Hammondo
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- Aug 21, 2015
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Not in midfield pogba isn't.Sorry, I think Pogs and Bruno are our best players but equally at times the most indisciplined.
Not in midfield pogba isn't.Sorry, I think Pogs and Bruno are our best players but equally at times the most indisciplined.
We don't have that player and it's why we're in the transfer forum discussing the potential arrival of one with the transfer window still open.Good player but unproven in the prem. The problem with that formation is we don't have the players to play it. Bruno and Pogs leaves the 3rd midfielder out to dry.
Rice isn't a option for the reasons you've described. A deal for Tchouameni could be a possibility, though.Blowing 100 on Rice would be stupid. He’s a solid player but for that you’d want someone to be better on the ball. Surely Tchouameni would be better value…
Wondered if Monaco would be interested in Donny. Using him in part exchange would solve a problem as it doesn’t look like he’ll ever fit in for you. Tchouameni looks better on the ball than Rice is and I don’t get the idea that Rice is “proven in the Premier League”. He’s proven at West Ham’s level. He’d be okay for United but his limitations would frustrate.Rice isn't a option for the reasons you've described. A deal for Tchouameni could be a possibility, though.
Maybe but this league can punish you on any given day....Don't you think we can afford some indiscipline against the so called lesser teams?
Yep and just commented that he's unproven in Prem and a massive risk to come in and anchor the midfield from the get go.We don't have that player and it's why we're in the transfer forum discussing the potential arrival of one with the transfer window still open.
Could it be because we need a DM and he's one of the best in the league I wonder? It's up to the suits to find a deal.Can literally sign any two of Camavinga/Neves/Bissouma/Saul for the price of Rice. Why has this thread got to 200 pages?
So hopefully it is clear now from yesterday's game that Martial is ahead of VdB & Lingard,No, because we don’t need 4 forwards on the bench.
It’s frustrating because Rice would help massively with the defensive side, which was clearly an issue yesterday, but an even bigger issue is that you mention and Rice isn’t helping there.We struggled keeping possession in the first half under heavy press, and building play. Pogba lost the ball a few times. Fred too.
Rice wont help with that either.
Rightfully so too, as shit as he’s been, I’m sure we all got a little excited watching Martial come on at left wing and hoping he could make something could happen.So hopefully it is clear now from yesterday's game that Martial is ahead of VdB & Lingard,
Yeah, that would not work. But I don't think OGS would set the team up this way if McT was ready to play either. With Rice on the books we would probably se McT partnered with Rice most of the time with Fred as a backup.That's more balanced and better defensively but we were talking about just replacing Fred with Rice in this game and how that would have prevented the midfield from getting bypassed so easily
He's from a league that is arguably the best when it comes to exporting talent. And unless the club (United) believe there's someone 'prem proven' who they can sign in the time remaining before the window shuts, then a player like Tchouameni who is from a country with a very good record of churning top talent should be a potential option IMO.Yep and just commented that he's unproven in Prem and a massive risk to come in and anchor the midfield from the get go.
Maybe. It's like the lad from Brighton, if it's so obvious why is he still there at a club that pretty much 70% of the teams in PL could get even if it's to improve their squad? No saying that they aren't a talent, just think fans tend to rate their own players less, other teams players more. It's funny as when we signed Harry, many Leicester fans weren't marching to the ground or burning shirts because they see him ever game. They knew they wouldn't miss him. I like my football but if I'm honest, most of these players we are linked with, never watched them play in any meaningful way.He's from a league that is arguably the best when it comes to exporting talent. And unless the club (United) believe there's someone 'prem proven' who they can sign in the time remaining before the window shuts, then a player like Tchouameni who is from a country with a very good record of churning top talent should be a potential option IMO.
I don’t remember any United fans marching to the ground or burning shirts when Ronaldo left, maybe we knew we wouldn’t miss him.It's funny as when we signed Harry, many Leicester fans weren't marching to the ground or burning shirts because they see him ever game.
