Camilo
Full Member
- Joined
- Jan 27, 2014
- Messages
- 2,940
Aye, project reality.project fear
Aye, project reality.project fear
We aren't going anywheresaid after the 2019 election that tories winning again would mean scotland leaving and a united ireland at a much faster rate than would have been case otherwise. it's turning out exactly as i thought tbh. don't see how you could blame scotland either. would you stay in a union where you're represented by neoliberalism personified despite never giving them a majority preference yourself?
remains to be seen.We aren't going anywhere
I will post a picture of myself licking Arthur's Seat if we vote for independence.remains to be seen.
I can't see it happening either. Numbers were a lot better last time although they could change by next year.I will post a picture of myself licking Arthur's Seat if we vote for independence.
on the contrary, I think England is quite culturally fragmented and the UK even more so.We don't deserve another choice.
It's a massive life changing decision which continues to divide the country 50/50, and we just had a fecking vote 8 years ago. We can't have another one if we change our minds.
Plenty of Scots voted for Brexit. Plenty didn't. Same across the UK. That's democracy. It was a stupid vote we should never have been given. And for some reason we continue to pretend like indyref2 is different.
What's the currency going to be? What's the border going to look like? Why are we pretending we'll get straight into the EU? Will my house be worth anything, and how will I pay my mortgage in pounds to an English lender?! Same with the car?! I know these are all details, but there are so many....we're talking about setting up a new country.
And then there's the fact that the SNP are fecking useless and have achieved nothing in 20 years. They'll be the ones having to make this work...and they don't have a clue. The state of the health service and police up here.... Everything they touch turns to shit.
The UK post Brexit will be fine - it's a long established world power which, rightly or wrongly, still has a big influence on the wider world. Scotland on the other hand... For what?! Because there's a generally more liberal political outlook right now?! That will change. It always does. We're culturally the same bloody people! It's ridiculous.
I think that's nonsense.on the contrary, I think England is quite culturally fragmented and the UK even more so.
You don’t think the North and South of England are culturally different?I think that's nonsense.
They will vote remain. You can quote me in years to come.Guess a lot will depend on where the government have taken the UK by next year.
Get the impression that Westminster have given up on the idea of sunlit uplands and realise that Brexit was a gross error and could never have worked. Trashing the NI protocol currently to distract attention. Five more years of new regulations and end of grace periods.
Do Scotland follow the rest of the UK down the Brexit rabbit hole as this may be the last chance they get for a long time.
Either way it's a tough choice and won't be easy. If they do choose to leave the Uk they will have to adapt their economy more towards the EU like NI are doing.
Whatever happens, lies will be abound as they were for Brexit and how will people understand what the consequences are because they certainly weren't understood with Brexit.
Not significantly... We all have our regional differences, but I wouldn't call it cultural in a million years. The difference between rich and poor is far more significant.You don’t think the North and South of England are culturally different?
Personally I think that's quite a big gulf without adding rich/poor dynamics.Not significantly... We all have our regional differences, but I wouldn't call it cultural in a million years. The difference between rich and poor is far more significant.
Sure, if you go to Shetland you'll find a slightly different way of living, but in general, Edinburgh or Bristol, we're extremely similar. The difference between a Londoner and a Geordie is no greater than the difference between a Londoner and a Glaswegian.
Maybe, if they hold it next year. If they held it in 2025 or 2026 it may be a different outcome.They will vote remain. You can quote me in years to come.
fecking hell, have you told Arthur yet?I will post a picture of myself licking Arthur's Seat if we vote for independence.
You've ruined the joke - that's my husbands namefecking hell, have you told Arthur yet?
I agree. You could probably throw a Dubliner into the mix as well.Personally I think that's quite a big gulf without adding rich/poor dynamics.
ffsYou've ruined the joke - that's my husbands name
I don't see it. It's no different to any other country.Personally I think that's quite a big gulf without adding rich/poor dynamics.
I’d be surprised if you lived in each of those areas and took away the thoughts that they’re no different tbh. Having lived in London, Dundee, York and Ed, there were varying cultural differences in everyday life.I don't see it. It's no different to any other country.
And I see absolutely no good reason why, if there were significant cultural differences, dividing a people and creating a border could be seen as anything other than fecking primitive.
Labour kind of dug their own grave in Scotland. For years they took for granted that they would get elected so, at least in my constituency, they did next to feck all because they were safe. From the 70s all the way until the mid 2000s it just got shitter and shitter. Zero central funding, industry gone and not replaced, constituent letters and calls ignored. It wasn't until 2005 when Gordon Brown was voted in that things started to improve because despite common opinion he was a great public servant. But since him it's been a yo-yo between SNP and Labour (now it's the Alba party because the MP switched sides so feck knows what's going to happen at the next GE).Any possibility of your current government encouraging this behind the scenes ?
While extremely cynical it does ensure labor not having a ghost of chance of winning in the foreseeable future.
So I guess in a very cynical pragmatic sort of way it must be quite an intriguing proposition.
Happy enough to be slaves for eternity? fecking shameful shower of fannies if thats trueI will post a picture of myself licking Arthur's Seat if we vote for independence.
dont talk shite...all they have said is Scotland would have to wait in lineSpain would veto Scotland's entry into the EU anyway. The independence vote is a choice between staying in the domestic union but being outside the European union; or being outside both the domestic union and the European union.
