Joel Glazer sets fan forum date (4th June)

Van Piorsing

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Resetting the toxic relationship ? :lol: Every experienced bloke or lass will tell you it's suicide.

Hope the fanbase won't let go and stay vigilant.
 

TsuWave

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Did he say if they're buying Sancho? Speak on squad investment?
 

#07

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My response to Mr Glazer's words is simple: I'll believe it when I see it.

If the reader isn't broken the next time I go to swipe my card at an Old Trafford turnstile I'll begin to believe the promises.

As long as the roof at Old Trafford is leaking like a sieve etc. This is all just hot air.
 

King7Eric

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Think this is about as good as you can hope for at this point. We are not going to kick them out or have them pay off the debt overnight. We need to take small steps and this is really all that we will get out at this point. I am all for the protests, even if it means getting games called off, but we also have to be realistic in our short-term demands. Them committing to fan-owned shares and investment into the stadium and the team is pretty positive imo.
 

Nou_Camp99

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so no comment about the debt? Has anyone seen their answers directly to the fans?
There was a comment was there? They have said they have no intention of paying it off. Presumably very happy to just keep paying the interest and leaving us with THEIR debt.

They are parasites and need to go. Fans aren't go to buy into any of this BS anymore. More protests needed and we need to step it up again. Can't let these bloodsuckers win. This club is finished until they are gone. It's been dying a slow painful death every since they took over.
 

Dr. Dwayne

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Point 8 by itself is inexcusable. This is a debt they put on the club.
Is there a reason why they’re not paying it off? I mean, beyond the money going in their pockets instead. Some sort of financial shadiness/tax avoidance or something?
Morality aside, carrying debt is not unusual for a large entity. Interest rates are incredibly low making the servicing costs negligible. While some would argue that over time the costs could have been put toward the purchase a world class player, it's unlikley that the club would have put those funds into savings year over year so it's basically missing out on a squad player each season, something we can leverage our academy for instead. If the argument is that it could have been put to stadium upkeep or training ground improvements, again, the marginal annual amount would not likely have a significant impact.

There may be some tax advantages to carrying the debt when it comes to the dividend payments but I'm not 100% sure it applies to United.
 

Desert Eagle

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The two things they brag about are high net spend and high wages ( could argue its because they have incompetent idiots negotiating) and not increasing ticket prices ( fair) . That line about our commercial successes being crucial rings especially hollow when they are literally sucking money out of the club and loading us with long term debt.
 

Infestissumam

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more fan involvement and finally renovating the stadium would be a start. Let's see if it actually happens.
 

GBBQ

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We've every reason to be suspicious BUT there are some potentially significant positive outcomes all as a result of fan protest and pressure and thats something to be proud of.
 

TheReligion

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If those 'concessions' is all we get, our fans have bottled this worse than our players in the semis and EL final.

We've shown them we won't kick them out the same way the scousers did with their previous owners. In fact, we'd be willing to accept the crumbs they've thrown our way and will probably won't deliver on half of those promises to 100%, based on recent and past experiences.
What on earth you on about here? I certainly have no idea
 

Dr. Dwayne

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We've every reason to be suspicious BUT there are some potentially significant positive outcomes all as a result of fan protest and pressure and thats something to be proud of.
Yep. A real opportunity for some fan ownership and representation at board level. And some people still shit on it. Amazing.
 

jackal&hyde

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The fan share scheme sounds interesting. It will not be over night but in time, fans might be able to get significant ownership of the club. Might be the owners way of cashing out while also doing the right thing. I'm delusional I know.
 

Nou_Camp99

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Morality aside, carrying debt is not unusual for a large entity. Interest rates are incredibly low making the servicing costs negligible. While some would argue that over time the costs could have been put toward the purchase a world class player, it's unlikley that the club would have put those funds into savings year over year so it's basically missing out on a squad player each season, something we can leverage our academy for instead. If the argument is that it could have been put to stadium upkeep or training ground improvements, again, the marginal annual amount would not likely have a significant impact.

