Moises Caicedo

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Skills

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Pogue Mahone said:
If giving him enough opportunities to develop at United was a concern, he could have been loaned out to another club. A club like, say, Brighton?

Just one more example of our utter incompetence in the transfer market. So depressing.
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What motivation would they have to develop him?

It's worth it for them now, because they've just turned a 5m player into a 40m player.
 

Pogue Mahone

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Skills said:
What motivation would they have to develop him?

It's worth it for them now, because they've just turned a 5m player into a 40m player.
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The same motivation that has seen plenty of other young players get games and develop while on loan. Look at Gallagher, or Broja. Or our own James Garner. If you sign the very best young players around then they’ll do well on loan because they’re good footballers the loan clubs will be grateful to have in their team.
 
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SilentWitness

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hellhunter said:
Was he given the choice, though?

Generally agree with you, just can't come up with an example where a player actually decided against his favourite club. Maybe Shaw?
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Yes, SAF tried to sign him at the same time Chelsea signed him as a 14 year old.
 

DannyCAFC

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Brilliant bit of business by Brighton - exactly the sort of smart succession planning you find at well-run clubs they way they replaced Bissouma with him. Had plenty of time to settle without any pressure before they actually needed to call upon him to play regular first-team football.

If only Bissouma had an extra year on his contract and they got market value for him (£45m/£50m) they would have been in an even better position, but I'm sure they won't be complaining. Looks to potential have a higher ceiling too on the evidence so far.
 

Bestietom

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They actually outplayed us in midfield, same as most teams last season. We have a huge hole to fill in this area.
 

Cassidy

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Jeppers7 said:
Amad did. Caicedo is far more ready than those three and has fecking McFred in his pocket
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Caicedo didn't play for his first 6-9 months at Brighton and its not about him being ready, its about our club making the correct decisions
 

cnwo

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Matt851 said:
Possibly but neither seemed to have as much experience as him before they joined. They also don't have his physique

Amad in particular is mystifying given his tiny frame and lack of game time
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Pellistri had just as much top flight experience in Uruguay and was in and around the national team. A lot of his strengths were directness, pace, work rate - he didn’t look out of place in senior football. No different to Caicedo but here we are
 

Jeppers7

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Cassidy said:
Caicedo didn't play for his first 6-9 months at Brighton and its not about him being ready, its about our club making the correct decisions
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Which they haven’t done in this instance
 

UnofficialDevil

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city-puma said:
He was the sensation here a year or two ago after watching his goal in wc qualification game. Everyone here wanted to sign him but the club somehow decided not to pursue him. They were saying it’s too complicated to sign him and then suddenly Brighton signed him. Unbelievable…
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Just about sums us up.
 

Adnan

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The difference is that Brighton are a club who provide the next step for a teenage talent to progress in his career by giving the player game time. And to implement the method of buying a young player with high potential and to then develop the player at the club, they (Brighton) need the first team head coach to buy in to their methods. Which is normal at clubs like Brighton who are a mid table club in the EPL with a league best finish of placing 9th.

And as far as Caicedo is concerned, he was still loaned out by Brighton, but his loan was to a club in Belgium (Beerschot). He made 12 appearances for Beerschot before he was recalled by Brighton due to the club having a shortage of midfield options. Potter started playing him and Caicedo started growing as a player and started becoming more and more confident in the EPL. If he had been at our club, then I'm sure the consensus on this forum would've been to send him on loan to the championship and then a year later send him on loan to a EPL club.

We can't operate like Brighton, because the pressure and expectations are huge at the club in comparison. But what we can do is maybe give one or two younger players a bit more of a chance than what we've been giving in recent years. Our problem isn't that we can't develop players or there's a problem with our development at youth level. Our issue at the club has been the first team manager who has been reluctant to give the younger players minutes in Cup competitions like the league Cup. And we still see a very poor midfield pairing of McFred still starting for us, and it's no surprise to see mid-table clubs with better midfields.
 

Pogue Mahone

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Adnan said:
The difference is that Brighton are a club who provide the next step for a teenage talent to progress in his career by giving the player game time. And to implement the method of buying a young player with high potential and to then develop the player at the club, they (Brighton) need the first team head coach to buy in to their methods. Which is normal at clubs like Brighton who are a mid table club in the EPL with a league best finish of placing 9th.

And as far as Caicedo is concerned, he was still loaned out by Brighton, but his loan was to a club in Belgium (Beerschot). He made 12 appearances for Beerschot before he was recalled by Brighton due to the club having a shortage of midfield options. Potter started playing him and Caicedo started growing as a player and started becoming more and more confident in the EPL. If he had been at our club, then I'm sure the consensus on this forum would've been to send him on loan to the championship and then a year later send him on loan to a EPL club.

