Rooney: Manchester United should go 'all out' for Mauricio Pochettino
- Thread starter Attila
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Both are valid opinions.
Not in one interview they're not
"First of all you have to give Ole an opportunity and that's a discussion that has to take place with the Glazers," said Rooney told ESPN.
"But if I had the opportunity to appoint someone, I'd go all out for Pochettino."
To me that's pretty clear. Pretty sure that's the boards stance right now and about 85/90 percent of us.
It's around 2:18 is people want better context.
How's going all out for pochetinno = giving ole a chance?
Don't get why it's so confusing for you. He said first would be discussion of ole and then all out for Poch.
You either give ole a chance and that's it.
Any talk of approaching pochetinno let alone going all our for him means ole is getting the boot, dispenseable, it simply means he's not good enough to hold the post on permanent basis.
We love you ole. But we're going all out to hire pochetinno. If we succeed, you're terminated. How's that for a chance?
Good points, and i agree, especially with the verdict.
A bit unfair to use players' fitness against Ole, that should be down to Mourinho and how he trained the players.
Not very impressed with Ole's subs yet, he seems to try a bit hard to look like he always want to attack.
As a Norwegian, i want Ole to succeed as United manager, but as a neutral United supporter, i will also be happy with either of him and Poch.
Worried what our fans will think of him if he fails as a manager.
I find it amusing that people are downplaying ole in favor of pochetinno.
Most of us here wanted giggs for ssentimentil reason and when we finally had ole, who granted wasnt ryan giggs but has all the united dna, modern and attacking and actually has a great start and shown tangible and intangible result from day 1 people find excuses how he's not ready and that guy next door is our next saf.
Both plays attacking football, both wins nothing yet, one is our very own legend. If trophies werent guaranteed I'd rather have ole at the helm. He's a made men while poch isnt even a friend of ours.
I'd be watching with glee the day poch declines a move to united and how most of his fans here will change their narratives.
Plus with ole we can be sure he wont somehow ditch us in favor of real madrid or barcelona.
If pep somehow lost the title to liverpool and quit city this place gonna be fun
Most of us here wanted giggs for ssentimentil reason and when we finally had ole, who granted wasnt ryan giggs but has all the united dna, modern and attacking and actually has a great start and shown tangible and intangible result from day 1 people find excuses how he's not ready and that guy next door is our next saf.
Both plays attacking football, both wins nothing yet, one is our very own legend. If trophies werent guaranteed I'd rather have ole at the helm. He's a made men while poch isnt even a friend of ours.
I'd be watching with glee the day poch declines a move to united and how most of his fans here will change their narratives.
Plus with ole we can be sure he wont somehow ditch us in favor of real madrid or barcelona.
If pep somehow lost the title to liverpool and quit city this place gonna be fun
He has nothing to do with the club right now and isn't making decisions. You need to chill. There are two opinions right now. Consider Ole at the end of the season or go all out for Poch.
I wonder what if it's up to you?
The hardest thing in all this is that nothing is guaranteed. If poch 100 percent wants to come and could come it's a different question.
But approaching poch in secret while keeping our options open incase he refuse us will made ole feel unwanted and unappreciated, and lets not go into how the players feel. Some of them may like ole or dont but looking at the current team they're not going to be happy to see ole sacked.
All decisions has to be made eventually. One bird at hand or two at the trees and all that?
Not sure about 'all out', but Pochettino should be considered. As should Ole. Thing with Pochettino is, he has proven his player development particularly with young players over the last 3-4 years in the premier league, and done so impeccably well. I have an open mind about this. Let's see how things are shaping up towards the end of the season. Will Ole turn us into a well oiled attacking side? Will he continue to get the best out of the team? Or will be be largely dysfunctional with only flashes of quality? Remains to be seen. Great start of course.
The sensible thing to do would be to neither do the 'all out' for Pochettino routine nor the 'We love Ole and give him a chance (screw others)' one (unless he's done insanely well). Let's keep our options open and interview and speak to all the candidates - the interim manager and the outsiders.
Poch is a tad overrated for me.
I like the system that Ole has brought in and I believe we can only get better with the addition of better players in the summer to play in such a system. The board is taking their time deciding on a permanent manager, so I suggest we all just enjoy the season and finish as best as we can.
I like the system that Ole has brought in and I believe we can only get better with the addition of better players in the summer to play in such a system. The board is taking their time deciding on a permanent manager, so I suggest we all just enjoy the season and finish as best as we can.
This i agree. Keep our avenues open while maintaining our class towards all parties.
His results look flattering because of how inconsistent us, Chelsea and Arsenal has been over the past 5 years.
