Bridging the Gap

[amolbhatia50k]

Despite the game being fairly even in the first half, it's obviously (as it should have been prior to yesterday) that we are comfortably behind teams like PSG, City, Madrid, Barcelona etc We've spent years now battling to enter the CL whereas they either win the league/CL or compete for them every season.

However while the easy answer here is to buy better players across the board (touched upon in point 2), I'm curious as to:

• What we need to do tactically or in terms do the collective to get there? With PSG and I'm sure it's the case with City too, it's clear that even if they lose a few big players, they'll continue to pass it around with excellent control, intelligence and composure. That seems to come from years of doing the same. In this regard are we headed in that direction? Because sometimes I feel we set up to play with pace and kill teams in 3-5 passed and I'm not sure were trying to be a team that is exceptionally comfortable opening teams up through patient play. But I suppose too started off at Liverpool playing very aggresive football. Watching PSG, I noticed that there was always one player available for a pass. With us, we struggled to find a team mate unmarked. This devopment of the team is something I'm interested in understanding.
• Are their a few positions where us being weak is the key to being able to transform into such a team? Right back and a proper passing technical CM is obvious to me. Young is average. Despite Herrera and Matic being good (the former in particular) neither has that class on the ball that make opponents chase us. Right wing is the other problem area I suppose. Thoughts?

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

We need to have much better ball circulation, but circulation with a purpose.

We still too often just hit the ball out wide and hit lofted crosses into the box with no real purpose. More cutbacks by the byline.

We're a long way from the top. It's a bit disheartening, but at least our outlook looks better than with the specialist in failure.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

We need to have much better ball circulation, but circulation with a purpose.

We still too often just hit the ball out wide and hit lofted crosses into the box with no real purpose. More cutbacks by the byline.

We're a long way from the top. It's a bit disheartening, but at least our outlook looks better than with the specialist in failure.

No doubt we are better off without Mourinho but these are the kind of things I want to judge Ole on although it's a tad unfair given the state he took us on in.

Ar the moment I feel we look to break teams trying to be as 'electric' (or erratic when it doesn't come off) as possible. Bang bang bang goal. Whereas I guess in the first few games under Ole I felt we were controlling games much better. In this regard while he has done a smashing job I'm not entirely sure what his blueprint is. Maybe he's alluded to it in comments in the media but I missed it?

 

[Dominant]

We lack football intelligence. So many times you see shaw crossing blindly and hitting the first defender instead of trying to find space to cross through or pick out a teammate. Young too. Blinding lumping crosses in the box is not the solution especially when we don't have forwards who can head the ball well.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

No doubt we are better off without Mourinho but these are the kind of things I want to judge Ole on although it's a tad unfair given the state he took us on in.

Ar the moment I feel we look to break teams trying to be as 'electric' (or erratic when it doesn't come off) as possible. Bang bang bang goal. Whereas I guess in the first few games under Ole I felt we were controlling games much better. In this regard while he has done a smashing job I'm not entirely sure what his blueprint is. Maybe he's alluded to it in comments in the media but I missed it?

I thought our ball circulation the first few games under Ole was pretty good, but it's been trending down a bit.

I want to see how we respond after this game.

 

[Canagel]

We need to build a squad. We should aim to create a team like Liverpools imo. Id id like us to pritorize the areas they did because they are exactly some of our weak areas. CB, RF..
VVD, Salah, Robertson types would immensely improve us.

The quality of players we bring in will determine the football we play. Fast and aggressive is the way forward.

​

 

[amolbhatia50k]

We lack football intelligence. So many times you see shaw crossing blindly and hitting the first defender instead of trying to find space to cross through or pick out a teammate. Young too. Blinding lumping crosses in the box is not the solution especially when we don't have forwards who can head the ball well.

Dont you feel this also comes from the system? When Shaw looks up and everybody's marked, it shard for him to pick out a team mate in space.

I'll give you Young. He's always been a one dimensional football who I still can't believe starts big games for us.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

We lack football intelligence. So many times you see shaw crossing blindly and hitting the first defender instead of trying to find space to cross through or pick out a teammate. Young too. Blinding lumping crosses in the box is not the solution especially when we don't have forwards who can head the ball well.

