Are people going to insist this isn't as bad or worse than the nadirs of LVG and Moyes?

[Raees]

Still the match going fans would support Jose I think.

Can any away fan who went today give us an update on how things are in the stands?

 

[Fortitude]

Good word, Nadir. Underused generally and nicely used here.

I would argue that this may not even be the nadir...so help us God

I don't know whether to laugh or cry, hadn't thought of that.

 

[sullydnl]

A big part of the problem is that it's only just December and yet it feels like we've been dead in the water for months. At least it was later in the season when we reached this point with the other two.

 

[Minimalist]

Worse than LvG’s first season, but Jose’s first season was better than LvG’s second.

Moyes isn’t worthy of comparison, I think some are forgetting just how hopeless we were under him.

Only due to Zlatan's performances and winning a European trophy. Otherwise, I was already struggling to get behind Mourinho after a few months into his first season - primarily because I had no idea what the hell we were doing on the training pitch (and that criticism has never ended for me).

 

[Andersons Dietician]

Bring back LVG. This is far worse, you just have to look at it and see how poor these guys are coached and what instructions they are trying to execute.

 

[Kemizee]

The worst thing is that I've stopped caring, totally numb.

This is me at the moment. Nothing surprises me anymore with this team and club.
I have become indifferent to everything.

I could not believe a day would come when I type this.

The last active match I watched was against West Ham away. I just follow the results these days and I don't feel astonished at all by the outcome of the games.

Not mad, not angry, not surprised. Just resigned and I hope for the love I have for my club, Ed Woodward does the right thing and employs an ultra-modern manager. Let's start from there.

 

[Eckers99]

Hard to say. It's like choosing between lethal injection and a few yards of hose in the exhaust.

 

[LoveFootball]

I'd pay money to have LVG back instead of this fraud. Mourinho anti-football went from bad to farcical.

 

[R'hllor]

Does it matter if this is worse or better then LvG/Moyes?

 

[dove]

Still not as bad as Moyes but it will get there if we don't sack him soon. LVG's last season was probably worse as well, did everyone forget how a shot on target looked like a miracle and we went out from group stages in CL?

 

[groovyalbert]

I'd pay money to have LVG back instead of this fraud. Mourinho anti-football went from bad to farcical.

To be fair, that comment was made in relation to Moyes and LVG.

Let’s just agree - they’re all fecking shite.

 

[peridigm]

I hate to say this but the grass in not greener on the other side re LVG. He was a much better coach than this shite we are seeing now. We should have kept with him one more year in hindsight.

Hard to say. I doubt we would have won EL with the players we had and were capable of signing under LVG. No way in hell we'd have signed Zlatan or Pogba if LVG was in charge wither. Not that the Pogba is helping is much at this point.

One thing we can agree on is it's bad when you wish we had kept LVG.

 

[Fortitude]

Worse than LvG’s first season, but Jose’s first season was better than LvG’s second.

Moyes isn’t worthy of comparison, I think some are forgetting just how hopeless we were under him.

I don't understand how you can watch a game like we've just seen and make that statement. Under Moyes we were inept but still had a plan, even in the Fulham game we were relentless at something, now we just amble along with no plan, no system, no passion and very little hope.

How many could have called us not winning the game before we even got beyond 80 minutes? We're in a shocking situation right now. Statistically we're also worse than Moyes' team was at this point in the season.

 

[Foxbatt]

With LVG we struggled to break down teams who sit back,we still do beacuse the team is not good enough

the problem now is we cannot break down any team now. Let alone teams who sit back. Southampton attacked us but still we could not beat them. This is why now Jose has to go now.

 

[fallengt]

Lvg wasn't that bad tbh. He was just boring in the final third but the team was clearly coached to play football.
Not sure what United is doing atm.

 

[Fully Fledged]

Not as bad as under Moyes but surely worse than under LvGs first season.

I think this is the worst we have been.

 

[Andersons Dietician]

Hard to say. I doubt we would have won EL with the players we had and were capable of signing under LVG. No way in hell we'd have signed Zlatan or Pogba if LVG was in charge wither. Not that the Pogba is helping is much at this point.

One thing we can agree on is it's bad when you wish we had kept LVG.

I mean this is true and well the rumours at the time were Dembele, Sane, Bernardo Silva, Gabriel Jesus so there is no saying we would have gotten any of those players over City but i’d Rather of had 1 of those guys than Zlatan any day of the week.

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

No one is as bad as Moyes was. Period. He was the reason we ended up with LVG and now Mourinho in the first place......

 

[Fully Fledged]

The first 20 minutes today is the worst I've seen us play in 30 years.

Nothing compares to the despair of the Moyes era though.

This does. It's actually worse.

 

[MDFC Manager]

Much worse than LvG and fast approaching Moyesy. Although statistically he's been even than that.

 

[Romez]

This season so far is 100% worse than anything under Moyes or LVG.

LVG was just boring, a lot of 0-0’s but at least we kept possession, dominated pretty much every team and had great results against big teams (City and Liverpool).

Moyes was bad but at the very least there were some performances where we just destroyed teams, played well the whole game, scoring 4/5 goals. Something I can’t say has happened once so far this season.

