Solskjaer's legacy and his future

[hobbers]

It is really incredible that people blame managers all the time. But never ever players. vanGaal not good enough. Mourinho not good enough. Solskjaer not good enough. And to believe rumours players aren't exactly pleased with Rangnick where some fans have already talked about not good enough. Nobody seems to be good enough for our players.

And no, he wasn't worst manager. Solskjaer did good job. Yes, he didn't won titles but we were top 3 every (whole) year with him. Countless semifinals and finals.

The managers sign and play the players who don't show up.

Ole wasted £140m on two shockingly poor defenders, for the money. And £40m on a midfielder who he treated like dirt. He played Rashford 90 minutes every game (or 120 in finals) when he was in poor form. He played Rashford when he was crippled by his shoulder. He played Rashford when he was in dismal form, crippled, had an ankle twice its normal size and was zonked out on pain meds.

He signed off on rewarding players with contracts more than twice their worth they hadn't earned, and he alienated half the squad by hoarding players and lying to them about their chances.

He kowtowed to Pogba and Martial, as was his original remit, but then completely failed to get any sort of system that Pogba could play in and oversaw Martial making the biggest collapse in talent and effort we've ever seen by any player at the club in living memory.

He also chose coaches and his staff around him based on them being nice people. Not because they were top in their field, they didn't even have to be competent.

 

[Leftback99]

It is really incredible that people blame managers all the time. But never ever players. vanGaal not good enough. Mourinho not good enough. Solskjaer not good enough. And to believe rumours players aren't exactly pleased with Rangnick where some fans have already talked about not good enough. Nobody seems to be good enough for our players.

And no, he wasn't worst manager. Solskjaer did good job. Yes, he didn't won titles but we were top 3 every (whole) year with him. Countless semifinals and finals.

People have become too entrenched in believing a change in manager will solve everything. It's always been the case that the quality and mentality of the players available is more important.

Many of those that are blaming Ole now also thought this squad was good enough for a title challenge pre season (it wasn't).

 

[Gordon Godot]

People have become too entrenched in believing a change in manager will solve everything. It's always been the case that the quality and mentality of the players available is more important.

Many of those that are blaming Ole now also thought this squad was good enough for a title challenge pre season (it wasn't).

Its actually incredible that muppets swing between blaming players and managers. None of them try to fail or want to play badly. Its the club board and owners who make these decisions. Thats where the blame lies. Sure, Ole should have had the self awareness to bring in proper coaches and even to walk once it went toxic, but not his fault he was given a job, initiall temp, then made permanent, then even renewed, when he had no qualifications for the job whatsoever. Nor the fault of many players we give them stupid money, renew contracts when they dont pay and then refuse to let them leave. its on the Glazers and Woodward. Debate all you like, but it wont change the reality.

 

[El Jefe]

Ole's legacy will be seen as one of incompetence, mediocrity and jobs for the boys. If he never gets another PL appointment which I suspect he won't it will be even more damning.

He was a puppet disguised as a manager and for the most part didn't know what he was doing. I'd attribute most of his 'success' down to keeping squad morale high, after all if you have good players in a good mood it will get you somewhere. Once that morale hit the wall it became the shitshow that most of us could see coming.

Still love the player and the man but Ole the manager is as bad as it gets at this level.

 

[R.N7]

This gif's more relevant for him than it ever was for Daglish.

 

[90 + 5min]

When one set of players fails, you can look at the players. But we've had so many since 2013, with different managers assembling different squads. Therefore, it's absolutely not "Nobody seems to be good enough for our players", as we're talking about dozens of them coming and going.

Morelike, nobody seems to be able to assemble a squad good enough and work with it properly.

Lot of players have played for atleast two managers and some for even more managers. And still there are same problems. I think it is about character.

Countless finals? Moyes was the worst, then Ole. 440 mill spent to win feck all

The managers sign and play the players who don't show up.

Ole wasted £140m on two shockingly poor defenders, for the money. And £40m on a midfielder who he treated like dirt. He played Rashford 90 minutes every game (or 120 in finals) when he was in poor form. He played Rashford when he was crippled by his shoulder. He played Rashford when he was in dismal form, crippled, had an ankle twice its normal size and was zonked out on pain meds.

He signed off on rewarding players with contracts more than twice their worth they hadn't earned, and he alienated half the squad by hoarding players and lying to them about their chances.

