MNF with Pochettino
- Thread starter keithsingleton
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Do you have a Poch agenda?
Was Pochettino expected to win trophies with Espanyol or Southampton? Was reaching the CL final with Spurs not as good an achievement as winning an FA Cup or a League Cup? Had he beaten Liverpool in a jammy final, would that have made him "complete""?
We went down the superficial route of judging a manager by his trophies when we appointed LVG and Mourinho. We got it wrong. We should appoint a manager based on a host of issues. Part of which, if he hasn't managed a club in the stature, abilities and expectations of United previously, is to evaluate his ability to elevate himself with better resources and win trophies.
There are no sure things in football. For my money, Pochettino has surely done enough to warrant that such of chance.
We went down the superficial route of judging a manager by his trophies when we appointed LVG and Mourinho. We got it wrong. We should appoint a manager based on a host of issues. Part of which, if he hasn't managed a club in the stature, abilities and expectations of United previously, is to evaluate his ability to elevate himself with better resources and win trophies.
There are no sure things in football. For my money, Pochettino has surely done enough to warrant that such of chance.
Question is when though
Yeah this is definitely a point which needs to be made more when people throw the no silverware thing at him managing Utd
After 2 seasons we look to be going nowhere, he just hasn't turned it around and we've had another disastrous transfer window. It's time for Poch to go and get Marco Rose in for the 2023/24 season.
Now are are blaming our disastrous window on the manager? I like Poch, but with our board he will have the same or if not worse transfer window. His purchases are actually not that good at Spurs (maybe again it is their board problem) even thought he managed to unearth a few gems. Then a couple seasons later we are here complaining about Poch and thinking about Nigelsmann.
I like him as well, but as long as we are in champions league this season... Ole will stay the man.
Spot on
Exactly
Headline sounds like a line from Avengers by Dr Banner - "I'm always angry“.
For me it's between Poch, Rose and Hassenhutlh as our next manager. The latter 2 have the ambition to get to the top. Not so sure about Poch though.
But I do believe that if he comes here he would definitely want to win a trophy and put behind "the bottler" reputation that he gained at Spurs. Tbh at Spurs he was never expected to win anything, so it was easy to stay in the comfort zone. At United it's different and something tells me he might rise to the challenge.
The only question mark that I have about the trio I mentioned above is:
How well do they handle pressure?
United is probably one of the most intense and stressful jobs in Europe. The only other teams that have even higher pressure to perform are Chelsea and Real Madrid.
We've seen how Moyes was out of his depth while here. We've seen how LvG went into his shell when results weren't coming and produce some of the most mind numbing football I've ever seen. We've seen how Mou lost it and went on his "heritage" rant after the Sevilla defeat.
In that regard Ole is doing pretty good so far, but you already can see that the pressure is getting to him. He's already starting to bring up some weird excuses.
Hell, even Sir Alex felt it. Look how he reacts when a reporter asks him if he experiences pressure at United. At the man won the Treble at that point.
So it'd be interesting to see how Poch and the other 2 would perform with the amount of daily pressure from the fans, press, board, etc
But I do believe that if he comes here he would definitely want to win a trophy and put behind "the bottler" reputation that he gained at Spurs. Tbh at Spurs he was never expected to win anything, so it was easy to stay in the comfort zone. At United it's different and something tells me he might rise to the challenge.
The only question mark that I have about the trio I mentioned above is:
How well do they handle pressure?
United is probably one of the most intense and stressful jobs in Europe. The only other teams that have even higher pressure to perform are Chelsea and Real Madrid.
We've seen how Moyes was out of his depth while here. We've seen how LvG went into his shell when results weren't coming and produce some of the most mind numbing football I've ever seen. We've seen how Mou lost it and went on his "heritage" rant after the Sevilla defeat.
In that regard Ole is doing pretty good so far, but you already can see that the pressure is getting to him. He's already starting to bring up some weird excuses.
