Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion

[Foxbatt]

The downside of having had Fergie is that we seem desperate to find another Fergie and are willing to stretch every manager's tenure until it violently breaks in the hope that this one will somehow end up staying for almost three decades and win everything many times over.

We have been down this path with SAF trying to find the next Roy Keane. We still have not found him. We will never find another SAF in the next 25 years. We should forget about all this and get someone who is capable of winning a trophy with these group of players who have the quality.

 

[FatTails]

He’s not going anywhere unless we don’t make top 4, which we will because our squad is too good not to and there is a considerable gap in quality between us and the other 16 teams (excluding City, Chelsea, and Liverpool)

 

[Frank Grimes]

3 defeats in our last 4 games. Very lucky not to get pumped by Wolves and even Southampton outplayed us. The guy is clueless and looking at our fixtures between now and end of November we are in big trouble.

 

[E-mal]

The result has finally caught up with the performance but anybody who analysed the team dispassionately could see that the performance was poor, tactics where rudimentary and not up to scratch!

 

[DomesticTadpole]

I won't hold my breath about our management acting swiftly even then.

One clear argument which is brought up by many is very relevant for club hierarchy to think. If Ole is sacked now or resigns, will even a tier 2 club employ him? Answer is no. Then why is he managing one of the biggest club in the world?

Also we have AWB missing who was good today.

 

[tenpoless]

This is the only time he's really been under pressure. Before this it was all like meh... we'll do alright. No more hiding for all his coaches and himself.

 

[JG3001]

I don’t get why he still has supporters, his limitations are obvious to anyone but the cult of Ole.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

He’s not going anywhere unless we don’t make top 4, which we will because our squad is too good not to and there is a considerable gap in quality between us and the other 16 teams (excluding City, Chelsea, and Liverpool)

Then we are going absolutely nowhere.

 

[talking robot]

If he loses against Villareal, he will be under enormous pressure. Villareal is a huge match for Ole personally and his future at the club. Zidane is out there, and could be seen as a clear upgrade. He would also be expected to have a good pre-existing relationship with many of the players.

 

[Man-United]

I hate 4-2-3-1.

 

[Foxbatt]

But you do agree that Ole came second with that midfield, right?

Is he going to even get second with that midfield this season?

 

[passing-wind]

the attacking football has been miles better...but the worry is at the moment it’s complete inconsistent. Crucial few weeks for ole coming up now, he usually pulls it out the bag but I’m not so sure this time after watching the game today.

United do not play attacking football under Ole. This narrative that fans have invented needs to go. The team sets out to play on the front foot with no consistency having any sense of cohesion, progressive movement or dynamism. This team still looks for the most part like a bunch of individuals.

United have better players in the starting 11 but they certainly don't look like an improved team.

 

[Beachryan]

Biggest worry is the sheer number of players playing worse right now.

Greenwood - selfish to an absolute fault today. Barely can call his relationship with Ronaldo a 'partnership'.
AWB - a travesty where football goes to die at present. In the second half Villa were literally leaving him open because he poses so little threat.
Fred - Diabolically bad at the easy stuff, and getting worse this season.
Fernandes - Not clutch, every key pass mishit slightly than costs us points.
Sancho - Who?

Even Varane looks a bit shaky, and who wouldn't playing with some of the above.

Limited structure, reliance on key players to magically conjure something up...and it's not working this season.

We were good against Leeds. That's been about it this season if we're honest.

 

[TsuWave]

Young Boys 2-1 Man Utd
Ham 1-2 Man Utd
Man Utd 0-1 West Ham
Man Utd 0-1 Aston Villa

 

[tenpoless]

From ManUtd app:

Ole : "We started the game well, aggressive, good on transitions, going forward quickly. The decision making, the execution in the final third, that costs us today. And decision making on VAR has cost us again, unfortunately. I've go to say it, it's offside, the goal. As Hause is heading it, Watkins is actually touching David, so he's impeding him".

Not worried about the VAR comment, it looked offside to me as well. What really concerns me is the first sentence. No mention on passing and keeping the ball better. Almost looks like that was how we wanted us to play. No control in midfield. When it works it's a joy to watch but when it doesn't it put the team on a massive risk. Can't see this sort of tactic winning big trophies.