Sure, and it would be more defensively solid, but it wouldnt suddenly mean Pogba stops losing the ball in midfield in dangerous areas, or that we become good at building up play.I would rather see Rice next to Pogba than either McTominay or Fred.
And clearly that's never going to happen, we are not going to move Bruno from his most dangerous position. He struggles when playing deeper for Portugal as well, he is simply not the player he is further up.I've quite clearly said that we should look to play a 3 man midfield in a 4-3-3 formation if possible by asking Bruno to retreat from his second striker role.
It's incredible how we have Carrick on the coaching staff and look completely clueless at what he excelled at. Scholes levels of coaching skills it seems.United Must sign a solid CDM by tomorrow or we will seriously struggle to dominate midfield.
Fred / Pogba mix is too weak
Maybe we should of because we were wrong. Says something when a player replaces himself 12 years later.....I don’t remember any United fans marching to the ground or burning shirts when Ronaldo left, maybe we knew we wouldn’t miss him.
I've explained to you in my previous post that unless we create conditions for triangles/rondos, then it doesn't matter who the midfielders are. Because if there isn't pass simple options or a vertical pass option then we will see what we saw yesterday with the opposition defending in a 5-4-1 whilst cutting off the pass lanes with very little movement up top from us to unhinge the opposition defensive structure.Sure, and it would be more defensively solid, but it wouldnt suddenly mean Pogba stops losing the ball in midfield in dangerous areas, or that we become good at building up play.
And clearly that's never going to happen, we are not going to move Bruno from his most dangerous position. He struggles when playing deeper for Portugal as well, he is simply not the player he is further up.
So rather than buying Rice in the hope that suddenly we will change our formation and Bruno's best position to accomodate Rice...Its makes far more sense to get a player than can work in our current formation, and not play players out of position(Pogba).
--------Varane--Maguire
AWB--Neves--Fred--Shaw
----------------------------------------
Jadon-Bruno-Ronaldo-Rashford
I'd rather have Neves in that deeper posiiton than Rice or Pogba, because he can actually evade the press and help in our buildup. Another thing that works is playing Pogba from the left who will drift infield during buildup to add an extra body.
Oh my god, how embarrassing.In fairness, Carrick has never done anything remotely as good as this in football.
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I disagree.I've explained to you in my previous post that unless we create conditions for triangles/rondos, then it doesn't matter who the midfielders are.
Jorginho plays ahead of a 3 man back-line and also has very mobile players in midfield next to him including the brilliant N'Golo Kante among others. But I do like Jorginho, I think he's a good player.I disagree.
Put Jorginho in place of where Pogba played yesterday, and we would be much better at keeping and progressing the ball. Because he is a natural DLP, unlike Pogba. I dont see how buying a "pure DM" helps us with out problem of progressing the ball on a personel level(w/o changing tactics).
Sure, we have issues with tactics as well, but we are not doing ourselves any favour by playing Pogba alongside Fred there. McT-Fred are our only functional midfielders. I'm not suggesting we buy Neves and play him as the sole DM, I'm saying we should play him alongside McT/Fred.
Blowing 100m at anyone is pretty stupid to be fair. Rice will be overpaid at whatever sum we get him if we decide to pursue with him.Blowing 100 on Rice would be stupid. He’s a solid player but for that you’d want someone to be better on the ball. Surely Tchouameni would be better value…
We are not playing 4-3-3Casemiro
Kroos-Modric
Fernandinho
De Bruyne-Silva
Busquets
Xavi-Iniesta
Rice
Bruno-Pogba
There were equally many times pogba had multiple options and picks the wrong one putting us in a worse position.Jorginho plays ahead of a 3 man back-line and also has very mobile players in midfield next to him including the brilliant N'Golo Kante among others. But I do like Jorginho, I think he's a good player.