I sympathise with them. The North of England gets almost as bad a deal. But I don't see this ending well.
I will always vote for independence despite probably losing out massively if it happened. Chance to rid ourselves of Westminster and be governed by a parliament that is elected at least somewhat proportionally, with parties that give cooperation a bash.Happy enough to be slaves for eternity? fecking shameful shower of fannies if thats true
Interesting, always thought having two consecutive Scottish Labour PMs endeared the party further for you folk.Labour kind of dug their own grave in Scotland. For years they took for granted that they would get elected so, at least in my constituency, they did next to feck all because they were safe. From the 70s all the way until the mid 2000s it just got shitter and shitter. Zero central funding, industry gone and not replaced, constituent letters and calls ignored. It wasn't until 2005 when Gordon Brown was voted in that things started to improve because despite common opinion he was a great public servant. But since him it's been a yo-yo between SNP and Labour (now it's the Alba party because the MP switched sides so feck knows what's going to happen at the next GE).
For what it's worth Tony Blair was a cnut but Gordon Brown was loved in his constituency, especially when he worked his magic and did what his MP predecessor failed to do and got the funding for a new hospital. Brown genuinely cared about his constituency and understood what politics was all about.Interesting, always thought having two consecutive Scottish Labour PMs endeared the party further for you folk.
Obviously I'm not as well versed in Scottish politics as you are and I assume your an Edinburgh dweller so how do assess the atmosphere in the city, has the yes inclination gotten stronger since 2014? Do you think this one will succeed?
Also how would the post uk future look like for Scotland? Is there any industrys to build an economy on?
You wont lose out massively at all. You have an abundance of natural resources and with eventual EU backing will do alright.I will always vote for independence despite probably losing out massively if it happened. Chance to rid ourselves of Westminster and be governed by a parliament that is elected at least somewhat proportionally, with parties that give cooperation a bash.
Not sure many share the same opinion. As I said before, nation of bottlers.
Oil revenues fell off a cliff after 2014 and trade with the EU is a fraction (1/3) of trade with the rest of the UK. And that's before we get to budget deficits and national debt. And using the pound.You wont lose out massively at all. You have an abundance of natural resources and with eventual EU backing will do alright.
Very interesting, thank you for your answer.For what it's worth Tony Blair was a cnut but Gordon Brown was loved in his constituency, especially when he worked his magic and did what his MP predecessor failed to do and got the funding for a new hospital. Brown genuinely cared about his constituency and understood what politics was all about.
You're actually quite close, I live close to Edinburgh and visit a lot but the disparity between the city and just outside of it can be jarring. To give you perspective, if I'm in Edinburgh then I have access to a plethora of art galleries and restaurants during the day, amazing jazz clubs in the evening and probably a great hotel room to pish the bed in by night. Every accent you come across down the street is different and the majority of folk aren't entirely wankers.
Me, though. I currently live in an absolute shit hole and it's only a few miles away. Once you leave the city or major towns (like the one I grew up in) you find a lot of places that just seem to be hotbeds for scum*. They would undoubtedly vote 50/50 depending on whether they support Rangers or Celtic. Because they're fecking morons. I say "would vote" because they actually wouldn't bother going to the polling stations.
But Edinburgh would probably vote No unless there was undeniable proof that economically it was the right choice. I think the British argument of yesterday doesn't really apply anymore (maybe my numbers are wrong but I'm sure 10-20% of the residents in Edinburgh are English, which explains the huge uptick in literacy levels and public hygiene compared to the rest of the country) because the Tories have decimated confidence in the last couple of years and their actions don't reflect what Scotland would want, therefore it doesn't really feel like a union anymore.
As for your second part; renewables are our bread and butter now. Where I grew up used to be iconic for the linoleum industry (Michael Portillo's family, no less, which is why he has a very strange association with my town), but once that died we became a service industry town. Now that's gone as well there's been a focus on small businesses working on engineering and technology. I guess what I'm trying to say is that, especially with the big push in schools and higher/further education, our future is computer science and renewables. Engineering, in the form of companies like Babcock and whatever the feck they do near Glasgow, will also play a part. As far as I'm aware the SNP are also focused on this. With schools and businesses focused on these targets, plus our historical need to press buttons and tamper with stuff, it looks to be on track.
I'm stuck in the middle. My family are a mish mash of Scottish, English and criminals (Australian) so feck knows.
*Yes, some people are scum and I don't care for any of this "they've been failed by the system" shite. Try telling me that after you've lived in one of these places and told a drug addict ten times to stop shitting on your garage roof.
grovelling to be in the largest trading bloc in the world is idiotic and staying with Bojo and the fascists isnt.... fecking dead on ye genius. Also as the NI economy has shown trade with the UK means feck all as other markets will open up. As for Scotlands North Sea oil revenues the cost at the pump should tell you that that will be going up drastically.Oil revenues fell off a cliff after 2014 and trade with the EU is a fraction (1/3) of trade with the rest of the UK. And that's before we get to budget deficits and national debt. And using the pound.
Trying to be an independent nation while grovelling to join the EU on the one hand and using a currency thats issued and controlled by a different country on the other. Just idiotic.