There may be some tax advantages to carrying the debt when it comes to the dividend payments but I'm not 100% sure it applies to United.
And when interest rates sore again after the pandemic is a forgotten stain in our distant memories and the world's economy starts to recover.....what then?

It will be back to no value in the market as the Glazer family simply don't care.

Protests aren't going away. They are only going to get worse. We've had enough of these parasites slowly killing our football club.
 

Dan_F

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The two things they brag about are is high net spend and high wages ( could argue its because they have incompetent idiots negotiating) and not increasing ticket prices ( fair) . That line about our commercial successes being crucial rings especially hollow when they are literally sucking money out of the club and loading us with long term debt.
This. And it’s something that so many opposition fans bring up to defend the Glazers. They’re basically bragging about completely wasting the clubs money.
 

Desert Eagle

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Morality aside, carrying debt is not unusual for a large entity. Interest rates are incredibly low making the servicing costs negligible. While some would argue that over time the costs could have been put toward the purchase a world class player, it's unlikley that the club would have put those funds into savings year over year so it's basically missing out on a squad player each season, something we can leverage our academy for instead. If the argument is that it could have been put to stadium upkeep or training ground improvements, again, the marginal annual amount would not likely have a significant impact.

There may be some tax advantages to carrying the debt when it comes to the dividend payments but I'm not 100% sure it applies to United.
It's not unusual but it's also unnecessary. We were debt free before these parasites leveraged the club in order to buy it. I don't know where you get the negligible amount from Doc but I've read it's been almost 1 billion taken out the club since they've been here. (Someone could correct me with the exact numbers)
 

RedDevilRoshi

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A load of politicians talk from Joel. We need to do this /that and the other and improve on this and that aspect. Nothing to say how are they going to go about it and when are they targeting to implement these changes.

Again, actions speak louder than words. The ball is in their court. Let’s see if they keep their word for once.
 

Dr. Dwayne

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And when interest rates sore again after the pandemic is a forgotten stain in our distant memories and the world's economy starts to recover.....what then?

It will be back to no value in the market as the Glazer family simply don't care.

Protests aren't going away. They are only going to get worse. We've had enough of these parasites slowly killing our football club.
Interest rates aren't going to "soar" anytime soon, they certainly won't be going up during a recovery. If they go up they go up incrementally quarter to quarter to lessen the shock to consumers who also carry debt.

And anyway the solution to rising interest rates is a bond issue, which they've done successfully before and could easily do again.
 

Dr. Dwayne

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It's not unusual but it's also unnecessary. We were debt free before these parasites leveraged the club in order to buy it. I don't know where you get the negligible amount from Doc but I've read it's been almost 1 billion taken out the club since they've been here. (Someone could correct me with the exact numbers)
Negligible annually, which is how entities look at these values.
 

TheReligion

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Just been reading my email and I'm fairly surprised. Again I'll believe it when I see it but the investment promises in both the squad and understructure are both hard to hide behind so they'll either deliver or they won't (and they already know what will happen if they don't).

The fan shares and representation is also quite interesting and most certainly positive. Again another one to watch develop.

All in all I think it's the best we could have hoped for bar the pig headedness about the debt and dividends. I don't think anyone thought we'd be at this juncture with one of the Glazers themselves a few months ago and here we are.
 
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Is there a reason why they’re not paying it off? I mean, beyond the money going in their pockets instead. Some sort of financial shadiness/tax avoidance or something?
interest payments decrease the level of taxable profit, and this tax. It’s not shady, it’s normal business practice and planning.

