Ajr
Probably no longer under surveillance
I dont think the r rate will ever go down if schools are open
That won't have been the reason for their decision. If they don't enter a full lockdown it'll be entirely due to economic ideology. The idea that the government could suggest people work from home or not go to school when they have the power to legally enforce both those things for the public good is an idea of diminished public capacity which comes from four decades of neoliberalist free market politics. Which is also why the US, UK, and any countries closest to their economic model in the developed world seemed to do disproportionately bad.. If they've decided the risk to education is worse than the risk to health then fine but they'll have to politically own the impacts to covid spread because of their decision.
Do you have access to a Google machine?Just found out my partner did a c-section on a patient who later tested positive for covid. She had to self isolate and whilst I don’t, I have no idea how to act in the house. Do I just stay away from her, sleep in different rooms etc?
10-15 staff members taken out in one go apparently
Checking the UGove map for infections shows that my area has gone up from 132/100,00 to 205/100,000 to 499/100,000 in the last 3 days. It was going down but has now started to rise quickly.
https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/details/interactive-map
it was just me venting more than anything!Do you have access to a Google machine?
Thanks for your time. I was not aware of the fact that Liverpool and London have not the same dominant strain of the virus.I don't think the lines are that clearly drawn. Closing schools is a bad idea in Liverpool and a bad one in London. Opening schools is a bad idea in Liverpool and a bad one in London. They're choosing between two bad choices and in that context, their national policy is for schools to be open wherever possible. Education is a priority that comes ahead of many parts of the economy and social connections. It's one of the few things they've been consistent on for months.
Their understanding of virus transmission right now is that the strain of the virus that transmits 50% quicker is now the dominant strain in London, but not in Liverpool. So "wherever possible" includes Liverpool, but doesn't include London. The current public health recommendations are that "tier 4" restrictions are not enough to hold back transmission of this worse strain, more needs to be done, and quite possibly those areas will be going back to exactly what we went through in March. But that is a last resort that they will only apply in the areas where that worse strain is very prevalent.
They still "hope" that tier 4 restrictions will be enough to hold back transmission with schools open, because their understanding of the data from the last lockdown is almost all areas that were in tier 4 and didn't have that strain did actually see transmission fall to acceptable levels. But that may just be selective misreading in the data, and if they get that wrong they'll just impose more restrictions on the other regions not long after. Personally I'm not sure why people are asking for that to happen. Some people seem to think if schools close then maybe we won't have to cut back on some of the other stuff that us adults like to do. If schools are closed for a significant period it means things are really bad and there will be more restrictions for all of us.
There are obviously pros and cons to a regional strategy but it was what the majority of the public wanted after the first national lockdown. Area x shouldn't be "punished" because of the "bad behaviour" of area y is a very popular view at the moment, particularly in conservative media. I agree with you that disadvantaging children's education in one area for a significant period of time while allowing others' to get on as normal comes with specific challenges that raise some difficult questions.
I wouldn't have a problem with it if the said they were prioritising Primary schools because online learning is too limited for the younger ones. I'm more dubious about them allowing Secondary to continue - especially fulltime on-site - the autumn term contained a massive missed opportunity to improve online resources and complete the roll out of laptops/data hotspots where needed. That makes me suspect they hadn't even thought about it, crossing their fingers and hoping for the best isn't the same as prioritising it.I don't think the lines are that clearly drawn. Closing schools is a bad idea in Liverpool and a bad one in London. Opening schools is a bad idea in Liverpool and a bad one in London. They're choosing between two bad choices and in that context, their national policy is for schools to be open wherever possible. Education is a priority that comes ahead of many parts of the economy and social connections. It's one of the few things they've been consistent on for months.
Is your partner getting vaccinated soon? An obstetrician friend of mine is livid that she seems to be one of the last specialities in the queue. All her patients are in the 18-44 age group with the highest incidence of cases and one thing you can never do at a two metre distance is deliver a baby!Just found out my partner did a c-section on a patient who later tested positive for covid. She had to self isolate and whilst I don’t, I have no idea how to act in the house. Do I just stay away from her, sleep in different rooms etc?