We can't operate like Brighton, because the pressure and expectations are huge at the club in comparison. But what we can do is maybe give one or two younger players a bit more of a chance than what we've been giving in recent years. Our problem isn't that we can't develop players or there's a problem with our development at youth level. Our issue at the club has been the first team manager who has been reluctant to give the younger players minutes in Cup competitions like the league Cup. And we still see a very poor midfield pairing of McFred still starting for us, and it's no surprise to see mid-table clubs with better midfields.
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Yeah, I’d agree with a lot of this. It’s no coincidence that the development of young players at the club has stalled since we basically completely stopped Fergie’s habit of giving kids games in all our league cup matches and intermittent league/FA cup starts. For the last 10 years they’ve been lucky to get a very occasional few minutes off the bench. 90 minute first team appearances are basically unheard of.
 

Adnan

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Pogue Mahone said:
Yeah, I’d agree with a lot of this. It’s no coincidence that the development of young players at the club has stalled since we basically completely stopped Fergie’s habit of giving kids games in all our league cup matches and intermittent league/FA cup starts. For the last 10 years they’ve been lucky to get a very occasional few minutes off the bench. 90 minute first team appearances are basically unheard of.
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Agreed mate.
 

0le

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Pogue Mahone said:
Yeah, I’d agree with a lot of this. It’s no coincidence that the development of young players at the club has stalled since we basically completely stopped Fergie’s habit of giving kids games in all our league cup matches and intermittent league/FA cup starts. For the last 10 years they’ve been lucky to get a very occasional few minutes off the bench. 90 minute first team appearances are basically unheard of.
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I think you forgot LvG but him aside, yes.
 

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city-puma said:
He was the sensation here a year or two ago after watching his goal in wc qualification game. Everyone here wanted to sign him but the club somehow decided not to pursue him. They were saying it’s too complicated to sign him and then suddenly Brighton signed him. Unbelievable…
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Yeap. I was on that muppet train. Tim Vickery suggested that he was leaning towards coming to United. Then suddenly it was Brighton. Some said back then that he be a cert to do well in the PL. And costs peanuts.

Took a few months of adjustment and then it was like a duck to water.
 

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hellhunter said:
That's clearly nonsense. He was a complete unknown, a punt by Brighton. It worked out very well for them, but it's not like he was the obvious next superstar we decided to pass on
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Maybe you didn't see him play before but everyone who did and understands football knew it.
 

jeepers

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Hindsight is always 20/20. However, he was rated a top talent by many (pros, not users here), we could have probably negotiated away the sell-on fee and bought him for maybe £10m instead and that would still be good money spent considering at that time he could have came in and be understudy to Matic.

I would like for us to go for him but Brighton will ask for top dollar, considering his talent and that sell-on percentage.

He was everywhere against us, good composure and technically solid.

Ultimately it also take balls to play a kid. Iqbal, Savage and Mejbri outshined McT in preseason, but McT still started against Brighton. “If you’re good enough, you’re old enough”, unfortunately that no longer means anything other than bullshit in United.
 

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Monitoring, register interest, enquire, deadline passed. “We tried”.

 

DWelbz19

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I remember when we were linked to him and Tim Vickery was going bananas about how good he was (admittedly he is a bit hyper about any South American kid) you kind of knew he was going to have a bit about him.
 

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FrankDrebin said:
How much are we talking ,regarding price ,40, 50 million already ?
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It’s going to be a ridiculous price. EPL players always are. Brighton know we are desperate.

All EPL teams are amongst the richest in the world. They rarely have a need to sell. We will get out priced or we will be stupid enough to abandon FDJ and spend a big chunk of the funds on this guy.
 

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MOTM against Newcastle yesterday. The kid is class.
Brighton would ask for £60m (and rightfully so)
 

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We should’ve got him for £5m but we didn’t. We should also now get him for whatever price he’s available for, but we won’t.

I don’t care how much he costs or what he could’ve cost. He’d improve us
 

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sewey89 said:
We should’ve got him for £5m but we didn’t. We should also now get him for whatever price he’s available for, but we won’t.

I don’t care how much he costs or what he could’ve cost. He’d improve us
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Problem is we as a club think we're too "big" to get these kids in and play them while they're still learning, same with Pellestri and Amad, just give them game time, can they really be worse than Rashford and Elanga?

We could have got Enzo Fernandez, Caicedo and Alvarez for £35m combined.
 

bond19821982

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Brilliant player. They won't sell so late . Next summer for sure. He is an United can as well.
 

bond19821982

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sewey89 said:
We should’ve got him for £5m but we didn’t. We should also now get him for whatever price he’s available for, but we won’t.

I don’t care how much he costs or what he could’ve cost. He’d improve us
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Thought he didn't want to come?
 
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