 

[Foxbatt]

LVG's biggest problem was he kept Rooney. I would think in the end players like Depay and even Rashford would have become better with better coaching as LVG is bound to be. I do not think LVG would have bought Lukaku, Matic, Bailly or Fred. yes he got Falcao but it was worth a punt.

 

[vidic blood & sand]

Right now I would prefer LVG.

 

[Foxbatt]

Right now yes I would gladly have LVG back.

 

[Damien]

From RedSky:

David Moyes Awful Season:
14 games
6 wins
4 draws
4 losses
22 points
+4 goal difference

LVG Awful Season:
14 games
8 wins
4 draws
2 losses
28 points
+10 goal difference

Jose This Season:
14 games
6 wins
4 draws
4 losses
22 points
-1 goal difference

Worth pointing out that it was Game 14 that it started going wrong for LVG. Moyes bad season went on a run of 4 straight wins from Game 16.

 

[lysglimt]

Moyes was worse than Van Gaal. And this is worse than Moyes now. Moyes only made us suffer for 10 months or whatever it was.

Don't care what any other posters say, that's genuinely how I feel. This is the lowest I've felt post-Ferguson.

I actually understood what Van Gaal was trying to do. It was shite in the end but the big loveable feckwit had a plan (in between diving on the sideline and calling reporters fat).

This guy is a genuinely incompetent feck who (to make it even worse) is also a horrible human being.

We sold our soul completely when we appointed a scumbag like Mourinho. And boy are we paying for it.

Moyes signed one player - Mourinho has messed up signing a lot more

 

[Foxbatt]

Herrera is an outright liar or being a great diplomat. haha

 

[lysglimt]

The first 20 minutes today is the worst I've seen us play in 30 years.

Nothing compares to the despair of the Moyes era though.

The scary part is - not even close. We have been a lot worse in other games. Bournemouth away, West Ham away to name a couple that actually were worse

 

[Minimalist]

Moyes signed one player - Mourinho has messed up signing a lot more

I agree. Spent more money, been given more time and delivered relatively fcuk all for all his big reputation. All while talking the club down and protecting his own reputation at all costs.

 

[Bastian]

What's the point in discussing if we are more shite now than we were under LVG or Moyes. We are shite, we've had the same board and the same structure throughout this time and that's pretty much what matters.

And yes, we are as shite now as we've been at any point in the last 5 and a half years. The table doesn't lie.

 

[peridigm]

I mean this is true and well the rumours at the time were Dembele, Sane, Bernardo Silva, Gabriel Jesus so there is no saying we would have gotten any of those players over City but i’d Rather of had 1 of those guys than Zlatan any day of the week.

There were strong rumors we were going to sign Kroos or Thiago under Moyes and he was an unknown at United. LVG over Pep? Don't kid yourself. Our style under LVG was well known by players after his first season. I think Jose HAD stronger player pull than LVG would have ever had under us, but I fear that is no longer the case. Ed will need to pay players 30% more than other clubs are willing to pay them in order for us to sign them at this point.

 

[lysglimt]

Lvg's was better than this. He'd be grinning watching us now. Actually we would have improved under lvg.

LvG made Smalling look great, Martial look like one of the biggest talents in Europe, and Rashford score goals.

 

[Schneckerl]

If you consider the results, style of play and his behavior it probably is.
I've been Jose out since the CL exit vs Sevilla. Overall you have to say though that he did have higher highs than Moyes/Van Gaal and his appointment back when it was made, made sense. Should have cut him earlier though.

 

[FreakyJim]

LVG was way worse, even than this now. Short memories

 

[Minimalist]

If you consider the results, style of play and his behavior it probably is.
I've been Jose out since the CL exit vs Sevilla. Overall you have to say though that he did have higher highs than Moyes/Van Gaal and his appointment back when it was made, made sense. Should have cut him earlier though.

Completely disagree with this. Definitely enjoyed the (limited) 'good times' under LVG than anything under Mourinho.

 

[MAME DIOUF 32]

winning a European trophy.

Which but for one of the worst misses in history with the last kick of the semi final would not have happened.

Mourinho is a total fraud at this point. He's done the absolute bare minimum you'd even think possible with the riches he's been given. Get him out NOW.

 

[The holy trinity 68]

I think we need to realise that as bad as all the managers have been after SAF, it is the fault of the people who run the club just as much if not more.

The players that have been here under Moyes and LVG have to be accountable for the pitch performances.

Unfortunately Mata, Fellaini, Jones, Smalling, Young, Valencia are just not good enough and haven’t been good enough. Add to that the poor signings after Moyes left, and we have a right old mess on the pitch.

 

[JPRouve]

It was better under van Gaal. Similarly terrible under Moyes — his even less impressive tactics and team mentality were somewhat compensated by the rare scraps of Fergie's football, Mourinho doesn't even have that luxury.

I'm glad that you feel the same, some posters made me wonder if I wasn't idealizing Moyes tenure.

 

[Foxbatt]

LVG was way worse, even than this now. Short memories

No way LVG was worse than this. No way at all.

 

[el3mel]

This is as bad as LVG last season, and I was a big supporter of LVG before losing nearly at the same time as this too.

 

[Di Maria's angel]

Whilst I think this is horrible to watch and really want Jose gone, the shit under Moyes and van Gaal was worse. However, this can still eclipse both as it looks to be going on for longer.