10-15 staff members taken out in one go apparently
Sounds brutal. Hang in there. One day this will all be a series of amazing anecdotes to impress your grandkids/hot young med students/whoever.Went in an hour earlier on Thursday just to catch up with some death certificates that had unfortunately been racking up during the week. Yes, it is as morbid as it sounds.
When you write in a death certificate, you also write in a "receipt" that stays within the book (as you tear out the actual death certificate), which also includes the causes of death.
I had a quick look through the many, many, many receipts that were there and the vast majority of them were 1a - COVID 19.
Bollocks to those who still think that doctors put down shit like: 1a Myocardial Infaction/(Heart attack), 1b COVID; or 1a Subarachnoid Haemorrhage (Brain bleed) 1b. COVID.
That shit doesn't happen and I can't believe people still think it happens. The only times I've put COVID in the death certificate when it wasn't the primary reason for the cause of death is when a patient is in the process of getting over the oxygenation failure from COVID and then pick up a hospital acquired pneumonia which worsens their condition again. In that case it would be 1a - Bacterial Pneumonia, 1b COVID.
Anywho our hospital is changing to a 7 day working week from now on as it's too unsafe in "out of hours" like weekends and after 5pm when ward teams head home.
So for the foreseeable future, everyday will be 12 hour shifts with the occasional day off or two so we still keep within the rough range of hours of our contracts.
This is despite practically everyone exceeding the hours of our contract anyway. Think the earliest I've left work over the last few weeks is 17:45.
We'll hit a 1000 deaths per day sometime this week.
If you’ve already had covid a couple of times then the first dose probably acted as a booster (hence you felt so shit) I’d be furious at being denied the licensed regime in your shoes but I’m sure you’re reassuring yourself that the studies excluded anyone with documented prior infection, so you would have been a bit of an experimental case regardless.I'm also pissed about this new vaccination change. I was due my second vaccine dose this Thursday.
I understand that you want more people vaccinated but I didn't accept to be part of a clinical trial to see the effectiveness of the vaccine by waiting 12 weeks between doses. Pfizier has rightly condemned this as well as their "~90% effectiveness" is based on a 3 week gap between doses.
I felt like absolute death after my first dose, and I wouldn't have had it so early if I knew this was the case as I had COVID a second time in October which meant I was probably still deemed immune by the time I received the first dose. I genuinely would have declined it if I knew they'd mess around with the schedule like this. This was not what we agreed when we accepted to take the vaccine as early as we did.
Also, doesn't look good when they've already flipflopped on calls. Weren't going to close certain boroughs but now have, funny enough some of the ones included are the ones that they threatened before christmas. (So very scientific)I wouldn't have a problem with it if the said they were prioritising Primary schools because online learning is too limited for the younger ones. I'm more dubious about them allowing Secondary to continue - especially fulltime on-site - the autumn term contained a massive missed opportunity to improve online resources and complete the roll out of laptops/data hotspots where needed. That makes me suspect they hadn't even thought about it, crossing their fingers and hoping for the best isn't the same as prioritising it.
The continuing hesitation over advice to Universities and Colleges is even worse as it has less actual educational necessity behind it, and a lot of extra potential for spreading problems around the country.
Then finally we get the question of, "so what do we sacrifice to keep the schools open?" and we get the easy bits, the pubs, the restaurants, the gyms, the non-essential shops. But take a look at Tier4 rules - those aren't the March/April lockdown rules. Places of worship stay open, so do support groups, and there are a whole bunch of other things that we realised were essential whether for mental health reasons or sheer practicality - like house moves etc, that are listed there. The default "stay home" now only really applies to certain aspects of certain people's social lives and some businesses - who can't workaround the rules.
So basically I hear the "we've prioritised schools" - but I don't see the evidence that we've done enough elsewhere to match how we acted in March/April (against a less transmissible strain) let alone match that and keep schools open. Especially not now as we head into winter, and we don't have the immense advantage that the "chance to say hello and hand the shopping over in the front garden" spring weather gave us.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...defend-contingency-plan-to-mix-covid-vaccinesThe NYT is a highly partisan paper that takes a dim view of the UK as they believe it is representative of a political ideology opposed to the one they espouse. It’s a shame that they claim the policy that they have misrepresented could cause vaccine scepticism when in fact that’s exactly what they’re doing with this politically motivated hit job.