Spurs are just maintaining the same standard without doing anything too special in the league or cup competitions.
They're maintaining a very good standard though, which is the entire point.
They are maintaining a very high standard, for a club such as spurs. You forget that before poch came in they were not a top4 club, same as liverpool. Winning the title or CL is just too hard, and they don t seem to care for the domestic cups. They want top 4 priority, so players wont start leaving, also money comes in to pay higher wages.
They swaped place with Arsenal it seems, they became tropyless arsenal who always somehow got top4, and Arsenal became trophiless and no top4 of the past Spurs.
They still won feck all and finished behind us and Chelsea when we played somewhere near our standards . That tells you that Poch isnt doing anything too special. Spurs aren't getting top 4 is the top clubs aren't having terrible seasons together.
Much easier to get top 4 when 3 of the usual top 4 are dong their worst at trying to stay inside the top 4. Poch needs to prove himself by actually winning something instead of just getting top 4 by default when the top clubs are all underperforming.
Spurs winning feck all is the norm. Everybody knows they should have the odd cup here or there, as should Liverpool, in recent years. But those, now much smaller, trophies no longer hold the weight they used to do, and certainly don't negate general progress a club could make regardless. And Pochettino has certainly done an excellent job at Spurs getting them regular CL football and making a light impression even in the CL itself while spending very very little. Expectations are at the end of the day viewed in context. The same results and performances at City would of course be unacceptable. That's the entire point of these forums. To try to discuss things with perspective and context rather than "no trophies, no good".
So yes I think he's done an excellent job at Spurs. Whether that translates to actual success in terms of trophies at a bigger club with trophy related expectations, is for him to prove. Hes proven himself at Spurs. Now let's see if he can't do so at an elite club, wherever that may be.
Laughable at people having a go at Rooney for stating the obvious.
For all the attacking improvement we've shown under Ole, there is still that naivety that can be seen in his approaches. We're still very easy to come at sometimes that even bottom teams find themselves creating several chances a game against us.
Unless Ole shows more tactical nous for the remainder of the season, we'd need to go for someone like Pochetino.
Nothing outrageous about what Rooney said.
For all the attacking improvement we've shown under Ole, there is still that naivety that can be seen in his approaches. We're still very easy to come at sometimes that even bottom teams find themselves creating several chances a game against us.
Unless Ole shows more tactical nous for the remainder of the season, we'd need to go for someone like Pochetino.
Nothing outrageous about what Rooney said.
No guarantee of success with either appointment. Poch for all the clamouring has no silverware to his name and for all the talk of promoting youth - it’s not a particularly impressive record if you take out Kane and Alli.
Hence I rather stick with the man who knows United and what the club stands for than an admittedly very good manager who doesn’t.
Hence I rather stick with the man who knows United and what the club stands for than an admittedly very good manager who doesn’t.
I dont see any reason Poch should be over Ole as we saw he didn't make any move to draw or win the game vs us , it was a very serious task for Ole to prove himself and he did , no matter DDG was MOTM , this is no coincidence
Don't get me wrong, I like Pochettino (MP) but has he really improved Spurs as much as we sometimes seem to think ? I looked at Spurs' results prior to hiring MP and their results afterwards
MP took charge of Spurs may 2014 - after 1.5 seasons at Southampton where he did good, but not brilliant. He achieved an average of about 1.5 Points pr game. This may sound quite good for a team like Southampton, but it's worth remembering that this was a very good Southampton-side with a lot of players who went on to bigger things immediately after (Luke Shaw, Callum Chambers, Nathan Clyne, Adam Lallana, Morgan Schneiderlin, Victor Wanyama, Dejan Lovren and Jose Fonte to name some). But MP certainly deserve credit for playing a lot of the youngsters and making them perform, but he had the talent in the club from the beginning.
Spurs in the seasons leading up to MP taking over did quite well in the League - but not close to fighting for the title
11/12 - 4th Place - 69 Points
12/13 - 5th Place - 72 Points
13/14 - 6th Place - 69 Points
So Spurs were getting an average of 1.8-1.9 Points pr game and finishing 4-5-6th in the League. But a Young striker by the name of Harry Kane had started scoring at the end of the 13/14 season, they finally had found a good goalkeeper in Lloris and Christian Eriksen had really impressed in his first season at White Hart Lane. In addition they had signed a good defender in Vertonghen 2 years earlier - so quite a few of the pieces were in places when MP took charge.