He kowtowed to Pogba and Martial, as was his original remit, but then completely failed to get any sort of system that Pogba could play in and oversaw Martial making the biggest collapse in talent and effort we've ever seen by any player at the club in living memory.

He also chose coaches and his staff around him based on them being nice people. Not because they were top in their field, they didn't even have to be competent.

I didn't say that he was spot on. There are things we can put blame on him too. Mostly, as you said, trying to please some players who should be out from the club.

He did improve our defence with Maguire and Bissaka. Not that they are great but they improved us. Did we need to pay as much for those? Ofcourse not. But that was the price we needed to pay. We have always overpaid players. That is nothing new with Solskjaer. What needs to be said is that he isn't the only one who makes or decide on signings. And why don't he get any credit for signings that were really good?

People have become too entrenched in believing a change in manager will solve everything. It's always been the case that the quality and mentality of the players available is more important.

Many of those that are blaming Ole now also thought this squad was good enough for a title challenge pre season (it wasn't).

On paper squad looks pretty good. That is on paper. In reality many are just average and there needs to be a miracle worker to get these players to perform. What we lack most is characters and leaders in the team. I think that Keane once said that you can't trust our players.

Ole's legacy will be seen as one of incompetence, mediocrity and jobs for the boys. If he never gets another PL appointment which I suspect he won't it will be even more damning.

He was a puppet disguised as a manager and for the most part didn't know what he was doing. I'd attribute most of his 'success' down to keeping squad morale high, after all if you have good players in a good mood it will get you somewhere. Once that morale hit the wall it became the shitshow that most of us could see coming.

Still love the player and the man but Ole the manager is as bad as it gets at this level.

Change Solskjaer to some players name that are seen as "stars" and you got it right. Pretenders that somehow got chance to play for our team.

 

[wolvored]

. And why don't he get any credit for signings that were really good?

Im struggling to think of a good signing. Bruno has undoubtably been the best, but is also very erratic. None of the others have stood out. As for the latest ones, although they have only had just over half a season, Verane hasnt improved the defence that much that is noticable, Sancho is up and down as well, more games poor than good. Ronaldo I'm not sure was 100% Ole signing, or just to appease Fergie. Saying that he hasnt pulled up any trees either.

 

[lex talionis]

Varane was an outstanding signing.

 

[Pintu]

He did improve our defence with Maguire and Bissaka. Not that they are great but they improved us. Did we need to pay as much for those? Ofcourse not. But that was the price we needed to pay. We have always overpaid players. That is nothing new with Solskjaer. What needs to be said is that he isn't the only one who makes or decide on signings. And why don't he get any credit for signings that were really good?

When you can afford to spend 140 M you are supposed to bring in real quality. Not blow it on 2 average players. Chelsea’s back 3 together costed them less than half that figure. And it has already delivered some silverware.

 

[Amir]

Lot of players have played for atleast two managers and some for even more managers. And still there are same problems. I think it is about character.

Which brings us back to the managers, as they assembles their squads, bought players, decided the starting lineup. If they chose players with crap characters, the problem is the managers.

Again, if we had the same set of players over the last 9 years and the managers couldn't make changes, I could say we had players with bad character and that was the big issue. But it wasn't. We've made tons of changes. And it's not very realistic to think we had so many players with bad characters.

 

[tomaldinho1]

People have become too entrenched in believing a change in manager will solve everything. It's always been the case that the quality and mentality of the players available is more important.

Many of those that are blaming Ole now also thought this squad was good enough for a title challenge pre season (it wasn't).

I think with a top coach we would be amongst or above Pool/Chelsea at the moment. Look at our results and say Flick was our coach (using him as an example as I'm assuming everyone rates him) do you not think we could have beaten Watford & Villa? That would put us 1 point behind Chelsea and we've played 2 games less than them... then you just look at the stupid dropped points, we have drawn with Newcastle & Everton (who are relegation fighters this season) and we got hammered by Leicester who are poor this season. That's just off the top of my head, there are other stupid draws I'm sure.

I think there's a very strong argument to say we wouldn't play as exciting football as Pool or as controlled football as City, and we wouldn't be favourites for the title, but we should be right amongst the chasing pack.