I made a thread a while ago, how I rarely see us doing cutbacks as a team. City score so many goals that way.

Whenever our fullbacks get to the byline or near it, they'll still just lump it into the box.

I don't know if it's per instruction or just them being a bit thick.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

We need to build a squad. We should aim to create a team like Liverpools imo. Id id like us to pritorize the areas they did because they are exactly some of our weak areas. CB, RF..
VVD, Salah, Robertson types would immensely improve us.

The quality of players we bring in will determine the football we play. Fast and aggressive is the way forward for me.

Fair enough. But while they have a team capable of playing fast and aggresive, they are able to play keep ball very well too. Young is fast and aggresive but completely unsuited to controlling football games through technique and intelligence.

 

[SER19]

We need to keep going in the right direction. Solskjaer is clearly improving us but lack of confidence belief and tendency to revert to caution were evident last night. Give this team more time to just keep getting better at what were doing and ideally upgrade one centre half and possibly matic (who i like).

 

[amolbhatia50k]

We need to keep going in the right direction. Solskjaer is clearly improving us but lack of confidence belief and tendency to revert to caution were evident last night. Give this team more time to just keep getting better at what were doing and ideally upgrade one centre half and possibly matic (who i like).

Yeah I thought we were a little intimidated at times even though PSG were offering feck all themselves. But do we also need to work on the system and patterns of play? I can see us having a run like we have under Ole, but the underlying development of our unit is absolutely vital.

 

[TheLord]

This summer is crucial for United's immediate future.

Will know lots of things:

Glazers and their purses
Woody and his thinking
Ole vs Poch
Serious market intent vs stop gap solutions
Aiming to the very best vs Top Four material

 

[Class of 63]

Real eye opener last night, Matic despite switching off for the second goal was probably on performance the only United player who looked as though he'd fit seamlessly into their system, yet before the game I feared he and Herrera would be our weakness. Plenty of work yet to do. Blank cheque book methinks.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

Fair enough. But while they have a team capable of playing fast and aggresive, they are able to play keep ball very well too. Young is fast and aggresive but completely unsuited to controlling football games through technique and intelligence.

We just have to get better as a team in keeping the ball.

The most successful teams in Europe are excellent at monopolizing the ball and creating a numerical superiority in key areas.

 

[bosnian_red]

Defence is a big one. A top, dominant center back next to a comfortable on the ball center back that make a good partnership is imperative. A much better right back. An actual right winger, but also a higher level player. Midfield and attack currently have no depth but both groups are also probably missing more star quality.
CB and RW are obviously the 2 biggest needs, with RB close behind. Midfield is obviously a big need too. A lot of times we have decent individual performances there but we can't properly dominate with them so that's an issue.

We also need to just be patient with Martial and Rashford and the rest of the younger players. They'll make the step up in time.

 

[RooneyLegend]

Players. We need better quality. I'm not sure what difference better tactics would have done for us. Herrera and Matic had enough ball in space to do something, it didn't happen. After the subs it was a disaster as what we put in has no place on that stage. Our defender decided to slow down mid way to stopping a goal. We have a failed winger at right back. Shaw can't overlap.

 

[SER19]

Yeah I thought we were a little intimidated at times even though PSG were offering feck all themselves. But do we also need to work on the system and patterns of play? I can see us having a run like we have under Ole, but the underlying development of our unit is absolutely vital.

We definitely do but surely thats whats being worked on, i can only hope so!

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Does anybody thing PSG focused on compressing the space on our left? I felt they knew that was our strength and forced us down the right where we lack quality. Can see other teams doing that too. We need to work on it

 

[amolbhatia50k]

I thought our ball circulation the first few games under Ole was pretty good, but it's been trending down a bit.

I want to see how we respond after this game.

Yep. Started off well but it's regressed a little. We've moved towards more direct football since IMO.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Players. We need better quality. I'm not sure what difference better tactics would have done for us. Herrera and Matic had enough ball in space to do something, it didn't happen. After the subs it was a disaster as what we put in has no place on that stage. Our defender decided to slow down mid way to stopping a goal. We have a failed winger at right back. Shaw can't overlap.

