Club Sale | It’s done!

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UDontMessWith24

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Most common one would be an owner that gets too personally involved in decision making, overriding whatever hierarchy is in place to run the club. Buying X player because they like them, sacking Y manager because they had a falling out (maybe over the manager not playing player X). The overall situation where the owner is in a sense bigger than the club, and feels no compunction about interfering in anything big or small.

Also in the context of being owned by a nation state, the club being used in promoting that nation state. So in the case of PSG they always do a few friendlies in the winter in the Middle East. It's not inherently bad for the club, but I imagine there's no discussion as to whether it's the best decision for the team.
I'm concerned about the first part too because of how PSG is run, but City's owners have done none of that. Abramovich did for a little bit and stopped when he saw it wasn't working. The hierarchy in place at United outside of the manager and the coaching staff is FAR from untouchable.
 

Spoony

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John Textor owns both Lyon and Palace. Does this mean Palace won't ever* have aspirations for CL football?

*unless rules are officially changed.
 

Giggsyking

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After the fall of the USSR there was a school of thought that integrating Russia with the West via business and politics could spark a change in their culture with regards to laws, human rights etc. Not only did that obviously fail spectacularly the opposite has probably been true.

This is the same sort of thinking.
So lets bomb the east and enforce our values.
 

UDontMessWith24

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It is absolutely insane to which the extent some people want to ignore the horrendous elephant in the room. The people buying and owning our football club have raised money through the oppression and state backed murder of vulnerable people. This will never go away. This will never be something that will be ignored. If you don’t like discussing this, then the next few years will be horrendous.
You ignore the elephant in the room every day of your life unless you're Amish.
 

red thru&thru

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I don’t support PSG, therefore have very little interest in either their men’s or women’s teams - apart from when United are knocking them out of the CL :smirk:
Ah. You must support Qatar national team then, as you have so much knowledge on them and their women’s team.

Thanks for the reply.
 

Giggsyking

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Encouraging news today. Hope Sheik Jasim or Sir Jim finish this chapter of the parasites once and for all. The Glazers will not be missed.
 

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It is absolutely insane to which the extent some people want to ignore the horrendous elephant in the room. The people buying and owning our football club have raised money through the oppression and state backed murder of vulnerable people. This will never go away. This will never be something that will be ignored. If you don’t like discussing this, then the next few years will be horrendous.
I'm anti the Qatar bid for other reasons but it's an opportunity, like the world cup, to keep those issues at the front of everyone's minds.
 

MTF

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I'm concerned about the first part too because of how PSG is run, but City's owners have done none of that. Abramovich did for a little bit and stopped when he saw it wasn't working. The hierarchy in place at United outside of the manager and the coaching staff is FAR from untouchable.
It could be either (play-thing or not) with any new owners. The one thing about owners who have a lot of their net worth tied into the club is that there's more of an incentive (but never a guarantee) to run it in a more rational way.

In the case of the Glazers the club is sort of bigger than them, or nearly all of their net worth. So that in part has allowed the club to run within it's own logic for the past 17 years. The problem is that they've really been lacking in vision and key personnel appointment (looking at Woody mainly). Their timing in terms of extracting $ and investing $ was always reactive, never proactive.
 

UDontMessWith24

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That's right, you cannot raise objections over a state owning your club unless you also retreat from modern society and live like a hermit.

What BS.
For the 100th time, there's a difference between raising objections and lording your imaginary moral high ground over everyone else. All he does is the latter and I will call it out every single time. There's a readily available ignore button if you don't like it.
 

Dr. Dwayne

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After the fall of the USSR there was a school of thought that integrating Russia with the West via business and politics could spark a change in their culture with regards to laws, human rights etc. Not only did that obviously fail spectacularly the opposite has probably been true.

This is the same sort of thinking.
To be fair, while I'm nonfan of the Qatari bid or acolyte of the idea that them owning United will foster cultural change, the west didn't do that with Russia. Instead, they nearly bankrupted them, which lead their leaders to resent the west and their people to long for the old days of dictatorship. That's ended well.
 

red thru&thru

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He has openly admitted his objections are not based on human rights violations in and of themselves.
That's fine. I was genuinely curious to how PSG have treated their women's team, as he said the way Qatar have dealt with the national's women team could be a reflection how our women's team is treated.
 

stevoc

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To be fair, while I'm nonfan of the Qatari bid or acolyte of the idea that them owning United will foster cultural change, the west didn't do that with Russia. Instead, they nearly bankrupted them, which lead their leaders to resent the west and their people to long for the old days of dictatorship. That's ended well.
No danger of that happening with Qatar.
 

Gazza

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For the 100th time, there's a difference between raising objections and lording your imaginary moral high ground over everyone else. All he does is the latter and I will call it out every single time. There's a readily available ignore button if you don't like it.
You called it out using the same simplistic and nonsensical logic everyone else has used, so I won't ignore it, I'll point it out.
 

