Good form? HahahahahaLooks like he’s carrying his good form from December into the Euros
6
Season Average Rating
- Appearances
- 42
- Goals
- 6
- Assists
- 6
- Yellow cards
- 9
- Status
Yes he’s been terrible since December hasn’t he
No he's been okay. He's scored 2 PL goals since Xmas day. Both of which came in January.
You love Pogba don't you?
He might do. He plays for the team he supports.
That's a strange comeback. We have over 30 players in our first team squad. Does he love them all?
Pogba hasn't been sensational since Christmas. He's hasn't even been great or good. He's just been okay. No less no more. And he was woeful in the final where we needed him to step up and run the game and he didn't. Mctomminay actually stepped up more on the night which speaks volumes.
Well you clearly don’t love them all that much is clear.
Your initial assertion was the strange thing actually. To come onto a United forum and throw accusations of United fans loving a United player is what is weird.
A United fan trawling the net to look for any praise of a United player so that they can shoot it down/diminish it no doubt to provide ‘balance’ or whatever is weird.
What absolutely isn’t strange is a Manchester United fan loving Paul Pogba, who has spent most of his career at United since he was 16. The few that are so intent on normalising dislike for him are the ones who need to have a look at themselves. United fans shouldn’t be getting called out for liking Pogba.
Not to mention that you’re talking shite anyway. He was the player of the month in January. He was injured after that and then returned in good form again, as has been recognised by all except this cult of yours.
And to use your own ridiculous logic that you have been using all year, ‘how many goals did McTominay score in the final?’
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The goals argument is a funny one. He got hammered in Jose’s last season when he was scoring at a good rate. I would say he’s been a lot better this season despite scoring a lot less
I like great footballers, I value that over work horses. What I dislike are people like yourself who come on here when it suits and spout absolute nonsense that can’t be backed up but just becomes narrative.
You may disagree in individual cases, which is fine, but simply look through the thread marks of the games on here from December game by game and you will get a general consensus of his performances in that period. There’s 34 games in total. I’ll tell you now that the general consensus in the majority is excellent, phenomenal, sensational some it’s very good, or good again, get the contract signed etc etc etc. Then there’s the odd game where he was average and a few particularly towards the end of the season like Liverpool where he was shite.
I think with a sample size of 34 games, if the likes of yourself and Pogue etc disagree with the general consensus, especially in a thread as toxic as this against Pogba, then the issue you have is a personal issue.
I just hope the Samaritans are fully staffed the day he leaves.
I'd disagree. And sort of agree, I guess? He's had good and great games, but he's also had really poor ones. The inconsistency has been there.
The problem is the constant overrating of his performances by his fans, who will scream a 9/10 performance if he pulls off one miraculous moment. Nevermind he carelessly gives away the ball that results in a foul that concedes a goal, or that his work rate in midfield can sometimes border on atrocious.
On the other hand, those that don't like him tend to underrate him, and the slamming begins not even 30 seconds into the game.
The problem with Pogba is we're constantly trying to balance his pros and cons, and it doesn't always work out.
I'm just now of the opinion that he's been a failed signing and we should move on. Away from the drama and all the fanfare and get someone in who gives us more balance, which I think will benefit us greatly more than Pogba does currently. He's actually not even that important to the way we play anymore.
The problem is that any opinion that is against Pogba is determined as being a hater, which is exhausting to deal with. I actually like Paul Pogba the personality, but I like my club infinitely more and I'd rather he played his football somewhere else, as I feel it would be more beneficial, but also because it feels like he's been a part of all the drama that's surrounded the club over the last few years, and now it's really time to move on.
Pretty sure that hammering was more to do with his conflict with the manager at the time, given that Mourinho dropped him from the team. People took sides. So did I, to be fair.
Most of those goals came under Solskjaer, where he bordered on unplayable.
Don't think anyone had complaints then.
The thing is, this type of conversation is a large part of the ‘circus’. I mean look at us. Why are we even having this conversation today? Again. All it took was a very good performance against Bulgaria and off we go again, red vs blue. ‘Calm down, their players play for FC whatever’, which, seemingly oddly to you, gets replies of ‘hater’ and so on and so forth. I don’t see other players good games overly mitigated to the same degree. You say ‘one miraculous pass’, yet the same happens for many other players, who we are a lot more willing to just concede the assessment of a ‘good performance’. Scott made a couple of runs against Villarreal, we all said he was good. No minute by minute, pass by pass. By any standard, it’s what footy fans will call a ‘good game’.
In the end, we all get exhausted and say we can’t wait for it to be all over. Personally, I don’t actually think there is anywhere near as much to discuss as we do discuss. In recent years, you would get the odd agent comment, perhaps twice a season, but other than that, radio silence typically. The actual football is micro-analysed for pages and pages, with red vs blue trying to infer deeper meanings, psychology and motivations etc. In short, I think us fans are the biggest part of this so called circus. Pogba threads stay active even if he is injured for ages. I’m exhausted, I promised myself that I’d stay away from all this BS this summer and here I am already!