Why can't Shaw overlap? The one time he burst past martial he was in.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

Yep. Started off well but it's regressed a little. We've moved towards more direct football since IMO.

Yeah hopefully we see a return of it.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

Why can't Shaw overlap? The one time he burst past martial he was in.

Think he meant it in the sense that when he does get space in, he's just not great at picking out players.

His attack leaves a lot to be desired.

 

[tjb]

We are not as far back as tonight looked. But we are far. The difference between psg and utd today was the first touch of the majority of the PSG 11. Particularly in midfield, and when i say midfield, I am talking about anyone with the movement and freedom to enter the midfield areas. Herrera Matic and Pogba were all fine for the most part. The problem came from young, lingard, rashford, shaw, sanchez, mata and lukakus first touches. And this is fine when you have say two none central defensive players who do not have great first touches, but when half of the team are inconsistent with how they control the ball, the team will surely lose control of the game. Compare that with PSG whos frontline and wide areas were able to catch every ball that was given to them easily and that tells you the difference, technique and first touch.
The key for utd is to not overreact. We need improvements in certain areas of the pitch, but we always knew that to begin with. Our right hand side of the pitch is particularly poor, and makes it incredibly difficult to control games as we cannot stretch the pitch as much as we would like. Bailly and Lindelof both played well, but were fortunate that european teams do not exploit weaknesses in aerial ability as much as premier league teams do, so we also need another central defender.

 

[Patrick08]

Midfeild restructuring is crucial to bridge the gap, along with a more dominant defender and a fullback who can actually cross to someones head inside the box.

 

[Patrick08]

Does anybody thing PSG focused on compressing the space on our left? I felt they knew that was our strength and forced us down the right where we lack quality. Can see other teams doing that too. We need to work on it

There is where pogba needs to show intelligence and find ways to apply himself onto the game. Matic 's sideways passing against a pressing team also doesn't help as we are too slow to move it forwards in that case lacking any real pace and creativity from the wide areas.

 

[kouroux]

Think he meant it in the sense that when he does get space in, he's just not great at picking out players.

His attack leaves a lot to be desired.

Exactly. He just crosses without aiming basically, it's madness when you think about it

 

[Patrick08]

Dont you feel this also comes from the system?

I dont feel it's the system, our playmaker in behind takes too much time on the ball and then is forced to pass sideways and coupled with that the movement of our creative players lacks intelligence as well. We are not a hard working team without the ball.

 

[mav_9me]

We just have to get better as a team in keeping the ball.

The most successful teams in Europe are excellent at monopolizing the ball and creating a numerical superiority in key areas.

This is the key imo. This has always been where we have not been as good as European teams, as far back as any of Fergie's teams in beginning of 2000s. This would be the case even against teams like Lille or Moscow teams or sporting or Wolfsburg etc. Now we won a fair few of those games but it felt like they could move the ball/keep the ball much much better.

This is where I'm most concerned about Ole, can he get us playing something similar to that rather than this fast paced counter attack? Cuz that might work in EPL but in Europe teams are way smarter. And that is one of my biggest positives with Pochettino. Spurs circulate the ball so beautifully.

Now we need new players too to get there but I feel it's more important to get a manager who can get them to play like that. And it's very difficult to get a team to play like that imo, unless you splurge.

Having said all of that, city have been playing like that at least for the last couple of years without much success. So who knows maybe just better players is all we need.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

This is where I'm most concerned about Ole, can he get us playing something similar to that rather than this fast paced counter attack? Cuz that might work in EPL but in Europe teams are way smarter. And that is one of my biggest positives with Pochettino. Spurs circulate the ball so beautifully.

Thing is, I thought initially, we controlled the ball really well under Ole. I thought we'd keep progressing and improving upon it.

But it has gradually gotten worse and worse(our ball circulation). Not sure what's happened.

 

[Canagel]

Thing is, I thought initially, we controlled the ball really well under Ole. I thought we'd keep progressing and improving upon it.

But it has gradually gotten worse and worse(our ball circulation). Not sure what's happened.