14/15 - 5th Place - 64 Points (average of 1,68)
The first season in charge wasn't a big success - in the summer he picked up Eric Dier and Ben Davies who would turn out to be big hits, and in january he signed Dele Alli who would be an even bigger hit. He also signed a few players who didn't turn out right like Yedlin, Fazio and Stamboulli. But from a financial Point of view, Spurs did really well. Off-loading a lot of players not deemed good enough and made a healthy net-transfer profit for the entire season. Harry Kane was the big hero scoring 21 goals in 34 matches.
15/16 - 3rd Place - 70 Points (average of 1,84)
Tottenhams climbed up to 3rd position and were for a long time fighting for the title, but collapsed at the end. This was the season Leicester won and if there ever was a time the title was there for the taking, this was it. But Tottenham only managed 70 Points which was no better than they did prior to MP. He signed players for £50 million - Son from Germany, Alderweireld from Atletico Madrid and Trippier from Burnley - who all became big hits - and Njie and Wimmer who flopped. But once again he made a profit in player sales - thanks to offloading flops like Soldado, Stambouli and Paulinho and selling Townsend to Newcastle.
16/17 - 2nd Place - 86 Points (average of 2,26)
This was the season where Spurs looked like they had taken the final step. But dropping too many Points at the start of the season made it impossible to catch Chelsea despite a superb last half of the season. 86 points was arguably the best Spurs-season for over 50 years. Ironically enough in a season where the majority of his transfers completely flopped. Jansen, N'Koudou and Sissoko were signed for close to £60 million - but all of them were poor in their first season. Only Wanyama signed from Southampton performed. After a shaky start with only 7 wins from their first 15 matches (and 10 Points behind Chelsea), Spurs won 19 of their last 23 matches and ended only 7 points behind Chelsea.
17/18 - 3rd Place - 77 Points (average of 2,02)
After a superb finish the season Before, many Spurs-fans believed they would fight for the title. Rather the contrary, Spurs (like all other teams) quickly lost Contact with City and ended 23 Points behind. Spurs signed Devinson Sanchez, Foyth, Aurier and Llorente for a combined fee of £87 million and added Moura in january for £25 million. Walker, Fazio, Wimmer and Njie were sold for a total of Close to £90 million so once again good financials from Pochettino. But after a good start, Spurs picked up 5 Points from a possible 18 in late October to early December and were realistically out of the race long Before christmas. Once again if was his new signings who failed to deliever. Foyth didn't play at all, Aurier didn't impress too much, Moura hardly played, Llorente started 1 game. Sanchez however impressed in Alderweireld absence due to injury.
18/19 - so far 3rd Place - 48 Points (average of 2,18)
The big criticism against MP prior to this season was the lack of activity in the transfer market. No players signed leaving the team very vulnerable to injuries in attack. Spurs once again have had a good season but not great, already 9 Points behind leaders Liverpool and with the absence of Harry Kane for 5-6 weeks it could mean the end of their title-challenge.
My main criticism against Pochettino after analyzing Spurs season for season is his lack of success in the transfer market. Many of Spurs' key-players were already in Place when Pochettino took charge of the club (Vertonghen, Lloris, Kane, Eriksen) - he has added some quality players (most notably Alli, Alderweireld, Dier, Wanyama and Sanchez) - but quite frequently he signs players who dont perform or who needs a long time to settle (Jansen, Wimmer, Njie, Yedlin, Fazio, Stamboulli, Llorente, Foyth, N'Koudou, Sissoko)
And then the question remains - how much has Spurs improved ? After a slow start, MP has lifted Spurs to at least 1 level above where they were before him. But Spurs never had the luxury of Harry Kane for a full season before MP so that alone can probably explain a bit of the improved results.
I am not convinced that MP is the right person for us. Will he do a good job ? Yes - without a doubt. Is he the best around ? His many strange signings indicate that he may not be. Would he be Uniteds first choice if Spurs didnt get Harry Kane at the exact time they did ? I don't think so.
MP took charge of Spurs may 2014 - after 1.5 seasons at Southampton where he did good, but not brilliant. He achieved an average of about 1.5 Points pr game. This may sound quite good for a team like Southampton, but it's worth remembering that this was a very good Southampton-side with a lot of players who went on to bigger things immediately after (Luke Shaw, Callum Chambers, Nathan Clyne, Adam Lallana, Morgan Schneiderlin, Victor Wanyama, Dejan Lovren and Jose Fonte to name some). But MP certainly deserve credit for playing a lot of the youngsters and making them perform, but he had the talent in the club from the beginning.