Hell, even Sir Alex felt it. Look how he reacts when a reporter asks him if he experiences pressure at United. At the man won the Treble at that point.
So it'd be interesting to see how Poch and the other 2 would perform with the amount of daily pressure from the fans, press, board, etc
Well it's not like we're skint or anything. When push comes to shove Woody usually pulls out the checkbook and backs the managers. Maybe not to the level we'd like, but it's not like he does a Levy or Arsenal every year.
I think he'd be a good choice but can't but wonder if he's tactically as good as what we want. I think he's more pragmatic than people think, and I'd ideally like someone to build a proper modern attacking system at the club. Where he excels is player development and hence is a good pick, but I do think the kind of coach I mentioned is the tonic this club needs.
There’s only one way to find out.... just give him the job already
Get down the betting shop then and place a bet if you are that confident.
I like Poch and I can see no problem with Ole being our DOF and bringing in Poch as our manager.
Yeah 100% confident about it.
People who keep saying "what next sign Poch and ask for his sacking 2 years later it's Woodward's fault bla bla bla" will also be the first to slaughter him after any bad result just to prove a point, as usual.
Utd are the biggest show in town and are the most talked about club and more so if performing badly and the majority of it is b0llocks and not worth listening to anyway
Why are people so intent on having this guy around? He doesn’t have to be part of the set up off of sympathy because he scored an important goal two decades ago. “Oh yeah, you failed as a manager so now we’re going to give you the job of the guy that’s going to be overseeing the next manager” what the hell? That’d undermine him and create a weird dynamic with the next manager
and before people start talking nonsense about the players he’s bought. Maguire and Wan Bissaka we’re both known quantities and the jury is still out for both. I personally think him and Giggs will not find peace in the after life for subjugating me to having to watch Daniel James. Ighalo I don’t even- and Bruno, though a good player and the only one you can really call a success, is a weird one in the sense that he can be downright dreadful for +70 minutes but then end up with two goal contributions. Telles is a good player but we need to see how that turns out, same for Cavani.
What about his transfer record screams “I need that as United’s DoF”? Herrera dashed out for better pay elsewhere, Lukaku wanted out, same for Young (IIRC he wanted more years for renewal), Darmian only existed as an algorithm (has anyone actually seen Darmian in the past 4 years?)
like what has this guy actually done that makes people say “yeah DoF”, what selling a flabby Sanchez? Or is it shipping Fellaini out? I’m trying to understand the reasoning
I'm not convinced he's the absolute best manager we could hire right now, because there's a lot of similarly-aged managers out there with similarly impressive CVs, albeit without winning major titles.
But without a doubt he would be a better, more intelligent appointment than any of the last four we've made. By a distance you could only measure in light years. And also without a doubt he would bring a massive improvement on everything Ole is currently giving us in all departments of football management.
And he's a very likeable guy. That if anything might actually be my biggest concern with him. He's too nice a manager to be stuck with the useless dope that is Ed Woodward.
Ole is never going to be our DOF. Neither is Rio or Fletcher or Evra or Neville or anyone else totally unqualified for the job. Do we never fecking learn?
But without a doubt he would be a better, more intelligent appointment than any of the last four we've made. By a distance you could only measure in light years. And also without a doubt he would bring a massive improvement on everything Ole is currently giving us in all departments of football management.
And he's a very likeable guy. That if anything might actually be my biggest concern with him. He's too nice a manager to be stuck with the useless dope that is Ed Woodward.
Has this stupid idea not been torn to shreds enough on here already? Why is it still cropping up now and then?
Ole is never going to be our DOF. Neither is Rio or Fletcher or Evra or Neville or anyone else totally unqualified for the job. Do we never fecking learn?
I'd rather the Southampton manager than Poch if we did sack Ole
Yeah that needs to happen before it's too late this season but it won't
I like him, he can make average or ordinary players to good players. Clubs are able to sell these players for a good profit. He will not bring immediate success but give him 3-5 years, we can witness the quality on the pitch. Ole hasn’t brought anything in his 3rd year. It is strange that he is still out of job. I guess after Spurs, he has aim his sight higher. He probably feels he is almost the level of Klopp, Pep, Jose and etc therefore would only join the right project.