We played better Opponents gradually .not much to do with getting worse. That was always one level

 

[Welbeckham]

Does anybody thing PSG focused on compressing the space on our left? I felt they knew that was our strength and forced us down the right where we lack quality. Can see other teams doing that too. We need to work on it

Tactically very smart as Pogba loves to play little combinations with Martial in that left channel. Now it was way too stacked with their 3-man midfield, Kehrer and Alves. Pogba should have moved around to right more to create space.

 

[Thiagoal]

Our major problem is our defense! Young is never going to be elite level at RB (fine as a rotation option); Shaw is not technically up to elite football and we need a Thiago level centre back who will dominate and provide a firm base to build from! Until we get that, we will be a team challenging for top 4- not Champions Leagues!

 

[Welbeckham]

Thing is, I thought initially, we controlled the ball really well under Ole. I thought we'd keep progressing and improving upon it.

But it has gradually gotten worse and worse(our ball circulation). Not sure what's happened.

Probably fatigue has some part to play. Last night the opponent was simply better, while we looked very nervous in the first half, when we could’ve hurt them with more composure.

 

[Thiagoal]

This is the key imo. This has always been where we have not been as good as European teams, as far back as any of Fergie's teams in beginning of 2000s. This would be the case even against teams like Lille or Moscow teams or sporting or Wolfsburg etc. Now we won a fair few of those games but it felt like they could move the ball/keep the ball much much better.

This is where I'm most concerned about Ole, can he get us playing something similar to that rather than this fast paced counter attack? Cuz that might work in EPL but in Europe teams are way smarter. And that is one of my biggest positives with Pochettino. Spurs circulate the ball so beautifully.

Now we need new players too to get there but I feel it's more important to get a manager who can get them to play like that. And it's very difficult to get a team to play like that imo, unless you splurge.

Having said all of that, city have been playing like that at least for the last couple of years without much success. So who knows maybe just better players is all we need.

I don't see why we can't play like that? Our players are technically far superior to some teams you just mentioned? Just needs to be worked on! Under LVG our ball retention was phenomenal by the way....just a shame we did nothing with it

 

[Kweku Amonoo]

Quality. Quality. Quality. We should only be on the look out for proper footballers and not be fooled by dodgy stats.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Tactically very smart as Pogba loves to play little combinations with Martial in that left channel. Now it was way too stacked with their 3-man midfield, Kehrer and Alves. Pogba should have moved around to right more to create space.

Yeah, it just feels like we're a very lopsided team. Our wide areas need some revamping, fullbacks included. I can't watch another season young and Mata being our right wing.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Tactically very smart as Pogba loves to play little combinations with Martial in that left channel. Now it was way too stacked with their 3-man midfield, Kehrer and Alves. Pogba should have moved around to right more to create space.

Yeah, it just feels like we're a very lopsided team. Our wide areas need some revamping, fullbacks included. I can't watch another season young and Mata being our right wing.

 

[Treble]

What is needed first and foremost is an exceptional manager. Merely a good one can't do it even if given a lot of money.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

This is the key imo. This has always been where we have not been as good as European teams, as far back as any of Fergie's teams in beginning of 2000s. This would be the case even against teams like Lille or Moscow teams or sporting or Wolfsburg etc. Now we won a fair few of those games but it felt like they could move the ball/keep the ball much much better.

This is where I'm most concerned about Ole, can he get us playing something similar to that rather than this fast paced counter attack? Cuz that might work in EPL but in Europe teams are way smarter. And that is one of my biggest positives with Pochettino. Spurs circulate the ball so beautifully.

Now we need new players too to get there but I feel it's more important to get a manager who can get them to play like that. And it's very difficult to get a team to play like that imo, unless you splurge.

Having said all of that, city have been playing like that at least for the last couple of years without much success. So who knows maybe just better players is all we need.

I hope Ole stresses more on quality on the ball from hereon. That's what I'd like to see. If the emphasis is on counter attack and leaning heavily towards pace and aggresion I'll be disappointed. I mean I do love counter attacking football but it has to complimented by quality in tight spaces and control of football games.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

What is needed first and foremost is an exceptional manager. Merely a good one can't do it even if given a lot of money.

Definitely. Are you certain Ole cannot be an exceptional manager though? The task is definitely is a big one. We don't want merely passion and aggresion. Top class coaching is also required.