Spurs in the seasons leading up to MP taking over did quite well in the League - but not close to fighting for the title
11/12 - 4th Place - 69 Points
12/13 - 5th Place - 72 Points
13/14 - 6th Place - 69 Points
So Spurs were getting an average of 1.8-1.9 Points pr game and finishing 4-5-6th in the League. But a Young striker by the name of Harry Kane had started scoring at the end of the 13/14 season, they finally had found a good goalkeeper in Lloris and Christian Eriksen had really impressed in his first season at White Hart Lane. In addition they had signed a good defender in Vertonghen 2 years earlier - so quite a few of the pieces were in places when MP took charge.
14/15 - 5th Place - 64 Points (average of 1,68)
The first season in charge wasn't a big success - in the summer he picked up Eric Dier and Ben Davies who would turn out to be big hits, and in january he signed Dele Alli who would be an even bigger hit. He also signed a few players who didn't turn out right like Yedlin, Fazio and Stamboulli. But from a financial Point of view, Spurs did really well. Off-loading a lot of players not deemed good enough and made a healthy net-transfer profit for the entire season. Harry Kane was the big hero scoring 21 goals in 34 matches.
15/16 - 3rd Place - 70 Points (average of 1,84)
Tottenhams climbed up to 3rd position and were for a long time fighting for the title, but collapsed at the end. This was the season Leicester won and if there ever was a time the title was there for the taking, this was it. But Tottenham only managed 70 Points which was no better than they did prior to MP. He signed players for £50 million - Son from Germany, Alderweireld from Atletico Madrid and Trippier from Burnley - who all became big hits - and Njie and Wimmer who flopped. But once again he made a profit in player sales - thanks to offloading flops like Soldado, Stambouli and Paulinho and selling Townsend to Newcastle.
16/17 - 2nd Place - 86 Points (average of 2,26)
This was the season where Spurs looked like they had taken the final step. But dropping too many Points at the start of the season made it impossible to catch Chelsea despite a superb last half of the season. 86 points was arguably the best Spurs-season for over 50 years. Ironically enough in a season where the majority of his transfers completely flopped. Jansen, N'Koudou and Sissoko were signed for close to £60 million - but all of them were poor in their first season. Only Wanyama signed from Southampton performed. After a shaky start with only 7 wins from their first 15 matches (and 10 Points behind Chelsea), Spurs won 19 of their last 23 matches and ended only 7 points behind Chelsea.
17/18 - 3rd Place - 77 Points (average of 2,02)
After a superb finish the season Before, many Spurs-fans believed they would fight for the title. Rather the contrary, Spurs (like all other teams) quickly lost Contact with City and ended 23 Points behind. Spurs signed Devinson Sanchez, Foyth, Aurier and Llorente for a combined fee of £87 million and added Moura in january for £25 million. Walker, Fazio, Wimmer and Njie were sold for a total of Close to £90 million so once again good financials from Pochettino. But after a good start, Spurs picked up 5 Points from a possible 18 in late October to early December and were realistically out of the race long Before christmas. Once again if was his new signings who failed to deliever. Foyth didn't play at all, Aurier didn't impress too much, Moura hardly played, Llorente started 1 game. Sanchez however impressed in Alderweireld absence due to injury.
18/19 - so far 3rd Place - 48 Points (average of 2,18)
The big criticism against MP prior to this season was the lack of activity in the transfer market. No players signed leaving the team very vulnerable to injuries in attack. Spurs once again have had a good season but not great, already 9 Points behind leaders Liverpool and with the absence of Harry Kane for 5-6 weeks it could mean the end of their title-challenge.
My main criticism against Pochettino after analyzing Spurs season for season is his lack of success in the transfer market. Many of Spurs' key-players were already in Place when Pochettino took charge of the club (Vertonghen, Lloris, Kane, Eriksen) - he has added some quality players (most notably Alli, Alderweireld, Dier, Wanyama and Sanchez) - but quite frequently he signs players who dont perform or who needs a long time to settle (Jansen, Wimmer, Njie, Yedlin, Fazio, Stamboulli, Llorente, Foyth, N'Koudou, Sissoko)
And then the question remains - how much has Spurs improved ? After a slow start, MP has lifted Spurs to at least 1 level above where they were before him. But Spurs never had the luxury of Harry Kane for a full season before MP so that alone can probably explain a bit of the improved results.
I am not convinced that MP is the right person for us. Will he do a good job ? Yes - without a doubt. Is he the best around ? His many strange signings indicate that he may not be. Would he be Uniteds first choice if Spurs didnt get Harry Kane at the exact time they did ? I don't think so.
This saves me from typing. Well written.
Perhaps an additional thing to consider, a possible Cons is Ole's tranfer management skills -- how is he going to kick out the deadwood, and what type of players can he bring in that suits the team or just another new average player/new deadwood. Poch seems to have a better record at that atm.