 

[Leftback99]

I think with a top coach we would be amongst or above Pool/Chelsea at the moment. Look at our results and say Flick was our coach (using him as an example as I'm assuming everyone rates him) do you not think we could have beaten Watford & Villa? That would put us 1 point behind Chelsea and we've played 2 games less than them... then you just look at the stupid dropped points, we have drawn with Newcastle & Everton (who are relegation fighters this season) and we got hammered by Leicester who are poor this season. That's just off the top of my head, there are other stupid draws I'm sure.

I think there's a very strong argument to say we wouldn't play as exciting football as Pool or as controlled football as City, and we wouldn't be favourites for the title, but we should be right amongst the chasing pack.

I honestly don't know how anyone can look at our squad and think it's up with Liverpools or City's. They are better in every single position.

The only reason we would be close to Chelsea in your scenario is because their results have dropped off. Don't they have a 'top coach' though?
(the Tuchel hype seems to have died down a bit on here lately)

 

[Caesar2290]

It is really incredible that people blame managers all the time. But never ever players. vanGaal not good enough. Mourinho not good enough. Solskjaer not good enough. And to believe rumours players aren't exactly pleased with Rangnick where some fans have already talked about not good enough. Nobody seems to be good enough for our players.

And no, he wasn't worst manager. Solskjaer did good job. Yes, he didn't won titles but we were top 3 every (whole) year with him. Countless semifinals and finals.

Of course, the managers are tasked to get the best out of the players. And let me give you an example, go no further than Sir Alex and his 2013 team.

That team won the title by 12 points. Next season, the exact same team finished 7th under Moyes. You will never get a much clearer split test of the impact of a manager on a group of players. Unless of course you think, all our players turned to shit over night. Personally I think if SAF that team had at least 2 more seasons in it to finish Top3. That is the impact of a manager.

As for Ole, not only did he spent a ton, what exactly did he leave us with? An unbalanced squad full of unhappy players that we are now scrambling to loan out? Players unwilling to train and act surprised when asked to run? 0 trophies? And no, Top4 finishes for a club of our stature and spending is completely unacceptable.

The man failed and thank God he was sacked because finally we can actually focus on meritocracy and leave this whole "he understands the club" nonsense behind.

 

[mu4c_20le]

Why would the best coaches want to work under a poor manager? At the end of the day a club as big as United can do far better than Solskjaer and shouldn't be trying to hire talented coaching staff to try and make up for the managers shortcomings, which is something I seen quite a few people suggest during the course of his tenure.

Why did Sancho want to come play under a poor manager?

 

[tomaldinho1]

I honestly don't know how anyone can look at our squad and think it's up with Liverpools or City's. They are better in every single position.

The only reason we would be close to Chelsea in your scenario is because their results have dropped off. Don't they have a 'top coach' though?
(the Tuchel hype seems to have died down a bit on here lately)

He's clearly a very good coach, my take was this season would define if he was world class (i.e. win PL or CL again). I do think they got a bit fecked over by the PL when they got made to play in contrast to Villa being allowed to call a game off with 2 hours notice but expect they'll be close enough by end of season.

I don't really see the point is saying x is better than y in certain positions because Pool have a top coach and we don't, that's what a top coach will do - he'll make players we all thought were good but not amazing into world class and elite players. It's like when Mou started well at Spurs we had at least 50% of the caf crying about how none of United's players would get into their first XI, there was even a Wolves versus United one at a low point a coupe of years ago on here. We think very poorly of pretty much all our players, if we now go on a run and win the next 10 games maybe we'll start loving them again. Conversely it only takes a few bad showings and suddenly Mane's finished, just like people were saying last season.

Pool have a set system and great players for that system but they still concede a lot and have drawn to many games so far. It wouldn't be that crazy to think in the hypothetical scenario of Flick being our manager we could have beaten Watford, Newcastle and Leicester and be 1 point behind them.

 

[SirReginald]

The only reason we would be close to Chelsea in your scenario is because their results have dropped off. Don't they have a 'top coach' though?
(the Tuchel hype seems to have died down a bit on here lately)

We haven’t been great this season. We started very well. We have had injuries and other situations this season that has definitely affected our form. I never penned us for top2 this season anyway. Just wanted to be closer to Liverpool and City. With the club World Cup too, I do think our league form will continue to be up and down.

