it at this rate.I knew about De Bruyne and Cesc as Cesc has the most assists in the Prem during his time. I think Ozil has a similar record

 

[BlueViper]

Your point about numbers isn't wrong per se, but nevermind the questionable worth of the chances created stat when it comes to judging creators, but try that with Ozil, De Bruyne, Fabregas, Willian, Eriksen, Coutinho and Alexis. Only chances created, nevermind assist. Look at both total, per game and per 90. Then tell us how hazard ranks among them

If you're suggesting that Hazard is on the bottom of that list...well...

In the Champions League Hazard beats them all in totals except Fabregas (who he also beats per 90).
In the league he beats Eriksen, Alexis and Willian comfortably per 90.

Also worth bearing in mind that a lot of those players take set piece situations when Hazard does not.

And even with the stats showing this I'd still say that it's not a good way to measure all players. Someone mentioned Iniesta above, he would be a prime example of where stats go wrong. If you're going to mention Fabregas and Willian in the same argument about creativity then I can atleast tell you that having seen all three for a good long time now, if you take Hazard out of our team we would be much much much worse off than if we missed either of them.

 

[giorno]

And even with the stats showing this I'd still say that it's not a good way to measure all players. Someone mentioned Iniesta above, he would be a prime example of where stats go wrong. If you're going to mention Fabregas and Willian in the same argument about creativity then I can atleast tell you that having seen all three for a good long time now, if you take Hazard out of our team we would be much much much worse off than if we missed either of them.

I did say the stat itself isn't particularly worthwhile even just judging creativity, and of course Hazard is a better player and more important for chelsea than fabregas and willian

Still, a prime creative player he is not. But more importantly, he's not a game-winner or a game-changer at the highest level. If he's your main man, you're not likely to be a CL contender. As for how he'd adapt on a team where he's not the main man, we'd have to see

At the moment he's a poor man's Ribery. Unlike most, i'm not at all convinced the problem is chelsea

 

[charlenefan]

I did say the stat itself isn't particularly worthwhile even just judging creativity, and of course Hazard is a better player and more important for chelsea than fabregas and willian

Still, a prime creative player he is not. But more importantly, he's not a game-winner or a game-changer at the highest level. If he's your main man, you're not likely to be a CL contender. As for how he'd adapt on a team where he's not the main man, we'd have to see

At the moment he's a poor man's Ribery. Unlike most, i'm not at all convinced the problem is chelsea

Very harsh the Ribery comment, Hazard is streets ahead of where Ribery ever was

Hazard needs to move to progress, he doesn't need to be the main man to succeed what he does need though is a move to Real or Barcelona to really kick on

 

[giorno]

Very harsh the Ribery comment, Hazard is streets ahead of where Ribery ever was

Are you kidding? Ribery at one point was a legitimate Balon D'Or candidate. Between 2012 and 2013 he wasn't far off the level of Messi and Cristiano and on a similar level to Robben(at his best). At his best he was streets ahead of Hazard

 

[charlenefan]

Are you kidding? Ribery at one point was a legitimate Balon D'Or candidate. Between 2012 and 2013 he wasn't far off the level of Messi and Cristiano and on a similar level to Robben(at his best). At his best he was streets ahead of Hazard

I'm not kidding no, most overhyped player in the world at that time.

 

[singabiru]

Hope he leaves for a better environment and to actually play in a world class team.

 

[BridgeBanter]

Are you kidding? Ribery at one point was a legitimate Balon D'Or candidate. Between 2012 and 2013 he wasn't far off the level of Messi and Cristiano and on a similar level to Robben(at his best). At his best he was streets ahead of Hazard

Unfortunately yes, your absolutely right

 

[Synco]

Your point about numbers isn't wrong per se, but nevermind the questionable worth of the chances created stat when it comes to judging creators, but try that with Ozil, De Bruyne, Fabregas, Willian, Eriksen, Coutinho and Alexis. Only chances created, nevermind assist. Look at both total, per game and per 90. Then tell us how hazard ranks among them

Also worth bearing in mind that a lot of those players take set piece situations when Hazard does not.

It's true, set pieces skew these stats quite a bit.

I've done the math (also added Silva to the list), and from open play Hazard is #3 for this PL season (on reduced mpg) and #1 for the last one.