From a team perspective, I’m with you though. I’m all about building the best team we can, and Pogba in a double pivot isn’t that IMO. If we can’t play a midfield 3, I’m happy for him to go, as that is where he is best. But the whole ‘circus’ and villain of the piece thing is massively overblown. The man barely speaks. It’s everyone else who just can’t shut up about him. Here we are at each other again, when all the actual player has done is play a football match (quite well, by most accounts).
That's the thing, we are the circus and complain about the circus.
If he’s gonna run his contract down I hope Ole has the spine to put him out of the squad for the entire season.
what would be the point of that?
let’s let him ‘rot in the reserves’ - well U23s…
Just another reason to bash the manager.
Okay, is that a response to what I said then?
Sell him this summer or make sure he signs a contract.
I cant bare to think about him leaving on a free next summer after we wasted £89m on him, not mentioned 10s of millions in wages and got almost nothing in return.
I cant bare to think about him leaving on a free next summer after we wasted £89m on him, not mentioned 10s of millions in wages and got almost nothing in return.
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If he's against moving this summer just so he can bank himself and his dick pull of an agent some exorbitant signing bonus he can get to feck. Not that I'd advocate relegating him to the reserves when the season actually kicks off, but it's not hard to get the sentiment.
And yeh, people can be petty and often act like children. Welcome to the (entertaining) shit-show that is talking about football. I wouldn't take it so seriously.
Which position does Pogba play for, for France?
How are they getting so much out of him and 9 times out of 10 he's under achieving at United?
How are they getting so much out of him and 9 times out of 10 he's under achieving at United?
The truth is that 9 times out of 10, he isn’t underachieving here, and also that 9 times out of 10, France win football matches. If they only won 6 out of 10, the narrative would likely be similar.
Sorry, but my national team is at a lower level than a Championship side.
This must have been one of France's easiest matches ever.He’ll get an exorbitant signing bonus is he extends his deal here. And I think this ongoing insinuation that Pogba’s future simply depends on a number is unfair. There has been little evidence of that so far in his career, never any arguments about wages etc.
Anyway, if he leaves next year, the most obvious question is, of course, will he be committed and professional next season. If the answer is ‘no’, then for sure - I agree with removing him from the team. Otherwise, next season should be no different. A player is free to see out his contract and then consider his options.
Also, an important thing to point out is that for him to be the villain in such a scenario, he would need to refuse to move this summer. If he ultimately wants to leave, yet no club makes a suitable offer for him, what is he supposed to do, just extend his contract because he’s nice? And then start angling to leave after that? If he wants to go, he’ll go this summer or next, but this summer isn’t in his control. I’ve seen no presentable bid arrive.
That would just be cutting off your nose to spite your face though.
Regardless of what is happening with anyone's contract you still put out your best team.
It's very hard to type these, as I find myself agreeing with you on some matters, but also find you misunderstand me on others. I'll try to acknowledge all points, but I get carried away, so that may be difficult.
I agree, largely, that we are a massive part of the circus. Whether regarding the manager or players or owners, we are an exhausting lot.
Tbh, I wasn't referring to his match today. What Paul or any other Manchester United player does on the national stage is largely irrelevant when critiquing them as Manchester United players. If something good happens, like a World Cup win, I'm happy for them, but I really don't care much, only hope they remain fit and injury-free, and maybe gain some confidence going into the new season.
My comment was largely based on what I read today and over a while now. Partially due to frustration that nobody can have a decent discussion here(on any thread), without it turning into a name-calling fest.
And yet I still feel that the comments become overblown when it comes to certain players who overrate and underrate performances. Maybe you and I don't, but it happens far too often.
One thing we do disagree on(of many, I assume), is the comparisons with other players. If I say something about one player, it has no relevance on my opinion of another. I dislike the "but what about player X performances", as a counter argument, as I feel it means the whole point is lost. Looking at the example, Scott McTominay had a good game by the standards of Scott McTominay. We probably won't see much better than that out of him as it's well known he is a limited footballer in his own right.
Paul Pogba is a footballer on another planet by comparison. The standards I hold to Paul are completely different to those I hold for Scott. But Pogba flatters to deceive a lot, and that is frustrating. It's true that he's been unlucky with injuries and so on, but contrary to you, I don't really expect too much from him. I do however, expect him to do more than he does, but we've argued this before.
One of the things that keeps getting to me is that I don't believe Paul really wants to be here. Now that's an opinion, and you can disagree, nor is it a condemnation of Pogba. I don't think he's wanted to be here for a while now, and if it weren't for Covid, he'd have been gone.
That then lends to my opinion that he is winding his contract down, which seems likely. Fair enough.
But if this club is pandering to a player who doesn't want to be here, there is an issue. So, perhaps using him as a way of bringing in something we need is valid rather than losing him on a free, which would be embarrassing.
This is where my point was severely misunderstood.
I never suggested Pogba was a "villain" or is "toxic".
The last 8 or so years have been the biggest circus around this club.
My point was, he has been an aspect of that. Indirectly so, but an aspect nonetheless.
Reason being that when we don't, the charades that this club creates continue onward.