Honestly this season is turning into a weird one for everyone below the top2. How Arsenal got anywhere near top 4 is proof of that. It’s hard to predict how this season will finish.

 

[Tyrion]

It is really incredible that people blame managers all the time. But never ever players. vanGaal not good enough. Mourinho not good enough. Solskjaer not good enough. And to believe rumours players aren't exactly pleased with Rangnick where some fans have already talked about not good enough. Nobody seems to be good enough for our players.

And no, he wasn't worst manager. Solskjaer did good job. Yes, he didn't won titles but we were top 3 every (whole) year with him. Countless semifinals and finals.

The players under LVG aren't the same as the ones under Mourinho or OGS. Maguire, Varane, Ronaldo, Sancho, Greenwood, Cavani, AWB, Pogba and Bruno can't be blamed for LVG not working out. "Our players" is a constantly changing group.

People have become too entrenched in believing a change in manager will solve everything. It's always been the case that the quality and mentality of the players available is more important.

Many of those that are blaming Ole now also thought this squad was good enough for a title challenge pre season (it wasn't).

Which is massively influenced by the manager. SAF proved that. Tuchel proved that.

Moyes and OGS weren't good enough and LVG and Mourinho were outdated. No other top club would have gone near them. The same can't be said for some of our players.

 

[Polar]

Many of those that are blaming Ole now also thought this squad was good enough for a title challenge pre season (it wasn't).

Yeh… And they probably still think the squad is of title challenging quality Stupid morons!

 

[AndySmith1990]

People have become too entrenched in believing a change in manager will solve everything. It's always been the case that the quality and mentality of the players available is more important.

Many of those that are blaming Ole now also thought this squad was good enough for a title challenge pre season (it wasn't).

Not even sure what this argument is. Managing the mentality of an employee to ensure they're happy and performing at their best isn't restricted to football. Its a thing in any professional career.

 

[Skills]

Harry Maguire.

He made him the most expensive defender in the history of football, and doubled down on it by making him our captain.

That's his legacy.

 

[VidaRed]

Harry Maguire.

He made him the most expensive defender in the history of football, and doubled down on it by making him our captain.

That's his legacy.

And we can't even get rid of him.

 

[dove]

I hope the remaining hardcore Ole supporters here will realise some day the damage he did at this club. Hands down the worst appointment post SAF, no contest really. How he has survived for 3 years dragging this club down is beyond me.

 

[HailtotheKing]

Harry Maguire.

He made him the most expensive defender in the history of football, and doubled down on it by making him our captain.

That's his legacy.

Took the words out of my mouth. Makes me want to vomit every time I hear him speak as our captain.

 

[LJJT]

Very odd how people keep coming back to blame ole. If it’s not clear now 7 managers in who’s to blame then I don’t know what to say.

 

[Andycoleno9]

I hope the remaining hardcore Ole supporters here will realise some day the damage he did at this club. Hands down the worst appointment post SAF, no contest really. How he has survived for 3 years dragging this club down is beyond me.

As a manager he is absolute disaster but as a person he is clever fecker.
1) he bought fans with Braveheart phrases "United Dna, attacking football, not parking the car on Saf's spot, cultural reset..."
2) he always talked about future. "We are getting there. Progress. Long term plan."
3) downplaying our strength (denial that we can win PL)
4) setting low standards. (trophies are for ego)
5) keeping main core of players happy all the time (with playing them every game and giving them soft trainings)
6) every now and then he mentioned glory days for United ("When i was a player....")

He is a smart guy. In his first interview after the sack he said that he wants to stay in club. He knows that nobody will hire him.
He is a big football fraud but very smart one.

 

[TheGame]

Very odd how people keep coming back to blame ole. If it’s not clear now 7 managers in who’s to blame then I don’t know what to say.

Some people still have a chip on their shoulder clearly.

 

[90 + 5min]

Haters keep hating. There are those in every club.

 

[big rons sovereign]

Some people still have a chip on their shoulder clearly.

I'm loving the cost of players being oles fault. Like he's just sat there with a blank chequebook.

 

[Max_United]

Took the words out of my mouth. Makes me want to vomit every time I hear him speak as our captain.