 

[talking robot]

I don’t get why he still has supporters, his limitations are obvious to anyone but the cult of Ole.

I've been very very loyal to him up to this point, and have thought he deserves a crack at the whip of taking us next level with these players. He has stabilized the ship, and helped lay important foundations. His coaching limitations are very clear and my question was always whether he would evolve. I'm at a breaking point with him now. 3 losses out of 4 is not acceptable at the club, and long term he seems too stubborn and risk averse to take us to a major title. I think he can be fired if he loses against Villareal.

 

[HairyBack23]

This season was now or never. We're barely a few games in and the answer is already never.

Anyone who thinks Solskjaer is going to turn us into world beaters is off their rocker. I wanted him to succeed as much as anybody, but thats not going to happen. He's had his chance and unfortunately just isn't good enough. I just hope we cut our losses before we're out of all competitions but sadly I can't see that happening. A long frustrating season ahead folks.

 

[Walters_19_MuFc]

Is he going to even get second with that midfield this season?

Time will tell

 

[Slevs]

Not looking good, not learning from his mistakes time after time.

 

[Maluco]

We need to act now and not write off yet another season. Look at the players we have and looks at how we play. No need to investigated XG and have a moral debate.

He isn’t a good enough coach for a club of this size and is wasting one of the best squads in world football.

Thanks Ole, but let’s make the change and actually compete this season.

 

[SirScholes]

I desperately want him to succeed but after today, maybe it's time i face up to the fact that it might not happen. He looks far too limited.

He has the worst in game management I have seen. He has so many options at his disposal and he just seems to freeze on the spot.

 

[Hisha]

SAF became a success because club backed him and gave him time. Ole will become as good as SAF, we just needs to give him more time to learn coaching and buy 2-3 more world class players for him.

 

[TsuWave]

I just hope we cut our losses before we're out of all competitions but sadly I can't see that happening. A long frustrating season ahead folks.

we should have done that ages ago. Majority of progressive attacking managers have been picked up by serious clubs. Ten Hag is still around but I’m not even sure he’d be tempted

 

[spiriticon]

I hope we're not running out of steam in the title race after 4/5 matches, that would be criminal. We've had enough rebuild time now, and I honestly don't think the squad can get much better than it is now.

The football in the last few games has been dire. We must do better otherwise even I will struggle to see the point of keeping Ole.

Love the man-management, love the team spirit. But we must have a better mentality. Must.

 

[dove]

SAF became a success because club backed him and gave him time. Ole will become as good as SAF, we just needs to give him more time to learn coaching and buy 2-3 more world class players for him.

Finally someone with common sense.

 

[JoaquinJoaquin]

We might actually go through fine the next 8 - 10 games period. Just have a funny feeling about it.

But, yeah, the way we start the games have been a huge problem. Why can't we start the game like we did against Leeds this season?

Start games? We have been poor in all aspects of the game aside from 1.5 games.

Surely you do understand the reason we beat Leeds so convincingly was because they were so open, rather than us being great? They done the same against Liverpool and the same thing happened. It's Leeds fans big gripe about Bielsa right now.

 

[TsuWave]

SAF became a success because club backed him and gave him time. Ole will become as good as SAF, we just needs to give him more time to learn coaching and buy 2-3 more world class players for him.

nearly had an aneurysm before I realised this was sarcasm. I’m so gone. My head is hot

 

[El-Manos]

we should have done that ages ago. Majority of progressive attacking managers have been picked up by serious clubs. Ten Hag is still around but I’m not even sure he’d be tempted

Ya exactly… Sure look, why would he have any interest managing the likes of Bruno, ronaldo,varane, Sancho, greenwood & rashford. It’s only Manchester United at the end of the day.

 

[ReallyUSA]

No, this team can't fail this year. Ole has tp go.

