See, being a hipster is so easy. Just diss the popular trends and you got street creds.
Film Martin Scorsese - Marvel movies are 'not cinema'
- Thread starter Sweet Square
- Start date
I saw avengers the new one on a long bus ride and I'm inclined to agree with Scorcese. It just seems so scripted, formulaic and lame.
You watched a movie that seemed scripted?
He's spot on, like many I've been saying it for years now. It's just disposal entertainment which is fine but it's harming other potential great films get green lit in Hollywood. Studios aren't going to take a chance on a new idea when they can ride this comic book wave. One will make a return and profit regardless of the quality of the feature, the other is a gamble. It annoys me when grown adults complain that there is nothing in the cinema, then go and watch these marvel and dead franchise films in the cinema. It's contributing to the problem. The goal is making money for studios in the end. The critics and audiences attitude towards film has changed. While writing this post Marvel Avengers end game is 8.5 on IMDb 94% on rotten tomatoes and 78% metacritic. These aren't gospel if a film is good but a perspective of opinions towards a film, this is disheartening.
It's subjective naturally what people enjoy and it's there opinion. It's a bit like going out in a city and saying there is nowhere to eat and ending up in Mc Donald's each time. In my opinion generally comic book movies in the last my few years are a lazy option, directed and made behind little talent, emotional depth and glossed up behind a green screen. There are obvious exceptions to the rule with Nolan's films and others. Then again maybe I'm not the target audience, these films are for children. To summarize any adult who likes the avengers films are cnuts
It's subjective naturally what people enjoy and it's there opinion. It's a bit like going out in a city and saying there is nowhere to eat and ending up in Mc Donald's each time. In my opinion generally comic book movies in the last my few years are a lazy option, directed and made behind little talent, emotional depth and glossed up behind a green screen. There are obvious exceptions to the rule with Nolan's films and others. Then again maybe I'm not the target audience, these films are for children. To summarize any adult who likes the avengers films are cnuts
I don't really get what point you're making here? A lot of kids' films have got great reviews in the past, as a have a lot of big dumb action blockbusters. I'm not sure what's supposed to have changed recently. Nor am I sure that it's unfair for critics to judge films for what they are. If a film that's supposed to be big, silly, entertaining fun succeeds in being just that then it should get good reviews on that basis.He's spot on, like many I've been saying it for years now. It's just disposal entertainment which is fine but it's harming other potential great films get green lit in Hollywood. Studios aren't going to take a chance on a new idea when they can ride this comic book wave. One will make a return and profit regardless of the quality of the feature, the other is a gamble. It annoys me when grown adults complain that there is nothing in the cinema, then go and watch these marvel and dead franchise films in the cinema. It's contributing to the problem. The goal is making money for studios in the end. The critics and audiences attitude towards film has changed. While writing this post Marvel Avengers end game is 8.5 on IMDb 94% on rotten tomatoes and 78% metacritic. These aren't gospel if a film is good but a perspective of opinions towards a film, this is disheartening.
It's subjective naturally what people enjoy and it's there opinion. It's a bit like going out in a city and saying there is nowhere to eat and ending up in Mc Donald's each time. In my opinion generally comic book movies in the last my few years are a lazy option, directed and made behind little talent, emotional depth and glossed up behind a green screen. There are obvious exceptions to the rule with Nolan's films and others. Then again maybe I'm not the target audience, these films are for children. To summarize any adult who likes the avengers films are cnuts
Saw a trailer of Wonder Woman on TV and genuinely wondered what was enjoyable about it. It was so lame. There are people out there who get hyped by those lame fight scenes? I actually looked a scene up on YouTube and I see people writing they "got chills".
How?He's spot on, like many I've been saying it for years now. It's just disposal entertainment which is fine but it's harming other potential great films get green lit in Hollywood. Studios aren't going to take a chance on a new idea when they can ride this comic book wave. One will make a return and profit regardless of the quality of the feature, the other is a gamble. It annoys me when grown adults complain that there is nothing in the cinema, then go and watch these marvel and dead franchise films in the cinema. It's contributing to the problem. The goal is making money for studios in the end. The critics and audiences attitude towards film has changed. While writing this post Marvel Avengers end game is 8.5 on IMDb 94% on rotten tomatoes and 78% metacritic. These aren't gospel if a film is good but a perspective of opinions towards a film, this is disheartening.
It's subjective naturally what people enjoy and it's there opinion. It's a bit like going out in a city and saying there is nowhere to eat and ending up in Mc Donald's each time. In my opinion generally comic book movies in the last my few years are a lazy option, directed and made behind little talent, emotional depth and glossed up behind a green screen. There are obvious exceptions to the rule with Nolan's films and others. Then again maybe I'm not the target audience, these films are for children. To summarize any adult who likes the avengers films are cnuts
What percentage of the movies produced every year are comic book movies, less than 5% probably?
Plus theres only what 2-3 studios making them, mostly just Disney who making more than one but they also produce lots of other types of movies. With Netflix and other streaming services looking to fill their content libraries there should be more opportunities now to make movies than ever.
Take Scorsese's movie the Irishman for example which cost over $160m to produce and is over 3 and a half hours long. Pretty much no major studio would have green lit that for a wide cinema release as it probably wouldn't make it's money back but it's found a home on Netflix.
These comments above are from a press event at Bafta last weekend, event though I disagree with a lot of this I do respect him not backing down. Most in this situation would apologise or at least try to tone it down but not him. I like that. I do wish he would have stopped at "It's not my kind of thing, it simply is not." I'd have agree with all of this comparing theaters to amusement parks and simply saying those films aren't for him. Saying we shouldn't be invaded by them is an odd thing to say. There was never a time when the "blockbuster " was not the driver of movie theater revenue. If it's musicals in the 30s or 40s all way to comicbook movies now. It's how it's always been.