Same conclusion we have.
But idk somehow Ole kept on mentioning his reign is only until the end of this season. Seems that's already the plan, maybe he already promise many people that he'll return back to the club at Norway (?), and Ole strike me as a person who won't break his promises, staying true to what he say. Things may change at the end, but we'll see. Anyhow if the newer manager fail, we can just get Ole back.
You're missing the point I'm making though, the only reason Poch is getting Spurs in the top 4 is because Arsenal, Chelsea and us have dropped our standards and Spurs is still the same team gets elevated to top 4 because somebody has to make up the numbers.
Getting past the group stages is the bare minimum for any English club in the CL because even our minimum spending is beyond most clubs in Europe other than Bayern, Juve, Real, PSG and Barcelona.
So from my point of view, Poch has done the bare minimum in the league and CL while underperforming in the domestic cups. Hardly signs of a top coach like so many people love to claim he is.
This. We tried three big name managers in now, and all three of them failed. Maybe Poch is the man for the job, but as you said no guarantee of success with either appointment. Oles Cardiff stint was a bad one, but i think a lot of people dont give him enough credit for the job he did at Molde. He won the league in 2011 and 2012, the cup in 2013 as well as some good results in Europe, which is not bad considering the Norwegian league is a one horse race mot years
Based on the evidence of a 7 game winning run?!
Fair points except that bold one.
I find his subs to be very fair, yes definitely more attacking, as it should as we're United, yet occasionally when necessary, it's more towards defensive, here's the subs pointing that out.
1st game,
Fred and Pereira (midfielders) for Martial and Lingard, to swamp our midfield with focus on the two opposite sides for each of them.
Fellaini for Matic, to defend the long balls by the opposing team. Both of them also attack with this new system.
2nd game,
Young and Herrera for Fred and Dalot who are exposed defensively. Better defensive security.
3rd game,
Bailly red card, Jones in for Martial. Sensible move yet Ole could have easily retain it by just moving Matic back to CB, so Martial stay and we'll be more attacking.
4th...
5th game,
Fred exposed us defensively. Fellaini in so we'll be more safer.
6th game,
Dalot and McTominay in for two of Martial/Lingard/Pogba. We know of McT's defensive works, and Dalot is another defender playing at RM.
7th game,
Darmian in for Rashford, extra security against their final ball.
It's still early days for Ole,but he has been close to perfection so far.
If he carries on anywhere like this itd be very brave to rip the 6months up and start again.
We've now scored the same amount of goals as Tottenham after only really getting going a month ago. (1 game played more in fairness)
If he carries on anywhere like this itd be very brave to rip the 6months up and start again.
We've now scored the same amount of goals as Tottenham after only really getting going a month ago. (1 game played more in fairness)
It's a really silly point. The only reason Atletico won La Liga is because Barca and Madrid were under par. The only reason Mourinho won the CL with Porto was because the competition was piss poor. The only reason Liecester won the league was because the league was poor. Etc etc The same logic would apply if we're using your logic for spurs and their progress/top 4 finishes.
Spurs spend less than their top 4 rivals. If they're finishing in the top 4 it is praise worthy. The bare minimum for them would be a lot less. As opposed to us achieving top 4 under LVG and Mourinho which was actually the bare minimum.
If OGS continues on an upward curve but then gets overlooked I’d hope Potch is given the time and patience to mould his own squad. You can just see it now, he comes in, we have a sticky start and the murmurings that we should have appointed Ole begin.
If it’s Potch then the men to compare him to will be Moyes, LVG and particularly Mourinho and NOT Ole.
If it’s Potch then the men to compare him to will be Moyes, LVG and particularly Mourinho and NOT Ole.
He isn’t at all. Yes ole had a great start but for once the board need to stick to their plan. Ole is temporary and Poch is long term tried and tested.
This is the part that is important. Ole comes across as wanting to keep everyone happy - which is great compared to the sourness we’ve suffered over the past several years - but we do need to move on some players and add new players. Suppose time will tell. I am open to both options especially with our string of results and seeing smiles back in the team.
I'm unconvinced long term about Ole and Poch to be honest. THere's something about Poch that makes him very hard to warm to personally.
Wait what? They battered us all second half. Ddg played well but a lot of those shots were poor from players who usually find thr corners. Lets not pretend the away match v spurs was a tactical masterclass, we robbed spurs. Plain and simple.
Surely he's saying he'd give Ole the job, but if that doesn't materialise then he'd go all out for Pochettino.
Hard to disagree given that we would all have opted for Pochettino until games ago that said Ole is making a strong case for the permanent job.