UDontMessWith24

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To be fair, while I'm nonfan of the Qatari bid or acolyte of the idea that them owning United will foster cultural change, the west didn't do that with Russia. Instead, they nearly bankrupted them, which lead their leaders to resent the west and their people to long for the old days of dictatorship. That's ended well.
In the case of the oil states the west has zero interest in fostering cultural change because they're begotten by the business deal that created these states and put the ruling tribes in power in the first place. If Sadam Hussain played ball with the west, he'd be at the palace going over the daily execution log as we speak.
 

Vapor trail

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It is absolutely insane to which the extent some people want to ignore the horrendous elephant in the room. The people buying and owning our football club have raised money through the oppression and state backed murder of vulnerable people. This will never go away. This will never be something that will be ignored. If you don’t like discussing this, then the next few years will be horrendous.
And funnily enough the country that hosts the premier league is built on a similar foundation through colonialism (over 300 years) massively contributing to the history and modernity of the countries economy. You wonder why scholastic primary / secondary education focuses on the escapades of individuals (Henry VIII) and not the objective view of the countries developments. There's only one reason why these things aren't discussed (by the masses including the media) is due to selective ignorance.
 

UDontMessWith24

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You called it out using the same simplistic and nonsensical logic everyone else has used, so I won't ignore it, I'll point it out.
It's simplistic, but if you're going to tell people you're morally superior, it's not nonsensical. You think it's nonsensical because you don't like it.
 

stevoc

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I actually enjoy your posts mate, I mean no offence. I'm just so fed up with the same repetetive arguments. I'm not partcularly fond of the idea of a state owning Utd either but this thread should surely just be for updates and news now? We've all had our say and shared our feelings on a potential Middle Eastern ownership.
When has it ever been solely for news updates? It's a discussion forum, so people are going to you know discuss it.

There's a tweet update thread on this very subject if the discussion is not for you.
 

Gazza

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It's simplistic, but if you're going to tell people you're morally superior, it's not nonsensical. You think it's nonsensical because you don't like it.
No, I think it's nonsensical because it is. But I do happen to dislike weak arguments with very little foundation to them besides whataboutism. So your post was a double hit!
 

UDontMessWith24

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That's fine. I was genuinely curious to how PSG have treated their women's team, as he said the way Qatar have dealt with the national's women team could be a reflection how our women's team is treated.
Very well to my knowledge. At the crux of it we are still talking about a sportswashing project, and painting a picture of how enlightened they are by investing in the women's team is part of it.
 

UDontMessWith24

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No, I think it's nonsensical because it is. But I do happen to dislike weak arguments with very little foundation to them besides whataboutism. So your post was a double hit!
Ah yes "whatabaoutism". The sandcastle under which hypocrisy is hidden.
 

red thru&thru

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Very well to my knowledge. At the crux of it we are still talking about a sportswashing project, and painting a picture of how enlightened they are by investing in the women's team is part of it.
Ah, that's good. Hopefully, our ladies will be doing better under Jassim.
 

Plant0x84

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Sorry, I didn't understand your post? Was this meant to be for me?
Yes, I thought you were being a smart arse. This thread is full of ‘em.
If not I apologise, I’m sorry.

That said the comparison proves nothing as PSG feminin are very much the after thought behind the men’s team and also struggle to overcome OL feminin. There certainly hasn’t been an explosion of winning under the Qataris and like the men’s team PSG proves that it takes more than endless money to get success.
 
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Red in STL

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To be fair, while I'm nonfan of the Qatari bid or acolyte of the idea that them owning United will foster cultural change, the west didn't do that with Russia. Instead, they nearly bankrupted them, which lead their leaders to resent the west and their people to long for the old days of dictatorship. That's ended well.
Not sure that's how Russia went, they were bankrupt in the old system, that's one of the reasons for the collapse of the old order, hey opened up and they benefited, then somehow one of the old guard got back in power and is trying to turn the clock back to the "glory" days of the Communist era - Putin is ex-KGB, he has always resented the West, most of the people do not long for the old days
 

Chief123

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Seems the 'ship as already sailed' in regards to the sale of the club. There is no turning back from here, I think.

The news comes as UEFA president Aleksander Ceferin confirmed the European governing body was looking at ways the rules on multi-club ownership could be adapted.
Paris Saint-Germain are already under Qatari ownership while Ratcliffe owns French side Nice potentially presenting a hurdle for both bidders for United.

“We are not thinking about Manchester United only,” Ceferin said in an interview with Gary Neville on his YouTube channel, The Overlap. “We’ve had five or six owners of clubs who want to buy another club. We have to see what to do. The options are that it stays like that or that we allow them to play in the same competition. I’m not sure yet.
“We have to speak about these regulations and see what to do about it. There is more and more interest in this multi-club ownership. We shouldn’t just say no for the investments for multi-club ownership, but we have to see what kind of rules we set in that case, because the rules have to be strict.

“From one point of view it’s true if you are the owner of two clubs and they play in the same competition you can say to one club to lose because you want the other to win. But for you, as a football player, do you think it’s so easy to do that, to tell a coach, lose the match because the other wants to win?”
 
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