The meeting sounded positive - let’s see the action that comes as a result. There’s nothing that they could have said that will appease fans - however if they are going to follow through, this is a good start, and they have to start somewhere.

they will need to make some infrastructure announcements, resolve some of the issues with the women’s team and have a good transfer window.
 

bosnian_red

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It's not unusual but it's also unnecessary. We were debt free before these parasites leveraged the club in order to buy it. I don't know where you get the negligible amount from Doc but I've read it's been almost 1 billion taken out the club since they've been here. (Someone could correct me with the exact numbers)
We operated on a much smaller budget as well. For me, it's a case of me and probably 99% of fans not really understanding the true impact/cost/benefit of it so I don't like going into it. If you look at it from a purely owner selfish POV, if it was actually harmful to their pockets they wouldn't want to have it. You could look at it as being extra money that they could pocket anyway. Swiss ramble has goody threads but I just don't know how useful it is to look at some of these figures in absolutes.
 

romufc

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This is typical stuff that you hear from big corporations. Say exactly what the fans want to hear.

We need all those things he has said will happen to be delivered soon.
 

Adamsk7

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Sounds promising. Proof is in the pudding and all that but that was about as good as we were going to get. I’m willing to give them a chance but we need to see steps forward every year towards these goals.
 

bosnian_red

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If those 'concessions' is all we get, our fans have bottled this worse than our players in the semis and EL final.

We've shown them we won't kick them out the same way the scousers did with their previous owners. In fact, we'd be willing to accept the crumbs they've thrown our way and will probably won't deliver on half of those promises to 100%, based on recent and past experiences.
How exactly do you plan on kicking them out? They are owners of a company valued it £4billion. Nobody can kick them out. The realistic best case scenario was always them to just be better, more engaged owners.
 

#07

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Sounds promising. Proof is in the pudding and all that but that was about as good as we were going to get. I’m willing to give them a chance but we need to see steps forward every year towards these goals.
So was Casey Stoney when they told her two years ago they'd develop better training facilities for our women's team.

Its all spin.

We've had this lot for 16 years. That's longer than a lot of relationships. After 16 years you know what to expect from someone.

Just been reading my email and I'm fairly surprised. Again I'll believe it when I see it but the investment promises in both the squad and understructure are both hard to hide behind so they'll either deliver or they won't (and they already know what will happen if they don't).

The fan shares and representation is also quite interesting and most certainly positive. Again another one to watch develop.

All in all I think it's the best we could have hoped for bar the pig headedness about the debt and dividends. I don't think anyone thought we'd be at this juncture with one of the Glazers themselves a few months ago and here we are.
They've done it before, why change now?

Honestly, if we get off to a good start to the season, they'll just hope fans are so happy with what's going on on the pitch that they don't give a crap that the letters on the Sir Alex Ferguson stand look like they'll fall off.

This is all an exercise in buying themselves time and hoping things cool down.
 

Acole9

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Also considering renaming the stadium to pay towards refurb.

£80m available for new players and more through sales of our own

Admitted ESL handled badly, didn't rule out something in future but different than ESL

Not looking to sell but will have more input with fans
Very good :lol:
 
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JB08

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Just been reading my email and I'm fairly surprised. Again I'll believe it when I see it but the investment promises in both the squad and understructure are both hard to hide behind so they'll either deliver or they won't (and they already know what will happen if they don't).

The fan shares and representation is also quite interesting and most certainly positive. Again another one to watch develop.

All in all I think it's the best we could have hoped for bar the pig headedness about the debt and dividends. I don't think anyone thought we'd be at this juncture with one of the Glazers themselves a few months ago and here we are.
What will happen that hasn’t before?
 

Desert Eagle

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Negligible annually, which is how entities look at these values.
Sure, negligible only on the condition we maintain our value and income. Not to mention it was only done so they could buy the club. I understand what you're saying in that if we disregard how the debt came about a succesful large business could handle a chunk of debt no problem. I don't think further proof is needed though that our owners are in it for the cash and do not have the clubs best interest in mind therefore I am very hesitant to believe they will ever pay off the debt. We could be looking a few decades down the line at an obscene amount of money paid to banks for the privilege of having the glazers own us.