I agree we need a midfielder but I also think we need to create conditions for those midfielders to thrive. I've watched yesterday's game twice now and both times watching the game it became apparent to me that on too many occassions, Pogba had the ball deep in midfield and there was no simple pass option available to him. Both our wide receivers were blocked off and the only options Pogba had was to either to go on a dribble or knock it long to either Mason or Sancho who were second favourites against the Wolves back line against the high ball. So if we can address that, then I believe we would improve considerably.
But I do agree we need midfielders to upgrade us both defensively and offensively.
Our 3 does not fit what the other teams have at all.Casemiro
Kroos-Modric
Fernandinho
De Bruyne-Silva
Busquets
Xavi-Iniesta
Rice
Bruno-Pogba
Yes, Jorginho plays next to Kante, but I was saying for Jorginho-type to play next to Fred too. He has played next to Veratti for Italy who play a back 4 and did fine. Obviously a DLP usually plays next to a ball winner/box to box type. I think Fred and McT are decent options for that role for us now.Jorginho plays ahead of a 3 man back-line and also has very mobile players in midfield next to him including the brilliant N'Golo Kante among others. But I do like Jorginho, I think he's a good player.
Kroos, Modric, Xavi and Iniesta are elite midfielders who can control the game and set the tempo of the game with their passing. While Pogba and Bruno are the kind of mdifielders who are brilliant at playing that final pass, they are not good at controlling games. That's why they usually need 2 more midfielders doing that behind them. Pogba and Bruno are not the same type of players as Xavi, Modric or Kroos.Casemiro
Kroos-Modric
Fernandinho
De Bruyne-Silva
Busquets
Xavi-Iniesta
I expect that because the risk reward factor can be worth it with him. I'd rather see him play the way he does and provide moments of quality than seeing players hiding in midfield from the ball.There were equally many times pogba had multiple options and picks the wrong one putting us in a worse position.
No he was passing to people in bad positions and in no position to attack, he does not understand he needs to be making space for his team and setting the tempo.I expect that because the risk reward factor can be worth it with him. I'd rather see him play the way he does and provide moments of quality than seeing players hiding in midfield from the ball.
He would but I think people don't mention him because they assume Leeds wouldn't let him go for anything other than a ridiculous price. Would be great if possible though.Kalvin Phillips would be a far better buy in my opinion.
I prefer him as a player but Rice is more what we need, and even then I don’t really rate him that highly.Kalvin Phillips would be a far better buy in my opinion.
One of those is not like the othersCasemiro
Kroos-Modric
Fernandinho
De Bruyne-Silva
Busquets
Xavi-Iniesta
Rice
Bruno-Pogba
You can't make space for yourself if there's a huge gap between the midfield two and front 3 with Wolves players swamping the half spaces and cutting off passing lanes to our fullbacks. You can only control tempo if there is players in close proximity who you can play off. Muller plays in a similar role to Bruno for Bayern and provides a vertical option on many occassions for his two midfield team mates. Donny Van de Beek at Ajax did the same with Schone and Frenkie de Jong which creates rondos/triangles in the middle and either side.No he was passing to people in bad positions and in no position to attack, he does not understand he needs to be making space for his team and setting the tempo.
He's supposed to make space for the other players. He had multiple other easy passes and often did a pass further away to a player without space who then got closed down. He has shown time and time again he doesn't know how to play that role.You can't make space for yourself if there's a huge gap between the midfield two and front 3 with Wolves players swamping the half spaces and cutting off passing lanes to our fullbacks. You can only control tempo if there is players in close proximity who you can play off. Muller plays in a similar role to Bruno for Bayern and provides a vertical option on many occassions for his two midfield team mates. Donny Van de Beek at Ajax did the same with Schone and Frenkie de Jong which creates rondos/triangles in the middle and either side.
I don't believe he suits the deeper role but to expect him to control tempo yesterday against a team who were defending in a 5-4-1 and with our structural set up is silly.