 

[Sviken]

Expected. If anyone here expected we'd coast on individual performances till we win the title, he'd be delusional. The reality is that Villa game, as many people in this thread said, simply caught up to our performances. We didn't deserve to win against Wolves, we could have easily drew the Newcastle game, we could have easily lost the West Ham game and now... at the end of the road, there is no Ronaldo or Bruno to save us, no worldie goal from Jesse Lingard to nick the 3 points. And this is the problem with Ole. He has no system of play, he has no real "game" to his style. Our players are tactically clueless in everything. Yeah, sure, this squad will probably get us to top 4 by themselves, there's no doubt about that. But is our goal to be the new Arsenal? Because eventually even that leads to some bad roads down the line. Where are Arsenal now?

I've never seen a United team look as tactically clueless as under Ole (except Moyesy's tenure here). They're both the same. Every game we won under Moyes it was some great goal from Rooney or RVP and in every game we were tactically outplayed. Even under Mourinho or Van Gaal I could see what they were trying to do, albeit unsuccessfully. With Ole - I don't. And enough excuses. This is his third season and he has spent more than Guardiola or at least close to. Titles are to be expected. We're not playing on a shoestring budget here.

You give this squad to Zidane or Conte, they'd probably win the league with their eyes closed. Especially the latter. Do not underestimate the imporance of the manager when it comes to football. One simple signing from Chelsea changed them from a team that needs a "vast rebuild" into a CL winning team. One simple signing... that of the manager. We might seem tactically clueless now, but get a normal manager and we'd probably be world beaters. And the funny thing is - we have had easy fixtures so hard. Wait till we meet Chelsea, City and Liverpool back to back. This is where the fun begins...

 

[Foxbatt]

SAF became a success because club backed him and gave him time. Ole will become as good as SAF, we just needs to give him more time to learn coaching and buy 2-3 more world class players for him.

Do you know that SAF has already beaten the Old Firm when Scottish football was good? Do you know that SAF had already won a European Trophy beating Bayern Munich and Real Madrid before he was hired by United? The fact that under very difficult circumstances Fergie won all those trophies was the Main Reason why United hired him and backed him. What has Ole Gunnar done as a manager to get the job at United?

 

[devilish]

From ManUtd app:

Ole : "We started the game well, aggressive, good on transitions, going forward quickly. The decision making, the execution in the final third, that costs us today. And decision making on VAR has cost us again, unfortunately. I've go to say it, it's offside, the goal. As Hause is heading it, Watkins is actually touching David, so he's impeding him".

Not worried about the VAR comment, it looked offside to me as well. What really concerns me is the first sentence. No mention on passing and keeping the ball better. Almost looks like that was how we wanted us to play. No control in midfield. When it works it's a joy to watch but when it doesn't it put the team on a massive risk. Can't see this sort of tactic winning big trophies.

This is unbelievable. What is costing us is the fact that we're being schooled by Villa at OT despite having far better players then they do. We're clueless.

 

[Red Star One]

From ManUtd app:

Ole : "We started the game well, aggressive, good on transitions, going forward quickly. The decision making, the execution in the final third, that costs us today. And decision making on VAR has cost us again, unfortunately. I've go to say it, it's offside, the goal. As Hause is heading it, Watkins is actually touching David, so he's impeding him".

Not worried about the VAR comment, it looked offside to me as well. What really concerns me is the first sentence. No mention on passing and keeping the ball better. Almost looks like that was how we wanted us to play. No control in midfield. When it works it's a joy to watch but when it doesn't it put the team on a massive risk. Can't see this sort of tactic winning big trophies.

This is really worrying. Add to that his comments from before the WHU game where he disregarded tactics as a whole and I’m speechless

 

[The United]

Start games? We have been poor in all aspects of the game aside from 1.5 games.

Surely you do understand the reason we beat Leeds so convincingly was because they were so open, rather than us being great? They done the same against Liverpool and the same thing happened. It's Leeds fans big gripe about Bielsa right now.

And, what?

So you disagree that we don't start well? Or I am not sure what you are on about quoting me there.