Spoiler: Chances created pg from open play 2016/17

1. Hazard 2,36
2. Özil 2,18
3. Eriksen 2,08
4. Alexis 2,03
5. De Bruyne 1,94
6. Silva 1,82
7. Fabregas** 1,76
8. Coutinho* 1,55
9. Willian** 0,82

* reduced mpg, will fare better per 90
** strongly reduced mpg, will fare better per 90

Spoiler: Chances created pg from open play 2017/18

1. Özil 2,76
2. Alexis (Arsenal only) 2,47
3. Hazard* 2,35
4. De Bruyne 2,17
5. Coutinho (Liverpool only) 2,07
6. Silva 1,88
7. Eriksen 1,76
8. Fabregas* 1,65
9. Willian** 1,28

* reduced mpg, will fare better per 90
** strongly reduced mpg, will fare better per 90

(Hope I didn't feck up somewhere.)

Still, I agree stats tell only a limited part of the story. But since they were brought up, I thought this is useful.

-------------
Edit: Bummer, Squawka & WhoScored have different criteria to a "key pass", and I used both sources; this alters the numbers a bit, but not Hazard's ranking. Corrected, numbers are now also added up from totals (not averages), so as accurate as possible.

 

[RedDevilCanuck]

He really is brilliant.

Funny that he was mentioned often in the caf's overrated thread. Mainly because a lot of fans these days look at stats first.

If you watch him you quickly realize that he is responsible for creating and finishing almost all of Chelsea's chances. His only help is an ancient fabregas and a target man.

Hazard is Chelsea's attack. Watch him against Liverpool a few weeks ago. Brilliant again. No hattrick but hold up play and counter attack brilliance pretty much on His own.

 

[AgentP]

I genuinely thought Sanchez was a better player than him(because he scores more). Not anymore.

 

[IrishRedDevil]

He’s a little prick that always, always raises his game v United.

‘I could score more if I was selfish, but I can’t as I am a good person.’

 

[montpelier]

He really is brilliant.

Funny that he was mentioned often in the caf's overrated thread. Mainly because a lot of fans these days look at stats first.

If you watch him you quickly realize that he is responsible for creating and finishing almost all of Chelsea's chances. His only help is an ancient fabregas and a target man.

Hazard is Chelsea's attack. Watch him against Liverpool a few weeks ago. Brilliant again. No hattrick but hold up play and counter attack brilliance pretty much on His own.

Looks like a pretty accurate summary to me. His number of nominations for the overrated thread were a farce.

Fantastic player (even if you do say, ''when he decides to turn up'' after that)

 

[Bergman]

Really unfortunate that he's mostly played under defense minded managers. Would be ballon dor contender under a guy like Pep.

 

[Keeps It tidy]

His chances created stats were still fantastic this season. And he had a pretty good goal tally

 

[Treble]

And people compared Sanchez to him....Hazard is much better.

 

[bebeanderson]

That Hazard vs Sanchez thread was ridiculous. Hazard has much more talent. If im not wrong, caf voted Sanchez as better.

 

[Bole Top]

That Hazard vs Sanchez thread was ridiculous. Hazard has much more talent. If im not wrong, caf voted Sanchez as better.

doubt it, Hazard was leading comfortably the last time I checked. he's clearly better and more talented player, even if you compare him to Arsenal's Sanchez. still the best player in the league on his day, I'd say.

 

[kps88]

He's so annoying to play against. Impossible to get the ball off him when he's in form. Only way to stop him is to foul or hope he messes up.

 

[Litch]

Feck me, hindsight is an exact science. Hazard is still at Chelsea cause he's inconsistent. Last season people were talking about him being behind Messi and CR? He's still at Chelsea for good reason and will be next season too, not playing CL. Sanchez came here 5 months ago into an absolutely dire, negative and defensive playing Utd team, and not into the 99 or 2008 one.....

 

[hasanejaz88]

I actually thought he was poor besides the penalty. He had a lot of chances in the 2nd half to put in a cross on the counter but decided to dally on the ball and then ultimately lose it. Ofcourse, credit, especially to Smalling on a couple of occasions, to get the ball off him but he should've done much better in those situations where he could've killed the ball off.