HmPublic Health England’s Covid “green book” recommends that “it is reasonable to offer one dose of the locally available product to complete the schedule” if the same vaccine used for the first dose is not available. But it adds: “There is no evidence on the interchangeability of the Covid-19 vaccines although studies are under way.”
She’s heard nothing whatsoever about getting a vaccine. Her hospital only received the vaccine (Pfeizer obviously) on 23rd December. They all had to fill in a form saying they wanted it and including their risk factors and she hasn’t heard anything since.Is your partner getting vaccinated soon? An obstetrician friend of mine is livid that she seems to be one of the last specialities in the queue. All her patients are in the 18-44 age group with the highest incidence of cases and one thing you can never do at a two metre distance is deliver a baby!
She also said they’ve had a bunch of new mums re-admitted to hospital shortly after discharge, after contracting covid at home. In most of these cases the baby was also testing positive.
Seems to be a bit of a postcode lottery going on right now, for HCWs and patients. Hopefully get sorted soon now the Oxford vaccine is coming online.She’s heard nothing whatsoever about getting a vaccine. Her hospital only received the vaccine (Pfeizer obviously) on 23rd December. They all had to fill in a form saying they wanted it and including their risk factors and she hasn’t heard anything since.
She doesn’t have any risk factors - unless her black ethnicity counts, I’m not well informed enough to say - and hasn’t heard anything since.
Definitely. My mate who works 20 miles down the road as a podiatrist already has it.Seems to be a bit of a postcode lottery going on right now, for HCWs and patients. Hopefully get sorted soon now the Oxford vaccine is coming online.
We definitely need a lockdown now we have to try and keep control of the virus so that we can vaccinate enough people to get some degree of herd immunity by Easter.Unfortunately most of the country will be over 600 in the next week or so . My area in Liverpool us at 210 but parts of the city are already at 500. January is going to be pretty awful for UK . We will have a complete lockdown soon and then things should get better in Feb
I've asked the same questions myself. During the initial lockdown and even until today.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/jan/03/swedish-model-failed-covid-19
Why compare anything to anything then?Yeah. And early December and late December are very different. Do you think people have the same desire to get tested if unwell around Christmas and New Years as they do at the start of the month?
Like I said, it shows a trend perhaps at a high level. Nothing else. So excuse your sarcasm.
Yes? Close enoughDo you think people have the same desire to get tested if unwell around Christmas and New Years as they do at the start of the month?
For the record, the JCVI have been discussing using one dosage as far back as July last year. It's not new news, nor something that's been conjured as an idea at the last minute. It appears this approach is more a contingency approach, and they've hit a wall where they need contingent measures.But the fact that they have just slipped in this line into a book, and no other countries agree with them (reminiscent of Sweden's public health experts), makes me doubt them.
They've come out and said they don't be mixing vaccines though.Changing inter-dose lengths is hypothetical bad science, I feel mixing different vaccines is more concretely bad science.
Even if the Pfizer mRNA codes for the spke protein, and the Oxford contains the spike protein, do they both include the full-length protein, or different parts of it? I read Pfizer had to make modifications to the sequence to make the protein properly foldable after it is expressed in the cell. Similar modifications for Oxford or not?
So, will the antibodies made in response to both be the same? If not, is there any long-term benefit to a second dose?
I'm a microbiologist and the biggest thing I've worked with is a yeast cell, I know nothing special about vaccines or the human immune system. I knew no advanced biology at all till about 2014. Usually I'd assume that senior doctors and scientists in charge of these decisions would have answered these basic doubts, and many more I can't think of. Don't want to be a Dunning-Kruger case.
But the fact that they have just slipped in this line into a book, and no other countries agree with them (reminiscent of Sweden's public health experts), makes me doubt them.
The only vaccine mix that makes sense to me is a boost with Sputnik, which is whole dead virus (or maybe that’s the Chinese vaccine?). I think they’ve already started trials with that combination.Changing inter-dose lengths is hypothetical bad science, I feel mixing different vaccines is more concretely bad science.