It's like the difference between pop and opera really.
Apologize for what exactly ? What he said isn't shocking nor offending by any metrics
Thats a bit unfair, Marvel movies are nowhere near as bad as opera.
He's not wrong, but that doesn't mean Marvel films don't deserve their place in the cinema.
Same as with me saying that games like Cod, Fifa and Fortnite are disgusting generic preteen-marketed trash that don't belong anywhere near an e-sports label. But of course they do because they've got a mass market appeal that the far better competitive games don't have.
Same as with me saying that games like Cod, Fifa and Fortnite are disgusting generic preteen-marketed trash that don't belong anywhere near an e-sports label. But of course they do because they've got a mass market appeal that the far better competitive games don't have.
What's a decent e-sports label because to me, you perfectly described them all
I didn't say he should. You know what I mean, these days with cancel culture or outrage culture people always back down after some backlash. I disagree with him on the saying it isn't cinema bit and invading cinema but don't think he should either.
Yes, crazy times we live in, could what he said actually create a backlash ? That would be the most ridiculous thing ever
It's the difference between simon Cowell and real music
Same thing right?
Nah I can appreciate some pop, but I can see why people who make music with real instruments get annoyed at the fake musicians etc.
Wait, haven't many of Scorsese's films been adapted from books?
Seems hypocritical if you ask me.
Seems hypocritical if you ask me.
How so?
Well, superhero movies are film adaptations of stories originally told through a print medium.
Many of Scorsese's films were adaptations of books as well, so it's not like he's Mr. Originality or anything.
High and (supposedly) low culture is rarely that far apart, regardless of our personal preferences. As an example of such, the brief, happy accident of Shakespeare (King Lear) and The Beatles on I Am The Walrus - a fitting and resonant emblem of historic English culture high and low. Ominous too, in light of Lennon's 'untimely' death. Not to mention Lennon's deliberately nonsensical lyrics via Lewis Carroll.
He's complaining about the movies generally being rehash repeated formulas of comedy and action over and over again, no?
I'm not sure it's the originality (alone) he's criticizing, it's more the oversaturation of the market and their formulaic/marketed appearance (from what I understand).
Also, I feel that adaptations aren't by essence bad or uncreative - there's a few by Scorsese (or Kubrick off the top of my head) where the director really brings something new to the table using a different medium. Which I don't feel can be said for Marvel films.
Who still goes to the cinema anyways? I tried like 5 years ago... feck that.
And feck Marvel too.
And feck Marvel too.
Yeah, there is an element of repetitiveness I suppose. I don't think it's to the same level as comic book films though.Meanstreets
Goodfellas
Casino
Gangs of New York
I'm a big fan of his work but it does seem to be old man yells at cloud the more I think of it.
Deafening cinema sound is ruining films, claims Hugh Grant:
https://www.theguardian.com/film/2019/oct/13/cinema-noise-levels-ruining-films-joker-hugh-grant
https://www.theguardian.com/film/2019/oct/13/cinema-noise-levels-ruining-films-joker-hugh-grant
The nature of the stories certainly limits them. For everything to work they have to have their own universe. While I agree with his comments that it "isn’t the cinema of human beings trying to convey emotional, psychological experiences to another human being", it's kind of obvious that films of that genre, as well as those of the action, adventure, and sci-fi genres often don't have that either and his statement ignores the fact that these deep emotional experiences are not what audiences are seeking when they go to see superhero films.
Old man yells at cloud is becoming more and more apt.
High and low quality art is far apart. And I don't think you can accurately compare a classic era theatrical play with music from the 20th century here.
Generally I agree. My biases were too evident, as I love both Shakespeare's work and the Beatles'.
I don't agree, and I find it a bit reductionist (is this the right word?) and disparaging to qualify it as such, but that's like, your opinion man
I find you a bit reductionist!
he's referring to cinema as a piece of art. marvel movies aren't art, then again a lot of hollywood isn't - rom coms, action, comedies etc are just entertainment. same goes for most TV.
I think it's more the what kind of adults are still getting worked up over fecking superhero films .
Never really been a fan but I don't think any Avenger's fans, even the extreme ones, would think the films are cinematic masterpieces. They are loud, in your face and with a huge budget and if you like that kind of thins, they're probably a damn sight better scripted than Transformers or similar.
For me, they just have the most pointless fight scenes of superheroes who are near impossible to kill just whacking each other in a variety of ways. Given this accounts for about 50% of the plot, Scorsese's quote is hardly surprising.
For me, they just have the most pointless fight scenes of superheroes who are near impossible to kill just whacking each other in a variety of ways. Given this accounts for about 50% of the plot, Scorsese's quote is hardly surprising.
Christ, Doc, Godfather isn't original either. Nor Kurosawa's Ran for that matter. They're hardly Iron Man 68689 though.
So reductionist
Yeah Spoons, they're a different genre. Not all genres are obliged to offer viewers deep, philosophical experiences.
I watch films to be entertained. Infinity Wars entertained me far more than Taxi Driver or Good fellas, which were both very good. If I want hoity toity opinions I'll visit an art gallery. If I want to be educated I'll watch documentaries on TV or read a book .
Edit: the closest analogy, in my mind anyway, is a strip club owner complaining the club opposite the road is full of plastic tittied women. You're both strip clubs ffs.
Edit: the closest analogy, in my mind anyway, is a strip club owner complaining the club opposite the road is full of plastic tittied women. You're both strip clubs ffs.