I honestly think Poch would be another mistake... we need someone who has managed a really big club and brought them success: it's Allegri for me; and he should have been in the job since the end of Ole's first season
I see where you are coming from, but then again LVG and Mourinho both fit that criteria. While I would definitely have Allegri over Ole, I am kind of intrigued by the idea of a hungry Pochettino stepping into the position.
I think people are happier with the squad he built and rightly so - It does look better, fresher and younger than the one he inherited - and are fearful of letting someone else take over completely and maybe go a different route again.
But part of the idea of DOF is that he brings in a coach that suits the sort of style he wants to team to have and fit the squad he builds. The quetion marks over Solskjaer's style of football are also relevant here - both as squad builder (the likes of AWB amd Maguire are good fooballers but won't be every coach's cup of tea) and whether Pochettino would be the right coach for him.
Giving Solskjaer consolation prize and make him DOF is probably somethng he wouldn't want anyway.
I'm not an Ole outer, but I'd like to see a manager's like Poch idea of what to make of our really good, and underperforming, squad.
Could we move Ole upstairs as a director of football and bring Poch in to coach?
I'd move Ole upstairs into some kind of DoF role. His recruitment, youth policy and implementation of United principles have been fantastic. After the disasters of the last few managers who failed to grasp those principles, I wouldn't want to lose that now that we've got someone who gets it.
Ole's issues have been his coaching and in-game management. I wouldn't be against bringing in a new head coach.
Ole's issues have been his coaching and in-game management. I wouldn't be against bringing in a new head coach.
Why is this in the United forum?
I love how football fans like to change history. Roll back about 12 to 13 months and loads of Spurs fans were calling for Poch's head. They just had a really a poor start to the PL and were getting embarrassed in the CL. Bayern scored 7 on their own patch.
Not good enough for Spurs and not trusted to be the man to finally win them a trophy but he's good enough for us which is a much much tougher job???
Rather stick with Ole.
Not good enough for Spurs and not trusted to be the man to finally win them a trophy but he's good enough for us which is a much much tougher job???
Rather stick with Ole.
If Ole went, Poch is who I’d like to come in. Lack of silverware isn’t too important when you consider he was at Southampton before he came very close to major trophy’s at Spurs. Exactly what we need in my humble opinion.
Was his spurs side press resistant? Were they able to break down teams who sat deep?
Exactly. It's not as if Ole is guaranteeing us trophies. Far from it. We don't seem--as a club or as fans--much concerned with trophies anyway anymore. Might as well try different managers until we find someone who works instead of holding on to this myth of sticking to a manager for its own sake.
EDIT: in fact, my ambitions for the next manager are quite humble: finish in the top 4 and, most importantly, play attacking football with definite patterns-of-play and build-up -- not this cowardly style which is either faux-Mourinho or go-out-there-and-get-it-together-lads. it's very achievable for this squad of players.
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Do you not care about the style we play at all? Allegri would be a horrible choice.
I can't help but feel hiring Pochettino would be an exercise in futility, two years ago he was manager of Spurs and Mourinho was United manager. We sack Mourinho for not being good enough, they sack Poch for not being good enough. They hire Mourinho so what we should hire Pochettino? Whats the point?
He's a good manager but i've never been a massive fan of his teams style.
He's a good manager but i've never been a massive fan of his teams style.
Yeah Sissoko is a cult favorite - limited but gives everything and Lucas is essentially a Spurs legend just because of his hattrick vs Ajax.
Well that's hardly true though is it?
Mourinho wasn't good enough for us over a 2 1/2 year period. Poch was plenty good enough for Spurs for nearly six years but it just fell apart that last season.
You can see no problem with Ole being moved aside from a job and then essentially being the boss of the man replacing him?