Even if the Pfizer mRNA codes for the spke protein, and the Oxford contains the spike protein, do they both include the full-length protein, or different parts of it? I read Pfizer had to make modifications to the sequence to make the protein properly foldable after it is expressed in the cell. Similar modifications for Oxford or not?
So, will the antibodies made in response to both be the same? If not, is there any long-term benefit to a second dose?
I'm a microbiologist and the biggest thing I've worked with is a yeast cell, I know nothing special about vaccines or the human immune system. I knew no advanced biology at all till about 2014. Usually I'd assume that senior doctors and scientists in charge of these decisions would have answered these basic doubts, and many more I can't think of. Don't want to be a Dunning-Kruger case.
But the fact that they have just slipped in this line into a book, and no other countries agree with them (reminiscent of Sweden's public health experts), makes me doubt them.
From the article @rcoobc just postedThe only vaccine mix that makes sense to me is a boost with Sputnik, which is whole dead virus (or maybe that’s the Chinese vaccine?). I think they’ve already started trials with that combination.
!!PHE’s coronavirus green book adds that the option of a different second dose is only preferred “if the individual is likely to be at immediate high risk or is considered unlikely to attend again”. Both the Pfizer/BioNTech and Oxford/AstraZeneca vaccine are based on the spike protein, it says, making it likely that the second dose will help to boost the response to the first.
Sigue sigue Sputnik - the Spanish booster jab.The only vaccine mix that makes sense to me is a boost with Sputnik, which is whole dead virus (or maybe that’s the Chinese vaccine?). I think they’ve already started trials with that combination.
How was your school for providing work during lockdown in march?Our older one's primary school has only just sent out communication stating which years should attend the school. The whole school thing is a total joke to be honest and it's clear that our local school doesn't really want to open. It will be interesting to see what the attendance is like tomorrow and which rule changes are going to come about as I don't think the situation can continue like this for much longer.
Thanks F-Red I've had a read of the recent JCVI statement and it clarifies the position regarding this option, based on the rising number of cases, hospitalisations and the new variant. It's an option and it's a good thing to have options. One unknown factor is the vaccines efficacy being compromised by the new variant. I understand It'll be a couple of weeks before we have a clear picture on that aspect. One thing's clear, time is not on our side and its a difficult balancing act. We also have to add into the equation a government who have a record of cherry picking scientific advice and in some cases disregarding it all together.I can see the cynicism, but I believe the move on dosage from the JCVI (not the government remember) is to reduce the strain on hospitals which they are seeing currently with the new variant. Vaccinating more quicker with one dose, will reduce the chances of hospitalisation, or at the very least intensive care requirement, and in turn ease the burden the south are currently seeing on ICU.
It wasn't great. They left a lot of things up to us to do and communication from the school was quite poor. The school sound like they are not bothered if some pupils don't go in. Our boy will be off tomorrow as we assess how things are panning out.How was your school for providing work during lockdown in march?
Ours was poo. And our whole school is shut again but they aren't even doing work tomorrow it's starting Tuesday...
Idiots!!!
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Get well soon. Don't spread it, we know how South Carolina peoples are.Well. It got me. Tested positive.
Get well soon. Don't spread it, we know how South Carolina peoples are.
I'm not sure if your'e located in the U.K but this gives guidance. Sorry to hear about your partner.Just found out my partner did a c-section on a patient who later tested positive for covid. She had to self isolate and whilst I don’t, I have no idea how to act in the house. Do I just stay away from her, sleep in different rooms etc?
10-15 staff members taken out in one go apparently
I do believe that the Christmas gathering have had a massive effect on the new case load and considering this new variant the fact that people were legally able to gather was a massive clusterfeck by the government. They should have cancelled Christmas nation wide but after calling Starmer the Grinch BJ had backed himself into a corner where he wasn't willing to look foolish.Tweet
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Bugger. All the best.Well. It got me. Tested positive.
Feck man I hope you are alright and stay alright.Well. It got me. Tested positive.