Maguire transfer fee is not on Ole, but I just really would like to understand Ole's reasoning for making him captain. Maguire was made captain after only 6 months at United, wasn't captain at previous clubs, does not seem to have leadership qualities or be vocal. Just why, Ole? Just because of Maguire was the most senior English first-team player? Cannot find any other explanation.

 

[ForeverRed1]

Very odd how people keep coming back to blame ole. If it’s not clear now 7 managers in who’s to blame then I don’t know what to say.

He did ok, should of left sooner than he did. That’s what ruined his time at the club, if he had gone out on a relative high, everyone would be singing his praises and wanting him back!

 

[TheGame]

Harry Maguire.

He made him the most expensive defender in the history of football, and doubled down on it by making him our captain.

That's his legacy.

He may have made him captain but he didn’t negotiate the transfer fee, you do know that right?

 

[TheGame]

I'm loving the cost of players being oles fault. Like he's just sat there with a blank chequebook.

People sat on their keyboards playing football manager thinking it resembles real life. Bless them.

 

[Ralph1386]

Harry Maguire.

He made him the most expensive defender in the history of football, and doubled down on it by making him our captain.

That's his legacy.

I came to post this. Thank you for showing I’m not the only one who thinks this. Maguire is a liability.

 

[Anustart89]

He may have made him captain but he didn’t negotiate the transfer fee, you do know that right?

We all knew what Leicester were demanding for him, didn’t we? It was all over the papers, so he had to think he was worth that amount of money and that it was more important to get him (and AWB) for £130m than buying more players, only for him to then complain about not having a deep enough squad.

 

[King7Eric]

As a manager he is absolute disaster but as a person he is clever fecker.
1) he bought fans with Braveheart phrases "United Dna, attacking football, not parking the car on Saf's spot, cultural reset..."
2) he always talked about future. "We are getting there. Progress. Long term plan."
3) downplaying our strength (denial that we can win PL)
4) setting low standards. (trophies are for ego)
5) keeping main core of players happy all the time (with playing them every game and giving them soft trainings)
6) every now and then he mentioned glory days for United ("When i was a player....")

He is a smart guy. In his first interview after the sack he said that he wants to stay in club. He knows that nobody will hire him.
He is a big football fraud but very smart one.

I think this place has totally lost it. More than 2.5 months since he was sacked and people still keep on coming with new ways to blame him.

All I'll say is until the last 6 weeks of his tenure, he used to find a way to get results, even if we didn't play well, which is more than can be said of us now.

That being said, I do think we are gradually playing well under Ralf, performance wise. But somehow our biggest strength of last season has become reversed in that we can't get wins despite playing well, and for me that is more concerning than anything, because that's when players heads start to drop.

But of course I'm sure that is because the clever fecker Ole managed to convince a voodoo priest to cast a curse on us at a discounted price to protect his "legacy".

 

[Chairman Steve]

Ralf has got Solskjaer’s squad playing much better football than Solskjaer could this season to be honest. Its just a shame that the recent results can’t reflect that. We won 1-0 against West Ham and created a lot that game too to justify it being a potentially bigger margin.

And while you can argue that transfers are decided by a committee at Utd so that ‘Solskjaer didnt buy AWB’, Solskjaer’s much preferred RB which was AWB, is now sitting on the bench as we now look much better going forward without him in it, and I’m not saying Dalot is amazing in case you jump on me for that.

 

[TheGame]

We all knew what Leicester were demanding for him, didn’t we? It was all over the papers, so he had to think he was worth that amount of money and that it was more important to get him (and AWB) for £130m than buying more players, only for him to then complain about not having a deep enough squad.

No he wanted to sign the players. It’s up to the board to turn around and say no they are too expensive. He is not the negotiator. He manages the team.

 

[Anustart89]

No he wanted to sign the players. It’s up to the board to turn around and say no they are too expensive. He is not the negotiator. He manages the team.

But if they do that then everyone’s going to say “the manager’s job is to select the targets and the board have to back him”. It seems very much like he locked in on the most expensive target in pretty much every position that he signed players in, apart from James, and then complained about not having squad depth. Go figure.

 

[TheMitz]

He left us in such a mess its going to take more than one season to even attempt to sort it out.

 

[Andycoleno9]

No he wanted to sign the players. It’s up to the board to turn around and say no they are too expensive. He is not the negotiator. He manages the team.

But then people would have said "Ole is not backed. Burn Ed. Burn Glazers".