 

[devilish]

Expected. If anyone here expected we'd coast on individual performances till we win the title, he'd be delusional. The reality is that Villa game, as many people in this thread said, simply caught up to our performances. We didn't deserve to win against Wolves, we could have easily drew the Newcastle game, we could have easily lost the West Ham game and now... at the end of the road, there is no Ronaldo or Bruno to save us, no worldie goal from Jesse Lingard to nick the 3 points. And this is the problem with Ole. He has no system of play, he has no real "game" to his style. Our players are tactically clueless in everything. Yeah, sure, this squad will probably get us to top 4 by themselves, there's no doubt about that. But is our goal to be the new Arsenal? Because eventually even that leads to some bad roads down the line. Where are Arsenal now?

I've never seen a United team look as tactically clueless as under Ole (except Moyesy's tenure here). They're both the same. Every game we won under Moyes it was some great goal from Rooney or RVP and in every game we were tactically outplayed. Even under Mourinho or Van Gaal I could see what they were trying to do, albeit unsuccessfully. With Ole - I don't. And enough excuses. This is his third season and he has spent more than Guardiola or at least close to. Titles are to be expected. We're not playing on a shoestring budget here.

You give this squad to Zidane or Conte, they'd probably win the league with their eyes closed. Especially the latter. Do not underestimate the imporance of the manager when it comes to football. One simple signing from Chelsea changed them from a team that needs a "vast rebuild" into a CL winning team. One simple signing... that of the manager. We might seem tactically clueless now, but get a normal manager and we'd probably be world beaters. And the funny thing is - we have had easy fixtures so hard. Wait till we meet Chelsea, City and Liverpool back to back. This is where the fun begins...

Zidane and Conte would probably dismantle the McFred CM first. They would need to partner Pogba with someone whose not championship level.

 

[Ranchero]

I desperately want him to succeed but after today, maybe it's time i face up to the fact that it might not happen. He looks far too limited.

I think we have all known this but are blinded to a degree by loyalty to a club legend. He isnt the man to take us forward. We need a top manager like Conte.

 

[Giggsyking]

This season should be his last chance, I dont give a shit about his contract extension. If he does not come close of winning the league. Then show him the door. If we are by Christmas too far from the top, then sack him before the second part of the season start.

 

[Ranchero]

Zidane and Conte would probably dismantle the McFred CM first. They would need to partner Pogba with someone whose not championship level.

Conte over Zindane. The Frenchman has only done it at his club. Conte is proven in the Prem and overseas

 

[berbatrick]

Glad I messed up setting my alarm, missed every minute.


Consistent good football under Ole:

1. Caretaker spell (Jan-March 2019)

2. Lockdown games (June-July 2020)

3. Bits of winter and spring last season: Nov-Dec 2020 and March-April 2021

Each time they happen, it's possible to build a narrative.
With the first one it's obvious. He's taken the team out of the Jose doldrums and has a positive attacking style with flair players (Pogba, Rashford) happy and in-form. Next season when things gel and he can buy players, it will be great!
With the second one, Bruno was the key signing at 10 to replace Lingard/Pereira, Pogba, Martial and Rashford all shaken off injuries, the front 4 look world-class. Really looking forward to next season with this young quick attack!
With the third one, Martial became lazy overnight, Pogba had Covid, Greenwood has 2nd season syndrome, but now with Cavani fit, Pogba back and Greenwood in form, Ole has the players to really play. Fill in some squad gaps and next season will be amazing!

(Fwiw, I really believed the second one).

The thing is, these are 3 spells of a few months each, spread over about 30 months of coaching.
It's exactly like that within this season too. Great first game, struggle through the next few, great game with Ronaldo, struggle through the next few. Both at the level of months and individual games, there is just no trend. There are good and bad performances that seemingly happen at random. The squad keeps improving in mostly logical ways (unlike Moyes or LvG or Jose or even "value in the market" period SAF), but the football doesn't really follow, I'd rather watch the lockdown games on repeat than almost any since tbh.

I guess the hope is that the good spell this season goes on for longer than usual?

 

[Ranchero]

This season should be his last chance, I dont give a shit about his contract extension. If he does not come close of winning the league. Then show him the door. If we are by Christmas too far from the top, then sack him before the second part of the season start.

He should go now. It is clear he is not the man. We need a proven coach.