I just want this club to be done with it all.
The quality wasn't there, but those games aren't the easiest ever because the team is so compact and not taking much risk. They're usually frustrating games to watch for France, but they managed to break Bulgaria down. With this tactic, no matter how poor the opposition team is, it can frustrate any level of opposition.Sorry, but my national team is at a lower level than a Championship side.
My points were not an attempt to summarise your personal views. You mentioned circus, and I spoke broadly about the nature of conversation around Pogba - not yours in particular. And your comment on Scott is fair, but I don’t think it is only limited to limited players. Other good players too. I don’t think I’ve seen another footballer in my life get the sort of minute by minute, pass by pass analysis that PP gets. Kevin De Bruyne has just been lazily awarded a POTY title, for example. It’s like people are barely paying attention to the detail there. Bruno has just been names United’s best player this season. He’s had more bad games than even Pogba. For Pogba to win a POTY award, whether at the club or beyond, I’d imagine he’d need to be beyond any question in almost every game. Others are clearly not held to the same standard. In my opinion. But this isn’t about anything you have said specifically, more generally.
With regards to him wanting to be here, I neither disagree nor agree with you. I simply don’t know, nor do I care. I don’t require an affirmation of ‘forever and ever’. My only requirement is for you to do your best while you are here. I’m not sensitive about Pogba maybe wanting to leave one day. If that day comes, then he will go. My issue is the ‘until then’. He hasn’t gone yet, so let’s at least treat him like a United player while he is a United player. If he leaves next summer, for all the ‘he hates it here’ talk, he’d have spent 6 years here. 6 years in his 20s. That is more than what many of the squad will see. Worse players than him will leave because their interests and our interests no longer align. That’s the game. But I don’t see him as some prisoner. I’m sure he’s more than happy to do what he can while he is here. Which is all that matters for me.
And I don’t get you saying he is ‘winding down his contract’. He hasn’t refused to leave for a fee. It is us that has refused to sell him! Come next year, we can no longer refuse, and he’d of course be villanised at that point, but the club could have sold him at any point over the 6 years if making money was their aim, but they have chosen to keep the player. All he can do is try his best while he is here.
Yeah, but if you put Pogba in the team someone else that is actually staying wont get gametime and develop further
Their other midfielders > Uniteds
I know it's the extreme end of the scale but what if you ended up narrowly losing a title?
Well yeah thats true I guess. I would just think it could be quite an upset in the dressing room if Pogba got played much ahead of others if it was obvious he was leaving.
Maybe a compromise as a super sub then...
He'll get a bigger signing on fee as a free agent, though. I imagine the exact reason why he hasn't signed yet is precisely because we aren't offering him and Raiola the packet they're after. There's definitely been murmurings about money, though, just recently reports suggested he wanted £500k a week. You aren't going to get concrete evidence obviously, you never do. With that said since joining he's been amongst the top paid players consistently, it's hardly surprising there's been few arguments. What the feck would he/Raiola have to complain about?! He's been fantastically well recompensed. By all accounts he's taken the piss with his recent demands.
I find it hard to believe there isn't a buyer out there that'd take him this summer for £40/50m. He's one of the most talented midfielders in the world in his prime years - practically every big club across Europe would want him. Quite a few teams in a state of transition following rubbish campaigns, too. Rumours circulating today about Hakimi going for £63m ffs, Pogba for £40m is a snip! Likewise I've seen nothing about him leaving this summer but I can't see why United and another big club wouldn't want to make it happen over the next couple of months at a discounted rate. I don't think Pogba is a supervillain and I don't expect him to sign a contract just to be nice, but his agent is Raiola so people will automatically assume the worst, which is hardly surprising.
Why would it be an upset? He has a contract and is respecting it, why should the club sanction a player and itself? This is one of the dumbest aspects of modern football.
I hope he stays, I really do but if he makes it plain he isnt going to sign then Im in favour of him never playing again. We need players 100% committed to the cause, not ones with one foot out of the door.
He scored more than Pogba over the season tbf. That pretty much sums it all up to a tee.
If Pogba puts his boots on the correct feet you lot fall over in admiration. He's been a very disappointing signing. The excuses made for him and that continue to be made for him have ran their course.
Great to see he his doing well
I’m not really fussed whether he stays ot goes personally, the show will go on. Him not staying beyond his contract shows nothing about his commitment to achieve the best he can while he is here. Nor does it for any other player, be it Wijnaldum, Aguero, Alaba or anyone. Which is why players don’t get benched just because they are in their final season. And having a contract to run is no greater indication of commitment than being in your final year. Otherwise Dortmund should bench Haaland all year if he doesn’t sign a new deal as him leaving next summer is an open secret. We’ve had a player on loan literally play against us and celebrate a goal this season. Likewise Coutinho scoring goals to knock his club out of the CL.
All you can ask of a player is to do his best where he is. The future is the future.
If a manager picks a player that clearly doesnt want to be in the club over others perhaps?
What exactly does it sum up?
And by the same token, he needs to score a goal a game for you to get the feck off his back for 5 minutes.
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